BP Oil Spill also leaking huge amounts of Methane - Just fucking great :/

[dav3]

NEW ORLEANS ? It is an overlooked danger in the oil spill crisis: The crude gushing from the well contains vast amounts of natural gas that could pose a serious threat to the Gulf of Mexico's fragile ecosystem.

The oil emanating from the seafloor contains about 40 percent methane, compared with about 5 percent found in typical oil deposits, said John Kessler, a Texas A&M University oceanographer who is studying the impact of methane from the spill.

That means huge quantities of methane have entered the Gulf, scientists say, potentially suffocating marine life and creating "dead zones" where oxygen is so depleted that nothing lives.

"Where nothing lives" - That includes the microbes that breakdown the oil. - AKA. this is bad fucking news.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100618/...gulf_oil_spill

Worst quote from the story:

"The gas that escapes, what we don't flare, goes up to the surface and is gone," he said.

Yea, because matter is known to just be 'gone', huh? Fucking assholes are still in the PR story twisting mode.

[ottopottomouse]

Originally Posted by dav3

Worst quote from the story:

Yea, because matter is known to just be 'gone', huh? Fucking assholes are still in the PR story twisting mode.

Methane comes up out of water anyway. 'goes up to the surface and is gone' is how I would have described it as well and i'm not aware of BP paying my wages.

[dyna mo]

who farted?

[JFK]

Originally Posted by ottopottomouse

Methane comes up out of water anyway. 'goes up to the surface and is gone' is how I would have described it as well and i'm not aware of BP paying my wages.

did they give you any gifts ?

[crazytrini85]

Anything and everything will be said now so Obama and his thugs can pass through new energy laws.

[BestXXXPorn]

Originally Posted by crazytrini85

Anything and everything will be said now so Obama and his thugs can pass through new energy laws.

qft, it's all about the government taking control over as much as possible these days... way out of hand.

[thickcash_amo]

I honestly keep thinking "this is the worst of the news".....but every freaking day they come out with something that tops it!

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

qft, it's all about the government taking control over as much as possible these days... way out of hand.

self-regulation has proven to not work.

[BestXXXPorn]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

self-regulation has proven to not work.

This is the biggest load of crap ever... when have we been self-regulated?

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

This is the biggest load of crap ever... when have we been self-regulated?

you're joking right? what do you think allowed the bp disaster?

The U.S. government is not alone in ceding responsibility to the oil industry for the design of key safety features on offshore rigs, a trend coming under scrutiny worldwide following the deadly blowout in the Gulf of Mexico.

Across the globe, industry-driven regulation is the norm, not the exception ? and critics are calling for a re-examination of a system that puts crucial safety decisions into the hands of corporations motivated by profit.

[Sausage]

I know its tempting to blame BP for everything but ...

# Only 8 of the 126 people working on the Deepwater Horizon were BP employees.

# BP only held a 65% share in the well, Anadarko held 25%. Anadarko are a Texas based oil production company with 4000 employees.

# The rig itself was owned and operated by an American firm, Transocean. They have been questioned with regards to possible understaffing. On the night of the disaster there were just 18 employees on the rig, lower than any other retained record. None of these were engineers, electricians, subsea supervisors or mechanics.

# The failed 'blow out preventer' was made by another American firm - Cameron.

# The cement work carried out which was supposed to 'seal' the well was carried out by yet another American firm, Halliburton - once run by Dick Cherney.

[dyna mo]

311,000 results on oil industry self-regulation

http://www.google.com/search?q=oil+i...ient=firefox-a

[baddog]

They have always said there is more gas escaping than oil. 2012 is just around the corner.

[BestXXXPorn]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

you're joking right? what do you think allowed the bp disaster?

The U.S. government is not alone in ceding responsibility to the oil industry for the design of key safety features on offshore rigs, a trend coming under scrutiny worldwide following the deadly blowout in the Gulf of Mexico.

Across the globe, industry-driven regulation is the norm, not the exception – and critics are calling for a re-examination of a system that puts crucial safety decisions into the hands of corporations motivated by profit.

Are you saying the oil industry isn't regulated??!! hahahhahahahahahahahha

First I'll tell you what caused it... the 0.08 cent per barrel tax that pays for the disasters... As a company, why would I install expensive security and safety measures if my risk is minimal?!

