Something you idiots don't understand about this industry 'getting rid of the rif raf'.

almost done

Just a note, this is not to say that there aren't many smart motherfuckers here that will just find something else to be successful in. I'm talking to the idiotic affiliates talking like they are some big shit because they were lucky enough to put up a porn page 10 years ago when the money got dumped in their laps. They are posting all over this forum how they are glad to see the herd getting thinned when they are next up to be turned into hasbeen weiners.

All these monkeys that you speak of will open up tubes before they go out. That's why you monkeys better keep the cash flowing if you want to stay in business.

You don't realize that the more you destroy the affiliate model the deeper you dig your grave.

Let's do the time warp again.....

Umm, yep. That sounds about right.

It's just a jump... to the left!

Don't you make something like 500$/week as an affiliate? ... ...

yep, and it's all honest work with no scummy tuber site.

Still nearly %75 of my income comes from pay sites and %25 from cams/dating.

I can't start a tube just as easily as the next guy.


Don't think for a second that all these guys the industry is screwing won't turn to tubes and really fuck this industry up if things don't change.

So what else is new? It's been this way for a while. People have been trying to cut others out for the last decade. Many people here would sell their own mothers for a buck and they seem to always make decisions based on what makes them the most money in the short term no matter what. If you read the boards, who these people are should be clear after a while. Don't do business with them and your chances of getting screwed by them goes down a great deal. That's one thing I've always loved about reading GFY. I get to see the owners of the programs and the reps and I get to see what they really think about the industry and affiliates. I get to see if they seem like honest people or if they seem like psychopaths who only care about making an extra buck today. If you haven't been using this to your advantage, you should.

How the owner of the program views affiliates actually means a lot more than anything else in and of itself. Follow this and you'll find yourself screwed less often.

The industry is already fucked up... partially from tubes (and other forms of piracy), partially from other shady adult practices (card banging, cross sales, programs closing down and not paying), and partially from the economy and new cc regulations. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a dumbfuck, whether they are banking or not.

I agree with your thoughts.

I do not know of any business that has a dependency on sales/sales people. That can stay in business by eliminating the sales staff.

Not eliminate them, but convert from outsourcing the generation of sales (affiliates) to generating their own in-house sales....
Can you name any businesses that rely on outsourced sales people? (besides some MLM schemes)

Avon, Mary Kay, Kirby, Silpada, Fuller Brush, Tupperware, and on and on and on.

Possible legal consequences there. You'll also likely see a lack of creativity and adaptability. Collectively affiliates can be very crafty in generating new sales. There is a strong incentive due to them getting their cut. But if you think you can cut out affiliates go for it and see.

Even at 50% revshare the truth is probably that the affiliate gets about 20 - 40% of all revenue they send due to various issues. That's just the way it is. It's almost free money for the owner and that's how they can profit quickly. That's why the affiliate model has been used for so long. Cut it out and you might be okay in the short term but look out later on. I think many are just desperate to get short term revenues up. In the short term one easy way to do that is to screw your affiliates and take their cut. Then you hope they aren't elephants that you need later on down the road when those numbers sink. ;)

says the guy who exposed himself as broke and nobody.

Any commissioned salesman is theoretically an out sourced sales staff. What about a car lot that has 20 sales men too many. The theory is if 20 can sale 40 cars a week. Then 40 can sale 45 to 50 because each will be trying harder to make their commission. This business is no different.

I get confused with all the fuss about "affiliates" costing a program money. I got into this business a few years ago. I bought some domains. I signed up as an affiliate with a few programs. Took their promo content and built me some sites. And have been letting the search engines do their thing. I rarely if ever contact a program for something. I do it all my self. Have I cost them something yet?

So I advertise their product which helps me get visitors to my site. Many of those visitors click their product and end up at their site.

Now, every time I do happen to make a sale, what did I cost them?

Affiliates ( free salesmen), are not the problem. A little bad luck mixed with a little poor business management has been putting companies out of business for a long time in the past and will for a long time in the future.

