Yeah exactly, kinda brilliant how you can claim self defense by being the aggressor and people buy it. Sometimes I think the jews are right.. the goyim are just cattle easily fooled.

again- more countries having nuclear weapons is not the answer, it's worse.

LOL 'So Israel was created?' that's definitely not how it worked!!

The plans for Israel were laid down decades earlier, the fact that after WWII there were Jews moving south was just a 'coincidence'.

The winners of WWII = Israel and the Zionists through the lives of other innocent Jews, through the lives of American soldiers and their allies.

fully agreed, but with that thinking everyone should disarm. it should be equal rules for all.

That's fair, they didn't like their government but if you haven't realized the majority of people in the US don't like THEIR government either. Does that give another country the right to start saying they're going to come in and put someone of their choosing as head of the country? OH PLEASE...

Also they are called Persians because for all of the history of the country it was called Persia up until 1935 which is still pretty recent. It has NOTHING to do with them not liking their government.

Just because people don't like their government it doesn't mean that the government needs to be overthrown. The point is there are elections, someone is voted in and they become head of the government only through those democratic means. It only becomes a bad government when they don't side with the US, then they are 'terrorists'.

Look at Hamas in Palestine, for years people called for a fair and free election in Palestine and when it happened, Hamas won. So what does the US and Israel do? They declare Hamas a terrorist organization and give the election to someone of their choosing. How is that democracy? The whole idea of it is a joke, the people don't decide anything and when the people do decide they ALWAYS decide for their best interests which often happens to be not the best interest of the US.

Correction...Hamas was deemed to be a terrorist org by western powers before they were voted into power in Gaza.

They kept the hostages as a political move via someone within and on the US's behalf so it appeared as though it was Reagans doings and to discredit Carter who was running for re-election. My understanding is that there were weapons exchanged for this deal. Which later became known as the Iran-Contra affair.

Your understanding is wrong...which is not unusual for you.

My understanding is backed up as usual by documented factual historical events. What is it about the unclassified documented events do you have trouble with believing war hero?

Israel funded Hamas even before that. Much like the US did the Taliban and created and funded alCIAda

No it is not...and I can prove it with a link. You cannot do the same...now can you?

You mean like this? Grant it this is just the "read between the lines" link for starters..

The Iran–Contra affair[1] (Persian: ماجرای مکhaفارلین, Spanish: caso Irán-contras) was a political scandal in the United States that came to light in November 1986. During the Reagan administration, senior U.S. figures, including President Ronald Reagan, agreed to facilitate the sale of arms to Iran, the subject of an arms embargo.[2] At least some U.S. officials also hoped that the arms sales would secure the release of hostages and allow U.S. intelligence agencies to fund the Nicaraguan contras.

The affair began as an operation to improve U.S.-Iranian relations. It was planned that Israel would ship weapons to a relatively moderate, politically influential group of Iranians, and then the U.S. would resupply Israel and receive the Israeli payment. The Iranian recipients promised to do everything in their power to achieve the release of six U.S. hostages, who were being held by the Lebanese Shia Islamist group Hezbollah, who in turn were unknowingly connected to the Army of the Guardians of the Islamic Revolution. The plan deteriorated into an arms-for-hostages scheme, in which members of the executive branch sold weapons to Iran in exchange for the release of the American hostages.[3][4] Large modifications to the plan were devised by Lieutenant Colonel Oliver North of the National Security Council in late 1985, in which a portion of the proceeds from the weapon sales was diverted to fund anti-Sandinista and anti-communist rebels, or Contras, in Nicaragua.[5]

While President Ronald Reagan was a supporter of the Contra cause,[6] no conclusive evidence has been found showing that he authorized the diversion of the money raised by the Iranian arms sales to the Contras.[3][4][7] Handwritten notes taken by Defense Secretary Casper Weinberger indicate that Reagan was aware of potential hostages transfers with Iran, as well as the sale of Hawk and TOW missiles to "moderates elements" within that country.[8] Oliver North, one of the central figures in the affair, wrote in a book that "Ronald Reagan knew of and approved a great deal of what went on with both the Iranian initiative and private efforts on behalf of the contras and he received regular, detailed briefings on both." Mr. North also writes: "I have no doubt that he was told about the use of residuals for the contras, and that he approved it. Enthusiastically."[9] North's account is difficult to verify because of the secrecy that still surrounds the affair.

After the weapon sales were revealed in November 1986, Reagan appeared on national television and stated that the weapons transfers had indeed occurred, but that the United States did not trade arms for hostages.[10] To this day, it is unclear exactly what Reagan knew and when, and whether the arms sales were motivated by his desire to save the U.S. hostages. Notes taken December 7, 1985, by Defense Secretary Weinberger record that Reagan said that "he could answer charges of illegality but he couldnt answer charge [sic] that 'big strong President Reagan passed up a chance to free hostages.'"[11] Investigations were compounded when large volumes of documents relating to the scandal were destroyed or withheld from investigators by Reagan administration officials.[12] On March 4, 1987, Reagan returned to the airwaves in a nationally televised address, taking full responsibility for any actions that he was unaware of, and admitting that "what began as a strategic opening to Iran deteriorated, in its implementation, into trading arms for hostages."[13]

Several investigations ensued, including those by the United States Congress and the three-man, Reagan-appointed Tower Commission. Neither found any evidence that President Reagan himself knew of the extent of the multiple programs.[3][4][7] In the end, fourteen administration officials were indicted, including then-Secretary of Defense Caspar Weinberger. Eleven convictions resulted, some of which were vacated on appeal.[14] The rest of those indicted or convicted were all pardoned in the final days of the George H. W. Bush presidency; Bush had been vice-president at the time of the affair.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Contra_affair

Now before you use your fingers further you might want to read through the unclassified documents of those investigations into it all during and prior to.

US officials used hostages as a way to get what they wanted politically at home and in Iran. It's been done time and time again.

But once they won the election they were declared a terrorist organization and therefore they wouldn't recognize their government. Maybe it wasn't the first time they were being accused of being terrorists but I don't see your point?

theking do you support what Israel did to the USS Liberty when they killed 34 US soldiers, the only 'friendly fire' incident never investigated by congress?

but then again what can you expect from someone who fought for the US, you guys are just Israeli puppets anyways especially the soldiers, I just thought that maybe you learned to form your own opinions by now.

Yes...you have correctly identified what became known as the Iran/Contra affair which had absolutley nothing to do with the embassy hostages taken by Iran during President Carter's Presidency and that were released upon President Regan being elected President.

So I repeat...your understanding was wrong...which is not unusual for you.

Same shit, different hostages.. Get it? It's been done time and time again. I already knew where you were going which is why I said "you might want to read through the unclassified documents of those investigations into it all during and prior to.."

You are uncapable of reading between the lines.. There again, I already knew where you were going..

Oh I get it...your understanding was wrong...as I originally stated...and no it is not the same "shit" at all. Nothing was exchanged for the release of the Embassy hostages...and there was an exchange during the Iran/Contra affair...so once again you are wrong...which once again is not unusual for you...sport. Get it?

You believe that if you wish. Don't you think it's kinda childish to believe that was the first time it was ever done old man? Seriously.. The DAY OF Reagan being sworn in they were released.. Next up October Surprise

The phrase "October Surprise conspiracy" refers to an alleged plot to influence the outcome of the 1980 United States presidential election between incumbent Jimmy Carter (D–GA) and opponent Ronald Reagan (R–CA).

One of the leading, national issues during that year was the release of 52 Americans being held hostage in Iran since November 4, 1979.[1] Reagan won the election. On the day of his inauguration—in fact, twenty minutes after he concluded his inaugural address—the Islamic Republic of Iran announced the release of the hostages. The timing gave rise to an allegation that representatives of Reagan's presidential campaign had conspired with Iran to delay the release until after the election in order to thwart President Carter from pulling off an "October surprise".

According to the allegation, the Reagan Administration rewarded Iran for its participation in the plot by supplying Iran with weapons via Israel and by unblocking Iranian government monetary assets in US banks.

