Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17715875)

This quote is just a placeholder for everyone suggesting mobile/sms billing for this...

At 1.50 customer cost, you are going to pay 50% to affilaites? <G> That's already MORE than you are getting from the providers out of the 1.50!?

The logic is flawed, I am sorry... affiliates will never understand why you are only paying them 50% of .74 if the user paid 1.50...

On top of all of this, anything below $2 (or 1.99 to make it nice) is useless the second it comes from europe, since you will lose another roughly 18% to VAT.

I do disagree with TheDoc and such though, since this is working in europe, maybe not at 1.99 a clip, but it works at a per minute pricing logic very very well.

I think only option though is to pay affiliates around 25% or 50 USD PPS (which is doable if a big enough company does this).

Stocktrader, regarding billing.. you are not understanding I think why billing is so expensive... microbilling never worked before because of TRANSACTION charges, not %age... At $1 the transaction charges alone will account for at LEAST 10%. For most people out there using merchant accounts it is more like 25%. (25 cents flat per transaction). On top of that, the actual %age of around 5% for most people out there, and you already lose 30% ... at $1.99 it will still be 17.5% lost to billing right away.

At a normal growth rate that anyone big will want to achieve, you are likely looking at another 5% because of rolling reserves (after the first 6 months of 10% until the old reserves are being paid back).

So 22.5% for $1.99 or 35% for $1. Nobody out there is going to run this if they have to pay affiliates 50%... I for sure will not... I can buy traffic much much cheaper for this than paying affiliates 50%... paying $50 pps I would see no problem with though... Possibly more after testing for 1 year.

But, never compare this with itunes or such, as someone else mentioned, the difference in size between itunes and any porn site out there is huge. Simply because of age and gender you lose 60-70% possible targets, and the other 30-40% maybe, if we are lucky, half of them would ever surf porn and out of those, 10% will ever buy. So you are at 2% if you are very lucky...

This is reality... does not make your idea horrible, it just makes it very hard to handle... We make very good money with a similar logic in europe though, so it is doable.. and we will move it to the US soon.

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17715875)

Stocktrader, regarding billing.. you are not understanding I think why billing is so expensive... microbilling never worked before because of TRANSACTION charges, not %age... At $1 the transaction charges alone will account for at LEAST 10%. For most people out there using merchant accounts it is more like 25%. (25 cents flat per transaction). On top of that, the actual %age of around 5% for most people out there, and you already lose 30% ... at $1.99 it will still be 17.5% lost to billing right away.

At a normal growth rate that anyone big will want to achieve, you are likely looking at another 5% because of rolling reserves (after the first 6 months of 10% until the old reserves are being paid back).

So 22.5% for $1.99 or 35% for $1. Nobody out there is going to run this if they have to pay affiliates 50%... I for sure will not... I can buy traffic much much cheaper for this than paying affiliates 50%... paying $50 pps I would see no problem with though... Possibly more after testing for 1 year.

Originally Posted by stocktrader23 (Post 17714530)

I responded to Paul in another thread and typed so much I wanted to post it here. Don't believe what you read below? Fine. Bookmark this thread and get back to me in a few years.

You want to compete with Tubes?

Micropayments would work fine with the affiliate model but a couple of things have to happen.

1) They have to be true micropayments. I can watch a $20 DVD for $1 at Redbox, I'm not paying $8 for a clip of two lesbians fucking. Yes, I know you can get $8 for ultra niche shit but a tube can spend a pittance on content and get the same thing, or just steal it.

2) There needs to be ONE main gateway. Not 20, not even 2. This needs to be the gateway to paying for all vendors accepting micropayments on the web. Nobody wants to dump $20 in an account for every site out there so it has to be somewhere they can dump $20 but choose content from every site out there. All content needs to be on the site, well organized (not like most adult sites) and clean. No more black backgrounds and shitty banners everywhere.

Mark my words, the FIRST company to get micropayment billing done correctly will become extraordinarily wealthy.

3) The micropayment gateway needs to handle all affiliates for micropayment options, no signing up to 4000 sponsors to sell $1 videos. This would be like a CPA network in mainstream where once you sign up you can promote any video on the site. If you aren't familiar with CPA networks you need to look them up, it's how the affiliate model should be handled and is by industries that aren't so God damned worried about everyone stealing their affiliates.

4) Surfers need the option of purchasing one video at a time or loading funds. A discount could be given to those depositing blocks of money to their account but you can't make the single videos $5 each and $1 each if you preload $20. The minimum load needs to be reasonable as well, $10 is probably best, $20 would work. Bigger discounts could be given for bigger packages.

5) Affiliates needs to be paid on all referrals for LIFE. If you send someone to a single video and they purchase it for $1 you should also be paid when they come back and deposit $50 to their account. This commission should be 50%, no ifs ands or buts.

There are so many damn options with a system like this that it's ridiculous. You are taking the purchase down to the pure impulse buy level but still providing excellent value for those that come back for more.

Affiliates could promote a single video, whatever collection of videos they choose or the entire damn program.

An API could be made to easily allow affiliates to pull whatever content they want into their websites, blogs, etc.

People all over the world could afford to pay for porn. Mobile billing and other methods used to get money out of the poorer parts of the world would be accepted.

Every video provided by a paysite could be used to upsell that paysite at a REASONABLE monthly fee.

==========

Teen Lesbian Orgy - 35 Minutes - Provided by Only Teens.

<image>

<video description>

Watch this full video for only $1.00!

Did you enjoy this video? Browse for more or get unlimited access to the Only Teens video library for only $9.95 per month!

==========

Of course, affiliates should be paid for those sales as well.

THE QUESTION IS, WHICH SPONSORS WILL BE THE FIRST TO ALLOW THEIR ENTIRE CONTENT LIBRARY TO BE SOLD ONE VIDEO AT A TIME, AND AT A REASONABLE PRICE?

The sad part is that affiliates and sponsors would make more money under a system such as this than they do now. It wouldn't happen overnight but it would happen.

This is the future, bookmark it and call me in 5 years.

Peace. :thumbsup

Originally Posted by kazbalah (Post 17714653)

At least someone is thinking now, instead of just saying lets sue all the tubes :)

Originally Posted by ilnjscb (Post 17714681)

Micropayments are the answer. There is a resistance level at higher payments. MFC is proof that you don't need rebills, and that whales and cheapies will self identify under a reward system.

Someone needs to convince ?Leo? or someone like him to act as a "microbuck" purveyor to overcome the initial resistance. Imagine if MFC currency could follow girls to their solo web sites, with him collecting half the revenue?

Some cam girls already use MFC solely to drive traffic to their sites.

Once someone tests the waters with a 5$ purchase and finds:

1. CC doesn't say "Pussybucks" or some divorce prelude
2. No rebills
3. No underhanded shit
4. Reward system follows him all over the web, with extra messages and invites, bonus scenes, fansigns, etc - things you CANNOT get from tubes

his relationships begin to feel alive instead of exploitive, and that is what they'll pay for.

Originally Posted by nastymed (Post 17717181)

Micropayments already exist on several european market for 10 years .... nothing really new here.

The only problem is that most micropayment sponsors on these markets all went to credit card billing as it is 10 times more profitable....

Remember also that if you charge your user $2, telco + your micropayment provider will take at least 50% of it. So you have to live and pay your affiliates with $1.... good luck :2 cents: