Gays will probably have to wait for the next generation to become old enough to vote. Younger voters are less religious.

Underlying the reasons people are againts it is 1) their religion says it's wrong 2) tradition 3) irrational belief that it's a choice

Some like to put forth dubious arguments that pedophilia is any way comparable when any reasonable person knows this is ridiculous. The mistaken belief that it's a choice also leads people to think that if it's legal, straight people are somehow going to start living gay lifestyles. Again, ridiculous. There have and willl always be a very small number of people that experiment with their sexuality to that degree, but it'll never become widespread.

I'm a heterosexual male. I was born this way. I've always liked the opposite sex. As a normal male, the thought of actually engaging in sexual behavior with another male elicits a violent visceral reaction in me. It disgusts me, therefore I would never engage in that behavior. Yet I understand that others are born that way and I couldn't care less what they do with their partners.

Then you have bisexuals.

Live and let live, I say.

http://jakepays.com/affiliates/banne...0_dexter_r.jpg

I like looking at gay porn it's hot

I watch guys fuck all the time.... don't care one way or the other about it. I have no real opinion on homosexuality... I do however wish the guys wouldn't act like doris day in public sometimes :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Please, what is wrong with his behaviour? I doubt you will be able to answer.

I don't allow my own personal opinions to ever pass judgement on how someone behaves or leads their lives. Why? Because I have never lived in their shoes, I have not experienced all the things they have from their perspective, I will never know what it was like to have been raised in their environs, I will never be able to understand what in their life has lead to their behaviour or lifestyle.

That being said, whom am I or anyone else to pass judgement on someone else's behaviour or lifestyle. This somehow lends to the belief that you are somehow better than the people you are judging.

I think we hit something here.

I think part of the reason prop 8 didn't pass (sorry, fail) isn't because people are against gay marriage is as much as gay parades have been in so "in your face", that when straight people finally get their say, they said "enough is enough just go away".

I think that if they gay community was less in your face about it, and more relaxed *asking rather than *demanding approval of their lifestyle, it would have passed (I mean, failed). I keep getting it mixed up that prop 8 was a negative proposal rather than an accepting proposal.

Sowell's argument is fairly retarded. Homosexuality is a completely normal biological occurrence that happens in our species. Homosexuality does not harm anyone. Pedophilia does. The reason there are laws against marrying a 12 year old girl is to protect the child. There is no need to protect any part of a consenting relationship between two adults. To compare the two is just stupid.

And redefining marriage is something this country has done since its inception. Early on, women had no rights in the marriage at all, couldn't file for divorce. Up until the 60's, a black person couldn't marry a white person. We have since redefined marriage since then. Trying to scare the world into thinking redefining marriage is some scary obstacle shows a complete lack of respect for the history of marriage in this country.

But Sowell's arguments are not new. They were made during the civil rights and abolition eras of our country. There were many pieces by men like Sowell who stated that if we gave blacks certain rights, we'd have to extend rights to women, dogs, etc someday.

lol you might want to stick to the photography and leave the reading comprehension to others :1orglaugh

Just like those rascally blacks who asked that the definition of marriage be set aside and redefined to suit their needs. Or those sly women who asked that the definition of voter be set aside and redefined to suit their needs.

Raping a 9 year old does damage to the 9 year old. The laws on pedophilia are there to protect the child.

With gay marriage, there is no one to protect. The decision is made by two consenting adults.

It's neither. Being gay is a biological issue. It's like saying someone with red hair has a personal issue.

Rights have nothing to do with acceptance. You don't half to accept a black person, but our government does. The same goes for gay people. If you don't want to accept them, don't talk to them, don't associate with them. Everyone has that freedom. But they shouldn't have a right to tell our government to discriminate against them.

[QUOTE=bm bradley;15027815]never occurred to me to think about the issue in these terms before. however I think I agree.
---
You agree with that garbage? Wow who would think there are still homophobes in our biz sad day:Oh crap

spend some time with richard then decide :)

well sucking dicks isn't something to be proud of... now designing the space shuttle, that's something to be very proud of :) no one like a bunch of obnoxious loud mouths demanding stuff that's for sure..

[QUOTE=Holly Lez!;15031904]great another open minded gfy intellectual giant :( if you have any input I would be glad to read it, not really interested in reading any degrading rhetoric... thanks -bmb

best watch that argument, same could be said for a host of miserable conditions: pedophilia, rapist, serial killers etc..


so taking an age old institution like marriage and perverting to suit their needs is a right? I'm pointing this out to you from the main steam middle america point of view.

I'm all for gays having civil unions with all the associated rights... why must it be called a marriage? that's the issue in my mind. a marriage is clearly defined by society and has been since it all started. why must we allow gays to subvert that?

why should the Christians and others who view marriage vows as something 'holy' have their faith attacked? believe me when I tell you that homos taking marriage vows is confronting the moral majority right down to their 'nuts'. who gave gays that right?

this is the real issue for me... not if homos can/would or should butt fuck and have legal protection. why should I even know someone is gay to be honest about it?

Are civil unions legal there? Do civil unions provide the same rights as a marriage? Does this have to do with terminology or are gays not allowed to have civil unions either?

my understanding is a marriage is 2 parts, the civil union and the ceremony. you can get married at the court house with no ceremony or if you get married by an institution you must still fill out the 'civil union' stuff... I think it's called a marriage license.

not sure why they don;t let the mo's go ahead and get civil unions? can't see what the big deal is really... HOWEVER when you talk marriage there is a BIG problem :)

[QUOTE=bm bradley;15032275]LOL you dont know me from Jack so I suggest you learn before you insult people. You agreed with that article so you are nothing more then a sheep!

[QUOTE=bm bradley;15032327]best watch that argument, same could be said for a host of miserable conditions: pedophilia, rapist, serial killers etc..




so taking an age old institution like marriage and perverting to suit their needs is a right? I'm pointing this out to you from the main steam middle america point of view.

Why can you marry a millionaire on tv for entertainment if you are straight? Or why can you have Elvis marry you in Vegas at 3 AM? But I can't marry my partner???? What institution are you speaking of when divorce is at a record high and we are teaching our children to marry on tv for mere entertainment value??????

That is true. But pedophilia, rape, and murder are crimes against another unwilling participant. Homosexuality is not. To compare the two is ridiculous.

Look at the history of marriage in this country. Women had no rights in the early times. They weren't allowed to divorce and men could beat their asses to a pulp with no punishment. A husband could rape his wife at any hour of the day. A black person was not allowed to marry a white person. Do you want to go back to that? I mean that is the "age old institution" you talk about. Were women and minorities "perverting" marriage to suit their needs?

It has never been clearly defined since it started. Read up on the history of marriage. It has changed a lot over time.

How is that attacking their faith? They are free to continue to get married in churches, have their ceremonies, and do whatever they want. No one is taking that away from them. We are talking about legal marriage by the government, not a ceremony a church has. Seperation of church and state, remember? The church should have absolutely nothing to do with a government document that gives individuals certain classifications.

How about this... Why doesn't this guy NOT force "his" views and opinions onto others?

That's what everyone that is for banning gay marriage, or whatever is really missing. You are forcing your views on others, stop it you assholes!

Why do some bring in religion? What about people that don't believe in what you do? Why do you force your point of view on to others that don't agree with you?

That is affirmative action and not equal rights. Gay marriage is about equal rights.

An accurate analogy would be if a polka band wanted to call the place they perform a nightclub, the same as the place the hardcore or metal bands would call the place they perform a nightclub.

If someone actually tried to change the California state constitution to force polka fans to call their nightclubs "non-daylight music performance spaces", that would be an accurate analogy. And, really, isn't it obvious how silly that would be?

I think a lot of people may have voted YES, when they meant to vote NO, because of exactly what you found confusing about it. It was put together in a very confusing way.

As far as parades are concerned, do you know who tends to wear something flamboyant or half-naked in a parade? It doesn't matter if the parade is for something gay or straight or totally unrelated to sexual preference, it is for the most part single people who get dolled up and show off.

Married people don't have nearly the same motivation to get out there and strut their stuff. So, if you are actually bothered by seeing "in-your-face" gay parades, legitimizing gay marriage is your absolute best antidote.

you do know that he's black, right?

so you have no useful input then? another gfy mental giant?

** the analogy is that it can't be helped due to birth

you mean like modern islam?




christians are very frightened people on several levels. calling the ceremony a 'marriage' certainly implies a religious connection. that is very scary to certain segmnets of the population.

this is why I say why not just call them something else and give them all the rights due to a couple in the eyes of the law. a very simple solution.

