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Vendzilla 01-20-2010 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teh ghey (Post 16765681)
I love how people are saying "this sent a message to Washington".
This wont change shit. Republicans are power hungry assholes and democrats are retards. One party gets in, fucks everythign up, and people get frustrated and vote for the other party. Then they other party fucks up and people vote the first ones back in.

it really is the difference between a giant douche and a turd sandwich.

No party does shit for anyone. They make promises, get in office, and do nothing.

Um, I guess you didn't hear what happened in the 90's
Voter revolt, gop took the house and senate and Clinton had to change the way he did things

JaneB 01-20-2010 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSSuperstars (Post 16764475)
You seriously don't think healthcare is a right?
Really?
Like at all?

I must've been raised completely differently than you... or have a heart or something.. I can't see how a human being doesn't think that healthcare could be a right. I just don't. Any way I look at it, my brain pleads with me a million and one reasons why it IS a right... and should be a right.


Why should everything be a right? The problem in the US is that everyone thinks they are entitled to things.

JaneB 01-20-2010 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sausage (Post 16764494)
Please educate yourself on facts before you contribute to discussions like this.

It took me 2 seconds to find this ..

http://www.health-tourism.com/medica.../usa-research/

http://healthcare.change.org/blog/vi...outside_the_us

How many came to America for treatment ... there are a few hundred thousand a year, as i mentioned mostly for cutting edge care, trials and care not offered in other countries. For basic health care .. dental, surgery, general health care its all outbound traffic. Thailand, Canada, hell even Mexico and South America are proving to be popular destinations for Americans. Hell you guys even have an association for medical tourism set up to cater to the estimated 1 million americans who will seek care outside the US this year because of costs. Its big business.



A total face and neck lift procedure can cost about $12,000 in the U.S.A, while a similar procedure will costs around $3,000-4,000 overseas.

Plastic surgery is not a need in most cases. I thought we were taking about medical needs. :2 cents:

Tom_PM 01-20-2010 12:06 PM

It's silly how prominent people are tryng to say that this shows "the people" are worried about the country and all this. You mean "the people" of massachusetts. Fine. Good for you, lol. The demon craps dont need 60 votes anyway. They just wanted to bring in some publictards. We all know the pubes just stamped every shit bush sent anyway, guess the dums can just do the same thing now. How is this a win for the country? "Country First", right? lol, right.

Holly Lez! 01-20-2010 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rangermoore (Post 16763806)
All the demotards are crying on the floor right now..Sucking their little thumbs... :thumbsup

I am not lol... And I am from Boston.. She blew a huge lead but being fucking stupid and name calling.. If she had just stuck to the basics she could have pulled it out... To me it isn't about parties it is about the people as I think both parties suck

$5 submissions 01-20-2010 12:24 PM

The best REFORM for healthcare I can think of is a MARKET-BASED reform. 1) Set uniform standards for care and legal protections (this reduces the cost of defensive medicine) 2) Using these standards, allow HMOs and health companies to send patients overseas for much cheaper medical care 3) Allow health insurance companies to sell policies across state lines 4) enter medical standardization treaties with other countries 5) strict accreditation of foreign medical institutions.

Healthcare becomes way way cheaper, the market for medical services expands, developing countries step their game up through technology transfer/standards proliferation, patients get high quality care at lower costs, there's many benefits.

Why is this better than the Public Option? Because private players have an incentive to keep costs down and profits up. Competition breeds innovation and excellence. Bureaucracies lead to rationing and other problems. If there's anyone who can pull this off, it's the US.

The Demon 01-20-2010 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneB (Post 16765941)
Why should everything be a right? The problem in the US is that everyone thinks they are entitled to things.

I agree, I don't understand this mentality.

