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~TheDoc - ICQ7765825
It's all disambiguation
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"Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie MungerComment
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Hm... From what was previously said here on behalf of pornhub, I was under the impression that PAID means producers should pay you something to get listed. But if you say it aint so, OK.
So I went on to your site and found yet another version of what your content partnership program is there:
http://www.pornhub.com/information#partner
"Pornhub does not charge any upfront fees to join or upload. We receive compensation through your existing PPS or RevShare affiliate program. We only get paid when you get paid."
So where is the truth?
1. You pay producers.
2. Producers pay you.
3. Standard revshare/PPS scheme..
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ICQ: 38.89.22.76 e-mail: support AT ferrocash.comComment
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I'll second this quote. In addition, the FSC spent months of time researching solutions, gathering legal experts and studios for opinions, and now spending time to educate people all while not even covering their costs in order to benefit many companies in this industry.
I have a feeling that any one here who would negatively comment on the FSC, must not own any content because if you really are a content owner here your choices are simple:
1) Continue as you do now and find content on these tubes & send DMCA notices (or however your operate)
2) Participate in the program & set up your rules and recommendations for how to automatically handle content uploaded. (Of course you can go direct to Vobile & pay significantly more money)
Or I guess you can invent your own solution, but it can't just be an idea you throw out on GFY, you actually have to do it.Allison
President
TopBucks.com| PinkVisual.com|
[email protected]
Follow Me on Twitter:
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ICQ: 120353154
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Comment
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The only thing you got right here was the fact that the FSC will be there and provide an in-depth demo to the service and answer questions as well as hear out studios who want to contribute ideas that could maybe improve the program (a grand total of 1 hour).
In addition, there will be experienced IP attorneys on hand covering a range of topics, end-user litigation experts discussing that approach, torrent and cyberlocker industry experts, content removal service provider, and some additional technology experts. Of course the event is focused around studios who are able to absorb a higher level of information and then able to collaborate and share with each other and encourage follow through.Allison
President
TopBucks.com| PinkVisual.com|
[email protected]
Follow Me on Twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/PV_Alli
ICQ: 120353154
Check out PVLocker.com
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FerroCash - 50+ quality niche paysites to promote | 100K+ FHGs | Check recently added galleries
New sites | Pantyhose | Nylon | Shemale | Strapon | Lesbian | Mature/MILF | Anal | Old&Young | Gay | Feet
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ICQ: 38.89.22.76 e-mail: support AT ferrocash.comComment
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You forgot one....
3) Sue and try to get a settlement. Worked for you.
Not sure why you wouldn't list your option as a valid one.
Considering the FSC solution is paying a monthly free for tracking content across 16 tube sites (correct me if I'm wrong), I don't really see that as a service worth paying for. 16 tubes + 16 torrents + 16 file sharing site + 16 surfer boards, then it would be extremely valuable. Most of the smaller tubes scrape from the bigger ones, so you don't really have to police a lot of them. All I hear the FSC talking about is tubes, tubes, tubes, tubes.... and while that probably works for the Porn Valley DVD companies, those of us who make a living online know tubes are now just a small part of the problem.
Last I looked into it, the cost was around $400 to track only 10 videos. It would cost me 20k a month to police only 500 videos across only 16 tubes. Then when the find one of my videos on - say one of Nathan's tubes - the system swaps it out for a shorter teaser or ad video that I choose, that will sit in a pile of 1000s of full length free videos? Explain to me how that makes any sense at all, cause I don't get it.
I'm either missing a critical bit of information or simply can't comprehend what is going on, as Nathan condescendingly suggests is the case with everyone. The numbers just don't add up.
Someone please shed some light on the part of this solution that I am obviously missing.Comment
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no offense to anyone, but you can fingerprint my ass and pay me $450/month + annual members fee and you will get better results.
again no offense to anyone
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So... it's OK for you to assist law enforcement to go on IP hunts when it involves your sites and uploaders, but it's not OK for guys like Steve Lightspeed to go on the exact same hunt when it comes to his own content and downloaders?
