So let's recap some of the economic woes yet to come....

It could be worse.

It's worse in england, job cuts everywhere, extremely high debt, millions un-employed. eastern europeans taking jobs from the brits! VAT cut from 17.5% to 15%. interest rates at a massive low! and overall going to the fucking dogs!

Nah, never that.

Personally, I'm thankful of the Obama presidency.

He might not be able to fix it; but, I don't think he will be shoveling billions of dollars into the pockets of his cronies...like Bush/Cheney did.

Just imagine if...

The government was to take those millions/billions in bail out money - and use it to properly care for its wounded and disabled vets returning from Iraq/Afghanistan.

In both the U.S. and Canada.

Just imagine.

Just imagine if we had minimal wounded because we didn't get into a bullshit war and were able to concentrate on locking down Afghanistan from day one, saving untold billions

You guys do realize that "bail out" money is not just money straight down the toilet, right?

Much of it is loans and purchasing of existing debt. When you buy a mortage, you don't write down the entire value of the house. The houses may be worth less, but they still have a value.

The auto industry has to pay back that money. The last time a loan was made (Chrysler) it was actually paid back ahead of time.

So you're not talking about money staight down the toilet like many of you seem to think.

The US is definitely fucked, but the UK and a few other European countries are fucked in both holes.

Rahm Emanuel was one of the ones who played a key role in the bailout plan itself. He and Obama were key players in getting it through. He's very much on board with the bankers.

That was all bullshit. The real problem was the credit default swaps. They just used the real estate market as the scapegoat.

nothing will change. sad but true

I remember reading articles years ago, when the economy was strong... about how much the economy will be in trouble when a small population is left to support a large population of baby boomers retiring.... how the social securities and tax levels wont' be there to support it.

And now it's beginning to happen and the economy is, well... let's say, a little worse than it was.

Ahahahhahah yeah, just wait..

good point war child

you really think if we left Iraq alone we could win Afgan? Russia tried for years to win that war and never could and they did shit we would never do to people they captured or killed.

I'm curious to see how long it takes people to figure out how bad it really is.


Till that day I'm done trying to warn people.

Live and Let Die.

When they realize they are about to go broke........

Some sooner, some later...

It gives one a sense of perspective that one didn't have before.

Back in Nov 2001, US Delta almost had Bin Laden in the Tora Bora mountain war.

The campaign included less than 35 Deltas and 12 UK SBS (in addition to General Ali and General Zumans local Muhj fighters).

Very brief reasons why the mission failed.


1) General Ali (self proclaimed Mujahideen general) a clueless bastard who was more interested in prancing for the media to further his own career. The Delta's were here to support him and his Muhj fighters, that was their orders - and if they got the chance, to kill Bin Laden and take as many Al-Qaeda as possible

2) The Mujahideen - General Alis so called hardend fighters were in reality not very effective at all. For one, they're not really trained. It was also the middle of Rhamadan, so they would fight during the day (if you could call it fighting because their tactics were to haphazzardly fire their AKs over rocks while launching a few RPG's towards the mountain defences). Once they gained some ground, they would loot any dead Al-Qaeda before returning to their villages because they wanted to go home when it got dark. In the morning they would repeat the same medieval style tactics having to gain the same ground again, then going home lol.

3) General Haji Zuman (Another self procalimed General and General Alis rival in the region) again, more interested in furthering his own position in Afghanistan and probably one of the main reasons Bin Laden escaped to Pakistan.

4) That Delta were not allowed additional forces or to event try secure the potential rear escape route to Pakistan.

Delta were not allowed to play a large part in the early campaign (they weren't even described as being anywhere near the area). They were all dressed like Muhj fighters with full beards to blend into the local look and had to avoid the media circus in the area at all costs. General Ali didn't want any American to get hurt in the fight.

It wasn't until Delta managed to prove to General Ali that an unrelenting pin point bombing campaign and night attacks would inflict heavy casualties on the Al-Qaeda fighters and allow them further into the mountains that real progress began. Of course, they had to do the night attacks on their own, the Muhj were back at home in bed.

The Delta bombing campaign was highly successful in the most attrocious day and night conditions. They would locate enemy mountain positions, mortar emplacements and heavy gun locations before calling the co-ordinates into the air force to hit them with Jdam bombs.

In the thick their campaign (and towards the end of Rhamadan), the Delta radio crews intercepting Bin Ladens radio frequencies heard Bin Laden himself pardon any fighter to leave the mountains and that Allah had not come forward with victory for them, their campiagn was that intense. A ceasfire was called with the intention of Bin Laden surrendering.

Zuman pretty much ballsed up the surrender of Bin Laden, although it is now suspected that he was resposible for a delaying tactic to either allow Bin Laden to re-group or to allow him to escape to Pakistan. Delta would have had Bin Laden without a doubt.

Any American should be very pround of Delta squad (the SBS were also very highly regarded by Delta too). In less than a month, the Delta's managed to accomplish more than the soviets did in 10 years....with less than 50 operatives and against a very motivated Al-Qaeda force entrenched in an almost perfect defensive fortress.

yep, you are missing a falling dollar.

1. The war in Iraq will be over.

2. With Obama as president we'll see more and more interracial marriages which will produce hot mulato girls which in the long run is always a good thing.

Hey, I found something positive!

My Bankers gonna be in a much better mood, thanks to Tax Payer dollars

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2008...outs.html?_r=2

Unfuckin' believable

The US needs a revolution.

Bankers heads on sticks.
Blood in the streets.. It's over due.

You're assuming they will repay it?

What if they need another boost to keep going?

In the 80s Thatcher inherited an economy that was in the toilet. A lot of it due to companies that simply were not worth keeping open. She put a lot of people out of work because there was no other way. The companies that could not survive did not. She realised that to keep them on life support was not in the countries long term interests.

Whether these bail outs are a solution or a life support for a dying industry only the future will tell.

Yeah, I guess. Everyone else's dollar is also falling though... but it's definitely not a good thing.

Oh, and as for the bail outs being loans... the money still has to be accounted for until it's paid back. It's like those toll highways where they say the toll will only exist until the highway's paid for, except that it never does go away once they get used to that money coming in.

I think you are spot on. But I think the way this is going to fall on tax payers and everyone else is the complete destruction of the dollar. Our first excuse to start inflation was because we didn't want to raise taxes during War. Except, instead of paying it back, we just kept it growing and growing.

Not only that, but in the long run I think this may set things so that in the future if they dont manage the business better, they wont get money to bail them out..

You forgot one big thing. The generation of young 20 somethings falling into this mess are mostly a bunch of pussies and brats, with a huge sense of entitlement, and don't want to work for anything. It's not their fault, they were raised that way. Don't think they can run shit, if they can barely tie their own fucking shoes without mommy.

heh, this is very true. That definitely won't help matters.

Damn straight!

true, and downright scary. I mean, I get terrified about what will happen to this country -- whenever I look at anyone under 25.

yes. We need more chicks with afros and freckles. That shit is hot. I'm not even kidding, its like my biggest fetish.

we will get through this