The Demon 01-20-2010 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by $5 submissions (Post 16766022)
The best REFORM for healthcare I can think of is a MARKET-BASED reform. 1) Set uniform standards for care and legal protections (this reduces the cost of defensive medicine) 2) Using these standards, allow HMOs and health companies to send patients overseas for much cheaper medical care 3) Allow health insurance companies to sell policies across state lines 4) enter medical standardization treaties with other countries 5) strict accreditation of foreign medical institutions.

Healthcare becomes way way cheaper, the market for medical services expands, developing countries step their game up through technology transfer/standards proliferation, patients get high quality care at lower costs, there's many benefits.

Why is this better than the Public Option? Because private players have an incentive to keep costs down and profits up. Competition breeds innovation and excellence. Bureaucracies lead to rationing and other problems. If there's anyone who can pull this off, it's the US.

Where did you come up with this? I've heard bits and pieces of this but together, it surprisingly is a very good idea.

crockett 01-20-2010 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DateDoc (Post 16763768)
I'd love to see this bring the Democrats and Republicans together to work on compromise, however, I think it will be the same old BS and they will just bicker more.

When have the Republicans ever come to the table to work with the Democrats? Even in massive defeat the Republicans were just as hard headed as they were when they controlled everything.

The simple fact is both side suck and neither does anything with the first thought being "for the people" but rather the first thought is what will this do for my re-election campaign or can I get something for myself out of this.

Anytime "for the people" comes up in their reasoning for doing anything, it's only to use as a campaign slogan. The simple fact is our govt sucks and it's not the Republican's or the Democrats fault, but rather all us idiots that play into their game and continue voting for them.

Minte 01-20-2010 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crockett (Post 16766092)
When have the Republicans ever come to the table to work with the Democrats? Even in massive defeat the Republicans were just as hard headed as they were when they controlled everything.

The simple fact is both side suck and neither does anything with the first thought being "for the people" but rather the first thought is what will this do for my re-election campaign or can I get something for myself out of this.

Anytime "for the people" comes up in their reasoning for doing anything, it's only to use as a campaign slogan. The simple fact is our govt sucks and it's not the Republican's or the Democrats fault, but rather all us idiots that play into their game and continue voting for them.

Surprisingly it has happened.


Asked about his greatest regret as a legislator, Ted Kennedy would usually cite his refusal to cut a deal with Richard Nixon on health care.

. . . [in 1971], Nixon asked Congress to require for the first time that all companies provide a health plan for their employees, with federal subsidies for low-income workers. Nixon was particularly intrigued by a new idea called health maintenance organizations, which held the promise of providing high-quality care at lower prices by relying on salaried physicians to manage and coordinate patient care.

At first, Kennedy rejected Nixon?s proposal as nothing more than a bonanza for the insurance industry that would create a two-class system of health care in America. But after Nixon won reelection, Kennedy began a series of secret negotiations with the White House that almost led to a public agreement. In the end, Nixon backed out after receiving pressure from small-business owners and the American Medical Association. And Kennedy himself decided to back off after receiving heavy pressure from labor leaders, who urged him to hold out for a single-payer system once Democrats recaptured the White House in the wake of the Watergate scandal

JaneB 01-20-2010 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by $5 submissions (Post 16766022)
The best REFORM for healthcare I can think of is a MARKET-BASED reform. 1) Set uniform standards for care and legal protections (this reduces the cost of defensive medicine) 2) Using these standards, allow HMOs and health companies to send patients overseas for much cheaper medical care 3) Allow health insurance companies to sell policies across state lines 4) enter medical standardization treaties with other countries 5) strict accreditation of foreign medical institutions.

Healthcare becomes way way cheaper, the market for medical services expands, developing countries step their game up through technology transfer/standards proliferation, patients get high quality care at lower costs, there's many benefits.

Why is this better than the Public Option? Because private players have an incentive to keep costs down and profits up. Competition breeds innovation and excellence. Bureaucracies lead to rationing and other problems. If there's anyone who can pull this off, it's the US.



This would work. :thumbsup

baddog 01-20-2010 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16765853)
You've got to be kiding me

Unfortunately, he is serious.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holly Lez! (Post 16765997)
If she had just stuck to the basics she could have pulled it out...

Doubtful. Mr Obama has screwed the pooch for democrats. :2 cents:

Holly Lez! 01-20-2010 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 16766735)
Unfortunately, he is serious.



Doubtful. Mr Obama has screwed the pooch for democrats. :2 cents:

She was actually winning nicely despite Obama although it is easy to blame this loss on him .. She blew it herself .. Have you heard the woman talk??? OMG

12clicks 01-21-2010 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holly Lez! (Post 16767468)
She was actually winning nicely despite Obama although it is easy to blame this loss on him .. She blew it herself .. Have you heard the woman talk??? OMG

actually, she had a comfortable lead until the senate bribed, borrowed, and stole its way to 60 votes.

Vendzilla 01-21-2010 09:15 AM

people are pissed, they want change, thats how the dems got in there in 06, thats how Obama got in there in 08
So far, no change for the good, so voters are going to vote out the old in favor of the new

MsCheyenne 01-21-2010 11:35 AM

Did anyone catch the 60 Minute episode on Medicare Fraud? That is 60 billion reaons the goverment has no business running health care.

Vendzilla 01-21-2010 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MsCheyenne (Post 16769717)
Did anyone catch the 60 Minute episode on Medicare Fraud? That is 60 billion reaons the goverment has no business running health care.

ever seen the movie aticle 99? Thats was about the VA hospital system

Holly Lez! 01-21-2010 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12clicks (Post 16769179)
actually, she had a comfortable lead until the senate bribed, borrowed, and stole its way to 60 votes.

Don't forget the vacation she took where her office went black for like 2 weeks, the fact that she didn't run an ad in the first weeks of the new year, the fact she would not debate him and her list of screw ups goes on and on

12clicks 01-21-2010 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holly Lez! (Post 16769770)
Don't forget the vacation she took where her office went black for like 2 weeks, the fact that she didn't run an ad in the first weeks of the new year, the fact she would not debate him and her list of screw ups goes on and on

I guess we'll see once reid, pelosi, and the rest go down to defeat as well.

TheSenator 01-21-2010 01:29 PM

Please support your local corporation because we care.

The supreme court agrees......

http://www.forbes.com/2010/01/21/sup...ess-court.html

The Demon 01-21-2010 01:39 PM

We can all agree that we need health care reform. However, who would be dumb enough to allow our government to be responsible for health care?

Redmanthatcould 01-21-2010 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neonlights (Post 16763757)

I tried to pay for my cable bill with a similar image, but my spider had 8 legs instead of 7 the first time around.

_Richard_ 01-21-2010 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minte (Post 16763916)
I can't speak for all America. But I want healthcare reform that the country can afford. I don't want my childrens,childrens children to have to pay for my generations mistakes.

There are plenty of things that can be done to make healthcare more affordable for everyone. And hopefully now,the parties will look at some realistic solutions.

i was under the impression that is exactly the reality of children, grandchildren etc. not to say 'whats a little more', but this will save money..

Big John 01-21-2010 05:37 PM

Always amazes me how clueless and insular many in the U.S. are. A huge chunk of the Western, developed world has MUCH better healthcare at a lot lower cost with everyone covered yet people think it a bad idea? Amazing how often people buy into the BS spread by the health and insurance companies and their pet politicians.

JaneB 01-21-2010 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 16769742)
ever seen the movie aticle 99? Thats was about the VA hospital system


That was a good movie. Came out in the 90's I believe.

StaceyJo 01-21-2010 10:44 PM

Great news. :)

directfiesta 01-21-2010 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minte (Post 16763916)
I can't speak for all America. But I want healthcare reform that the country can afford. I don't want my childrens,childrens children to have to pay for my generations mistakes.

There are plenty of things that can be done to make healthcare more affordable for everyone. And hopefully now,the parties will look at some realistic solutions.

True.. and this leave money available for real issues such as wars ...


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