You adamantly oppos downloaders being sued, all the while turning in uploaders to the FBI to face legal charges.
You're making my head hurt, Bro.Comment
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"Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie MungerComment
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I was expecting a condescending tone and the "Fabian Side Step" on that one, so thanks for being so predictable.
Forget the subject matter of the content, I'm purely talking about methods to ensure the uploader/downloader is actually the person who will be sued or have their doors smashed in by the FBI.
What user info could you possibly give law enforcement that would be any more accurate than what those who are suing downloaders can get?
I could create an account right now and upload all kinds of terrible shit. You wouldn't have anything more than a bogus IP address to go off of. Yet you were opposed to this exact method when it came to suing downloaders.
Now I'm wondering which is worse, getting a $1000 fine for not stealing a movie, or having the FBI bust my door down and arrest me for CP that I never owned or uploaded in the first place, name in the news paper and local TV associating me with CP, guilty until proven innocent, life ruined, and so on. Based on everything you said about suing downloaders, this would have to also apply to what you are doing. Unless of course, you have a magical way of knowing 100% sure that the account that loaded the video is actually the person who loaded it.
Just trying to understand. Shall I ask the DJ to play another song for you to dance to, or do you actually have an intelligent answer? It really is a simply question.Comment
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I trust the FBI more than some random lawyer out to make money.
I see a big difference, if you do not, so be it."Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie MungerComment
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Why doesn't Manwin just stop taking user submitted content. Trust me you can tell the difference between ama and studio. And if you can't....
The best is when I find my stuff on your tubes with the 2257 slate before the scene or our watermark clearly visable on the bottom right. Why accept that submission?Sean Holland
Vice President
OrbitalPay / Global Electronic Technology (GET)
SKYPE: iam.sean ::: sholland at orbitalpay.com
888-775-1500Comment
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Allison, something I'm kinda wondering about...
I DO protect my stuff. Been doing it for a while. Haven't had even one of my high res/high quality streams ripped and put up on a pirate site. That's after two years (and dozens of "experts" on GFY telling my it wouldn't work and it would be hacked and blah-blah).
But the ongoing problem still concerns my older stuff that's out there. The stuff I put out on .wmv in the first place and that I foolishly released on DVD. I have to keep removeyourcontent searching for that all the time because it comes up over and over and over.
How does "fingerprinting" help you in that way? For instance...Pink Visual already has a huge DVD catalog out there. And tons of stuff that has been pirated, I'd dare say your entire catalog.
I'm assuming that the "fingerprinting" will only have effect on the files that you NOW have had processed (if someone rips one and uploads the "Fingerprinted" one). But everything up until now is still out there (your members areas, your DVD rips, etc.)
Also, it would seem to me that as long as you're still releasing hard copy DVD's and not taking measures to keep your content in the members area on the paysites...then any of the thousands of bit torrent, rapidshare, megaupload, fileshare, and tubes that don't play by the rules are still going to be pirating you and devaluing your content?
What's your specific strategy for Top Bucks to combat those aspects (which are even more damaging than even Pornhub)?
As a long time affiliate of Top Bucks I'd kinda like to know if there is a chance that I can start converting the sites again.
By the way...does Kevin still own Top Bucks? Last I heard his name was a couple of years ago when he was going to meet some friends of mine down in South America. Just curious if it's still his company and how he's doing. Haven't seen him in person since 2002.Last edited by Robbie; 10-05-2010, 08:57 AM.-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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FerroCash - 50+ quality niche paysites to promote | 100K+ FHGs | Check recently added galleries
New sites | Pantyhose | Nylon | Shemale | Strapon | Lesbian | Mature/MILF | Anal | Old&Young | Gay | Feet
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Wish to review or evaluate our sites before promoting them? Contact me for free password.
ICQ: 38.89.22.76 e-mail: support AT ferrocash.comComment
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People are upset, at the FSC, because folks tell us they are dropping the ball in so many other areas. It's not this particular venture, if you will. They have injected themselves into an area they no nothing about. Sure, Gil is an attorney... but there's lots of attorneys out there. Volbile was an idea I mentioned at a closed-door meeting in Vegas some time ago. Dianne was actually handing out business cards to some other company, which was not Vobile, which had some fingerprint on it ...site was a shell. I remember. You weren't there but you can ask Diane.