After twelve years of mixed media attention, both houses of the US Congress held separate inquiries and concluded that the allegations lacked supporting documentation.

Nevertheless, several individuals—most notably former Iranian President Abolhassan Bani-Sadr, former Naval intelligence officer and National Security Council member, Gary Sick; and former Reagan/Bush campaign and White House staffer, Barbara Honegger—have stood by the allegation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October...spiracy_theory

BTW...to further educate you...the Embassy hostges were released on 20 Jsnusry '81...and were received by President Carter at Rhein-Main Air Base in West Germany.

I am and have been fully aware of the events since they took place...which is the reason I knew that you were wrong...and allegations are allegations and allegations equals pigshit.

After Reagan being sworn in..

So you chose to believe the "official story".. We all get that.. A good slave.. You were trained well.

I...unlike you...usually choose to believe what is provable...and do not rely upon allegations...inuendo...suspicions..."reading between the lines"..etc.etc. In other words...unlike you..I choose to believe in reality and not pigshit...sport.

The Crazy October Surprise Debunking By Robert Parry (A Special Report)

"Patently absurd reasoning in someone’s argument can often tell you about the strength of the underlying facts. If an argument is deceptive on its face, you might suspect the supporting facts are pretty fragile, too."


"To this day, now 30 years after Iranian radicals seized the American hostages, the real story of what happened and how the Republicans manipulated the process remains mostly unknown."


http://www.consortiumnews.com/2009/110609.html

Read between those lines..

You just love pigshit...now don't you?

how on earth you came up with all this as a retort for my comment is beyond me. i've never advocated overthrowing anything, when the fuck did i ever say that? never is when. and i certainly do not need a fucking history lesson on persia/iran.

i was told the reason for calling themselves persians by every single one i met, not by a canadian, not an american, not a politician, not the wikipedia, not the fucking television. i have no reason to believe you over them. NONE. they were all very wonderful people and respected me and my views as they reflected theirs in conversation.

you gfyers just look for reasons to try and *correct* other's view & align them to your's.

and if you think i am going to think any person yapping in this thread is an authority on the middle east, you are truly drinking your own kool-aid.

The US should cut all ties with Israel.

Of course not. I have repeatedly stated that I am not a big fan of Israel...and even less of a fan of Hamas...the Palestinians and Iran.

i love iran... i want to move their and marry Mahmoud Ahmadinejad... we could have children and they could all be sailors......

i dont think i would force them to wear those silly sailor suits with the blue and white stripes though...

i hate americans....




.

Somethin for you americans

they wont watch it, they are convinced that they are in control of their media and government.

israel has won, they have convinced and entire population of lies. and control almost all free flowing information the average american sees.

they somehow take facts and call them "conspiracies". :1orglaugh

wow... i never knew you hated jews so much...

would you like me to send you some white supremacy literature?

there are many good racists groups to join that feel the same hatred you do.... :thumbsup










.

This is fucking horrific, and it is why the US needs to stop supporting Israel immediately!

How dare he talk bad about a people who see gentiles as subhuman, run the banks that are sucking people dry, run the media that brainwashes the goyim, and control american foreign policy through AIPAC.

P.S. Send me some literature.

seems fake

guess it isn't, but that's a crazy about-face considering

I just think its funny all of these people going "you Americans". When you need help, who do countries come crying to "usually?" America. Sure we have our flaws, every country does. Does everyone in the US agree with the political jackoffs in Washington? Nope. You have your opinions, but stop saying "American soldiers" are puppets for Israel as someone said. Those men and women are doing what they are told, the government you can blame for being a puppet, the people of a nation and the soldiers that defend them are not the puppets. Blame the government, fine, not the people, but at the same time remember who also comes to a lot of countries aid when needed. So many people are quick to criticize others instead of looking at themselves and their own country first. All these countries are fucked up, fighting over religion is fucked up, nuclear weapons are fucked up. It's part of life and needs to be dealt with, each country does it differently. I think I would much rather have the US helping "create democracy" (I use that term loosely) than say someone like China who might throw in large amounts of communist dictators or something (just an example). We are just looked at as the bad guys because we are the most "out there" in the world political view. If it was the great country of Canada out there doing the same thing, they would be bashed. The grass is always greener on the other side.

i'm american & i've seen that more than once in the time since it was produced several years ago.

