Here's a radical idea why don't we all use one gallon of fuel less per week. Walk to the shops or restaurant, share a ride to work, ride a bike or use a scooter. This would not cost us a single cent more in fact we could save a few dollars a week and the side effect is some of the fat fucks in this country could actually lose a few pounds and become more health ( more savings on outrageous medical bills ) . Hows that for a radical theory ? :2 cents::thumbsup

Libertine, these so called scientists you are talking about, well they really didn't write that shit or publish it. Actually, most of what they say is taken out of context and is old.

You can have your opinion, but the facts have already started to come out that Humans aren't doing shit to this planet, rather she is doing shit to us.

Are you one of those guys that thinks humans can blow earth up too?

D already addressed the point you're trying to make by linking to that article. Scroll up a bit.

As for "blindly" following science... I am sitting behind a computer right now. Without science, that computer would have been impossible to make. That, to me, is a good reason to at least take science seriously. Add to that the very nature of the scientific process, where there is a large incentive for scientists to disprove both new and commonly held theories, and it should be clear that science can't simply be disregarded as "just another set of views".

Today's experts don't claim to know everything, and often, they are wrong. Nonetheless, they tend to be wrong a lot less often than people who haven't studied the subject matter as extensively as they have.

Were I a climatologist, perhaps I would have good reason to disagree with them. However, not being a climatologist, the only sensible thing to do for me is to accept the fact that a majority of climatologists endorse the idea of human influence on climate change. They might still be wrong, but they are rather less likely than me to be wrong.

Also, religion is a different matter entirely. Unlike science, it actually IS based on blind faith, and has failed to produce any of the technological thingies that science has brought us.

Here are a few so called scientists. Why don't you send them an email, let them know they aren't actually researching, writing or publishing. I'm sure they'll be thoroughly shocked when they find out what they have actually been doing these past few years.

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php...tributor-bios/

It's a shame that these facts are consistently choosing to come out in other places than peer-reviewed scientific journals.

What about the global warming on mars? Hmmm....
http://www.space.com/scienceastronom..._011206-1.html

Maybe you should quit telling them to speak on subjects that don't effect the grants they get. You might actually get a fact then. If you want to buy into the hype from a bunch of ass hats that of course depend on saying global warming is real, then please do so.

Let me give you a quick run down of truth, that can be researched and proven, and has been.

We have been warming up for a really long time, and in the last hundred years before fossil fuels, it really started to increase. We still aren't as warm as we were before the little ice age, I guess global warming got us back then too? Anyway....

Again, before fossil fuels, all ice on this planet started to melt on it's own, as the entire planet got warmer on it's own.

This has a MAJOR effect on the warming cycle of the earth. As ice melts, the oceans absorb the suns heat, this of course creates more melting. This reduction in ice, also creations less reflection of the sun rays, which creates more warming.

When the ocean waters start to warm, the ice in the hell depths of the ocean starts to melt and give out too. This releases methane gas and lots of other nasty things straight into the atmosphere. Millions of times greater than humans ever could.

Global warming is a earth, sun, solar system thing... Way the hell past human control.

I'm done, You can take what I said and do your own research and find out real facts or listen to monkeys that will prove anything to be fact if the paycheck is coming in.

See... the thing is... I have done real research on matters that centered around this topic - as pointed out earlier in this very thread.

Real... academic... research.

At least 120 hours worth... which is just short of the research assistant requirement of most university graduate programs... in the stacks of the Los Angeles Central Library's Science department - with a couple shorter stints at the Library at UCLA.

And, in all that time - I didn't find this proof you're talking about... not one shred. In fact, many of the things I read suggested that man does, indeed, affect his own environment on a global scale... and often to the detriment of other species.

Drop me some peer-reviewed sources that say affecting global temperature (or, even any global system) is beyond our control, and I'd be happy to read them over... as that would interest me very much.

Until then, though - I'm of the mind that you're the one that's "buying into the hype" and needs to "do your own research," man.

All that said, though... and back on subject...

Again... I don't support the tax.

Assuming we are part of the problem, it's not the answer to the problem, imho... and instead of solving for it will mostly cause greater polarization on the matter, I think.

This thread's an example of that.

I'm in favor of such a tax.
you don't like it ? switch to a car that does not fuck up the planet

D, I have to say.. If you have really done 120 hours of research on this and haven't read everything the other side is saying, then you failed class :)

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releas...-gef071906.php

University of California - Santa Barbara
"Gas escaping from the ocean floor may provide some answers to understanding historical global warming cycles and provide information on current climate changes"

"Atmospheric methane is at least 20 times more potent than carbon dioxide"

More: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0829090326.htm

About the ice caps reflecting heat, along with clouds, ect..
http://www.sciencepoles.org/index.ph...&uid=625&lg=en

I parked my car 3 days ago and I'm taking the bus/subway now.

transit pass - $109 /mo

Car

$300/min a month in gas
$300/month insurance
$100+/month maintenance, yearly averaged
$130 month parking

Then factor in how much money you have to make before tax to pay those things, it's really a pretty big savings.

Car needs premium gas, was paying $1.20 a liter here, and it's supposed to get worse in the summer. I don't even drive very much. I have friends paying $500-600 a month in gas.

I haven't minded taking the bus really at all either, kinda nice to have some do nothing time, and so many hot women running around I never see in the car.. also just the walk is more than I was doing since I had to give my dog away.

I still love my car, and keep it parked downstairs, but I don't love paying for it. :) And think if you lease on top of that, fuuuck.. Super expensive even if you own a car nowadays.

If I save that $721 a month and resist driving for 3 years, not even accounting for a raise in gas prices, I'll have saved $27,276.48, assuming I got a 5% yearly return on the savings.

Whhhhaaaaat. Why did I even buy a car again?

I asked for peer-reviewed sources. :2 cents:

That aside - your contention, I believe, was that the ability for man to affect global temperature is beyond his control. At least that's what you said that originally elicited a response from me. Nothing you listed there touches on that.

Cow farts also contribute to global warming... but that doesn't mean what we're doing isn't impacting things as well.

All I see there are articles that imply how natural processes can compound the problem... which I absolutely agree with. In fact, two of the studies I ended up using in my paper dealt with what your third link is talking about, and how the dissipation of polar ice is trending to total dissolution.

It's all a slippery slope that could eventually result in the stalling of the oceanic conveyor, and the dawn of the next ice age.

But that doesn't mean that we're not doing our part to help things along... and it doesn't mean that we don't have the power (or maybe even _responsibility_, if it's to be shown we're contributing to the problem) to help avert it.

I don't do research for free :)


Speaking off... How do they measure what humans release vs what earth releases as greenhouse gases? Cause everything I read says, well really we can't tell. Or what about the fact that these gases have been far greater than they are today? This is all related.

We may be 'adding' to the problem, but we aren't creating or compounding the problem. And that's the hype of global warming.

Sad fact, as much as I love red meat the cattle industry causes more global warming / green house gases then all the cars in the world.

Mother Earth cries a little with each shart!

The sad think is I can probably count on the tree huggers to vote in favor of it.

Oh well, should make the freeways less crowded. Maybe some people will move too.

Sounds like a complete waste of time for me

Just remember if those "scientists" do not produce results that are worthy of their grant money they wont have money to feed their families and keep them driving high quality foreign cars that expunge all those deadly emissions..

Hey Im just still pissed about all the parkas and firewood I bought in the late 70's preparing. Then when I set all my computers on fire right before new years eve 2000 THAT wont happen again. All those cans of AquaNet that I threw into the bonfire to help get rid of the cfcs cause I didnt want to get sun cancer from our disappearing ozone layer. Having my hair be all fluffy all that time :( Fuck that. Then all those fucking trees I planted to help stop the onset of deforestation? Then all the sandbags I packed along the shoreline to stop soil erosion. FUCK THAT!! hahhahhahahahahaha http://www.gfy.com/images/smilies/1orglaugh.gif Sorry if I just dont buy what these scareologists are selling..

You should really learn the difference between media hypes and actual scientific hypotheses shared by a large number of scientists.

So you think the things in the past were not shared by a large number of scientists? LMAO! Dude it was EXACTLY the same shit as global warming all of it. All of it was said to be scientific fact. Everything I listed. Typical that they would act like those other things were bs now that they have been shown to BE bs.. :1orglaugh:1orglaugh