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  • Phil LoadedCash
    LoadedCash AM
    • Jan 2007
    • 462

    #1

    Legal Help

    Are chat conversation (via IM) used in court? Can they be consider evidence or not, since anyone can log on anyone's screen name?
  • mmcfadden
    So Fucking Banned
    • Oct 2008
    • 5099

    #2
    can u post the im message? and yes... it could certainly be used

    Comment

    • After Shock Media
      It's coming look busy
      • Mar 2001
      • 35299

      #3
      Sure why not.
      Well may be harder to use in a criminal case but civil I see no issues and small claims would fall into a hell yes.

      [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

      Comment

      • Phil LoadedCash
        LoadedCash AM
        • Jan 2007
        • 462

        #4
        Originally posted by mmcfadden
        can u post the im message? and yes... it could certainly be used
        No.. actually it is over a couple months. I think. Not really sure. Anyway, could you argue the fact that it was not you?

        And just so I don't get any questions. No, I am not talking about a friend or asking for a friend of a friend of a cousin of a sister of a mother. Yes I am talking about myself.

        Comment

        • tony299
          lurker
          • Aug 2002
          • 57021

          #5
          Bump for a interesting question.

          Comment

          • Phil LoadedCash
            LoadedCash AM
            • Jan 2007
            • 462

            #6
            Originally posted by After Shock Media
            Sure why not.
            Well may be harder to use in a criminal case but civil I see no issues and small claims would fall into a hell yes.
            Well most likely it would be a criminal case.. Civil I'm not worried about. They are cheap people anyway so no matter what they will ask for money.

            Comment

            • mmcfadden
              So Fucking Banned
              • Oct 2008
              • 5099

              #7
              if it's divorce... it will be into evidence like cookie dough in betty crocker

              Comment

              • Phil LoadedCash
                LoadedCash AM
                • Jan 2007
                • 462

                #8
                Originally posted by mmcfadden
                if it's divorce... it will be into evidence like cookie dough in betty crocker
                Nope.. not a divorce.

                Basically, someone does not like me. That someone got access to a computer of someone I talk to, and looked at the IM logs and found out they could get me in trouble.

                If of course.. I sent it..

                Comment

                • After Shock Media
                  It's coming look busy
                  • Mar 2001
                  • 35299

                  #9
                  Were you trying to sell something online you should not be selling.

                  [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

                  Comment

                  • 96ukssob
                    So Fucking Banananananas
                    • Mar 2003
                    • 12991

                    #10
                    Originally posted by x Shady x
                    Are chat conversation (via IM) used in court? Can they be consider evidence or not, since anyone can log on anyone's screen name?
                    Im pretty sure instant messages can NOT be used unless the other person admits to them. Since they can be faked, or someone else sign in under their name, etc.

                    but id ask an attorney
                    Email: Clicky on Me

                    Comment

                    • mmcfadden
                      So Fucking Banned
                      • Oct 2008
                      • 5099

                      #11
                      Originally posted by x Shady x
                      No.. actually it is over a couple months. I think. Not really sure. Anyway, could you argue the fact that it was not you?

                      And just so I don't get any questions. No, I am not talking about a friend or asking for a friend of a friend of a cousin of a sister of a mother. Yes I am talking about myself.
                      Just saw this post... sounds like maybe some type of affair. Yes it can be used and the better attorney's always win. It doesn't matter when it get's to court who's wrong or right... it's always about the money

                      Comment

                      • Phil LoadedCash
                        LoadedCash AM
                        • Jan 2007
                        • 462

                        #12
                        Originally posted by After Shock Media
                        Were you trying to sell something online you should not be selling.
                        Nope. Completely legal.

                        Comment

                        • After Shock Media
                          It's coming look busy
                          • Mar 2001
                          • 35299

                          #13
                          Originally posted by bossku69
                          Im pretty sure instant messages can NOT be used unless the other person admits to them. Since they can be faked, or someone else sign in under their name, etc.

                          but id ask an attorney
                          Tell that to judge judy, brown, mathis, and that peoples court chicka. Thats were all the smart arm chair lawyers get their skills at. The other judges just be paternity hoes.