& as i have said here time and time again, and there are several posters in this thread that know it- the media is the problem. and as long as we have the metamans of the world name-calling & denigrating others for not seeing the world EXACTLY as he does, we will continue to be groups that are splintered and unable to come together to create change.

media wins. :upsidedow

Well, probably you are right, well, most people are easy to manipulate and only insignificant units that experienced a lot in their lives are able to tell apart manipulation from facts and truth.

hey stupid just because you dont like the killing of innocent people does not mean you have anything against a group.

i have problems with Israel and the zionists in american who start war with them.

this may SHOCK YOU but there is jewish people who live all over the world in peace and harmony. and not every jewish person in Israel or America supports the occupation.

if you watched the vid above you would understand that.

the jews in the video that did not agree with policy were called "self jew haters".

and warned that the greatest threat to Judaism is the fact that anytime you do not agree with policy you are labeled as an anti Semite or a self hating jew. this in turns distracts from real anti Semites who want to see the jews go down.

just because i do not agree with policy does not mean i have anything against the people. many jews in Israel agree with my views.

but you are a complete tool anyway. but you feel cool throwing out words like "anti semite" because it is the thing to do.

you are a brainwashed dumb fuck and anyone who reads your post realizes you are completely useless. even when you try to be funny you come off as a complete idiot. dont quote me anymore it pains my brain to have to respond to people who cant understand the base of a topic before responding.

but hey you quoted me about the video because you watched it first right? you did watch it NOT.

idiot. :thumbsup

I LOVE AMERICA, my dad just became an american on friday, i am about 6 months away from my permanent green card. than i hope to become one also.

American soldiers are puppets. when you fight for a cause that you do not understand you are a puppet. that is the entire point of the term.

if they knew the back story of the topic they would have the right to say NO I WILL NOT FIGHT FOR THIS.

i dont know about you but i would be pretty pissed to find out i have been lied to. as they send my off IN MY PRIME to fight wars of greed that are complete lies.

Canada is just as fucked up for being there. same with the UK and any Israel supporting nations.

The people ARE TO BLAME! lets use this for example. when you are part of a gang and support a gang and they go around killing people YOU also have blood on your hands. we in north america and the UK all have blood on our hands because of our policies. if you dont understand that i dont know what to tell you.

keep trying to distance yourself from the truth, the truth is out there if you choose not to listen to it that is your own fault. it doesnt change the fact that the blood of innocent people are on your hands as an american just as they are mine a canadian.

and we arent talking about "China" it takes a very evil person to make it sound like their evil actions are ok because other people are worse. people go around and rob banks. is it ok for me to steal from the local corner store because people commit worse crimes of robbery? no of course not. open your mind and you will understand.

everything you read or hear in the north american meda is all a smoke screen. it is 100% filtered WAKE UP! just because you do not agree with your countires policy does not make you anti american, anti jew, anti canadian or anti british. it makes you PRO american/jewish/canadian/british because you believe in PEACE and not war and killing of innocent people.

and use paragraphs omfg how annoying i couldnt go through that entire post.

wrong when you are brainwashed about a situation you are indeed an idiot about it. i was there before, i used to be 100% on the other side of this issue until i did my own research and stopped listening to what people in the media tell me.

before i def. was a brainwashed idiot on the situation and now i have wised up. at least i am man enough to admit my faults.

i do not want to "come together" with people who refuse to think outside of the 4 walls they live in. these people you can lie to for years, let them know it was a lie and they will continue to rather believe in the lie rather than realize they are wrong and hear the truth. they do not want to proceed with the truth. proceeding with the truth means that it will force change. and most of these types do not want change.

i would rather move forward with the truth even if i found out my entire life was a lie.

you cannot come together with people like that, it is impossible.

keep believing that so you can continue to point your finger at others,

media wins.

you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem.