Question inside for the armchair lawyers.

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  • BV
    wtf
    • Sep 2001
    • 10914
    #1

    Question inside for the armchair lawyers.

    I'll make this a Hypothetical Situation to keep it simple:

    Two people (A & B) equally own a bunch of land free and clear. Both persons are on the deed with an "and" in between their names and each own the land equally.

    Person A wants to sell their half of ownership.
    Person B does not want person A to sell or do anything.
    Person B does also does not want to "buy out" person A.

    What are person A's options if he wants to sell?
    Tags: None
    • Sid70
      Downshifter
      • Dec 2002
      • 16413
      #2
      I think Person A can not be limited in selling his part by person B.
      Русня, идите нахуй!

        Comment

        • baddog
          So Fucking Banned
          • Apr 2001
          • 107089
          #3
          Well, if I recall my high school Business Law class correctly, I think A might be screwed.

            Comment

            • tony299
              lurker
              • Aug 2002
              • 57021
              #4
              What does the original agreement say?

                Comment

                • baddog
                  So Fucking Banned
                  • Apr 2001
                  • 107089
                  #5
                  Originally posted by tony404
                  What does the original agreement say?
                  Sounds to me like they did not think that part out.

                    Comment

                    • After Shock Media
                      It's coming look busy
                      • Mar 2001
                      • 35299
                      #6
                      Person A should get on the interwebz using a internet cafe, cash, and proxies after making sure they do not have security cameras and research hard to trace poisons and knock off person B so that they own everything since person B is being a bitch.

                      [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

                        Comment

                        • woj
                          <&(©¿©)&>
                          • Jul 2002
                          • 47882
                          #7
                          Maybe find person C who will buy person A's share?
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                            Comment

                            • baddog
                              So Fucking Banned
                              • Apr 2001
                              • 107089
                              #8
                              Originally posted by woj
                              Maybe find person C who will buy person A's share?
                              Person B does not want person A to sell or do anything.
                              Person B does also does not want to "buy out" person A.

                                Comment

                                • faisalp
                                  Registered User
                                  • Jan 2002
                                  • 46
                                  #9
                                  it really depends on the jurisdiction - the most common answer is that if B is standing in the way, A can bring a suit to partition the land and create two parcels. it can get messy.

                                    Comment

                                    • faisalp
                                      Registered User
                                      • Jan 2002
                                      • 46
                                      #10
                                      FYI http://www.bicknell-law.com/real/real_more.asp?real=4

                                      google is your friend. I would recommend google over GFY, as GFY is home to the largest contingent of morons on the Internet.

                                        Comment

                                        • woj
                                          <&(©¿©)&>
                                          • Jul 2002
                                          • 47882
                                          #11
                                          Originally posted by baddog
                                          Person B does not want person A to sell or do anything.
                                          Person B does also does not want to "buy out" person A.
                                          "does not want" doesn't necessarily mean that person A has no right to sell his share...
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                                            Comment

                                            • pornlaw
                                              Confirmed User
                                              • Feb 2007
                                              • 1902
                                              #12
                                              Real estate law is very complicated and there is no simple answer and with your fact pattern no one can answer.

                                              We would need to know how the property is owned....
                                              Michael

                                              www.AdultBizLaw.com

                                                Comment

                                                • baddog
                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                  • Apr 2001
                                                  • 107089
                                                  #13
                                                  Originally posted by woj
                                                  "does not want" doesn't necessarily mean that person A has no right to sell his share...
                                                  So, you are married and buy a house. The deed says you and her. Think she can just sell her portion?

                                                    Comment

                                                    • baddog
                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                      • Apr 2001
                                                      • 107089
                                                      #14
                                                      Originally posted by faisalp
                                                      FYI http://www.bicknell-law.com/real/real_more.asp?real=4

                                                      google is your friend. I would recommend google over GFY, as GFY is home to the largest contingent of morons on the Internet.
                                                      Of course you can sue and try to force the issue.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • faisalp
                                                          Registered User
                                                          • Jan 2002
                                                          • 46
                                                          #15
                                                          baddog, agreed...however the point is that if the land is owned jointly there is likely no other way to do it, that is the answer to the question.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • baddog
                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                              • Apr 2001
                                                              • 107089
                                                              #16
                                                              Originally posted by faisalp
                                                              baddog, agreed...however the point is that if the land is owned jointly there is likely no other way to do it, that is the answer to the question.
                                                              Hindsight is 20/20. That is why you should have contracts that are well written and take things into consideration that you would never think possible at the time of signing.