                          [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

                          Comment

                          • Phil LoadedCash
                            LoadedCash AM
                            • Jan 2007
                            • 462

                            #14
                            Originally posted by mmcfadden
                            Just saw this post... sounds like maybe some type of affair. Yes it can be used and the better attorney's always win. It doesn't matter when it get's to court who's wrong or right... it's always about the money
                            Well money isn't a problem. Even if I have to pay the dues for the rest of my life. But no, its not an affair either.

                            Really wish I could be more open about this, but can't find the right words to put it in.

                            Comment

                            • mmcfadden
                              So Fucking Banned
                              • Oct 2008
                              • 5099

                              #15
                              wow... this thread moves fast. My point still holds... it goes to court for whatever reason the better attorney wins...

                              Comment

                              • Phil LoadedCash
                                LoadedCash AM
                                • Jan 2007
                                • 462

                                #16
                                Originally posted by bossku69
                                Im pretty sure instant messages can NOT be used unless the other person admits to them. Since they can be faked, or someone else sign in under their name, etc.

                                but id ask an attorney
                                Exactly what I was thinking. AIM, ICQ, MSN, they have no real evidence of what IP you sent it from. Sure, I might have been online when they were sent, but that person could of been too.

                                Comment

                                • Phil LoadedCash
                                  LoadedCash AM
                                  • Jan 2007
                                  • 462

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by mmcfadden
                                  wow... this thread moves fast. My point still holds... it goes to court for whatever reason the better attorney wins...
                                  I agree with you. I think it depends on the judge as well.

                                  Comment

                                  • mmcfadden
                                    So Fucking Banned
                                    • Oct 2008
                                    • 5099

                                    #18
                                    yes definetely... the judge who knows the attorney who gets together on holidays ;)

                                    Comment

                                    • Phil LoadedCash
                                      LoadedCash AM
                                      • Jan 2007
                                      • 462

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by mmcfadden
                                      yes definetely... the judge who knows the attorney who gets together on holidays ;)
                                      Since most judges are male.. (didn't I See a thread about this a few days ago, black women judges?) I should hire a hot female attorney.

                                      and hope I either get a male judge or a lesbian black one...

                                      Comment

                                      • mmcfadden
                                        So Fucking Banned
                                        • Oct 2008
                                        • 5099

                                        #20
                                        if your around philly area I can direct you to the best criminal or civil attorney's around

                                        Comment

                                        • mmcfadden
                                          So Fucking Banned
                                          • Oct 2008
                                          • 5099

                                          #21
                                          $400 per hour for criminal... $475 for civil/divorce

                                          Comment

                                          • Phil LoadedCash
                                            LoadedCash AM
                                            • Jan 2007
                                            • 462

                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by mmcfadden
                                            if your around philly area I can direct you to the best criminal or civil attorney's around
                                            Pittsburgh actually.. think they would take a drive over for lil' ol' me? lol

                                            Comment

                                            • jmcb420
                                              So Fucking Drunk
                                              • Oct 2006
                                              • 2155

                                              #23
                                              I know e-mails can be used, Especially in divorce cases....but you have made it clear this is no divorce..
                                              Sometimes the evidence wont stand up if it wasn't legaly obtained.
                                              If the other party in your case illegaly obtained the IM's in question (no warrent / password hack) then any lawyer 2 days out of lawschool can get them thrown out.

                                              Unless you were doing something really really really bad, I wouldn't worry to much.
                                              I'm funner than AIDS, and easier to explain to your parents.

                                              Comment

                                              • Phil LoadedCash
                                                LoadedCash AM
                                                • Jan 2007
                                                • 462

                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by jmcb420
                                                I know e-mails can be used, Especially in divorce cases....but you have made it clear this is no divorce..
                                                Sometimes the evidence wont stand up if it wasn't legaly obtained.
                                                If the other party in your case illegaly obtained the IM's in question (no warrent / password hack) then any lawyer 2 days out of lawschool can get them thrown out.

                                                Unless you were doing something really really really bad, I wouldn't worry to much.
                                                The person who obtained them owned the computer. The person that the messages were sent to from another source was using that computer. It wasn't a setup or anything. They had every right to look at it, but morally its wrong.

                                                Who is the moral court judge again? lol.