What's wrong with that? This whole program is being presented as if folks don't have choices now. I am seeing it all over the place. If it's so effective, why aren't people lining up to join? It's certainly not due to lack of press. In any event, we will continue to send mass notices to tube sites.. in fact.. we may switch to mailed notices now
Again, Vobile is not in this for their good health. They have quotas that must be met and Adult is no exception.
We have. Thanks.Comment
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Watch the first 2 secs of this video - Case in point...
http://www.pornhub.com/view_video.ph...key=1298498983Sean Holland
Vice President
OrbitalPay / Global Electronic Technology (GET)
SKYPE: iam.sean ::: sholland at orbitalpay.com
888-775-1500Comment
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Sean...now why would you think that is one of your vids? Something that you put all the money, work, and risk into... only to see it devalued?Watch the first 2 secs of this video - Case in point...
http://www.pornhub.com/view_video.ph...key=1298498983
Anybody can plainly see that it an amateur movie shot by somebody at home and uploaded. Just because it has your companies name all over it doesn't prove anything man!
IF it was one of your vids...how the heck could you expect anybody to know the difference between that and a shot at home amateur vid?
-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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It's simple.
After the court case there was a meeting between Manwin and Pink Visual/Topbucks. They decided to get into bed with each other to further their own interests at the expense of others.
So any affiliate sending Pink Visual/Topbucks is now in bed with Pornhub.Comment
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Sean...now why would you think that is one of your vids? Something that you put all the money, work, and risk into... only to see it devalued?
Anybody can plainly see that it an amateur movie shot by somebody at home and uploaded. Just because it has your companies name all over it doesn't prove anything man!
IF it was one of your vids...how the heck could you expect anybody to know the difference between that and a shot at home amateur vid?
RIGHT!! sigh....Sean Holland
Vice President
OrbitalPay / Global Electronic Technology (GET)
SKYPE: iam.sean ::: sholland at orbitalpay.com
888-775-1500Comment
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So it's the same exact information.
You trust the FBI to kick in the correct door and literally ruin someones life, but not a court of law to figure out if a person downloaded the correct file or not, should the person fight it in court, which they have every right to do so IF they are wrongly accused.
The only difference is, the FBI will fuck someone up with no remorse. Shoot first, ask questions later. Guilty until proven innocent, but you will forever be associated with CP from that moment on. While if you are sued for downloading something you did not, you CAN challenge it in court, a check of your computer can prove you did or did not download it, and your life is not ruined.
You don't need to reply, you've said enough. You're just being a hypocrite, and that's OK. Everyone is a hypocrite to some degree.Comment
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Paul, word to the wise, start using the word allegedly in your posts.
You are very busy libelling people left right and centre here.
You insinuate I am a pirate all the time knowing I won't sue you for your attempts to damage my business because you cannot wrap your old brain around the fact someone can be both anti-blackmail and anti-piracy.
However, Fabian and Allison both have considerably more money than you. And much better lawyers.
I would, seriously, suggest that you stop posting your opinion on events as facts. Especially as you are almost always wrong anyway. Just using "I think" or "allegedly" you would protect your incorrect rants from legal repercussions.
HTH
Love
Damian
xoxoxComment
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Fabian. I took a look on your site and saw 2 more videos of girls being fucked by dogs. You don't flag the word dog as it's used in the tags term. So you're publishing obscene porn. The authorities have been notified.Comment
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interesting....
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I appreciate Allison and Nathan trying to explain this, its a step in the right direction. But one step in a hundred mile walk can be very discouraging. I have a few questions.
I watched the whole Montana Fishburne sex tape on SpankWire a few weeks ago. I checked a day later and the video was still up and had over 100,000 hits. I finally contacted Vivid and they said they would get it taken down. That's 100,000 surfers that saw a video that they should of paid $29.99 for.
