Are there any programs that actually hit the shitter after converitng to nats? If so if like to know what these programs did wrong, as we are considering to switch ourselves to NATS
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I know few such programs, but I won't name them...
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- Skype: jim_3rdshiftvideo
Petite18.com, MeanMassage.com
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do you refer to shaving or what?Comment
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I send about 90-150 SEO hits per day... mostly US traffic.. to a certain big boob sponsor.. once they went to the new big nats.. everything went all to thell...
I don't expect to pay my mortgage or light bill with that few of hits.... but an extra 100 per month or so in spending money... and nada... for months.. since the switch.
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there're some big names and small names...
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If no one is going to post what program went to shit with stats to backup their statements this thread is useless.
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One you go to Nats... You're with Nats.
Just food for thought.Comment
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People are with nats for a reason. Any piece of software is better when alot of people use it, because bugs are exposed quicker and ideas for improvement come from a deeper pool of knowledge.
DukeComment
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notice how no one is using nats4 ??
get nats3, that one is the best option
i can tell you a new program that IMO crashed and burned cuz of nats4
mofoscash.com
I can also tell you of another top 5 affiliate network that decided against nats4 on our advice.
With that said, if you can get nats3. Go for it. Its the best affiliate software by far IMOComment
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we are setting up NATS 4 right now however we are also keeping the current CCBill program along wit CCBTools backend.
This way we can leave it to the affiliate to pick what they prefer.
it will be interesting to run some data down the road and compare.My God there's Porn on here!
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Damn.. im just getting into this, and already i dont know what to go for.
Somehow i dont like ccbill, and nats seems to be shit for the surfers now?Comment
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I can name a lot of programs that went to shit after switching to NATS. First that comes to mind though is...
Boobbucks.net. They switched from being a CCBill based affiliate program to NATS. Once they switched to NATS, conversions went to shit and rebills virtually stopped. I've also had a very difficult time receiving payments from them. They're really shady.Comment
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Why do you think that is? I want to know why affiliates claim sales and rebills seem to diminish when a program switches to NATS. Is it an issue with tracking? Is it that program owners have the ability to exploit the system? Or are they just not paying you?
EXPLAIN!?!?
I think it's important, a lot of us promote programs that use NATS. If there is a legitimate reason we should be more weary of programs that use NATS I'd like to hear it.
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The biggest issue is that rebills are still at where ever so the people who have been promoting you a while have to rebuild up the rebills. A few places focused on the NAts and let updates go for a bit while they converted over so the rebills did not build and the whole thing looked like a hot mess.Comment
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Convert a program with 100s of affiliates from any back end to any back end and you'll have some people who do worse going forward and a some people who do better going forward. Just as you'd have people doing both if the program didn't change back ends.
Convert 100s of programs with 100s of affiliates and you'll see a few of those people who might do worse posting in threads for the next few years as an excuse as to why their numbers are going down. I'm willing to bet they were going down prior to the switch and would have regardless of a switch.
You'll see this with any move to any back end. It just happens that NATS is the back end moved to most of the time. If people's income all went to shit after the move, you wouldn't see so many moves to NATS, which you do.
If someone has something they'd like me to look at, I'm more than happy to. The times I have looked into things like this, there was no issue. Usually its an affiliate who has done 2 sales in a month and this month did 0 sales and is looking to blame the world for it.
If there is an issue, show us, and we'll fix it.Last edited by TMM_John; 10-16-2009, 05:05 AM.Comment
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I think the problem is you always hear more from the people doing worse than the people doing better.Comment
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Europeans Billing Europe!
We have Merchants operating successfully on both NATS3 and NATS4, and the TMM Team is supporting our Merchants on both versions - and Webbilling as well.
One thing I have noticed is that the more technologically savvy one is the better one seems to do with e-commerce in general, and it may be that the most successful Merchants are the ones accessing more of the capacity and capability of the management software and exploring ways to utilize it more fully, for both their programs' and their affiliates' advancement...
Ask questions, put in tickets - we get some really great requests directly from Merchants using the systems and this drives improvements and innovation.
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Any major piece of software will have a learning curve, and a small operator that might lack a dedicated staffer to manage these utilities may spend more time "figuring it out" than on updating / improving their website, which could result in less sales / retention for the short term -- and have nothing to directly do with the software of choice.
Lots of possibilities that could bottom line to language barriers and experience levels
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So pre NATS a system using ccbill - We had many many sales- NO chargebacks. Once the affiliate switched to NATS- we had the same sales- but every month the affiliate claims many chargebacks have come through- thus deducting usually 50% of the money we made...
Can you look into that!? How can we prove the chargebacks are warranted?