INSTEAD if there was no $0.08 cent tax and the company, in this case BP was FULLY FUCKING LIABLE for all damages... I guaran-damn-tee you they would install every safety measure they could because the risk is too great.

The government supports shady practices by lowering their risk... through... control and regulation.

Same thing with fractional reserve banking. The FDIC insures all accounts up to $100k or whatever it is... This completely destroyed reserve banking because the risk to the consumer is NULL. If this insurance wasn't available then banks would not be loaning out 80%+ of their clients cash. You would see many more reserve banks and at least MUCH higher holdings by fractional banking systems...

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

Are you saying the oil industry isn't regulated??!! hahahhahahahahahahahha

snipped.

you lost me when you made the disrepectful hahah, there's simply no need to laugh at me and point fingers.

i treat you with respect and require the same.

[Tom_PM]

The rights position is that when they dont control the government, then the government is the problem. We all remember (well not really) Ronald Reagan using that line of bullshit. We also rememebr the era of "greed is good" that ole ronny ushered in.

Yeah. We want THAT again.

[dicksman42]

Originally Posted by Sausage

I know its tempting to blame BP for everything but ...

# Only 8 of the 126 people working on the Deepwater Horizon were BP employees.

# BP only held a 65% share in the well, Anadarko held 25%. Anadarko are a Texas based oil production company with 4000 employees.

# The rig itself was owned and operated by an American firm, Transocean. They have been questioned with regards to possible understaffing. On the night of the disaster there were just 18 employees on the rig, lower than any other retained record. None of these were engineers, electricians, subsea supervisors or mechanics.

# The failed 'blow out preventer' was made by another American firm - Cameron.

# The cement work carried out which was supposed to 'seal' the well was carried out by yet another American firm, Halliburton - once run by Dick Cherney.

Maybe that explains the recent apology to BP which was later recanted or he would have to kick rocks.

[dyna mo]

nytimes on oil industry self-regulation
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/08/us/08agency.html?hp

MMS Ceded Oversight of Rig Safety to Oil Drillers
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?a_id=92962

AP INVESTIGATION: Self-regulation of safety features is norm in oil industry worldwide
http://calamities.gaeatimes.com/2010...rldwide-24658/

Carelessness and industry self-regulation created the calamity
http://unearthed.earthjustice.org/bl...-and-disbelief

industry self-regulation of key parts of the drilling
http://adropofrain.net/2010/06/how-l...zon-oil-spill/

The St. Petersburg Times is publishing a damning piece Sunday on Big Oil’s success in lobbying for voluntary, “trust us,” self-regulation.
http://climateprogress.org/2010/05/0...lf-regulation/

Self-Regulation in the Corporate State: The BP Spill
http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns/tgif/bp-spill/

[BestXXXPorn]

You're missing my point ... if oil companies were held 100% liable for all damages... all of that goes away. The risk becomes to great for oil companies not to put all the proper safety measures in place.

The industry is regulated via a giant blanket get out of jail free card... Take the card away... make them 100% liable.

[dyna mo]

Federal oversight of oil industry is broken
http://www.nola.com/opinions/index.s...oil_indus.html

The BP Spill: Self-Regulation, Public Property, and Political Capitalism
http://www.masterresource.org/2010/0...al-capitalism/

Oil industry self regulation not working
http://www.wildlifeextra.com/go/whal...-sperm.html#cr

MMS has began relying more on industry self-regulation
http://rt.com/Top_News/2010-05-12/oi...-hearings.html

But it is clear that oil industry self-regulation is a dangerous policy that needs to change.
http://www.allbusiness.com/governmen...4479685-1.html

[BestXXXPorn]

The links you're posting are again, misinformed people... they don't understand that there ARE regulations in place... They're clamoring for more industry regulation in an industry that's already regulated in the WRONG direction...

Every time more regulation is added it creates additional loopholes and problems... You have to look at the root of the problem. The root of the problem is that the oil companies aren't fully liable for their damages. No matter HOW MUCH REGULATION you add to the picture they will always do the minimal required to have their asses covered by the government regulated/provided insurance...

You MUST take away the regulation which allows them to not be liable. It's the ONLY WAY.

[DaddyHalbucks]

Global warming is bunk. That said..

"Methane is a relatively potent greenhouse gas. Compared with carbon dioxide, it has a high global warming potential of 72 (calculated over a period of 20 years) or 25 (for a time period of 100 years).[2] Methane in the atmosphere is eventually oxidized, producing carbon dioxide and water. As a result, methane in the atmosphere has a half life of seven years[citation needed]."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

you're joking right? what do you think allowed the bp disaster?

