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-   -   what's going on? Why are sales so down (https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=977566)

Agent 488 07-12-2010 09:57 PM
plenty of creative billing still going on. affiliates going nowhere. people doing the same old are hurting.

adapt or die.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MetaMan (Post 17330597)
Adult is in big trouble for another 2 years before it picks up again.

Visa and Mastercard came in and did a shit canning on alot of processors for allowing cross sales and shady rebills where terms were not stated properly.

this is basically how 90% of adult programs have been operating for the past 2 years+. this is how they afforeded to pay all you idiots high PPS. basically banging peoples cards. Visa and Mastercard came in and said enough is enough and forced processors to clean up their act in mainstream and adult.

the processors feeling the heat have shit canned almost everyone who even remotely reeks of anything that is not pure white hat techniques. there are still a few people around who have connections in billing but if you promote them you are only playing with fire as merchants can lock go in and lock accounts without even blinking an eye. which is happening left right and center.

so what you have had happen imo is sponsors are A) either forced to close down B) know that their currents methods are going to be shut down so they are milking whatever they can while they can.

the only people being approved are white hat sites with large backing of capital. smaller people will be approved but they are capping those accounts at ridiculously low maximums like $25 000. leaving no space to even process for affiliates.

Adult is overall deemed by Visa and Mastercard as a high risk industry and it is only going to get worse.

It will be a long while before things open up again and there will only be a few left. and as risk becomes less and less viable affiliates will be pushed out of the game further and further.

Vjo 07-12-2010 09:58 PM
Sally, I didnt see you were trying to learn. In that case it isnt so funny. :) The first thing you will have to learn is getting affils to reveal anything will never happen. :)

Agent488,
Please send me some kind of documentation of your site's traffic.
Thank you,
:)

Best we can hope for is TeenCat throws us a bone once in a while. :)

Welcome to the wonderful world of Adult Webmastering. :) I admire your fire! :thumbsup
Fire is good and needed. :)

Vjo 07-12-2010 10:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetaMan (Post 17330597)
Adult is in big trouble for another 2 years before it picks up again.

Visa and Mastercard came in and did a shit canning on alot of processors for allowing cross sales and shady rebills where terms were not stated properly.

this is basically how 90% of adult programs have been operating for the past 2 years+. this is how they afforeded to pay all you idiots high PPS. basically banging peoples cards. Visa and Mastercard came in and said enough is enough and forced processors to clean up their act in mainstream and adult.

the processors feeling the heat have shit canned almost everyone who even remotely reeks of anything that is not pure white hat techniques. there are still a few people around who have connections in billing but if you promote them you are only playing with fire as merchants can lock go in and lock accounts without even blinking an eye. which is happening left right and center.

so what you have had happen imo is sponsors are A) either forced to close down B) know that their currents methods are going to be shut down so they are milking whatever they can while they can.

the only people being approved are white hat sites with large backing of capital. smaller people will be approved but they are capping those accounts at ridiculously low maximums like $25 000. leaving no space to even process for affiliates.

Adult is overall deemed by Visa and Mastercard as a high risk industry and it is only going to get worse.

It will be a long while before things open up again and there will only be a few left. and as risk becomes less and less viable affiliates will be pushed out of the game further and further.

Wow. Great post MetaMan. Lots of meat. I like it but it may need a few more BF's Will76, Sly (I'm such a name dropper) and guys like that to pick it apart. Great post tho.

So you are saying little sponsors are being capped at like 25K? Which would explain a few things why some sponsors convert and some dont or why some suddenly stop.

I dont know, but my gut feeling is there is very little shaving going on now days unless you mean processor shaving. Nats 4 shows you. And my submits are not going thru. I honestly do not think I am being sponsor shaved but rather they are being denied by the processor for some reason. In almost all cases where things suddenly stop.

Also you ever notice this shit always starts right at the first of the month usually after a real good month. hmmm.

loreen 07-12-2010 10:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by officegirl2006 (Post 17328054)
my site launched 2 weeks ago is going a storm - www.natashasnylons.com
if you ar ewanting solo milf sites to promote
The site looks fine but how could someone in his right mind spend his traffic on a site with so many traffic leaks? :Oh crap

MetaMan 07-12-2010 10:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vjo (Post 17330654)
Wow. Great post MetaMan. Lots of meat. I like it but it may need a few more BF's Will76, Sly (I'm such a name dropper) and guys like that to pick it apart. Great post tho.

So you are saying little sponsors are being capped at like 25K? Which would explain a few things why some sponsors convert and some dont.

I dont know, but my gut feeling is there is very little shaving going on now days unless you mean processor shaving. Nats 4 shows you. And my submits are not going thru. I honestly do not think I am being sponsor shaved but rather they are being denied by the processor for some reason. In almost all cases where things suddenly stop.

Also you ever notice this shit always starts right at the first of the month. hmmm.
the $25k cap is the figure i was being told by people i was also recently spanked for an amount i would rather not post here. now is this a stern amount? not 100%. of course things like credit and the capital you have will change this amount.

the only way i was personally able to avoid lower amounts was being backed by a large amount of capital.

maybe the sponsor is not shaving but if they are purposely sticking with methods that they know processors are no longer liking and in turn playing with affiliate joins trying to milk things until they hit the fan. i dont know what you would call that. it is not shaving but close enough imo.

they know what the state of processing is, and alot are choosing to make one final blast to see how far they can push it. that is why so many programs are going under now. it is a processing issue not a join issue.

there could be alot of reasons why the processing is not going through. what type of sites do the processors have a history of processing? take a look at this and understand why they may be behind the scenes being further regulated and why joins are down.

it used to be "what processor do you guys use?" and than in turn trust your billing with that company. i think the exact opposite now.

"what company do you guys not use?" and there lies your answer. alot of processors billed high risk for many years and you may in turn be clumped in with other deemed high risk sites even though yours is not.

MetaMan 07-12-2010 10:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vjo (Post 17330654)
Also you ever notice this shit always starts right at the first of the month usually after a real good month. hmmm.
this could be because people are budgeting at the beginning of the month for the entire month. where as the end of the month most people know if they have extra cash or not and are more willing to spend.

it also depends what countries you are promoting, when is payday, when are credit card bills due.

to many factors to list, this is where tracking is supremely important. you have to get things down to a science.

which hours of the day people shop on your site the most. what days they spend more money. what months. what holidays. on and on. your own stats are your best friend and in lies your only answer. every site is different.

Vjo 07-12-2010 10:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetaMan (Post 17330667)
the $25k cap is the figure i was being told by people i was also recently spanked for an amount i would rather not post here. now is this a stern amount? not 100%. of course things like credit and the capital you have will change this amount.

the only way i was personally able to avoid lower amounts was being backed by a large amount of capital.

maybe the sponsor is not shaving but if they are purposely sticking with methods that they know processors are no longer liking and in turn playing with affiliate joins trying to milk things until they hit the fan. i dont know what you would call that. it is not shaving but close enough imo.

they know what the state of processing is, and alot are choosing to make one final blast to see how far they can push it. that is why so many programs are going under now. it is a processing issue not a join issue.

there could be alot of reasons why the processing is not going through. what type of sites do the processors have a history of processing? take a look at this and understand why they may be behind the scenes being further regulated and why joins are down.

it used to be "what processor do you guys use?" and than in turn trust your billing with that company. i think the exact opposite now.

"what company do you guys not use?" and there lies your answer. alot of processors billed high risk for many years and you may in turn be clumped in with other deemed high risk sites even though yours is not.
You are right on the money in this post too. But everytime I try and take a stab at it I delete what I wrote. It is a tough one to stab into and I will leave it to others. :)

It does ring true to me tho and I appreciate it. Let me digestize it a bit then maybe I'll have more comment. :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MetaMan (Post 17330667)

maybe the sponsor is not shaving but if they are purposely sticking with methods that they know processors are no longer liking and in turn playing with affiliate joins trying to milk things until they hit the fan. i dont know what you would call that. it is not shaving but close enough imo.
See this is where us affils are in the dark as we really only know what is going on only from our stats. But yeah, a lot stopped selling that is for sure. And I should be changing links right now. :)

SallyRand 07-12-2010 10:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vjo (Post 17330616)
Sally, I didnt see you were trying to learn. In that case it isnt so funny. :) The first thing you will have to learn is getting affils to reveal anything will never happen. :)

Agent488,
Please send me some kind of documentation of your site's traffic.
Thank you,
:)

Best we can hope for is TeenCat throws us a bone once in a while. :)

Welcome to the wonderful world of Adult Webmastering. :) I admire your fire! :thumbsup
Fire is good and needed. :)
OK; we're square now and thank you for your reply!

Thanks more than you know!

Qouth The Boss:

"Oh, Oh, Oh, I'm on fire!"

Sally.

Theo 07-12-2010 10:49 PM
it's normal your traffic to be down in July. Ratios is another story though..

Vjo 07-12-2010 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SallyRand (Post 17330682)
OK; we're square now and thank you for your reply!

Thanks more than you know!

Qouth The Boss:

"Oh, Oh, Oh, I'm on fire!"

Sally.
Look out, I may post that video hehe I like that one. :)

But this is a serious thread. So I won't :)

Metaman is about to BLOW UP the adult industry. SKY HIGH!

Well maybe make us lowly affils a little more scratch anyhow. :)

This is why MetaMan fucking RULES :thumbsup

Now I'm fired up. :)

Barefootsies 07-12-2010 11:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarmusch (Post 17328030)
http://rationallythinkingoutloud.fil..._bob_large.gif
We are having a record sales month. Everything is great.
That picture, and punchline always make an appearance.
:1orglaugh

adult-help 07-12-2010 11:11 PM
I wonder if all you guys say about the economy is the reason sales are down OR maybe the sponsors are scamming us by skimming orders?

Vjo 07-12-2010 11:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adult-help (Post 17330726)
I wonder if all you guys say about the economy is the reason sales are down OR maybe the sponsors are scamming us by skimming orders?
In my case the economy didnt mean anything as there were 15 submits at the join page and no signups. Normally that yields about 7 signups the two previous periods. But yes the economy hurts but not that bad really. $30/month isnt much for some people. But yes it hurts.

As far as shaving. The losers, yes I think it could happen. If they are losing altitude and know an impending crash is coming yes. But the winners. No. At least I don't think so or see it in my ratios.

Go with the winners. Nothing really has changed in 13 years for an affil. Look at your stats and replace the losers with more from the winners. There have always been winners and losers. No big deal.

All we have is our stats and hard work. But we are free to interchange links and today an affil should be jumpier than a flock of sparrows.

The winners want every signup and will pay for every signup honestly. At least I want to believe that.

andrej_NDC 07-13-2010 12:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Argos88 (Post 17330208)
Are you serious?

Man, open your eyes.. can't you see the current situation of the business??, for long time now... no news at all...

can't believe poeple are so naive, seriously.

.
My sales have been great in june...its just this month and a few days within it that suck a lot.

ro8in 07-13-2010 12:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetaMan (Post 17330597)
Adult is in big trouble for another 2 years before it picks up again.

Visa and Mastercard came in and did a shit canning on alot of processors for allowing cross sales and shady rebills where terms were not stated properly.

this is basically how 90% of adult programs have been operating for the past 2 years+. this is how they afforeded to pay all you idiots high PPS. basically banging peoples cards. Visa and Mastercard came in and said enough is enough and forced processors to clean up their act in mainstream and adult.

the processors feeling the heat have shit canned almost everyone who even remotely reeks of anything that is not pure white hat techniques. there are still a few people around who have connections in billing but if you promote them you are only playing with fire as merchants can lock go in and lock accounts without even blinking an eye. which is happening left right and center.

so what you have had happen imo is sponsors are A) either forced to close down B) know that their currents methods are going to be shut down so they are milking whatever they can while they can.

the only people being approved are white hat sites with large backing of capital. smaller people will be approved but they are capping those accounts at ridiculously low maximums like $25 000. leaving no space to even process for affiliates.

Adult is overall deemed by Visa and Mastercard as a high risk industry and it is only going to get worse.

It will be a long while before things open up again and there will only be a few left. and as risk becomes less and less viable affiliates will be pushed out of the game further and further.
Thats the first time I see you writing some real serious shit and being 200% right in a long time

DaLord 07-13-2010 12:59 AM
I was at a big factory the other day with a friend who mentioned to a lot of workers that I work with porn. Suddenly they started talking about which TUBE is the best. Youporn won I think. 5-6 of the guys kept cheering 'YouPorn'.

People don't buy porn anymore. They get it for free and why would they not.

Sausage 07-13-2010 01:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vjo (Post 17330433)
I have one prog this period (7-1 to 1-15) using nats 4 that had around 15 submits from the signup page and 0 signups.
So something is wrong.

So I look at last period 6-16 to 6-30
and I had almost the same number of submits (15) and had 7 signups
Small time/ newbie webmasters who make these stupid posts irk me. 15 submits is nothing ... its bugger all traffic and such a small sample pool that its idiotic trying to read anything into it.

There is a worsening of ratios, and yes it is getting harder to get a CC through the scrubs, but just because your tiny tiny little pool of traffic isn't converting doesn't mean much. I hate it when small time webmasters make sweeping assumptions based on their own tiny pools of data.

Vjo 07-13-2010 01:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sausage (Post 17330913)
Small time/ newbie webmasters who make these stupid posts irk me. 15 submits is nothing ... its bugger all traffic and such a small sample pool that its idiotic trying to read anything into it.

There is a worsening of ratios, and yes it is getting harder to get a CC through the scrubs, but just because your tiny tiny little pool of traffic isn't converting doesn't mean much. I hate it when small time webmasters make sweeping assumptions based on their own tiny pools of data.
First of all the site and niche make 15 submits a factor.

Second of all 7 signups a period x over 50 sponsors per period and I live just fine.

So ASSuME all you want BIG timer.

Besides it isnt about how big you are.

I never said I was drawing conclusions to anything. Just gettinmg peoples attention.

I started with CE in Novemebr 1997. So I aint no newbie either.

Thanks for the bump.

Sausage 07-13-2010 01:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vjo (Post 17330931)
First of all the site and niche make 15 submits a factor.

Second of all 7 signups a period x over 50 sponsors per period and I live just fine.

So ASSuME all you want BIG timer.

Besides it isnt about how big you are.

I never said I was drawing conclusions to anything. Just gettinmg peoples attention.

I started with CE in Novemebr 1997. So I aint no newbie either.

Thanks for the bump.
Sorry for my terse reply. Just saying that while you probably think your pool of data is big and 'worthwhile' .. it really takes a ton more traffic to be able to make reasonable assumptions about traffic trends and possible problems.

You may not be a newbie sure .. but i know a lot of people who started in 97 who are barely scraping together $500-1000 a month at this game .. when you started has little or nothing to do with things. Infact most of the 97-00 guys still around don't have a clue and haven't adapted. Just saying

Anyway back on topic ... yes there has been a definite downturn, more than in previous years during summer.

Vjo 07-13-2010 01:44 AM
forget about it :)

BAKO 07-13-2010 01:48 AM
I'm 1:2600 overall this month, last month i was 1:1100 :(

NetHorse 07-13-2010 07:44 AM
monster.com

magicmike 07-13-2010 10:17 AM
Send some traffic to www.justporno.com via www.nichewealth.com and see if we can help your poor sales.

Fabien 07-13-2010 11:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeCreep (Post 17329565)
3 years from now, you'll wish your ratios were still as good as 1:8500.

3 years from now ? Make that one, just one. Trust me...

Fabien 07-13-2010 11:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tical (Post 17330487)
Traffic is up, sales are down. Ratios are turning to absolute crap. I don't see how the "summer slowdown" applies when you're still getting the same amount (or more) hits. If hits were down, then I'd buy into that theory.

Scrubbing is insanely high these days not to mention, so many customers have been fucked over by questionable billing practices that they've been forced to charge back at some point. Now these customers are in negative databases. Even if they legitimately want to sign up to site, they're declined off the bat.

Good point. The database must be bigger than it was 2 years ago for sure. I wonder for how long before the banks/card billers reactivate someone ?

j.chedda 07-15-2010 04:09 PM
give dating a try. We are still doing great! Hit me up

will76 07-15-2010 04:18 PM
Threads like this are funny and the responses are typical GFY.

Damn my sales are terrible this month, what caused this:

- The summer
- World cup
etc..

Or is it possible that it could be: competition where ever you are advertising increased? or you working less? or a problem on your end? No....

When sales drop, come to GFY where everyone will help fill your head with bullshit excuses to explain why it happened.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tical (Post 17330487)
Traffic is up, sales are down. Ratios are turning to absolute crap. I don't see how the "summer slowdown" applies when you're still getting the same amount (or more) hits. If hits were down, then I'd buy into that theory.

Scrubbing is insanely high these days not to mention, so many customers have been fucked over by questionable billing practices that they've been forced to charge back at some point. Now these customers are in negative databases. Even if they legitimately want to sign up to site, they're declined off the bat.
Traffic can't be up, everyone is spending 2-3 hours a day on facebook and WOW and less time on porn. So traffic has to be down, you have to be wrong sir! :winkwink:

(im being sarcastic, I agree with you).

colin farrell 07-15-2010 04:25 PM
biggest year and month for me in 9 years.

colin farrell 07-15-2010 04:26 PM
lol. people still believe in the scrub o meter.

hahaha.

will76 07-15-2010 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sausage (Post 17330944)

Anyway back on topic ... yes there has been a definite downturn, more than in previous years during summer.
You are in Australia, so is it called a Winter down turn for you guys then? And then during your summer when less sales are made there it is our winter, so it's a winter slow down here? I can't keep up with all the down turns, its funny how if all of these down turns were true everyday would be a down turn for everyone and no one would have good days :1orglaugh Fact of the matter there is shit that happens every day, and if said shit really did affect porn sales by the nature of it happening everyday it would be an illrelivant factor :2 cents: Bad whether here, good there, summer here while winter there, those that look NFL not surfing during games but those who watch soccer instead surfing, during world cup no soccer surfers but nfl surfers still looking at porn. during summer too hot to go out people surf more, some people play more during the day, now surf at night, so people go out more at night, surf during the day. there is always something but people only key in on the "something" when they have a bad day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by colin farrell (Post 17338631)
biggest year and month for me in 9 years.
congrats! you know why it was your best month, because there was good weather today :1orglaugh j/k.... because you have been working hard I assume. The same logic why some people are doing worst than ever... still advertising the same shit the same way working the same amount of time doing it.

nikki99 07-15-2010 06:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarmusch (Post 17328030)
http://rationallythinkingoutloud.fil..._bob_large.gif
We are having a record sales month. Everything is great.
:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

ContentPimp 07-16-2010 01:06 AM
Vacations everywhere, not only sales are down, but everyone I know goes on vacations (webmasters included!)

$5 submissions 07-16-2010 01:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarmusch (Post 17328030)
http://rationallythinkingoutloud.fil..._bob_large.gif
We are having a record sales month. Everything is great.
Nice preemption. Baghdad Bob FTW

GARY LEE 07-16-2010 04:18 AM
sales cycles
 
Come on guys. It's a fact of life. Sales are like slot machines. Sometimes they pay really great and sometimes they just suck all the money out of your pocket (and your girlfriends). Just hang out and keep running your business solid and the payout will swing the other way.
Good luck!:thumbsup

Zester 07-16-2010 07:27 AM
too much free content is to be found to easily with the help of google.
it doesn't matter that you promote webcams or dating because they already jerked off to free content they found so easily.
sub and micro niches are easily found on youTube because it is not considered porn - so going that way won't help either.

I found a few ways of making the same amount of money but I don't want to spit them out as long as they are working for me.

Stephen 07-16-2010 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GARY LEE (Post 17339635)
Sales are like slot machines. Sometimes they pay really great and sometimes they just suck all the money out of your pocket (and your girlfriends). Just hang out and keep running your business solid and the payout will swing the other way.
While that's true, it may not be that simple anymore.

I fear the bloodbath is just starting... Of course, that leads to new opportunities :2 cents:

rogueteens 07-16-2010 09:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrej_NDC (Post 17330846)
My sales have been great in june...its just this month and a few days within it that suck a lot.
same here, last month was one of my best ever. I'm looking at being a third down on that this month :(

Zester 07-17-2010 12:31 AM
for those of you talking about last month only: you can't conclude much about one bad month, in this biz sometimes sales goes up and sometimes down.
you need to detect a trend


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