                                                Comment

                                                • skrinkladoo
                                                  Confirmed User
                                                  • Oct 2007
                                                  • 629

                                                  #25
                                                  highly doubtful, and if you have a good attorney - hell no.

                                                  a good attorney would request proof from the opp. side it was you that typed it, such as a witness, there is a burden on that request. A good attorney could prove you have a virus - and thereby the pc could have been exploited. Guess what you prob. got a few and dont even know it. A good attorney would keep it out of evidence all together. Its not like you just get to say heres my 100 pieces of evidence - and its all gonna be allowed in.

                                                  I'd say without proof - you got hear-say, and thats worthless.
                                                  Not to mention just about anything you say or write can be written off as "banter" with a good attorney.
                                                  *** Andrew Love ***

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                                                  Comment

                                                  • Phil LoadedCash
                                                    LoadedCash AM
                                                    • Jan 2007
                                                    • 462

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by skrinkladoo
                                                    highly doubtful, and if you have a good attorney - hell no.

                                                    a good attorney would request proof from the opp. side it was you that typed it, such as a witness, there is a burden on that request. A good attorney could prove you have a virus - and thereby the pc could have been exploited. Guess what you prob. got a few and dont even know it. A good attorney would keep it out of evidence all together. Its not like you just get to say heres my 100 pieces of evidence - and its all gonna be allowed in.

                                                    I'd say without proof - you got hear-say, and thats worthless.
                                                    Not to mention just about anything you say or write can be written off as "banter" with a good attorney.
                                                    I agree. So if the attorney did ask if they were sent by me.. what would be the proper answer?

                                                    Comment

                                                    • jmcb420
                                                      So Fucking Drunk
                                                      • Oct 2006
                                                      • 2155

                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by x Shady x
                                                      The person who obtained them owned the computer. The person that the messages were sent to from another source was using that computer. It wasn't a setup or anything. They had every right to look at it, but morally its wrong.

                                                      Who is the moral court judge again? lol.
                                                      That sounds pretty bad. Call these guys, a friend of mine used them here in Ohio (i'm near youngstown) and they got him off quicker then a $5 hooker:

                                                      Harshman & Gervelis Attorneys At Law
                                                      105 W Market St Warren, OH.
                                                      Phone: 330-395-3323

                                                      And I do believe these guys also work civil and criminal law in PA. Their a bit closer then philly, you may want to check them out.
                                                      I'm funner than AIDS, and easier to explain to your parents.

                                                      Comment

                                                      • WarChild
                                                        Let slip the dogs of war.
                                                        • Jan 2003
                                                        • 17263

                                                        #28
                                                        Why do people keep talking about using IM evidence in a divorce? Aren't most states No Fault divorce law now or do you actually have to sue for divorce and the court finds someone at fault in some of your ass backwards states?
                                                        .

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Spieglergirls
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Feb 2008
                                                          • 476

                                                          #29
                                                          If it's a Criminal case, before anyone could enter the IMs into evidence, they would have to prove that YOU sent the IMs (to the exclusion of all other persons).

                                                          Regarding Tell that to judge Judy, brown, Mathis, and that peoples court chick - all of the cases on these shows are Civil cases and have a lower threshold with respect to what may (or may not) be entered into evidence.

                                                          (BTW, the shows on TV are technically not really court cases. The participants on all these shows all consent to enter into a binding arbitration agreement with the "judge" being the final arbiter).
                                                          Mark Spiegler
                                                          "Patron of the Tarts"
                                                          http://www.spieglergirls.com/html/main.html

                                                          Comment

                                                          • Phil LoadedCash
                                                            LoadedCash AM
                                                            • Jan 2007
                                                            • 462

                                                            #30
                                                            Originally posted by jmcb420
                                                            That sounds pretty bad. Call these guys, a friend of mine used them here in Ohio (i'm near youngstown) and they got him off quicker then a $5 hooker:

                                                            Harshman & Gervelis Attorneys At Law
                                                            105 W Market St Warren, OH.
                                                            Phone: 330-395-3323

                                                            And I do believe these guys also work civil and criminal law in PA. Their a bit closer then philly, you may want to check them out.
                                                            Thanks man. I am about less than a half hour from Youngstown. Hopefully they can be used in PA courts. Think they will be in on New Years Eve?
                                                            Last edited by Phil LoadedCash; 12-30-2008, 10:04 PM.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • Phil LoadedCash
                                                              LoadedCash AM
                                                              • Jan 2007
                                                              • 462

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by Spieglergirls
                                                              If it's a Criminal case, before anyone could enter the IMs into evidence, they would have to prove that YOU sent the IMs (to the exclusion of all other persons).
                                                              How could they prove I sent the IM's? I don't think they can. They might be able to ask my cable provide if I was online during that time, but that pretty much is it, am I right?

                                                              Comment

                                                              • After Shock Media
                                                                It's coming look busy
                                                                • Mar 2001
                                                                • 35299

                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by WarChild
                                                                Why do people keep talking about using IM evidence in a divorce? Aren't most states No Fault divorce law now or do you actually have to sue for divorce and the court finds someone at fault in some of your ass backwards states?
                                                                I think there are like 10-15 states that still have a fault divorce option but if I recall all of them also have no fault. I get confused by this too. Perhaps everyone has crazy amounts of imaginary money to defend and their prenuptial agreement has some sort of fault clause or something.

                                                                [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

                                                                Comment

                                                                • Spieglergirls
                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                  • Feb 2008
                                                                  • 476

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by x Shady x
                                                                  I agree. So if the attorney did ask if they were sent by me.. what would be the proper answer?
                                                                  Are you referring to your Attorney or the District Attorney?
                                                                  Mark Spiegler
                                                                  "Patron of the Tarts"
                                                                  http://www.spieglergirls.com/html/main.html

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                    LoadedCash AM
                                                                    • Jan 2007
                                                                    • 462

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by Spieglergirls
                                                                    Are you referring to your Attorney or the District Attorney?
                                                                    The attorney I hire.

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • After Shock Media
                                                                      It's coming look busy
                                                                      • Mar 2001
                                                                      • 35299

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by Spieglergirls
                                                                      If it's a Criminal case, before anyone could enter the IMs into evidence, they would have to prove that YOU sent the IMs (to the exclusion of all other persons).

                                                                      Regarding Tell that to judge Judy, brown, Mathis, and that peoples court chick - all of the cases on these shows are Civil cases and have a lower threshold with respect to what may (or may not) be entered into evidence.

                                                                      (BTW, the shows on TV are technically not really court cases. The participants on all these shows all consent to enter into a binding arbitration agreement with the "judge" being the final arbiter).
                                                                      I was being a smart ass. It was more about gaining legal knowledge and less about the actual cases.

                                                                      [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • jmcb420
                                                                        So Fucking Drunk
                                                                        • Oct 2006
                                                                        • 2155

                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by x Shady x
                                                                        Thanks man. I am about less than a half hour from Ohio. Hopefully they can be used in PA courts. Think they will be in on New Years Eve?
                                                                        I dont know about the lawyers themselves being there, but i do know these guys have criminal investigators at their offices who are likely to be there.
                                                                        I'm funner than AIDS, and easier to explain to your parents.

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • bdld
                                                                          $100,000
                                                                          • Dec 2001
                                                                          • 11452

                                                                          #37
                                                                          the casey anthony trial will feature IM's she sent to the babys father, so we'll see how the defense handles that one.

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                            LoadedCash AM
                                                                            • Jan 2007
                                                                            • 462

                                                                            #38
                                                                            Originally posted by jmcb420
                                                                            I dont know about the lawyers themselves being there, but i do know these guys have criminal investigators at their offices who are likely to be there.
                                                                            Thanks man. One more question not sure if you can help me with this as well.

                                                                            You know.. the New Year is coming.. I want to start out fresh.. so I was thinking about reformatting my computer. Should I wait, or just go ahead and do it, since it is the New Year, and all.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • bdld
                                                                              $100,000
                                                                              • Dec 2001
                                                                              • 11452

                                                                              #39
                                                                              and if what you did/said was legal, dont worry about it then

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • Spieglergirls
                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                • Feb 2008
                                                                                • 476

                                                                                #40
                                                                                Tell your Attorney the truth if he asks you. You don't want him to get blindsided by the DA. He won't be able to divulge anything you tell him due to "Attorney/Client privilege".
                                                                                Mark Spiegler
                                                                                "Patron of the Tarts"
                                                                                http://www.spieglergirls.com/html/main.html

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                                  LoadedCash AM
                                                                                  • Jan 2007
                                                                                  • 462

                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  Originally posted by bdld
                                                                                  and if what you did/said was legal, dont worry about it then
                                                                                  Just depends on what you consider legal.