What questions or what verifyable information should we ask a sponsor to reveal to us- before we take them to small claims court?
Seems to me NATS gives thieving webmasters "too much" control.Last edited by SeanLEE; 10-16-2009, 07:35 AM.I spammed in threads!Comment
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Hi John... no comment
i like wafflesComment
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Im not into dry snitching! As a webmaster Id like to know what documentation can we request from a webmaster who we think is shaving or making frauduelnt chargebacks using NATS.
Basically: What document or piece of information can we request from a NATS webmaster to confirm their claims. What do we need to ask them to present to us? A certain log? A chargeback receipt?
And if attorneys were involved- would the affiliate program be subpoenaed as well as NATS for the corresponding documents/records?Last edited by SeanLEE; 10-16-2009, 07:50 AM.I spammed in threads!Comment
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You would need to confirm it with the processors. I'd imagine if a person was stealing from you, they'd send you false information without much hesitation.
If you want to make a claim, you should be ready to back it up. I'm sure if someone made such a claim about your websites or services, you'd want them to back it up.Last edited by TMM_John; 10-16-2009, 07:49 AM.Comment
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So once an affiliate program using the NATS system has stated you have multiple chargebacks-
To check the authenticity of the chargebacks we would request from the Affiliate program
what exact piece of information?- The chargeback receipt? What is the name of the file or document on NATS we would need to request?
If the affiliate program refuses this information- would NATS be entitled to give an Affiliate Programs chargeback information to an affiliate?
Once given this information we then we would cross-reference this with the processor?
Does the processor have a privacy clause or they are obligated to tell us yes these chargebacks or real- or no they dont exist?Last edited by SeanLEE; 10-16-2009, 08:01 AM.I spammed in threads!Comment
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Affiliate program operators will have varied amounts of information regarding chargebacks depending upon which processor(s) they use. Typically they only have a post from the processor or an entry in a poll indicating the chargeback.
I can't speak as to what a processor's privacy policy is. You would have to contact the processor.
Unfortunately I can't discuss what we would or wouldn't do on a hypothetical situation.
If you wish to discuss a specific situation with details and information, as I said, I will.
As a general note. If a program is showing that you have a FIFTY percent chargeback rate something is wrong somewhere.Comment
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TMM_John, I commend you on your honesty. Ive been trying to dig up information like this for a while... Thanks agian!
To The Affiliate Program in question-
Be warned- Im 1/2 of a million dollars richer... dont let a few fraudulent chargebacks- get your whole affiliate program snatched from you...
You will have so many liens on your business when we are finished with you- You will wish you would have just used your own money for the 2009 Summer Internext- instead of billing honest affilates to foot your bill.
Test me.Last edited by SeanLEE; 10-16-2009, 08:42 AM.I spammed in threads!Comment
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we use NATS 4 and haven't had any complaints.Comment
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He counts every click on his network as being worth 5 cents. (EVERY CLICK)
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I just got done setting up NATS 4 and have done 2 test transactions and im actually very surprised and impressed just how well the tracking is. After you make a sale is shows the entire history of the surfer (myself in this case) since they first hit your tour, also if they went from typein to having a refcode, etc.
I had heard the whore stories about after programs switched thats why Im starting with NATS. Anyway, just wanted to point out that so far im really impressed with Nats 4.
Edit-- One program I promote alot that has done very well with nats 3 to nats 4 is score cash. I get just as many sales if not more now that they made the move. I think it probably has alot to do with the people running the program.Last edited by FrozenJag; 10-16-2009, 11:47 AM.Comment
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There was one site that was doing $5k a month for me with revshare without even trying.
Then they went to a backend and you could hear the crickets chirp on the same traffic.
And no I'm not going to name them. There is no way to prove anything about anything.
And for the record I don't blame NATS or MPA, their products incorporate some excellent ideas. But as an affiliate I tend to shy way from backend programs based on my own experiences.Comment
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He bought a few games of LIFE and is speaking about his LIFE money...Comment
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i have heard whore stories as well.Comment
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I definitely used to do better with KinkyDollars when they had their custom system than I do now on NATS. There are a couple others, but that is the most noticeable. Doesn't have to mean the software is the cause, but it made me jumpy. Then again, webmasters are a superstitious bunch, when it comes to billing platforms, myself included.Comment
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And TrashyBucks apparently went over to NATS without importing their old affiliates, as near as I can tell, or at least I can't get a reply from their support. So that was quite the decrease in sales for NATS migration. Not sure if NATS is able to import CCBill affiliates. I thought they were, but it seems like a lot of programs don't bother.Comment
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if you are going to move to NATS you will have to make sure that the people still can promote your sites using CCbill only... as lots of people prefer CCbill...Comment
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