AW the worst business people in the world !?

[Webmasterbaby]

AW the worst business people in the world !?

"How to turn a Billion dollar business into a Million dollar business"

Not so long ago, many small time webmasters where making $10.000's per month working from their bedroom, program owners were making millions.
Remember when Marc from ARS posted pics from his garage ?
Even I as a part time webmaster was making $15.000 US per month working 2h per day.

How did our future look only a few years ago ?

1. Our potential customers have more then doubled:
Internet users in 2005 - 938 millions, 2010 - 1,966 millions

2. People are getting less scared to make payments online / use a credit card

3. Download speeds enable us to offer HQ movies, potentially killing the DVD rental and sales market ( even more new customers )

4. Server and BW prices cheaper then ever

The future looked great and we had to go and fuck it up by offering in some cases
full length movies for free.

I don't care if "some" tube sites ARE making money, even good money.
The fact is they have turned a Billion dollar business into a Million dollar business.

Well Done !!!

[Fat Panda]

right on my friend

[FlexxAeon]

pretty much, you're right. it's not 100% our fault but i'd day 75% our fault

[Webmasterbaby]

pretty much, you're right. it's not 100% our fault but i'd day 75% our fault

well you get my point right!

[FlexxAeon]

well you get my point right!

i do

i just meant that, before things like facebook, myspace, youtube, online games, etc etc there was nothing fun to do on the internet except chat, search for porn and maybe look at some flash cartoons

once those fun websites came along we were bound to lose some of the percentage of users. but the majority of our money loss is our own fault

[Paul Markham]

The list of what we did wrong is so much longer than what we did right it's frightening. What is even scarier is nothing is being done to turn it around.

Blaming it all or mostly on free full scenes on tubes is ignoring all the other factors.

[mlove]

[Webmasterbaby]

The list of what we did wrong is so much longer than what we did right it's frightening. What is even scarier is nothing is being done to turn it around.

Blaming it all or mostly on free full scenes on tubes is ignoring all the other factors.

you're probably right...i just wanted to touch on our biggest problem.

anyway

[erooup]

Companies like VividCash.com already have the content and websites for the future. They will become even bigger because they dont try and fuck the customer over.

[Fenris Wolf]

[Altwebdesign]

15k a month, sounds like those were the days!

[vittle]

The porn "middle class" is almost gone. The rich are getting richer. The small guys are still figuring out how to make a few extra bucks. The guys who were making a good living have lost a lot of traffic to the tubes.

[Paul Markham]

Companies like VividCash.com already have the content and websites for the future. They will become even bigger because they dont try and fuck the customer over.

Vivid are part of the approximate "10%" who have content that can't be duplicated by any Tom Dick or Harry with a camera. They are also not 100% reliant on the Internet for the money to make that content.

One of the biggest problems is most content today sucks. It's the same tired scenes over and over again. Customers don't want 30 days recurring of that level of crap.

[Webmasterbaby]

Customers don't want 30 days recurring of that level of crap.

most guys look at porn for what...30min maybe ? that includes the search on xvideos or porntube... no need to pull out a CC for that !

[Sausage]

Because traffic is king and I want your traffic.

[signupdamnit]

Saw this listed on "There is no money in porn". Needs to be seen by more people because it's spot on.

[andrej_NDC]

Who is we? You mean google and youtube, right? Go blame them, please.

[signupdamnit]

Who is we? You mean google and youtube, right? Go blame them, please.

Youtube isn't that bad and has decent policies which are enforced. Google only points to content and doesn't actually host it. And besides neither is technically in the adult business. The blame should rightfully fall on those in the industry. And no, for the most part, it isn't the little guy's fault beyond a minor part in enabling it. It's the poor choices of the adult industry's leaders. "Make a buck today, screw tomorrow or just sell out later".

1:200 conversions (125 sales)

verus

1:25,000 conversions (1 sale)

Do the math on how it affects the bottom line and the opportunity cost of the idiocy.

125 sales * $25 = $3125 (1999)
1 sales * $25 = $25 (2011/2012?)

[andrej_NDC]

Youtube isn't that bad and has decent policies which are enforced. Google only points to content and doesn't actually host it. And besides neither is technically in the adult business. The blame should rightfully fall on those in the industry. And no, for the most part, it isn't the little guy's fault beyond a minor part in enabling it. It's the poor choices of the adult industry's leaders. "Make a buck today, screw tomorrow or just sell out later".