The U.S. government is not alone in ceding responsibility to the oil industry for the design of key safety features on offshore rigs, a trend coming under scrutiny worldwide following the deadly blowout in the Gulf of Mexico.

Across the globe, industry-driven regulation is the norm, not the exception ? and critics are calling for a re-examination of a system that puts crucial safety decisions into the hands of corporations motivated by profit.

woo re-examination.. i wonder if those regulations will go the way of the financial ones

[dyna mo]

Rampant de-regulation - and its fell cousin, industry self-regulation/voluntary regulation - has consequences. ...
http://www.whistleblower.org/blog/31...form-explosion

The perils of industry self-regulation
http://oneutah.org/2010/04/30/bp-oil...-libreal-bias/


The Gulf oil spill is a classic act of industry self-regulation
http://danerwin.typepad.com/my_weblo...ving-door.html

the concept of industry self regulation is laughable.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/foru...rust-authority

The government can no longer embrace the concept of industry self-regulation.
http://thenewsdispatch.com/articles/...1171122073.txt

industry self-regulation is not adequate
http://www.viewzone2.com/oilnuke.html

But it is clear that oil industry self-regulation is a dangerous policy that needs to change.
http://www.timesheraldonline.com/editorial/ci_15115999

[BestXXXPorn]

You can stop posting links... they're all people that don't understand the full picture, just read what I wrote and respond to it if you have a valid argument against my logic.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by _Richard_

woo re-examination.. i wonder if those regulations will go the way of the financial ones

yeah, exactly. just like the deep water atlantis operating in the gulf. 2000 feet deeper than the deepwater horizon, 5-6x more production and it's cranking out oil as we speak.
it didn't have to shut down via the moratorium

BP Atlantis rig plans never received proper approvals, former contractor says
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...061703872.html

[Hornydog4cooter]

Originally Posted by DaddyHalbucks

Global warming is bunk. That said..

"Methane is a relatively potent greenhouse gas. Compared with carbon dioxide, it has a high global warming potential of 72 (calculated over a period of 20 years) or 25 (for a time period of 100 years).[2] Methane in the atmosphere is eventually oxidized, producing carbon dioxide and water. As a result, methane in the atmosphere has a half life of seven years[citation needed]."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane

Do you know what the biggest methane cause is not man made?

[fatfoo]

This oil spill is sure poisonous.

[Tom_PM]

I actually saw a republican congressman yesterday on tv saying, and I dont have a exact quote, but he said , If this disaster was caused by lax regulations from the Bush era, then how come it didnt happen until a year and a half into the Obama administration? lmfao.

Come on. It's a politics game where it shouldnt be.

[roly]

Originally Posted by DaddyHalbucks

Global warming is bunk. That said..

"Methane is a relatively potent greenhouse gas. Compared with carbon dioxide, it has a high global warming potential of 72 (calculated over a period of 20 years) or 25 (for a time period of 100 years).[2] Methane in the atmosphere is eventually oxidized, producing carbon dioxide and water. As a result, methane in the atmosphere has a half life of seven years[citation needed]."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane

if global warming is bunk then it doesn't matter. but the vast majority of scientists say its happening.

either way the amount of methane escaping is a piss in the ocean (excuse the pun) when compared to the amount of methane produced when cows and other livestock belch. and its a bit of a joke for the worlds greatest polluter (the US) to be complaining about the methane having an impact on global warming.

[Hornydog4cooter]

Originally Posted by roly

if global warming is bunk then it doesn't matter. but the vast majority of scientists say its happening.

either way the amount of methane escaping is a piss in the ocean (excuse the pun) when compared to the amount of methane produced when cows and other livestock belch. and its a bit of a joke for the worlds greatest polluter (the US) to be complaining about the methane having an impact on global warming.

smart reply and correct reply

[dyna mo]

with deregulation of the oil supply industry
http://www.med.govt.nz/upload/20008/risbccs.pdf

Oil Self-Regulation Happens All Around The Globe.
http://saviourfavor.com/2010/05/20/o...und-the-globe/

Lessons Not Learned: Oil Industry Fails to Embrace Adequate Safety Measures
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...-96077909.html

At the MMS, federal regulation has increasingly become industry self-regulation.
http://www.newsobserver.com/2010/05/...spillover.html

Federal Regulators Allowed Oil Companies To Decide Safety Issues
http://www.scientificblogging.com/ch...a fety_issues

[seeandsee]

bp spills shit with this all over us, how about that top kill, is that done?