I doubt if most people would even know what was going on however as soon as you say MARRIAGE the heat is on

actually the hollywood parade bothered me much more than any gay parade. I don't live anywhere near the gay parade and the hollywood parade fucked up every year with traffic issues :)

I like your intellect.... very refreshing for sure, especially on this forum...

about a s silly as richard simons sitting in my damn lap for 20 minutes :)

lol you guys are fucking idiots

that article is dead on perfect. the idea of marriage is that through the union between a man and a woman you can have babies, and there are laws formed to help you through that family process.

gay people don't need that. no one said you cant be gay, you just cant be two married gay people because marriage is exactly what the guy said, between a man and a woman.

what if i want to marry myself? i want the tax cuts and im in love with myself. what about a chair. what about a table.

im not hurting anyone, i should be able to do it!

Why do so many people care what human another human marries?

Yes I do, I'm very familiar with him. I'm comparing the arguments being made.

Don't see how that matters. You can't control your attractions, just as I can't control the fact I'm attracted to tall brunettes.

I guess. Not sure what modern Islam has to do with this discussion though.

People were also frightened to have their kids share a classroom with a black student. People were frightened when women were able to step into polling place and vote. Ignorance and the ability to scare easy are not good arguments for discrimination.

So your solution is separate but equal? Didn't we go down that path before?

If marriage is only about having children, shouldn't we revoke licenses for all those who are unable to have children? Also refuse to marry anyone who doesn't want children. We should also void the marriage license of those over 50 years old as they are unlikely to be able to have children.

I mean if marriage is there because of babies, we should not allow people to be married who choose or are unable to have them. Correct?

No one said a black man couldn't be black, just that he wasn't allowed to marry a white woman because marriage is between the same race.

what do you think about him? I find him pretty refreshing at times..

He's unique. I think his thoughts on race and culture are fascinating, and he has some completely different perspectives. He is just an impressive mind.

My issue with him is that he sometimes gets caught up in the partisan crap. He can write an amazing essay on a topic that really makes you think and then ruins it by taking some political or idealogical jab. It just seems that's unnecessary, especially from such a great mind.

I'd recommend Black Rednecks, White Liberals if you're interested in cultures. It more or less says that black culture is really old redneck culture. Really interesting read.

http://www.amazon.com/Black-Rednecks.../dp/1594030863

If you are a big furniture-fetishist and want to be considered married to a dinette set, I don't see the benefits because it is not my thing, but it's no skin off my ass if you do it.

Also, I'm kind of appalled that any businessperson believes there is a tax benefit to getting married. You only get a tax break for being married if the person you are marrying makes less money than you do. Otherwise, married people pay more in taxes. If homosexual marriages were federally recognized, the US government would collect more in taxes and not less.

We better be careful trying to intelligently discuss the actual ideas and not degenerating to name-calling or we might get our GFY cards revoked :winkwink:

The parades that annoy me are those mass bicycle rides where they make tons of noise in residential neighborhoods, pee on people's lawns, and someone riding by always has to kick my car or hit it with a stick.

Probably true. We may never know the real vote because of this. It will probably pass next time around if queers can keep their attitudes in check. (oh I can just hear you fuming as I type)

Sort of like the best solution to not getting raped is to just take it up the ass and get it over with? Where do you live? I think we need to meet for coffee - I will bring my hancuffs and a shovel to bury the body. ;-)

I've read that, and conquest and culture. some very refreshing thoughts and intuition. I haven't read anything I feel is totally off key. I'm pretty good with the 'people and reasons' are but really lack in political areas..

This thread is irratating

yeah the bike stuff sucks too, so does the LA marathon :(

Okay, you haven't made the slightest case for how what you just said had anything to do with anything I posted. Did you just threaten to rape and murder me because I pointed out that it is single people, not married people, who are most likely to march flamboyantly in parades? That issue is that violently important to you? You threatening me like that is beyond creepy and probably a bannable post. In civilized society, intelligent grown-ups can discuss an issue, not agree on it, and not have to murder each other. You know felons can't vote, right?

Oh, I thought you would like it. I thought you were inviting me to a party ;-)

If your parents' house was a polling place, then I'm really wondering whether the ballots were handled properly.