                                                              Kind of like pre-nups.

                                                                Comment

                                                                • BV
                                                                  wtf
                                                                  • Sep 2001
                                                                  • 10914
                                                                  #17
                                                                  i've stated how the land is owned. there is no agreement.

                                                                  there is a deed with both peoples names on it with an & in between their names.

                                                                  A & B own parcel blah blah blah......

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • baddog
                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                      • Apr 2001
                                                                      • 107089
                                                                      #18
                                                                      Originally posted by BV
                                                                      i've stated how the land is owned. there is no agreement.

                                                                      there is a deed with both peoples names on it with an & in between their names.

                                                                      A & B own parcel blah blah blah......
                                                                      Lawsuit time.

                                                                      Hope the property has some value to make it worth while.

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • BV
                                                                          wtf
                                                                          • Sep 2001
                                                                          • 10914
                                                                          #19
                                                                          I'll even thicken the plot a little.

                                                                          Person B has "somehow" sold off about 100 acres of the land to the state without person A's signature.

                                                                          Person B has also sold over 100k worth of additional fill dirt to the state for a 4 lane hiway.
                                                                          Last edited by BV; 06-23-2008, 11:21 PM.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE
                                                                              best designer on GFY
                                                                              • Mar 2003
                                                                              • 30307
                                                                              #20
                                                                              Person A is still scrood.

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • ottyhotties
                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                  • May 2005
                                                                                  • 188
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  I must have a one of a kind yellow pages on my kitchen table because where I live lawyers offer free sit downs with you, hear you out, and tell you if you've got a case. My legal advice is you should go tell your friend to get a free consultation.

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • baddog
                                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                                      • Apr 2001
                                                                                      • 107089
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      Originally posted by BV
                                                                                      I'll even thicken the plot a little.

                                                                                      Person B has "somehow" sold off about 100 acres of the land to the state without person A's signature.
                                                                                      Time for a lawyer, and quickly. The limitations to file a suit against the state are probably a lot quicker than if you were suing Joe Blow.

                                                                                      I would say that sale was not binding. Sounds like some forgery had to be involved. Both parties should have signed in front of notary at least.


                                                                                      Person B has also sold over 100k worth of additional fill dirt to the state for a 4 lane hiway.
                                                                                      50% belongs to Person A.

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • BV
                                                                                          wtf
                                                                                          • Sep 2001
                                                                                          • 10914
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          I'm thinking person B has committed a felony. I'm also thinking that the Title Insurance company is not going to be too happy because they are essentially insuring that the transaction was/is legit.

                                                                                          Person A already knows they need a lawyer and has one ready if that's the route they have to take.

                                                                                          The problem is that persons A is the daughter of person B and it's sort of a hard thing to sue your own father.

                                                                                          On the same token it's even worse to steal from your own kids (and grand kids)

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • baddog
                                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                                              • Apr 2001
                                                                                              • 107089
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Originally posted by BV
                                                                                              I'm thinking person B has committed a felony. I'm also thinking that the Title Insurance company is not going to be too happy because they are essentially insuring that the transaction was/is legit.

                                                                                              Person A already knows they need a lawyer and has one ready if that's the route they have to take.

                                                                                              The problem is that persons A is the daughter of person B and it's sort of a hard thing to sue your own father.

                                                                                              On the same token it's even worse to steal from your own kids (and grand kids)
                                                                                              Oh, there is all kinds of questions that come up. And the old saying that there are three sides to every story comes to mind as well.

                                                                                              And while it is tough to sue dad, if dad did that he would not have a problem suing her.

                                                                                              Tough love.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • Mutt
                                                                                                  Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                  • Sep 2002
                                                                                                  • 34431
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  Originally posted by faisalp
                                                                                                  FYI http://www.bicknell-law.com/real/real_more.asp?real=4

                                                                                                  google is your friend. I would recommend google over GFY, as GFY is home to the largest contingent of morons on the Internet.
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                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                    • ottyhotties
                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                      • May 2005
                                                                                                      • 188
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      ahh, one of those situations. Then have her check Dad's will and see if she likes what's in it. If she does then do the below posted earlier.


                                                                                                      Originally posted by After Shock Media
                                                                                                      Person A should get on the interwebz using a internet cafe, cash, and proxies after making sure they do not have security cameras and research hard to trace poisons and knock off person B so that they own everything since person B is being a bitch.

                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                        • fluffygrrl
                                                                                                          So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                          • May 2006
                                                                                                          • 2187
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          Actually let me state all the preceeding armchair lawyerly oppinions are wrong.

                                                                                                          No person can be held indivise against their will. Any person owning together with others real estate can appeal the court, to either divide it or auction it.

                                                                                                          The other parties have no recourse.

                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                            • Tickler
                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                              • Jul 2005
                                                                                                              • 650
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              The "and" may also need to be clarified as to whether they are "joint" owners, or I think the other term is "common/shared" owners.
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                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                • ADL Colin
                                                                                                                  Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                  • Feb 2001
                                                                                                                  • 11929
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  Depends on what the judge had for breakfast


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                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • Sly
                                                                                                                      Let's do some business!
                                                                                                                      • Sep 2004
                                                                                                                      • 31376
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      Originally posted by BV
                                                                                                                      I'm thinking person B has committed a felony. I'm also thinking that the Title Insurance company is not going to be too happy because they are essentially insuring that the transaction was/is legit.

                                                                                                                      Person A already knows they need a lawyer and has one ready if that's the route they have to take.

                                                                                                                      The problem is that persons A is the daughter of person B and it's sort of a hard thing to sue your own father.

                                                                                                                      On the same token it's even worse to steal from your own kids (and grand kids)
                                                                                                                      Just my opinion, but I think it's far worse for a parent to screw over a child than the other way around. In this case, the child did nothing wrong and although it will cause major problems based on what kind of parent this seems to be, it sounds like they have every right to file suit.
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                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • Bama
                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                          • Nov 2001
                                                                                                                          • 2727
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          Sounds to me that person A has one hell of a case and everyone who has suggested a sit down with the guy with the law degree's hanging on the wall is an appointment definitely worth making.

                                                                                                                          If it is undeveloped land that neither party A or B reside jointly at (and if B was selling fill dirt it doesn't sound like it is), it should make things simpler. Baddog is correct that you can't sell half of your ownership of a house and have a stranger move in with you as a new co-owner.

                                                                                                                          Party B is in hot water for profiting from the sale of fill dirt if party A was not involved in the sale and profits not divided. You can't say "I sold fill dirt from my half of the land" because the whole land is jointly owned.

                                                                                                                          If that was the case and at the very least, the judge will most probably force the sale of the land wholly and Party B will have to give Party A their portion of the profits they kept if not also sending Party B to jail for fraud and forgery of Party A's signature for the 100 acres of land sold.

                                                                                                                          Had those sales not have taken place, Party B would most probably have the right of first refusal, but Party A shouldn't be kept from selling their interest in the property.

                                                                                                                          Party A would also have a claim against any title insurance company as well if one was involved. Since her name is on the deed of sale for the 100 acres sold off, her identity needed to be established and notarized.

                                                                                                                          There should have also been a new deed issued for the remaining portion of the land that Party A & B co-own.

                                                                                                                          Lots of issues to discuss - lots of parties involved - great bargaining chip and Party A has a case.

                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                            • DatingGold
                                                                                                                              $6 PER EMAIL JOiN
                                                                                                                              • Feb 2003
                                                                                                                              • 13185
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              Originally posted by After Shock Media
                                                                                                                              Person A should get on the interwebz using a internet cafe, cash, and proxies after making sure they do not have security cameras and research hard to trace poisons and knock off person B so that they own everything since person B is being a bitch.
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                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • DatingGold
                                                                                                                                  $6 PER EMAIL JOiN
                                                                                                                                  • Feb 2003
                                                                                                                                  • 13185
                                                                                                                                  #33
                                                                                                                                  is Person A your mom or your wife?
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                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                    • G-Rotica
                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                      • Aug 2005
                                                                                                                                      • 4258
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      Jacoby & Meyers

                                                                                                                                      Solomon, Relihan & Blake

                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                        • ThunderBalls
                                                                                                                                          So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                          • Oct 2002
                                                                                                                                          • 2926
                                                                                                                                          #35
                                                                                                                                          The word 'and' holds the most weight here. If Joe AND Jenny own property then it becomes one entity as the owner.

                                                                                                                                            Comment

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