Youtube started the whole "user uploaded, we are innocent" thing. And google makes all the free downloads huge, not just for adult, but mainstream also. Just type in any movie and google will even add rapidshare at the end for you.

[papill0n]

[Agent 488]

the porn tubes just followed the trend in mainstream technology and sites. stupid thread.

[icymelon]

what does AW stand for?

[docputer]

what does AW stand for?

Adult Webmaster

[signupdamnit]

Youtube started the whole "user uploaded, we are innocent" thing. And google makes all the free downloads huge, not just for adult, but mainstream also. Just type in any movie and google will even add rapidshare at the end for you.

So what are you trying to say - that Google and Youtube are responsible for the downfall of the industry and not the "big players" within it who acted like idiots for years? Or are you merely stating that Google and Youtube aren't helping matters either?

[signupdamnit]

the porn tubes just followed the trend in mainstream technology and sites. stupid thread.

But does the RIAA or MPAA (or it's members) host pirate torrent and tube sites? It's a different situation in adult because some of the sponsors own these tubes. And the technology isn't the problem. It's what is done with it.

[Agent 488]

once youtube took off porn tubes were inevitable. even if no one in adult internet created one, someone somewhere would have seen the opportunity and did it.

[andrej_NDC]

once youtube took off porn tubes were inevitable. even if no one in adult internet created one, someone somewhere would have seen the opportunity and did it.

Thats it.

[Argos88]

BUMPED for truth.

.

[notime]

Yesterday you cannot change anymore and tommorrow is yet to come, so the NOW is most important.

Our little small VOD in Holland still does 1:50 to 1:100 average. All content that doesn't convert is switched off after some time, helpdesk are instructed to replace or refund if helping out doesn't solve it for whatever reason. Regular clients are rewarded a few times per year. Constant innovation is a must. Baby steps..! Computers only do what humans instruct them to do.

[signupdamnit]

once youtube took off porn tubes were inevitable. even if no one in adult internet created one, someone somewhere would have seen the opportunity and did it.

But people within the industry continue contributing to it. And if the people within industry refused to support it or do business with such people they would find it harder to exist.

Basically it's a lot like taking a $30 product and passing it out for free everyday downtown in your city for years on end. It's a really stupid thing to do from a business standpoint if you intend to make a living selling that product.

They will never be able to make the same revenue as they once made. It's lost. As the original message suggests the business was once extremely lucrative. Sending 25,000 hits to a paysite once could easily mean over $5,000 in sales volume. Now we're to the point where you're lucky if you get $100. Dating and cams can't match that lost revenue (and there are free alternatives now too). Nor can selling ad spots in the long term It's just stupid.

[rogueteens]

The future looked great and we had to go and fuck it up by offering in some cases
full length movies for free.

I don't care if "some" tube sites ARE making money, even good money.
The fact is they have turned a Billion dollar business into a Million dollar business.

I 100% agree, i dont just blame the big illegal sites but also all those scrape scripts that sell to the mainstream webmasters so they can make a few pennies from selling advertising spots.

[BIGTYMER]

No surprise. The adult industry is based on fucking surfers over.

Paysites that offer the world only to have hardly anything in thier backend.

Dialers! Cross sales!

I could go on and on.

[Robbie]

What's with all this "WE" shit?

"We" didn't do a goddamn thing. A handful of scumbags did, and yes they have made a ton of fast money that is beyond most people's scope to imagine. And at the moment the business is fucked...worse than I've ever seen.

But "WE" didn't do shit. "They" did it. I know I sure as fuck didn't. And out of the thousands of people I know and do business with I only know a handful who did.

[garce]

"We" didn't do a goddamn thing.

Exactly.

[DWB]

Vivid are part of the approximate "10%" who have content that can't be duplicated by any Tom Dick or Harry with a camera.

Thank god for that. Their shit is the most unwankable crap I've ever seen. If it wasn't for comps, parodies and sex tapes, they would have been done a long time ago.

[FlexxAeon]

What's with all this "WE" shit?

"We" didn't do a goddamn thing. A handful of scumbags did, and yes they have made a ton of fast money that is beyond most people's scope to imagine. And at the moment the business is fucked...worse than I've ever seen.

