Cloning: what do you think?

It will all come down to how the technology is used. I can't see it being a bad thing as the likelihood of someone actually wanting to clone someone else is pretty low in my estimation. People forget that a clone is an exact physical reproduction of a person but not a recreation of the original person.

If they can use the technology to grow new skin/organs for someone who is in need of them, or perhaps cure certain kinds of cancer with cell/tissue replacement then I'm all for it. I don't think it should be used as an alternative form of procreation for the basic reason that IVF is so widely available and effective. Besides, like I say, how many potential Mom and Dad's are gonna want a baby that looks just like them? Anyone who does probably needs mental examination.

Btw, this is my guess, but the Clonaid controversy is fake. All the excuses that Rael has been throwing out is real lame...

Some good points made. However, do you think its the business of the Federal Government to create legislation against those who, as you put it, want to "use it as an alternative of procreation" ?

Just to say firstly, I agree with progex. I'm highly sceptical about the claims that have been made. Until there is confirmed proof that these babies ARE clones, all my statements are purely hypothetical.

That said:

No I don't think it is any government's place to tell a person they CANNOT clone for procreative use the same way it isn't their place to tell a person they CANNOT have an abortion. What I would hope is that cloning clinics would be regulated in a similar way to abortion clinics. There should be counselling available in all circumstances for whatever use the technology would be used, and again, I would hope that any cloning clinic approached by an individual/couple with the intent of having a cloned child without at least looking into other options would question their reasoning and insist on a required mental examination before making any promises or plans to carry out the procedure.

Wow, sorry, run on sentance!

So boiled down - No it isn't the government's right to tell anyone what they can/cannot do with their body.

i need to order a clone of myself

or order a clone of Britney and when it turns 16 - bang the fuck out of it !!

Woo !! Yay !!

Um, Jessica Alba clone please?

The future scares me sometimes.

You guys ever think about what it will realistically be like in 40 years? We may not have flying cars, but just think about it...

Cloning one way or another will eventually be a common thing. It may be just for 'spare parts' to start but will happen. With much controversial stuff there's a stage where all are against, then comes reluctant acceptance with many limitations on use then eventually we get acceptance and everyday use with people wondering what the original fuss was about.

The only problem with all these sexy girl clones is that they are just as likely to grow up to be tight assed men hating roman catholic closet lesbians that wouldn't look at ANY man twice, let alone a pasty webmaster, as they are to grow up as cum sucking porn loving sluts. Its all a matter of upbringing and luck.

I'm wondering if cloning would lead to a "premium" race of humans.

Any thoughts?

No doubt but in 40 years no doubt we'll have total recall type shit whre they can map your entire brain patterns at a certain snapshot and grow you in a tank. That will rock!

but then again, video phones aren't even here yet.

But then again, thats due to government regulation of telecommunications.

people in europe are already buying clones for $200.000

And there's your first mistake...

I think they should not clone Ted Hickman because 2 cats would be in trouble.

We've been cloning plants for thousands of years (take a cutting from a plant, plant the cutting, and *viola*! A cloned plant).

Cloning happens all the time in nature (identical twins). So the anti-cloning folks should want to ban identical twins as well, following their logic that closing is "unnatural". Their position seems to ignore the realities of nature.

A couple of points to consider.

1. If they can clone a sheep they can clone a human. There is very little difference. So the technology is there.

2. The moral issues come from religious belief structures that have a hard time wil life created by man. After all if man can create life what does that do the the concept of a soul. Kind of throws many religous dogma's in the trash heap.

3. The ethical issues. Why did you do the clone?
Spare parts for you?

No intentional of allowing the clone to develop. Spare stem cells and body parts?

When then is the clone a human? All the same issues in the abortion dialogue.

Who are the parents? Kind of messes with our social structure which is evolved under natures laws of breeding.

The issues are ethical and legal and very complex.

i think it's bullshit too, but it will happen with humans sooner or later. but what about the poor kids that are born, they don't get a choice and it's already been found with dolly the sheep that she aged prematurely and they think there are potentially lots of other defects that can happen. i'm all for gene therapy and similar to save lives but not to create it.

Where can I place an order for a Jessica Alba?

If we order two, can we get a bulk discount ?

I been watching Fox non stop for about a month now after being hooked on MSNBC for the last year.

They should call it the "we suck Bush cock" network. really, Fox, the people who bring you Married with Children, Cops, and Worlds Wildest Police Videos...

But then again, those shows pander to the lowest common denominator so it is more than appropriate that Fox be pro-Bush. Although, Bill O'Reilly is growing on me. I kinda like the cranky fucker. he will straight tell you to fuck yourself.

I watch Fox Friends every morning. That is a group of simple minded motherfuckers I would love to attack with a machete.

I'd rather attack Bill O'Reilly with that machete.

I love it when he comments on eminem however. Saying, and I quote "An evil plague on our nation's youth, he must be put down. I will not support him and his disgusting message by seeing his movie. Ever."

I like him because he fucking attacks everybody. Its like going on Springer... if someone called me and said "you wanna go on the springer show", I automatically know my girlfriend is fucking somebody. Springer show is bad news. Getting a call to go on OReilly show would be the same thing. You better have your shit straight because he will rip you a new asshole. I love watching some low level functionary of some bullshit organization go on that show and just get fisted.

Oh, and cloning. Go for it. Science should never be forced to hold back.

Fucking cocksmokers in the government who believe in creationism shouldnt be telling anyone what science is and what science is not.

I agree, don't hold back science.


I try and watch the "Factor" whenever I can. I like Bill's no-nonsense attitude, but I was sort of amazed to find that he was so prudish when it comes to sex related stuff.

I'll take 2 clones and an order of fries to go, please

They need to clone his cat before it expires!

O'Reilly is funny indeed. I love watching people get tore apart.

Okay guys, let's say that cloning is okay.
Answer these things for me, then...

1. If you clone your wife and raise the child together, would fucking the clone be the same as fucking your wife or would it be incest since you raised the child as your own?
2. If your wife dies but your clone is still alive, what happens to your wife's life insurance? Her pension?
3. If you were boning both your wife and your clone and your wife took you to divorce court for cheating... would it be cheating? What should the courts do/say in that case?
4. Let's say the wife and the clone are both working full-time jobs. Should they file separate tax returns as separate individuals, each being taxed on their individual income, or should they file their return as one person with a combined income from the two?
5. What happens if your wife kills your clone? Or your clone kills your wife? What should the law do? Is it murder, or is it suicide? Should the survivor go to jail?
6. When you die, your assets are determined and a tax is levied on them before they are distributed to your survivors. This is called a "death tax". If your wife dies, does the clone automatically take over her assets with no tax burden? Does she have any legal claim to the assets? As the original person, or as a child?

In other matters...
7. If you are a lesbian and you clone yourself, could you legally marry yourself in states that allow lesbian marriages?
8. Clones are not perfect replicas... they are clones with genetic faults that the original had, such as tendency for cancer, liver disease, etc. Are insurance companies required to cover hospital fees for both the original and the clone as one person? What about pensions? When the original retires, should a double pension be paid? If the original dies, should the company be forced to pay the remainder of the pension to the clone?
9. A clone does not automatically know everything the original knows. Let's say that a person decides to take the day off of work and sends the clone in their place. What legal grounds should the employer have if the clone cannot perform the job required of the original? Is it
a) they can't fire the original because "he" was at work, at least his identical clone was, or
b) they can fire the original because that is who they hired to do the job and that person wasn't there?
But then wouldn't the original be able to take them to court saying that they were, in fact, present at the job?

10. Humans have an internal clock that assures us that we live out our time here and pass away. It's nature's, or God's if you prefer, way of making sure that overpopulation is curbed. In the quest for immortal life, just imagine people having children and then having clones made. Imagine the population explosion. The drain on the job market. The drain on the economy as we try to support the aging originals and the aging clones.

And on, and on, and on....

mmm, fucking your 16 year old wife. This is a good idea. We need cloning.

And with the amount of single mothers, orphaned children (in this country and in others), children available for adoption, children in foster homes waiting to be taken permanently into a safe family...
Why should cloning be allowed when the parentless children that already exist are living out their lives in orphanages?