Affiliates are the problem in todays climate. Most of you don't get it but that is just fact.

With tightening regulations from Visa, MC etc now. An affiliate is an extra risk because as a program you are processing their sales.

this is not about sales anymore this is about PROCESSING. Would you rather process 20k and get paid? or process 100k and get shut down?

program owners understand this now.

affiliates are 100% of the problem. Affiliates have no tie to the "brand" of a site and in reality do not care how they push that brand just as long as they make a sale.

The credit card companies do not care anymore. After shit hit the fan last year with negative billing they are closing up shop on everyone who may even as so smell of anything shady.

If you're an affiliate in general start to look into your own solutions. Few will take the advice. But if you cant see the shit storm ahead you arent a real webmaster anyway.

There is a real credit crunch happening in the world. Tie that in with the general view of pornography. There lies your answer.

It's about processing!

You lost me here. Every promo tool I use has a viewer click through me and to the programs site I am an affiliate for. The only thing they take with them from my site is a affiliate ID that they most likely do not know exists.

I send them to the programs site and they normally go through a extensive tour. and if they decide to join they do so on the Programs join page.

All I done was get them to the front door. It is up to them to finish the sale.

The only difference in my getting them to your their door or them getting them to their front door. is an affiliate code. Which if you have your own internal sales staff and you want to know who to give a bonus to for generating the most traffic/sales you will probably have them assigned a like code anyways.

So what is the difference? Why would any credit card processor have a problem with the affiliate breaking any regulations when it is the program that are 100% completely in control of that part of all transactions?

If I am as an affiliate right now breaking some law or fucking some program why does someone not notify me.

Sorry but this irritated me...

Why do you think i give a fuck if it irritated you?

So because you are too stupid to understand what is happening you're "irritated"?

why don't you just say: "I'm a fucking dumb ass and im going to shut up and ask questions and learn instead of spouting a bunch of crap"

Look i will spell it out for you because i feel bad for some of you idiots.
------------------------

when you own a BRAND ie site, you do not want to do anything to tarnish that brand. so you ONLY promote your brand in ways that would not tarnish it.

When you have affiliates you cannot control what they do. IE download this file when you get a porn membership.

--------------

LOL you are so clueless. Credit card companies can come in and SHUT PROCESSING DOWN. no processing. no money. it's that simple.

that is why you have companies going in house. they control the traffic thus their traffic is ALWAYS playing by the rules. thus processing stays up. thus they keep making money.

what don't you get? seriously.

Hey You are right I am a fucking idiot.

And because I am a fucking idiot I will try to word my thoughts so all the smart people will understand.

So EVERY affiliate is a low life rip off according to you. ( Like programs that cookies that expire almost immediately).

So EVERY affiliate abuses a sites Brand. ( your right I am a fucking idiot on this one because I do not know how to do this one. And do not care to learn).

So EVERY affiliate fucks their traffic over. But programs did do prechecked cross sells? and I have no choice but to let them if I even know they are doing it. Oh and I heard the processors loved this one.

What I really do not get is people here at GFY that think that just because they have been around thousands of posts and have been a member here for along period of time that they can talk to anyone any way they want and call anyone anything they want. I am not a dumb ass and I can prove that so I believe according to GFY rules if you tell a lie about someone you are breaking the rules... But hey you been here a long time you know the rules better than I do.

I do not know who you are and looks like I will never care to know. But I dam sure know that you do not know who I am. And I will point blank tell you I am not one of the low life's that does adult promotion. I have been a successful businessman for many years and I run a clean operation in all my endeavors.

Oh One more question. As A fucking idiot I do not have a clue as to why A program would offer to pay me 100% of the join fee. Now who is the fucking idiot me for taking them up on the offer of the program. And consider rebills are down this makes even less sense.

Yea it is always someone else's fault HUH?

There is some kind of powder in your nose

I give respect to all that deserve it. As a newer member to this board I give respect to those that have been around for awhile. But I am surely getting tired that just because I am a new member I am considered untrusted and can be abused like I just was by the comments made earlier by a long standing member.

I was asked a legitimate question to one of my comments above and I posted an answer. Them this 2003 member chimed in and said I was a dumb ass. That person is the one with some weird stuff up their nose. I gave it up in the 80's.

Please point out where i said this and i will read the rest of your post.

They are not all rip offs. But processing is no joke these days. The days of "blaming it on an affiliate" are over.

It's a risk reward thing not a "im legit and he's the rip off". There is nothing else to it.

If you don't get it why are you arguing?

Maybe it is because i get tired of seeing idiots like yourself who chime in like they know wtf they are talking about.

then when someone with balls ie me tells you to shut the fuck up. All you do is start whining when in the first place you could keep your mouth shut, ask real questions and stop giving your opinions like you're in the know.

You're calling a global recession and a massive credit crunch "bad luck". How often in your life have you seen MULTI MILLION DOLLAR COMPANIES fail at the rate at which is happening now? This is not "bad luck".

we are talking about REAL BUSINESS CLIMATE. Not what your mom and dad let you watch on the news. im not going to waste my time with people who live in their own fantasy world.

When I was a kid, I used to park my Plymouth Duster in the parking lot of the KFC near Greenwood and Danforth. I dropped my Pignose on the hood of my car, and I played the songs from that movie. I made a LOT of money playing Rocky Horror Picture Show songs to the fans who were leaving the Roxy.

I understood then (circa 1979) that I could make a better living outside of the theatre than I could inside the theatre.

I hope you don't miss the relevance of this post.

you're abusing yourself by posting about things you do not have the slightest clue about.

Johnny, 90% of the people here are spiteful failures who think they can freely spew shit because they are posting on a board called Go Fuck Yourself. Remarkably few of them have any influence or spend any cash - they just constantly drool shit out of the tips of their basement dwelling fingers.

I personally do not give a flying fuck what anyone here types.

I have no idea who you are refering to, as I don't give a fuck. Just don't get dragged down to their level and start arguing with them. Its not worth it.

This is a great place to do business. Just don't let some piece of shit newbie let them drag you into their bullshit drama.

I'd be happy to chat with you.

HAHA got to love todays world. Everyone gets an opinion no matter what. Then the liberals always slide in and are there to help break the fall.

you 2 enjoy.

http://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=986884

got to love hypocrites.

I'd say it's a small percentage of affiliates that are fucking anything up..its usually the crooked program owners with shady billing practices. Affiliates just send traffic to the person who pays the most.

metaman is right.

Wlid Johnny since you're new you might find this of interest:

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/profile.php?do=ignorelist

This forum is lightly moderated with a few exceptions (see rules). Sometimes you'll have to take matters into your own hands. Good luck.

Metaman:
For the sake of argument Re-Read Post #20.
It was a conversation about affiliates and what do they cost a program?
In a bad economy you need them even more. They do not cost them nothing!

Your post #23
If a program controls 100% of the transaction after an affiliate gets them to the front door of the site. Is it not the programs responsibility to lead the viewer up to and process the sale. If the program screws that up then how did the affiliate have anything to do with that. Answer that!

As an affiliate how do I have anything to do with processing?
After they get to the program site how does them controlling the traffic change what the viewer is seeing and whethter they decide to sign up or not. Dam If someone takes you to a bar and you decide to go in. and the person that takes you there leaves and you spend the evening there. Must be because you liked the bar and you decided to stay. The guy that brought you there had nothing to do with that decision.

So this story you say about processing problems that you infer the affiliate has something to do with is off base. Because as an affiliate I have not one thing to do with processing or the sale after they enter the front door.

What part of my comments do you not get. It is simple I get them to the door and they finish the sale. The affiliate cost them nothing to get the viewer to the door.