But "WE" didn't do shit. "They" did it. I know I sure as fuck didn't. And out of the thousands of people I know and do business with I only know a handful who did.

valid point

except 'they' still roam among 'us' as if nothing is wrong and 'we' let them.

so... 'we'

[Robbie]

valid point

except 'they' still roam among 'us' as if nothing is wrong and 'we' let them.

so... 'we'

How are "we' supposed to stop them? Beat 'em up? Go to jail. Kill them? Go to jail.

What do "you" suggest? Everybody refuse to do business with anybody connected with piracy? That's like playing 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon...everything is intertwined one way or another.

Hosting companies, billers, paysites, etc. can all be "connected" in some way shape or form. So that isn't gonna work.

Look...I've said it over and over and over...NOBODY can tell somebody else what to do. If you decide to become the biggest pirate in the world, there isn't a goddamn thing I can do about it. And you can "roam among us" and I can't stop you. Most of us live in free countries.

There is no "WE" in any of this. You can't blame affiliates who have money and rebills tied up with Jug Cash for instance. They can't just walk away and not pay their bills and lose their homes and cars, etc.

You can't jump on a hosting company for taking in accounts that will make them more money than all other accounts combined.

You can't blame billing companies for doing their business.

The ONLY people to blame are the SCUMBAGS that own the pirate sites. They are the ones making money off of stolen content directly. If they hadn't done it...there would be no problem.

I'm just sayin'...I get tired of reading how "We" are not good business people, or how "We" destroyed "ourselves"

Bullshit. Thieves did it.

[rogueteens]

valid point

except 'they' still roam among 'us' as if nothing is wrong and 'we' let them.

so... 'we'

and "we" see no problem with all the sheep making their own illegal tubes and brag about it on the forums. There are new people joining this biz who think that scaping clips is the proper way to promote their sidebar adverts. Scumpond (before it's fall from grace) was full of the fuckers. Most of those sites only get a few hits a day but there are tons of them around.

[Stomped]

Adapt or die

[FlexxAeon]

How are "we' supposed to stop them? Beat 'em up? Go to jail. Kill them? Go to jail.

What do "you" suggest? Everybody refuse to do business with anybody connected with piracy? That's like playing 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon...everything is intertwined one way or another.

Hosting companies, billers, paysites, etc. can all be "connected" in some way shape or form. So that isn't gonna work.

Look...I've said it over and over and over...NOBODY can tell somebody else what to do. If you decide to become the biggest pirate in the world, there isn't a goddamn thing I can do about it. And you can "roam among us" and I can't stop you. Most of us live in free countries.

There is no "WE" in any of this. You can't blame affiliates who have money and rebills tied up with Jug Cash for instance. They can't just walk away and not pay their bills and lose their homes and cars, etc.

You can't jump on a hosting company for taking in accounts that will make them more money than all other accounts combined.

You can't blame billing companies for doing their business.

The ONLY people to blame are the SCUMBAGS that own the pirate sites. They are the ones making money off of stolen content directly. If they hadn't done it...there would be no problem.

I'm just sayin'...I get tired of reading how "We" are not good business people, or how "We" destroyed "ourselves"

Bullshit. Thieves did it.

i hear you. but like you said, we're all intertwined... and so closely so that if we attempted to ostracize everyone connected to the thieves, we'd end up at ourselves at some point. me included. that's where the 'we' comes from.

as far as being bad business people. we aren't, you're right. we're just in a biz with few checks & balances. so some people took advantage of that just to get a buck and fucked it up for everyone. much like the real estate market, the good went down with the scumbags.

[DWB]

How are "we' supposed to stop them? Beat 'em up? Go to jail. Kill them? Go to jail.

Every now and then the universe comes through with dose of harsh justice for those who deserve it. So we just have to keep hoping they will be victims of a random violent crime or deadly accident. I'd sleep just fine knowing a few of them went out horribly.

[BIGTYMER]

Adapt or die

My thoughts exactly.

[Agent 488]

[96ukssob]

[Paul Markham]

most guys look at porn for what...30min maybe ? that includes the search on xvideos or porntube... no need to pull out a CC for that !

And the Adult Net now gives away 30 minute clips for free. Legal or illegal isn't the point, it's irrelevant.

For 10 years the cry has been Traffic, Traffic, Traffic. And the only way anyone could think of getting it was to give the product away.

Thank god for that. Their shit is the most unwankable crap I've ever seen. If it wasn't for comps, parodies and sex tapes, they would have been done a long time ago.

Which is why they can afford to spend 10 times more on a scene than you do. Think about it.