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by PR_Tom

I actually saw a republican congressman yesterday on tv saying, and I dont have a exact quote, but he said , If this disaster was caused by lax regulations from the Bush era, then how come it didnt happen until a year and a half into the Obama administration? lmfao.

Come on. It's a politics game where it shouldnt be.

classic.

[Kiopa_Matt]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

You're missing my point ... if oil companies were held 100% liable for all damages... all of that goes away. The risk becomes to great for oil companies not to put all the proper safety measures in place.

The industry is regulated via a giant blanket get out of jail free card... Take the card away... make them 100% liable.

Uhhh, BP is legally liable for every penny. No cap.

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

You can stop posting links... they're all people that don't understand the full picture, just read what I wrote and respond to it if you have a valid argument against my logic.

I think he did .. very eloquently

[BestXXXPorn]

Originally Posted by RDFrame

Uhhh, BP is legally liable for every penny. No cap.

Again people are very misinformed ... they are responsible for 100% of the cleanup costs... they are only liable for $20M of all the damages caused to everyone effected by this disaster.

[GregE]

Originally Posted by Hornydog4cooter

Do you know what the biggest methane cause is not man made?

Yeah, well this stuff is gonna give those farting cows a run for the money.

[Kiopa_Matt]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

Again people are very misinformed ... they are responsible for 100% of the cleanup costs... they are only liable for $20M of all the damages caused to everyone effected by this disaster.

No. As long as the US government can prove in court that the negligence of BP (or any of its contractors) was responsible for the oil spill, then BP is on the hook for everything.

And from what's come out so far, I doubt it'll be very difficult for BP to be found guilty of negligence.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by RDFrame

And from what's come out so far, I doubt it'll be very difficult for BP to be found guilty of negligence.

what leads you to think so?

[BestXXXPorn]

Originally Posted by RDFrame

No. As long as the US government can prove in court that the negligence of BP (or any of its contractors) was responsible for the oil spill, then BP is on the hook for everything.

And from what's come out so far, I doubt it'll be very difficult for BP to be found guilty of negligence.

Not true...

"The Oil Pollution Act of 1990, or OPA, was put into place after the Exxon Valdez oil spill, which focused national attention on the oil industry’s responsibility to plan for, prevent, and eventually clean up its oil spills. As everyone on this committee knows, the OPA imposes several limits on the liability of a vessel or drilling facility owner in the event of a spill. These liability limits depend, for vessels, on the size of the vessel and whether it is a single- or double-hulled vessel; for facilities, the limits depend on whether the facility is onshore or offshore. For the purposes of the current disaster, the OPA provides that the facility owner is liable for all cleanup costs, but that its liability for longer-term effects on natural resources and the economy are limited to $75 million. Beyond this, damages are paid out of the Oil Spill Liability Trust Fund, which itself has a spending cap of $1 billion per incident, of which no more than $500 million may be paid for natural resource damages. Beyond that, the costs are ultimately the responsibility of the taxpayers and communities affected, sometimes for decades, after an oil spill."

Government regulation at its finest... providing a giant shield to oil companies for their disasters... down with the regulation! ;)

But instead the talks are about raising the .08 cent tax to like $0.64... FUCK THAT the consumers don't need to pay for their disasters, THEY DO. Again, like I stated... no amount of additional regulation will cause the oil companies to do more than they have to because the regulation shields them. The ONLY way to correct this problem is to remove this regulation and make them 100% liable for all damages.

[GregE]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

Again people are very misinformed ... they are responsible for 100% of the cleanup costs... they are only liable for $20M of all the damages caused to everyone effected by this disaster.

It's my understanding that the dems are going to try to change that law retroactively. Of course, they'll need 60 votes, as usual, to get this past the republicans

[Dcat]

[BestXXXPorn]

As a follow up to my previous post, new post in case I'm being quoted currently...

Regulating the type of safety precautions that need to be in place is a bad idea. What happens is it stops all progress towards creating better solutions. The regulation will lock in exactly what needs to be in place. It kills all competition and technological progress in creating better, safer, more reliable systems to ensure this doesn't happen again...