And my comment about bad luck poor business practices. I am not as blunt as you are. What I wanted to say but reserved myself was that many program owners do not have a clue as how to handle their money. and when times are good and they are rolling in it these boards are full of all their extravagant spending. And when business slides these boards fill up with webmasters who cannot afford to pay their affiliates. Because the guy that is making them the sales is costing them to much money. That is bullshit on any business scale. They made a sale you would of had less money if they didn't. Do you not see the point in that?

In summary when programs are dripping in cash they want more affiliates to make more money. When they are broke they fuck the affiliates because they they say they cost them too much money. Well if they would manage their money then most every one would be getting through this down turn in the global economy a whole lot better..

If the people that let the processing of trillions of dollars or worthless mortgages. would not of done that then we would not be having this conversation affiliates would still be loved.

If I put a thumb of someones on my site and a viewer clicks it to that site my job is done. If they fuck it up from there too many times I will discontinue using that program. Two way street.

You should care that you irritated me. because your comment was uncalled for and irritating. Dam take a chill pill there was an interesting conversation started here till you walked in in a bad mood....

I don't know everything But most generally when I speak I know what I am talking about. Other wise I do not speak.

And the rest of the posts indicated by by rising post count is doing business with good people. And I rarely sell anything I buy.

I am going to go watch tv with the family then go to bed.

Clean the shit off your boot and smile. Tomorrow is another day no sense putting on the same shit.

Good Night..

you guys are seriously entirely missing my point.

have any of you guys ever even had a merchant account? i have. and i have been shut down. i speak from experience. not "opinion".

this is not an affiliates vs program owner thing i am trying to create. i think affiliates can be a huge help to a program and all that jazz. But i am talking about todays REAL BUSINESS CLIMATE. not i want to be friends with everyone lets talk lies.

These days you need more and more credit and capital to open a "large" merchant. These days banks can close your merchant and it usually takes MINIMUM 3 months for seeing your cash. IF you're lucky.

and you dont even have to be doing anything "shady". If they feel your site is even remotely questionable they are going to shut you down.

why with this info as a site owner/merchant account owner would you risk getting shut down because of what someone MIGHT DO.

i don't have 3 months to waste or millions to sue banks etc etc. do you? if not then you should understand the current climate and what it means to the affiliate.

there is nothing else to chat about i am 100% right. because i talk via experience.

this is not a bash on affiliates this is REALITY.

You have to understand we are in times of one of the if not the greatest financial blow backs up history.

They wrote mortgages to just about everyone, they gave merchants to "almost" anyone etc etc.

We are in a re setting period. There is nothing else to it. This is not the wild west anymore this is business. and we are not in the best climate for RISK.

that boils down to affiliates being a RISK. and banks do not like this atm.

there is nothing else to chat about really.

And guess what people PORN in general especially on the net is viewed as shady by mainstream people. and mainstream people control the banks.

BRANDS, as the liable parties to the financial institutions (or aggregators) who acquire their transactions have several challenges to hurtle in order to maintain their processing, especially those who have direct relationships with acquiring banks.

1st, the BRAND has to maintain website compliance, PCI compliance and then manage to an aggressive VISA/MC mandated domestic chargeback threshold (it's more lenient internationally).

Further, the BRAND has to manage their affiliate traffic. Not every affiliate simply "get's traffic to the front door" as stated here earlier, but some engage in various sketchy business practices.

Rogue affiliates who create chargebacks for the BRANDS add to an already significant challenge for the BRAND who is struggling to make sure that their chargebacks don't exceed their thresholds. An account closed for chargebacks can put a BRAND out of business or at the very least increase their cost for processing by having to move to an aggregator at a much increased cost (sometimes double their processing costs with a direct merchant account).

I spend a significant amount of my work day helping clients and potential clients clean up these issues to either maintain or obtain solid processing solutions.

Thank you! This guy knows exactly what i mean. and the way you explained it is 20x better then i could have.

Thanks, Meta. But I do think that there is plenty of room for affiliate players in the industry. The BRANDS need to do a better job of managing, vetting and reviewing their affiliates.

Poor affiliate management is definitely effects the overall performance.

Totally agreed. I wish i was wrong, but it's just the climate we are in.

Affiliates will always be around but i see things going extremely private over the next couple years.

I'm going to rip you a new asshole, just because I'm bored.

Actually, I thought you had just curled up, crawled into a basement conber and just quietly died somewhere. You've always been a confrontational piece of shit. None of the garbage you have spewed over the few years you've been a member has been relevant. Its all about you. Oh, Metaman! Will you sign my 'taint? I worship the ground you hover ever so slightly over. Dude, you are an embarrassment to this board.

Tell your mommy to get you a glass of water, and take your Ritilan. We're gona have a Palaver.

Most affiliates are idiots, granted. Its a hard job, this online marketing thing. Sometimes I think to myself, "Would I rather make $50k a year doing this, or should I lease a general store and try to cough out a living selling cigarettes and milk?" Hard decision. I choose internet marketing. It works for me. You might be better off selling Lay's chips and Gummy Bears. I only say this because you cry. Like a girl. And crying girls do well as cashiers.

I know that this board is full of millionaires like you, Metaman. I also realize that anyone making 30k-50k is a loser.

In all honesty, though, this is the best job on the face of the fucking earth. Unemployment rate=zero. If you can manage to haul your fat "comic book guy" ass out of bed and be civil with your future superiors, you might have a chance at survival. There are a LOT of people at GFY who will happily lend you a hand. And maybe - just maybe - one of the people that currently makes no money may just fluke out and start pulling in huge dollars in a few years. Who's to say? Not YOU!

Speaking of making millions, God knows you haven't. You've been here since 2003 (I think that was the figure posted. I may be wrong because I've never read anything your fat basement-dwelling fingers have typed...) and you're STILL insulting newcomers.

Maybe one day I'll actually argue why affilates aren't irrelevant. Hint: For every brogram that shuts its doors to affiliates, there will be ten niched sites that want my traffic.

That's not even fucking English. That is some random beating off dialect. I am not a program owner and I am not processing any sales. Neither are you. But at least I'm not typing with one hand while I pound my pud and hit random letters on my keyboard.

Zub zub zub? What relevance do you have to anyone who processes affiliate sales? Maybe you do. I don't know. For all I know, you're the head of scrubbing at CCBill. I have an itch that tells me you're just a fat dude who likes to bitch. The only thing you control is nothing - including your own irrelevant opinions.

Why the fuck would you care whether some company you have no control over can process credit cards? You. Are. A. Fucking. Retard. Say it again, bitch.

You have no control over the processing of anything ANY affiliate might choose to sell. Shut the fuck up, you fat stupid idiot. Shut your mouth and start blindly hitting your screen, your keyboard, your dog. Close your eyes and flail blindly like the baby you are.

Nothing you say has any relevance. You control nothing. You influence nothing. Fuck off.

I can't believe I just wasted this much time responding to three of your "paragraphs".

You have the entire world figured out. Unfortunately, you got it wrong. Nothing you typed here has any relevance. Go back to 2003, fuck head. I'm more interested in what the noobs have to say.

garce you're sooooooo pussy whipped over me it's not even funny.

Lets hear more about how you don't bash people but then start threads photo shopping peoples faces bashing them. LOL.

what did you answer other then using the word "bitch, mom and fuck"? LOL
yep you disproved me by using as many swear words in 1 paragraph as possible.

even billers agree with me. You're a nobody affiliate and you're pissed you're getting shoved around.

also please point out where i said im a millionaire? LOL too funny. baby got mad.

can someone translate your post?

I changed and adapted years ago to cut off my affiliates the amount of money I made from them wasnt worth the stress. now i train my associates to think like me and make money plus they are alot more loyal and grateful

Attacking affiliates is fucked up. Go fuck yourself.

lol this thread is awesome