How about this:
We raise and breed cows for meat and for their hide. We genetically match them, perfect them, feed them certain things to make them the most perfect specimens of beef and leather available.
If we start farming... excuse me... cloning humans in the same manner, does that lower the human race to the level of cattle? Another resource to be farmed and cultivated?
No?
Why not?
Once we allow ourselves to be farmed and genetically engineered, what right do we have then to value human life above the life of a cow? Or a soy plant?
If a clone is a genetically engineered product - will it not then be able to be treated as such? Farmed and sold as slaves, perhaps? A genetically engineered workforce? A genetically engineered army? Since these "products" would be created in such a manner, would it then be fit to have stores selling the products?
Humans for sale? Hey, who couldn't use a helping hand around the house or someone else to take over the site coding for a while? You could hire a worker and pay them a salary or hourly wage, plus filing the tax papers etc etc etc, or you could take the hit all at once and buy a cloned human for $100k. Yours for life.
No?
Again, why not?

When we reduce ourselves to the level of cattle or even to the level of the computer you're working on right now, what is wrong with the buying and selling of such a product?

Things to think about...

Cloning cannot be likened to abortion.

The issue of abortion arises because it's a question of a woman's right to do what she wants to do with her body versus the government's ability to regulate what said person does with said body.

Cloning; on the other hand, is an issue concerning a group of rich scientists/cultists pushing the limits of technological advances because of their own motivations, no matter how twisted they may be versus government regulating a new technique of reproduction

Sometimes we need to stop asking if it's right or wrong and simply ask if it's necessary.

Furthermore, we have to consider the consequences of the "rich vs. the poor" scenario. For the same reason that the implementation of paying people to become organ doners after death has continuosly been shot down by legislature. If replacement organs are manufactured in some cloning facility of the future, who is going to benefit from it? The poor? I think not.

Hello all.. This one drew me out of my seclusion... My 2 cents on cloning for different reasons is varied...

Our country was based around the notion that there is a god and creation was his hand.... (Not that I agree with that BS BUT) With that in mind religious groups can play hell on the actual functuality of our government... How many politicians would not turn tail to the pressure of losing several million "Catholic" votes... So does the government have a say? Like it or not agree or not... They do and will if for no better reasons than to assure re-election possibilities....

Is it right or wrong? Are any of us gods? (other than in our own minds ) Its the same principle as choosing who gets to live.. Who gets to die? A clone although nearly identical to the errmm genetic host still does not mean that this person will be identical in all aspects.. IE: Learnings, opinions, moral curve etc... So in that aspect until we were to get like the movie "The 6th day" where we can grow blanks and then impart ones psyc into it there is no good foot to stand on as far as a continuation of life for great minds or those of immense financial backing... If it were a possibility to that extent.. Imagine the horror's capable? Litteral clones of people such as SAdam, or Osama... People whom could put cruel genious to ends by their own cloned hand...

meh.. Long on that.. Carrie brought up a point on body clocks.. A side point to that note is the simple fact that as humans our body clocks are getting longer lived on their own...



A short rebuff on spart part cloning... I am totally against this possibility until they can in some way or manor create bio-mechanical hosts to grow specific body parts for specific purposes..

I do not agree that people should ever be harvested for spare parts no matter the good intention.. Its a clone there for it is human.. It has a mind... It has a spirit within.. Another movie to give a close likeness... "The Matrix"

Imagine harvesting on a scale either as grand or no where near as grand.. The end is the same...




I do believe cloning as a whole is a great scientific step... But my distaste for the human race is as such...

Who does decide who is allowed to be god or a master of creation? Better yet who and how is it defined what the creators hand is allowed to emulate?


Sorry for the length... Carrie will prolly kill me for this.. I'm sick as hell and hope I got some of my points across..

Cadaver

AKA: Guy

Cad, the answer to your question is simple.
Who becomes God? Who decides who lives, and who dies?
Those people with (currently) $200,000 to purchase a manufactured reproduction of themselves, that's who.

The ultimate separation between rich and poor.
You think the bullshit now of class separation is unbearable? Just wait until Bill Gates announces that he has purchased a clone who will learn everything he knows and more and then will step up to take over the company and all of his assets fully when Bill dies.
He is already the most hated man in America for the money that he has earned... just imagine if he could also live forever.

God, indeed.