No company is going to manufacture or research a product they can't sell to anyone because the regulation says they have to have x, y, z specific safety measures...

[Kiopa_Matt]

Originally Posted by BestXXXPorn

Not true...

"The Oil Pollution Act of 1990, or OPA, was put into place after the Exxon Valdez oil spill, which focused national attention on the oil industry?s responsibility to plan for, prevent, and eventually clean up its oil spills. As everyone on this committee knows, the OPA imposes several limits on the liability of a vessel or drilling facility owner in the event of a spill. These liability limits depend, for vessels, on the size of the vessel and whether it is a single- or double-hulled vessel; for facilities, the limits depend on whether the facility is onshore or offshore. For the purposes of the current disaster, the OPA provides that the facility owner is liable for all cleanup costs, but that its liability for longer-term effects on natural resources and the economy are limited to $75 million. Beyond this, damages are paid out of the Oil Spill Liability Trust Fund, which itself has a spending cap of $1 billion per incident, of which no more than $500 million may be paid for natural resource damages. Beyond that, the costs are ultimately the responsibility of the taxpayers and communities affected, sometimes for decades, after an oil spill."

Government regulation at its finest... providing a giant shield to oil companies for their disasters... down with the regulation! ;)

But instead the talks are about raising the .08 cent tax to like $0.64... FUCK THAT the consumers don't need to pay for their disasters, THEY DO. Again, like I stated... no amount of additional regulation will cause the oil companies to do more than they have to because the regulation shields them. The ONLY way to correct this problem is to remove this regulation and make them 100% liable for all damages.

Ok, fine, you're right and I'm wrong. I don't particularly give a shit.

But yes, IF they followed all safety codes & regulations, and it was just a simple accident, then you're right, $75 million cap. However, if the courts find there was negligence behind the accident, then the cap becomes null & void.

Research it for yourself if you want, but even simple common sense will tell you this. Why do you think BP put $20 billion into an escrow fund without any real fuss? I highly doubt it was due to their good hearted nature.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Jesus H Christ

Slow down there sausage. Transocean and Halliburton were subcontractors. BP has had over 750 fines/warnings in the last 5 years when other oil companies averaged 2 or 3. What is most important here is BP had the final word in all decisions when it came to that rig. BP hired Transocean and BP hired Halliburton and it's others and failed at their management abilities.

yup. + the law states that the entity who is leasing the operation and owns the oil produced, has the liability. that said, bp, by design, operates via a confusing papertrail of ownership, they don't own any drilling operations, all leased, moreover, the deepwater horizon, like all offshore rigs, is classified as a ship, and bp flagged the ship deepwater horizon under the marshall islands to bypass u.s. regulations.

[TheDoc]

Having a localized release of methane is very bad.

The East Siberian Arctic Shelf, which covers 2 million square kilometers of sea floor is across a large enough area that it doesn't shut life down. And it's the largest releaser of methane on the planet, more than the rest of the oceans combined together. The oceans are the number one releaser of methane, however the water filters it and it happens across the entire globe.

If the methane was to build in an area, spewing out and can't be filtered - strong enough to kill life. It means it's strong enough to ignite. All it takes is cloud lightening, and you have a monster fire ball.

[baddog]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Having a localized release of methane is very bad.

The East Siberian Arctic Shelf, which covers 2 million square kilometers of sea floor is across a large enough area that it doesn't shut life down. And it's the largest releaser of methane on the planet, more than the rest of the oceans combined together. The oceans are the number one releaser of methane, however the water filters it and it happens across the entire globe.

If the methane was to build in an area, spewing out and can't be filtered - strong enough to kill life. It means it's strong enough to ignite. All it takes is cloud lightening, and you have a monster fire ball.

Hurricane season should be interesting.

[dav3]

Originally Posted by Dcat

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Having a localized release of methane is very bad.

The East Siberian Arctic Shelf, which covers 2 million square kilometers of sea floor is across a large enough area that it doesn't shut life down. And it's the largest releaser of methane on the planet, more than the rest of the oceans combined together. The oceans are the number one releaser of methane, however the water filters it and it happens across the entire globe.

If the methane was to build in an area, spewing out and can't be filtered - strong enough to kill life. It means it's strong enough to ignite. All it takes is cloud lightening, and you have a monster fire ball.

It's been fun ya'll: