Documenting the decline of the porn industry

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  • signupdamnit
    Confirmed User
    • Aug 2007
    • 6697

    #1

    Documenting the decline of the porn industry

    I thought it would be a good idea to post a thread where documentation of the decline of the industry can be provided.

    -----------
    LAS VEGAS -- Walking around the Adult Entertainment Expo (AEE) in Las Vegas,
    you'd never know the porn industry was at half-mast, sales-wise.

    There are floor-to-ceiling billboards of scantily clad sex actresses and HD TV
    screens showing every conceivable type of fornication (and a few unconceivable
    ones as well). Fans can take pictures with stars like Lisa Ann (the porn
    version of Sarah Palin), Julia Ann (no relation) and Alexis Texas (formerly
    Alexis Texass). If polite enough, the fanboy or frangirl might even get to
    touch a breast.

    If the AEE was one's only exposure to the industry, the crowded convention hall
    might seem proof that porn is truly recession-proof. But insiders claim the
    business has gone limp -- metaphorically speaking -- because more people are
    watching porn for free over the Internet instead of purchasing it.

    The end result means fewer gigs for hard-working porn performers like Dave
    Cummings, a 72-year-old porn actor who has also produced three series: "Dirty
    Dave's Sugar Daddy," "Sex Fun" and "Kneepad Nymphos."

    "The piracy has killed the industry," Cummings told HuffPost. "I'd say 80
    percent of the companies that were around five years ago either don't exist or
    are hanging by a thread. The day a new video comes out, within 24 hours,
    someone has set up a tripod in front of their TV to copy it and then uploaded
    it illegally."
    It's hard to track how much money the porn industry has lost, because it's
    nearly impossible to figure how much it typically earns. Theo Sapoutzis, the
    CEO and Chairman of Adult Video News (AVN), a trade journal that covers the
    porn industry and organizes the AEE, estimates that the pornography business
    made $10 billion in 2012, but admits getting exact figures is close to
    impossible since many porn companies are privately owned and tend to "inflate"
    their figures.

    Sapoutzis "guesstimates" the industry made as much as $13 to $15 billion during
    its peak in the mid-2000s, before the recession. He accepts Cummings'
    suggestion that 80 percent of porn companies are now defunct or struggling, but
    Sapoutzis sees that as a sign that the porn business is maturing, not dying.

    "There are more performers than ever before, but they're working as cam girls
    at home interacting with people, rather than in a studio," he said. "From a
    company standpoint, there's bigger competition. It's more difficult to enter."

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_2460799.html

    -----

    The Guardian?s Theroux does not offer an estimate as to the size of the porn
    industry, but warns, ?some time around 2007, the ?business of X? started going
    into a commercial tailspin.? Huffington?s Moye cites estimates from Theo
    Sapoutzis, the head of the Adult Video News (AVN), who claims that the porn
    business made $10 billion in 2012. Last year, CNBC claimed that porn
    businesses, led by Vivid Entertainment, Digital Playground and Manwin, ?generate
    roughly $14 billion in revenue per year that in 2012.?

    The porn industry is facing a period of significant restructuring. Porn
    theatres and XXX shops catering to the ?raincoat crowd? and the risqué have all
    but vanished; the DVD, the old cash-cow release platform, is in rapid decline
    for both porn and conventional movies. Digital video streaming is the
    21st-century medium of porn distribution.

    Most commentators identify five factors contributing to the predicament now
    facing the commerical porn industry: (i) the widescale pirating of copyrighted
    porn and its illegal resale and posting by opportunistic websites; (ii) the
    ease of producing do-it-yourself (DIY) amateur porn videos; (iii) the enormous
    increase of ?free? porn sites; (iv) the resulting change in business economics;
    and (v) the ongoing recession with cuts discretionary spending, especially
    among a certain sector of the male audience.

    This restructuring has led to the closing of many commerical porn companies and
    cuts in jobs and fees to porn workers. Not unlike other once-analog media
    industries ? e.g., newpaper, magazine and book publishing ? porn is struggling
    to make the transition to digital online publishing.

    ?The current economic crisis besetting the porn industry began to emerge around
    2005,? says Chauntelle Tibbals, a sociologist at the University of Southern
    California who has spent over 10 years studying the industry. ?2005 was one of
    the last years that things looked good for the industry, at least from the
    outside,? she adds.?Things started to visibly change after that.?

    She identifies piracy as the key factor fueling the crisis. She points out that
    the proliferation of ?free? stolen content cut into cash flow, but the
    industry?s inability ? or unwillingness ? to effectively deal with the problem
    turned a serious cold into a cancer. Only a handful of companies took early
    action. ?Digital Playground is an example of a company less impacted by
    piracy,? Tibbals reflects. ?They engaged a variety of strategies early on to
    protect their content.?

    http://www.salon.com/2013/05/30/is_s...ustry_partner/

    -----------

    A sinking ship
    For the past few years there have been complaints of a ?perfect storm,? a term
    repeatedly used to describe the double whammy that has hit the industry: the
    recession and a wave of online piracy.

    The economic downturn has caused customers? wallets to clam up, particularly
    when it comes to discretionary spending. And let?s face it, there?s little else
    more discretionary than porn.

    At the same time, a number of porn-flavored YouTube clone sites ? YouPorn and
    RedTube, to name a few ? have sprung up to offer aficionados all the copyrighted
    adult content they want, for free. Like their mainstream counterparts, porn
    producers are also seeing their content swapped freely through file-sharing
    programs.

    As such, the industry says it is losing millions of dollars and scores of jobs,
    not only on the performer side, but also in production and distribution.

    Specifics are hard to come by, since most companies are privately owned and
    tight-lipped on financials, but one look at the stock prices of the handful of
    public firms tells the story. Over the past two years, shares of Barcelona-based
    Private Media, Colorado-based New Frontier Media and Germany?s Beate Uhse have
    lost more than half their value.

    Chicago-based Playboy has seen a recent uptick, but that?s only thanks to
    speculation that founder Hugh Hefner was leading a bid to take the company
    private ? a trigger he finally pulled this week.

    Some insiders think that no new porn will be made because they can't stay in
    business. That's next...
    http://www.askmen.com/entertainment/...h-of-porn.html

    You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.
  • Mickey_
    • Nov 2005
    • 4238

    #2
    What's the purpose? Doom and gloom?

    I personally find it is better (not to mention more productive) to focus on opportunities than it is to complain about the changing world around you.


    LifeSelector Affiliates - Make money today promoting the online porn of tomorrow.

    mb [at] lifeselector.com

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    • signupdamnit
      Confirmed User
      • Aug 2007
      • 6697

      #3
      The adult entertainment business, centered in the San Fernando Valley, has
      weathered several recessions since it took off with the advent of home video in
      the 1980s. But this time the industry is not dealing with just a weakened
      economy. A growing abundance of free content on the Internet is undercutting
      consumers' willingness to pay for porn, and with it the ability of many workers
      to earn a living in the business.

      For Stern, 23, the rapid decline of job opportunities in the porn business over
      the last year has been dramatic. She has gone from working four or five days a
      week to one and now has employers pressuring her to do male-female sex scenes
      for $700, a 30% discount from the $1,000 fee that used to be the industry
      standard.

      Less than two years ago, Stern earned close to $150,000 annually, sometimes
      turned down work and drove a Mercedes-Benz CLK 350. Now she's aggressively
      reaching out for jobs and making closer to $50,000 a year.

      As for that Mercedes? She's replacing it with a used Chevy Trailblazer -- from
      her parents.

      "The opportunities in this industry really are disappearing," Stern said. "It's
      extremely stressful."

      Industry insiders estimate that since 2007, revenue for most adult production
      and distribution companies has declined 30% to 50% and the number of new films
      made has fallen sharply.

      "We've gone through recessions before, but we've never been hit from every side
      like this," said Mark Spiegler, head of the Spiegler Girls talent agency, who
      has worked in porn since 1995.

      "It's the free stuff that's killing us, and that's not going away," said Dion
      Jurasso, owner of porn production company Combat Zone, which has seen its
      business fall about 50% in the last three years.

      Porn is hardly the only segment of the media industry struggling with these
      issues. But its problems appear to be more severe. Whereas online piracy has
      forced big changes in the music industry and is starting to affect movies and
      television, it has upended adult entertainment.

      At least five of the 100 top websites in the U.S. are portals for free
      pornography, referred to in the industry as "tube sites," according to Internet
      traffic ranking service Alexa .com. Some of their content is amateur work
      uploaded by users and some is acquired from cheap back catalogs, but much of it
      is pirated.

      Sites like Pornhub, YouPorn and RedTube attract more users than TMZ and the
      Huffington Post. The porn sites are even bigger than Pirate Bay, the top portal
      for illegal downloads of movies, TV shows and music.

      http://articles.latimes.com/2009/aug...s/fi-ct-porn10

      ---------------------------




      Porn Has No One But Itself to Blame

      Sex isn?t selling: This is the headline of an issue of Canadian Business
      magazine. Of course it?s long been one of the truisms of marketing?sex sells.
      But this article contends that for the first time in recent memory sex no longer
      accomplishes what it once did; it no longer piles up the profits.

      The focus of the article is pornography and its coming decline. The author
      contends that pornography has been unable to adapt to the new realities of the
      Internet, realities that dictate that everything must be free, or at least
      everything that can be shared in bits and bytes. Porn producers are reporting
      that they have seen revenue fall 80% from their best days; Playboy is bleeding
      money and laying off staff; actors who were once paid $2,000 for a single scene
      are now being offered just half of that; revenue for major distributors has
      fallen precipitously.
      http://www.challies.com/articles/por...tself-to-blame

      You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

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      • signupdamnit
        Confirmed User
        • Aug 2007
        • 6697

        #4
        Originally posted by Mickey_
        What's the purpose? Doom and gloom?

        I personally find it is better (not to mention more productive) to focus on opportunities than it is to complain about the changing world around you.
        Just because I'm an asshole.

        No actually it's 50% to annoy people like you and the other 50% is just to have a place to link to the next time someone says things are better than ever.

        The industry is in denial. Acceptance is the first step towards positive change...
        Last edited by signupdamnit; 03-14-2014, 08:42 AM.

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        • Wizzo
          2011 GFY Hall of Fame!
          • Nov 2000
          • 15224

          #5
          "someone has set up a tripod in front of their TV to copy it"

          "Sapoutzis sees that as a sign that the porn business is maturing, not dying." QFT!
          Last edited by Wizzo; 03-14-2014, 08:43 AM.
          Looking for Opportunity!

          Comment

          • ITraffic
            Confirmed User
            • Jul 2013
            • 2725

            #6
            since you have moved on to dating, cams and mainstream why don't you post some tutorials and tips on how to make money in those verticals? it would be more constructive. i think everyone is aware the paysite model isn't what it was in 2007.

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            • signupdamnit
              Confirmed User
              • Aug 2007
              • 6697

              #7
              Top 5 Reasons Porn-for-Profit Is Dying

              Why is the adult film business in dire straits? Sasha Grey and other stars answered The Daily Beast?s question this weekend at the porn industry?s annual convention in Las Vegas.

              Every January, the Adult Entertainment Expo in Las Vegas is the biggest annual gathering of the adult film industry. But the biggest is suddenly a lot smaller. The 2010 AEE convention, which ran Thursday through Sunday, had shrunk from packing two floors of the Venetian?s Sands Expo Center last year down to one floor (and that one with lots of empty space).

              ?The AEE show is an example of what the business faces. There are fewer fans, less foot traffic, and less companies exhibiting,? said Steve Javors, editor in chief of industry trade publication XBIZ. ?During the 2000s, porn kept expanding outward. We thought there was an insatiable appetite for porn, and there would keep being more companies and more porn stars. Now, we are finding out that is not true.?

              ?People used to be ashamed to say their girlfriends did porn. That is gone. Anyone can afford a Web site now,? said Pete Housley, who aggregates porn on Twitter.

              As for the concurrent, AVN Awards?AVN being another adult industry trade publication?which the porn world bills as their Oscars, it moved from the arena-size Mandalay Bay Events Center to the few-thousand-seats theater at The Palms. AVN head Paul Fishbein sounded like he was echoing the words of Spinal Tap?s manager when he described the venue switch as not so much to a smaller space, but one more ?selective and intimate.?
              1. Piracy.

              According to porn star Dana DeArmond: ?If people don?t realize it is stealing and start paying for their porn then performers are going to stop performing.?

              Among the acts DeArmond performs (solo or in group sex with men and/or women) are anal sex and double penetration. ?I don?t think people are just going to do what porn stars do for free and put it on the Internet,? she said.

              ?It is stealing, and unfortunately it is hitting the adult industry hard right now,? said Sasha Grey, the current porn It Girl.

              According to XBIZ?s Javors, thanks to illegal downloading and ?Tube? sites like YouPorn, sales of porn?s most profitable product, DVDs, have taken a huge hit this past year. Javors said: ?Piracy is the biggest single factor contributing to the economic malaise we are in. How can you compete with free??

              Dan O?Connell, president of Girlfriends Films, explained how his company has been among the few to claim an increase in DVD sales from 2009. ?We?ve been able to grow our DVD sales, because we have been aggressive going after piracy. In the past eight months, we have taken down 17,000 pirated videos of ours by just sending out letters warning them that we will sue.?

              But Girlfriends Films is just one company that averages about five movies a month. And even Grey does not see DVDs sticking around much longer. ?I think DVDs are going to be a collectors? medium like vinyl,? she said.
              http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-is-dying.html

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              • MaDalton
                I am Amazing Content!
                • Feb 2004
                • 39861

                #8
                the initial flaw in this is that too many people still see this business as mainly based in the US
                AmazingContent.com - providing only the best content and service since 2003
                Monetize your content on Veegaz.com - one of Germanies largest VOD sites
                Got German traffic? We convert it into money for you!
                Email: oltecconsult [at] gmail [dot] com

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                • signupdamnit
                  Confirmed User
                  • Aug 2007
                  • 6697

                  #9
                  Money Trouble in Internet Porn

                  The online porn industry is facing a financial crisis as consumers find free alternatives. (Spencer Platt/Getty Images)

                  Online pornography helped to build the Internet. It was the cutting edge of e-commerce when sites like Amazon.com were just starting. But today the porn industry is suffering. It?s got lots of eyeballs, but experts say fewer are paying to view. A porn empire based in San Francisco is trying to recover by using data analytics.
                  Industry crisis

                  That is exactly the problem, according to Internet porn mogul Peter Acworth. ?We?re suffering what happened to the music industry a while back. It?s becoming much easier to get content for free and people are less apt to want to pay for it,? he says.

                  Acworth is founder of Kink.com, a San Francisco fetish porn conglomerate that had 205 million views last year alone.

                  Back in the late 1990s, Acworth was getting his Ph.D. in finance at Columbia University. He realized there was lots of money to be made in streaming sex. So he started video shoots right out of his own room. ?You honestly couldn?t add the sites fast enough. It was like money was falling from the sky.?

                  It?s becoming much easier to get content for free and people are less apt to want to pay for it.? Peter Acworth, Kink.com founder

                  Earnings were so strong that, by 2006, the company decided to make a major real estate investment and purchased the Armory ? a towering building that takes up a city block in the Mission District.

                  But because of piracy and an explosion of free sites, the heyday is over.

                  The porn industry trade group Free Speech Coalition estimated that global revenue plummeted by 50 percent, from $20 billion in 2007 to $10 billion by 2011. Kink.com saw a decline in its own revenue for the first time that year.
                  http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2014/0...internet-porn/

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                  • signupdamnit
                    Confirmed User
                    • Aug 2007
                    • 6697

                    #10
                    LAS VEGAS -- The atmosphere is festive, and how could it not be when scores of naked or almost-naked women are turning the place into a real exhibition center and banners promote upcoming porno versions of "Avatar" and "Spider-Man."

                    But behind all the giggles and surgically enhanced jiggles is yet another American industry facing a perilous time brought on by drastic changes in technology and an stagnant economy that has even prompted even the sexually ambitious to pinch pennies.

                    The porn business, convening at the Sands Convention Center in Las Vegas this weekend for the annual Adult Entertainment Expo, is feeling limp these days thanks to a plummet in the sale of its one-time cash cow, DVDs. Websites that offer free downloads or views of adult movies and that allow amateurs to upload their own have forced this once seemingly invincible business to grapple with an uncertain future.

                    "They're destroying us," said Michelle Liss, sales manager of Fleshdrive, a company that sells flash drives preloaded with adult films. "Business is down because of these sites and it sucks. I have friends who come up to me and they say, 'Oh, my god, I saw this great site,' and I say, 'You realize you're hurting my business?' "

                    The trade show itself is feeling it, too. About 170 exhibitors are here this year, down from more than 200 in past years. Attendance, about 20,000 people are expected, is about the same, but that's partly because the show sells tickets to the public and Las Vegas already has about 150,000 extra visitors this weekend for the 2011 Consumer Electronics Show.
                    http://www.aolnews.com/2011/01/09/po...gling-economy/

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                    • signupdamnit
                      Confirmed User
                      • Aug 2007
                      • 6697

                      #11
                      Will Porn Become a Mainstream Business?

                      Not too long ago, the average consumer would blush when talking about Larry Flynt's business. Today, they very well may be promoting his company on their shirt.

                      As the porn film business continues to see revenues decline ? a victim of both piracy and the copious amounts of free content on the Internet ? more and more adult companies have begun expanding into new fields of business. And business has been good.

                      Hustler leads the charge in this area, having spent years building up a successful clothing line, opening casinos and even publishing the occasional mainstream magazine (including the video game-centric Tips &Tricks Codebook).
                      "You can debate which industry is most affected by piracy," she said. "It might be a toss-up between adult and music. I know for us, adult is higher. For example, if you do a search for a non-piracy word like 'porn,' it's basically all piracy sites that show up. That doesn't happen if you search for music or an artist's name. ? We understood a lot from the side of the copyright holder how important it was to customize [anti-piracy tools] and make them cost effective. A lot of the anti-piracy firms are very expensive - and people who want to be active in anti-piracy are being impacted because they can't afford [those firms]."
                      http://www.cnbc.com/id/100364346

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                      • RyuLion
                        • Mar 2003
                        • 32364

                        #12
                        lol...........

                        Adult Biz Consultant A tech head since 1995
                        Affiliate Support: Chaturbate | CCBill Live

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                        • signupdamnit
                          Confirmed User
                          • Aug 2007
                          • 6697

                          #13
                          Poll: Porn Revenues Exceed $5 Billion According to Industry Survey

                          LOS ANGELES ? In spite of an economic recession, an oversupply of free porn online and rampant piracy, the business of porn continues to impact the global economy on a multi-billion-dollar level, according to the results of a new industry poll conducted by media organization XBIZ.

                          The majority of industry insiders place annual gross revenues in the $5 billion-plus range worldwide. The results are based on responses from members of XBIZ.net, the adult entertainment industry?s leading social network.

                          While revenues have declined sharply in some market segments of the industry since the mid-2000s, the demand for adult entertainment remains strong. In an era where mobile content delivery and interactive entertainment is gaining market share, XBIZ asked industry members: "In your estimation, how big is the porn industry today??

                          Of the 311 respondents, 36% believe the industry generates revenues of ?more than $5 billion per year,? while 29% say that number is ?more than $10 billion per year.? Another 21% estimate the industry to be worth ?more than $1 billion per year,? while the remaining 14% say it?s ?less than $1 billion.?
                          http://www.xbiz.com/news/151751

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                          • signupdamnit
                            Confirmed User
                            • Aug 2007
                            • 6697

                            #14
                            Porn is not recession-proof.

                            Like many other industries, the adult entertainment business did not exit the Great Recession unscathed, but, rather, it's been hobbled by the events of the past four years.

                            Some estimate that the projected $10 billion industry -- once thought to be largely impervious to economic downturns -- has lost about 40 percent of its sales base. The reining in of consumer spending combined with Napster-like offerings of free adult content on the Internet contributed to the sharp decline, says an executive for industry trade news site XBIZ.

                            Locally, those trends played out in a 23 percent drop in revenue from 2007 to 2011 for Boulder's New Frontier Media Inc., a firm that produces and distributes adult content.
                            http://www.denverpost.com/business/c...frontier-media

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                            • signupdamnit
                              Confirmed User
                              • Aug 2007
                              • 6697

                              #15
                              XBIZ, an organization that covers all sectors of the adult entertainment business, says piracy, free online content and legal challenges have all adversely affected the industry.

                              "The adult entertainment industry is facing its first downturn ever in its history," said Alec Helmy, president of XBIZ. Helmy also added that attendance figures at several trade shows have declined steadily in the past several years.
                              http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/10/05...tml?eref=ib_us

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                              • signupdamnit
                                Confirmed User
                                • Aug 2007
                                • 6697

                                #16
                                Porn industry feeling pain as expo hits Vegas
                                Industry gathers at annual convention to battle slumping sales, piracy

                                The economic downturn has many companies looking for ways to survive, and those in the adult-entertainment industry are also finding it?s not always easy to shake a recession.
                                http://www01.lasvegasweekly.com/news...po-hits-vegas/

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                                • signupdamnit
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Aug 2007
                                  • 6697

                                  #17
                                  In 1998, a study by Forrester Research on the porn industry - including paraphernalia, internet, cable television and magazines - estimated it was worth up to $10billion.

                                  This year, the worldwide industry is estimated to be worth up to $5billion - however, it is difficult to know how accurate these figures are.

                                  The mainstream industry has been hit not only through piracy and free content, but people choosing to pay to watch live sex acts over the internet.
                                  Steven Hirsch, who founded porn company Vivid Entertainment, told the newspaper: 'We're dealing with a perfect storm: decliing DVD sales, rampant piracy, free content and a weak economy.'

                                  Piracy, as in the film and music industries, is causing huge problems for mainstream porn companies.

                                  Kathee Brewer, an editor at AVN, which covers the porn industry, told USA Today:'The tubes are making money off the studio's investment of time and money, while the studios are forced to spend ever larger chunks tof change to police the tubes and send endless takedown notices.'
                                  http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...orn-stars.html

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                                  • arock10
                                    Confirmed User
                                    • Jan 2006
                                    • 6217

                                    #18
                                    Where does it say google caused most of the problems of the last couple years
                                    Sup

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                                    • CurrentlySober
                                      Too lazy to wipe my ass
                                      • Aug 2002
                                      • 38947

                                      #19
                                      i take a dirty delight in dollop...


                                      👁️ 👍️ 💩

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                                      • signupdamnit
                                        Confirmed User
                                        • Aug 2007
                                        • 6697

                                        #20
                                        Free Porn Threatens Adult Film Industry
                                        June 11, 2007

                                        "Free porn" just might be the two most exciting or frightening words in the English language, depending on your point of view.

                                        And they're especially threatening to the adult film industry, which has made billions through the sales of DVDs, videos, and sex products.

                                        After two decades of phenomenal growth in profits, the porn industry is facing some major challenges as its X-rated DVDs and Internet content lose out to free videos and photos distributed by amateurs on the Web.

                                        Sales and rentals of adult DVDs fell 30 percent in the last two years and sales of Internet-based porn, while still growing, have started to plateau, according to Adult Video News, an industry trade publication.

                                        "The DVD market is a battle that we're losing," says Drew Rosenfeld, the creative director of Hustler Video Group. "Looking back historically, we're at less than half in numbers. Even a line like Barely Legal, which is our hero brand, used to be off the charts and it's gone down to a third of what it used to be a few years ago."

                                        But pornographers will keep trying to adopt changes and hoping to make a buck. "I don't really think that there is less money to be made because of free content," says Drew Rosenfeld, the creative director of Hustler Video Group. "We're making important changes, from hard DVDs to video on demand and we're focusing a lot of production for Internet purposes first. In the past, we've put it online 90-100 days after we sell it on DVD. Now we're shooting it for the Web, which is less expensive for us and the consumer."

                                        Longtime observers of the industry are more pessimistic about its prospects. "Why buy it when you can get it for free on the Internet," says Luke Ford, an industry gossip columnist, comparing pornography to the plight of newspapers losing readers to the Web. "There is less and less reason to pay for porn because there are plenty of free two to three-minute clips out there."
                                        http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=3259416

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                                        • Tofu
                                          The Video Specialist
                                          • Jul 2003
                                          • 5615

                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by MaDalton
                                          the initial flaw in this is that too many people still see this business as mainly based in the US
                                          This! ^^
                                          tofu916 video services - tofu916.com
                                          twitter: tofu916 | skype: tofu916 | tel: 916-672-TOFU | e: tofu # tofu916.com

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                                          • signupdamnit
                                            Confirmed User
                                            • Aug 2007
                                            • 6697

                                            #22
                                            Barnett said it's already hard enough for an adult entrepreneur to make a profit since in the past four years revenue has declined industrywide by 80-90 percent, partly because of the popularity of tube sites operated abroad. Barnett said his own business has shrunk by 50 percent during the past four years.
                                            http://www.xbiz.com/news/news_piece....=all&q=rule+11

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                                            • EddyTheDog
                                              Just Doing My Own Thing
                                              • Jan 2011
                                              • 25433

                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by MaDalton
                                              the initial flaw in this is that too many people still see this business as mainly based in the US

                                              Comment

                                              • Rochard
                                                Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                • Dec 2001
                                                • 75733

                                                #24
                                                Everyone keeps talking about the "decline" of our industry. We just went through a massive worldwide recession: Everything declined. Every industry took a huge hit. Our industry, just like every other industry.
                                                Herschel Savage
                                                Brooklyn, NY

                                                Comment

                                                • Jel
                                                  Confirmed User
                                                  • Feb 2007
                                                  • 6904

                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by Mickey_
                                                  What's the purpose? Doom and gloom?

                                                  I personally find it is better (not to mention more productive) to focus on opportunities than it is to complain about the changing world around you.


                                                  and USE the tubes as part of your overall traffic generation scheme

                                                  Comment

                                                  • signupdamnit
                                                    Confirmed User
                                                    • Aug 2007
                                                    • 6697

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by Rochard
                                                    Everyone keeps talking about the "decline" of our industry. We just went through a massive worldwide recession: Everything declined. Every industry took a huge hit. Our industry, just like every other industry.
                                                    During the absolute worst of the recession I was making almost record sales with a certain paysite. It paid all of my living expenses from that one site alone. This was late 2008-2009. Now the site is lucky to make a sale a month. The surfers were trained to expect it for free. It wasn't just the recession.

                                                    But let us say your theory is correct. Should not things be rebounding by now?

                                                    You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                    Comment

                                                    • Sly
                                                      Let's do some business!
                                                      • Sep 2004
                                                      • 31377

                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by signupdamnit
                                                      During the absolute worst of the recession I was making almost record sales with a certain paysite. It paid all of my living expenses from that one site alone. This was late 2008-2009. Now the site is lucky to make a sale a month. The surfers were trained to expect it for free. It wasn't just the recession.

                                                      But let us say your theory is correct. Should not things be rebounding by now?
                                                      Why is your experience the truth and everyone else's experience a delusional bro lie?
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                                                      • signupdamnit
                                                        Confirmed User
                                                        • Aug 2007
                                                        • 6697

                                                        #28
                                                        Originally posted by Sly
                                                        Why is your experience the truth and everyone else's experience a delusional bro lie?
                                                        Hmm. My experience matches what the press both within and outside the industry is saying. I have to ask the same question of you?

                                                        Another question, why do you always come into these threads and make bitchy comments to people -- especially affiliates? You've been doing it for years.
                                                        Last edited by signupdamnit; 03-14-2014, 09:59 AM.

                                                        You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Magnetron
                                                          Lord High Groundhog
                                                          • Jun 2013
                                                          • 1841

                                                          #29
                                                          Originally posted by arock10
                                                          where does it say google caused most of the problems of the last couple years
                                                          +1.6666666666666
                                                          .
                                                          Approach the mirrored reflection saying his name three times : "Butcher .... Butcher .... Butcher ....."
                                                          and wait to see if this Bogeyman urban legend manifests in the background, looming over shoulder
                                                          While your neighbors were busy killing off everyone in the neighborhood
                                                          with your own butcher knife in hand concealed behind your back
                                                          you stood for
                                                          ever before the window saying
                                                          nothing

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                                                          • 12clicks
                                                            Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                            • Jan 2001
                                                            • 19813

                                                            #30
                                                            the weak die.
                                                            apparently, before they die, they post excuses why on chat boards.
                                                            I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • signupdamnit
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Aug 2007
                                                              • 6697

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by arock10
                                                              Where does it say google caused most of the problems of the last couple years
                                                              One of the articles referenced mentions Google. Namely that piracy sites dominate the porn terms but not the non-porn terms. Google has been a big part of the problem. They have helped to enable it.

                                                              You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                              Comment

                                                              • signupdamnit
                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                • Aug 2007
                                                                • 6697

                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by 12clicks
                                                                the weak die.
                                                                apparently, before they die, they post excuses why on chat boards.
                                                                So AVN Theo is weak? And XBIZ, Forbes, Rolling Stones, ABC, etc? Or are they all trolls?

                                                                You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                                Comment

                                                                • signupdamnit
                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                  • Aug 2007
                                                                  • 6697

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Don't shoot the messenger. <shrug>

                                                                  You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Sly
                                                                    Let's do some business!
                                                                    • Sep 2004
                                                                    • 31377

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by signupdamnit
                                                                    Hmm. My experience matches what the press both within and outside the industry is saying. I have to ask the same question of you?

                                                                    Another question, why do you always come into these threads and make bitchy comments to people -- especially affiliates? You've been doing it for years.
                                                                    Because I'm bitter and can't figure out how to make a penny.
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                                                                    • AmeliaG
                                                                      Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                      • Jan 2003
                                                                      • 10664

                                                                      #35
                                                                      That $14 billion number was always a fiction. At the time it was first bandied about, Playboy had a market cap of a hundred million and grossed about three hundred million a year. Even if you figure that Penthouse, Hustler, Vivid, and Private, every single major cam and dating player, and all the $30+PPS guys all did much bigger numbers than those, at the time, there is no way porn ever accounted for that much financial activity.
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                                                                      • EddyTheDog
                                                                        Just Doing My Own Thing
                                                                        • Jan 2011
                                                                        • 25433

                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by 12clicks
                                                                        the weak die.
                                                                        apparently, before they die, they post excuses why on chat boards.
                                                                        Your story is the story of the decline of porn...

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • signupdamnit
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Aug 2007
                                                                          • 6697

                                                                          #37
                                                                          Originally posted by Sly
                                                                          Because I'm bitter and can't figure out how to make a penny.
                                                                          It must be something but at least your employer is paying you to do it.

                                                                          You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • 12clicks
                                                                            Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                            • Jan 2001
                                                                            • 19813

                                                                            #38
                                                                            Originally posted by EddyTheDog
                                                                            Your story is the story of the decline of porn...
                                                                            if that helps you sleep at night, kid.
                                                                            I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • 12clicks
                                                                              Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                              • Jan 2001
                                                                              • 19813

                                                                              #39
                                                                              Originally posted by signupdamnit
                                                                              So AVN Theo is weak? And XBIZ, Forbes, Rolling Stones, ABC, etc? Or are they all trolls?
                                                                              Is Theo in here whining like a little girl before he dies? And XBIZ, Forbes, Rolling Stones, ABC, etc? Or are they all in here crying?
                                                                              I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • DWB
                                                                                Registered User
                                                                                • Jul 2003
                                                                                • 31779

                                                                                #40
                                                                                Originally posted by 12clicks
                                                                                the weak die.


                                                                                Originally posted by signupdamnit
                                                                                So AVN Theo is weak? And XBIZ, Forbes, Rolling Stones, ABC, etc? Or are they all trolls?
                                                                                Time will tell. But I no longer worry about what is happening to others, as I'm too busy focusing on my own business that is growing, not shrinking.

                                                                                When I worried about "the industry," my business shrank. When I stopped caring about "the industry" and focused 100% on myself, my business stopped shrinking and started to grow again and has been growing every since.

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • 12clicks
                                                                                  Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                  • Jan 2001
                                                                                  • 19813

                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  Originally posted by DWB

                                                                                  When I worried about "the industry," my business shrank. When I stopped caring about "the industry" and focused 100% on myself, my business stopped shrinking and started to grow again and has been growing every since.
                                                                                  I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • CaptainHowdy
                                                                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                    • Dec 2004
                                                                                    • 94034

                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Adraco or die ...

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • signupdamnit
                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                      • Aug 2007
                                                                                      • 6697

                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by AmeliaG
                                                                                      That $14 billion number was always a fiction. At the time it was first bandied about, Playboy had a market cap of a hundred million and grossed about three hundred million a year. Even if you figure that Penthouse, Hustler, Vivid, and Private, every single major cam and dating player, and all the $30+PPS guys all did much bigger numbers than those, at the time, there is no way porn ever accounted for that much financial activity.
                                                                                      Possible.

                                                                                      Even now I think there are serious misconceptions. People seem to think all the money is in the tubes, right? Since they have taken over and all. Well...

                                                                                      200 million uniques a day * $2.5 per 1000 uniques = $500,000 / day

                                                                                      $500,000 * 365 = $182.5 million

                                                                                      That's it. And that is revenue not profit. Now look at what was lost industry wide to generate that revenue. All this is right in front of our faces but we do not see it. It's a shame. If anything we should learn from these mistakes.
                                                                                      Last edited by signupdamnit; 03-14-2014, 10:24 AM.

                                                                                      You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

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                                                                                      • EddyTheDog
                                                                                        Just Doing My Own Thing
                                                                                        • Jan 2011
                                                                                        • 25433

                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by 12clicks
                                                                                        if that helps you sleep at night, kid.
                                                                                        I don't blame you - Greed is natural - It was going to happen with or without you - Your well documented greed is the story of the demise of internet porn though...

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • Sly
                                                                                          Let's do some business!
                                                                                          • Sep 2004
                                                                                          • 31377

                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by EddyTheDog
                                                                                          I don't blame you - Greed is natural - It was going to happen with or without you - Your well documented greed is the story of the demise of internet porn though...
                                                                                          This year is about tubes, not cross sales. Let's stay focused.
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                                                                                          • signupdamnit
                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                            • Aug 2007
                                                                                            • 6697

                                                                                            #46
                                                                                            Originally posted by DWB




                                                                                            Time will tell. But I no longer worry about what is happening to others, as I'm too busy focusing on my own business that is growing, not shrinking.

                                                                                            When I worried about "the industry," my business shrank. When I stopped caring about "the industry" and focused 100% on myself, my business stopped shrinking and started to grow again and has been growing every since.
                                                                                            You're right. But it's frustrating to have sat here and watched it all unfold and to see people in complete denial about it. All that means is we've learned nothing as an industry and it'll probably just happen again and again. We can't even all agree there exists a problem.

                                                                                            You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • EddyTheDog
                                                                                              Just Doing My Own Thing
                                                                                              • Jan 2011
                                                                                              • 25433

                                                                                              #47
                                                                                              Originally posted by Sly
                                                                                              This year is about tubes, not cross sales. Let's stay focused.
                                                                                              I thought we did tubes last year and moved back to cross sales?..

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              • Markul
                                                                                                Likes Pie
                                                                                                • Dec 2007
                                                                                                • 12404

                                                                                                #48
                                                                                                Originally posted by signupdamnit
                                                                                                You're right. But it's frustrating to have sat here and watched it all unfold and to see people in complete denial about it. All that means is we've learned nothing as an industry and it'll probably just happen again and again. We can't even all agree there exists a problem.
                                                                                                So? Even if we could all agree that there was a problem, what do you propose that we do to solve it?
                                                                                                But.... I pulled out...

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • 12clicks
                                                                                                  Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                  • Jan 2001
                                                                                                  • 19813

                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                  Originally posted by EddyTheDog
                                                                                                  I don't blame you - Greed is natural - It was going to happen with or without you - Your well documented greed is the story of the demise of internet porn though...
                                                                                                  as I said, blame me for your failure if it helps you sleep nights.
                                                                                                  In the mean time, those of us who can change with the times and stay legal will thrive. Those of you who whine about the demise of internet porn will wink out eventually.
                                                                                                  I'm not a dinosaur, I'm a crocodile. I've seen dinosaurs come and go and I'm left unimpressed.

                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                  • EddyTheDog
                                                                                                    Just Doing My Own Thing
                                                                                                    • Jan 2011
                                                                                                    • 25433

                                                                                                    #50
                                                                                                    Originally posted by 12clicks
                                                                                                    as I said, blame me for your failure if it helps you sleep nights.
                                                                                                    In the mean time, those of us who can change with the times and stay legal will thrive. Those of you who whine about the demise of internet porn will wink out eventually.
                                                                                                    Did it ever occur to you that screwing the surfers would make it harder to do business in the future?..

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