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • Spieglergirls
                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                    • Feb 2008
                                                                                    • 476

                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Originally posted by After Shock Media
                                                                                    I was being a smart ass. It was more about gaining legal knowledge and less about the actual cases.
                                                                                    I apologize.
                                                                                    Mark Spiegler
                                                                                    "Patron of the Tarts"
                                                                                    http://www.spieglergirls.com/html/main.html

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                                      LoadedCash AM
                                                                                      • Jan 2007
                                                                                      • 462

                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by Spieglergirls
                                                                                      Tell your Attorney the truth if he asks you. You don't want him to get blindsided by the DA. He won't be able to divulge anything you tell him due to "Attorney/Client privilege".
                                                                                      Thanks for all of your help.

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • mmcfadden
                                                                                        So Fucking Banned
                                                                                        • Oct 2008
                                                                                        • 5099

                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by x Shady x
                                                                                        Just depends on what you consider legal.
                                                                                        I think it may be time to post the said IM infraction and let the judge, jury, attorney and peers at this fine board make legal and binding decisions

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • After Shock Media
                                                                                          It's coming look busy
                                                                                          • Mar 2001
                                                                                          • 35299

                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by Spieglergirls
                                                                                          I apologize.
                                                                                          No need. Just making it clear.

                                                                                          [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • WiredGuy
                                                                                            Pounding Googlebot
                                                                                            • Aug 2002
                                                                                            • 34512

                                                                                            #46
                                                                                            If the method they acquired the data was illegal, it shouldn't be admissable.
                                                                                            WG
                                                                                            I play with Google.

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                                              LoadedCash AM
                                                                                              • Jan 2007
                                                                                              • 462

                                                                                              #47
                                                                                              Originally posted by mmcfadden
                                                                                              I think it may be time to post the said IM infraction and let the judge, jury, attorney and peers at this fine board make legal and binding decisions
                                                                                              I'm thinking about it. Don't worry.

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              • jmcb420
                                                                                                So Fucking Drunk
                                                                                                • Oct 2006
                                                                                                • 2155

                                                                                                #48
                                                                                                Originally posted by x Shady x
                                                                                                Thanks man. One more question not sure if you can help me with this as well.

                                                                                                You know.. the New Year is coming.. I want to start out fresh.. so I was thinking about reformatting my computer. Should I wait, or just go ahead and do it, since it is the New Year, and all.
                                                                                                I wouldn't be the one to ask for that. Destroying evidence can be a big mistake in the long run.

                                                                                                And about what you tell your lawyer...........ALWAYS TELL YOUR LAWYER THE TRUTH.

                                                                                                They cant defend you if you lie to them, and their paid to defend you wether or not they know you're guilty. They dont care, just tell them the truth. Thy'll probobly tell you to never repeat it again.
                                                                                                I'm funner than AIDS, and easier to explain to your parents.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                                                  LoadedCash AM
                                                                                                  • Jan 2007
                                                                                                  • 462

                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                  Originally posted by WiredGuy
                                                                                                  If the method they acquired the data was illegal, it shouldn't be admissable.
                                                                                                  WG
                                                                                                  Completely legal.

                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                  • Phil LoadedCash
                                                                                                    LoadedCash AM
                                                                                                    • Jan 2007
                                                                                                    • 462

                                                                                                    #50
                                                                                                    Originally posted by jmcb420
                                                                                                    I wouldn't be the one to ask for that. Destroying evidence can be a big mistake in the long run.

                                                                                                    And about what you tell your lawyer...........ALWAYS TELL YOUR LAWYER THE TRUTH.

                                                                                                    They cant defend you if you lie to them, and their paid to defend you wether or not they know you're guilty. They dont care, just tell them the truth. Thy'll probobly tell you to never repeat it again.
                                                                                                    Alright thanks.

                                                                                                    Comment

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