Since Spankwire is not responsible for user uploads (and I assume it was a user upload) will the Tube sites help hold the uploader responsible for the copy right infringement?
If Vivid is not part of the program will they have any recourse or will it be the status quo? user uploads video, million people watch it, producer sends in DMCA, movie is taken down, on to the next one.Always looking for trades on Linkspun! Check my Id hereComment
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No, and I'll bet my left nut you don't either. I don't want to start a fight here but you saying I do NOT know if the content is infringing or not, is an insult. I'll bet my right nut that the poster does NOT have the copyrights to the 50+ moneyshot scenes ripped from numerous producers.
user: wackyluke
The CFNM compilation wackyluke posted is all copyrighted material. No, it's not mine but I know for a fact it's not your's or wackyluke's either. All I'm saying is this shit is obvious, painfully obvious, yet you hide behind DMCA instead of doing the right thing because doing the right thing earns you no money. Kudos ...
So I can go into your members area, rip all of your best scenes, make a huge cumshot compilation, post it on my sites, make a ton of money off of selling ad space, pay you nothing and it's all ok because it's "just like a comedy central clip on YouTube or a music video or whatnot"? SWEET!This is just like a comedy central clip on YouTube or a music video or whatnot...
I'm all over it.
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You can participate in the monetization program without participating in the tracker program. This allows you to handle your content as you wish on every tube and torrent that is integrated. Currently there are what 8 or 9 tubes integrated and that number will be growing. This one is a no brainer to participate in if you'd prefer not to be hunting down uploaded content & sending DMCA's to those tubes.You forgot one....
3) Sue and try to get a settlement. Worked for you. Not sure why you wouldn't list your option as a valid one.
Considering the FSC solution is paying a monthly free for tracking content across 16 tube sites (correct me if I'm wrong), I don't really see that as a service worth paying for. 16 tubes + 16 torrents + 16 file sharing site + 16 surfer boards, then it would be extremely valuable. Most of the smaller tubes scrape from the bigger ones, so you don't really have to police a lot of them. All I hear the FSC talking about is tubes, tubes, tubes, tubes.... and while that probably works for the Porn Valley DVD companies, those of us who make a living online know tubes are now just a small part of the problem.
Last I looked into it, the cost was around $400 to track only 10 videos. It would cost me 20k a month to police only 500 videos across only 16 tubes. Then when the find one of my videos on - say one of Nathan's tubes - the system swaps it out for a shorter teaser or ad video that I choose, that will sit in a pile of 1000s of full length free videos? Explain to me how that makes any sense at all, cause I don't get it.
I'm either missing a critical bit of information or simply can't comprehend what is going on, as Nathan condescendingly suggests is the case with everyone. The numbers just don't add up.
Someone please shed some light on the part of this solution that I am obviously missing.
Whether you use and how you use the FSC tracking system is a business decision. Yes, there are other services or you can handle them inhouse. We have over 3000 pieces of video content, yet not all 3,000 of them are abused by infringers. We have paid additional fees to have all of our titles tracked to get some data on where infringement is occurring the most & what titles of ours are impacted the most. It's quite surprising as it's not always what our most popular content is.
Now we have the data to determine how much and how often we want to track in the future. In addition, the data tracks all the DMCA notices & gathered legal evidence which is an extremely important component for us.
Every company has different business needs. Some companies make the most money on their newest releases & are primarily concerned about release from the most recent 6 months. Other companies have specific sets of content that have the most value that they want to ensure are not infringed. And other companies like us, end up quite surprised at which content is infringed on the most & how it tends to be specific to certain scenes or DVD's and not all over the board.
When it comes to tracking & removing (whether through the FSC or another system), the key component is studying what is going on and finding a way to prevent infringement in the first place.
The FSC APAP now has 9 tubes willing to use technology to help prevent infringement in the first place going forward. There are other strategies as well including how you distribute content to your paying members, end user litigation, and other technology uses & legal approaches.
This finger print and filtering announcement about taking steps in the right direction towards prevention vs. reaction.Allison
President
TopBucks.com| PinkVisual.com|
[email protected]
Follow Me on Twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/PV_Alli
ICQ: 120353154
Check out PVLocker.com
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People like us got hurt...but look at some of the web companies whose entire members areas are based on "exclusive" licensing with a DVD studio. They got the shit knocked out of them.
Wasn't long ago that xxxjay had posted that pornhub (and a million bit torrent and file sharing sites) had the latest stuff that was supposed to go to their members area BEFORE they even had a chance to put it in their members area!
It had already been released on DVD per the agreement they have with the studio that actually produces it...so it was dead on arrival for their paysite business because it had already been ripped and uploaded from the DVD.
I know that I'm not going to do anymore DVD's in the foreseeable future. DVD sales are mostly non-existent and it just destroys the much more lucrative internet sales.-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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when they steal my content, i want their hands cut off and their legs broken. Your program offers noting like that. They can still go on hosting illegal contentDon't let greediness blur your vision | You gotta let some shit slide
icq - 441-456-888Comment
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Actually, if you think about it...that IS your most popular content. Only you wouldn't know it from sales and money generated because it is being given away for free. There is definitely a cause and effect happening there Allison.
You can pretty much determine what your "best" stuff is by tracking what is being infringed on the most. And that is all potential lost revenue or potential lost future revenue.
-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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I'll answer the last part:
This is the whole reason why in my opinion content owners should participate. Why send a DMCA after something has been uploaded when you have an opportunity to handle it before it gets uploaded on the site?
Porn is porn and for the most part users just want to see MORE porn, and every studio benefits when other studios prevent and curb infringement.
RE: But one step in a hundred mile walk can be very discouraging.
Many cliche things I can say here like that the first steps are the hardest and we've already done those, but honestly with technology developing and studios empowering themselves to take those simple steps to just learn about their options from real experts is what we need and we see more and more announcements of studios making those steps and changing from a culture of victims to being empowered.Allison
President
TopBucks.com| PinkVisual.com|
[email protected]
Follow Me on Twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/PV_Alli
ICQ: 120353154
Check out PVLocker.com
Comment
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DWB, in my opinion a lawyer sending 1000 letters to people demanding money or else they will sue is worse than the FBI looking into a case of illegal content and possibly getting the wrong person because of some hacker...
Am on my phone only so will not reply to the rest until I am back home."Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie MungerComment
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Yeah, I agree here. Some of my first reactions were "oh that's why we don't sell that site that well". It is great data to have just for business decisions as well.Actually, if you think about it...that IS your most popular content. Only you wouldn't know it from sales and money generated because it is being given away for free. There is definitely a cause and effect happening there Allison.
You can pretty much determine what your "best" stuff is by tracking what is being infringed on the most. And that is all potential lost revenue or potential lost future revenue.Allison
President
TopBucks.com| PinkVisual.com|
[email protected]
Follow Me on Twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/PV_Alli
ICQ: 120353154
Check out PVLocker.com
Comment
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May I ask the OP what algorithm they are using to generate their visual hashing db for cross-checking?
And don't come back with "it's proprietary" since all this technology is public domain having been developped by public-funded researchers...
I have all 28 of the major papers describing different ways and each has their major advantages and major flaws....
Just the paper's authors names is all I require
thanks
For coding work - hit me up on andy // borkedcoder // com
(consider figuring out the email as test #1)
All models are wrong, but some are useful. George E.P. Box. p202Comment
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Allison
President
TopBucks.com| PinkVisual.com|
[email protected]
Follow Me on Twitter:
http://www.twitter.com/PV_Alli
ICQ: 120353154
Check out PVLocker.com
Comment
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Let me get this right. You have to pay for partner account to get your ad there but alternatively you can also have a "user" upload full movies and have it replaced with your ads for free?
Good luck
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Good to hear that we got FSC to get this technology together
Im so glad this program has been put together and im gonna try it out and make a wish list on how to improve it and see how this evolves. I looked into this type of technology a couple of years ago with a forensic fingerprinting program by civolution and they wanted like 30K so what APAP is bringing to the table may be cost effective to start.Comment
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