Will, I don't think you have to know what happened there to make a judgement. I think the burden of proof is now on them to prove they weren't the ones that fucked people over.

Lets say they were just stooges and had nothing to do with it. Do you really want to trust a processing company that is being run by people who were so easily ripped off by some anonymous puppet master? I'm sorry, but if you're a CEO of a company and don't know what is going on, then I don't think I'd like you handling my money.

But no matter how "creative" their stories are for what happened to iBill, I just find it hard to believe they didn't know or didn't have something to do with it. These people are not stupid. You don't become CEO, VP, etc of million dollar companies like this for being naive. Reminds me of Enron, a company run by brilliant people who claimed that a few rogue accountants somehow ripped everyone off.

very good points. I guess i am just trying to explore what they are saying but like you pointed out if they are the CEO and VPS of a company and they had no idea what was going on, that doesn't play out well for them either.

It would be nice for them to try to tell their side of the story and explain it us, other than just saying " they are good people, they didn't know what was going on and they had nothing to do with it".

Agreed, both Will and PK -

No multi-million dollar company would have people in those positions that were so far out of the loop that any of the companies financial issues wouldn't have been bought to their attention - heck, it would be those people that would have been alerted before anyone simply because they may have the know how to drag the sorry ass of a company out of the doo doo.

And if they didnt figure it out, they were to dumb to be in that position in the first place.

People in those positions are the ones that get handed the golden parachutes. They know way before anyone else that its time to jump.

Thats always been the way of business, especially the bigger boys.

I wouldn't trust any of them with my lunch money.

I believe this accidentally slipped off the first page.

Here's my take for what its worth.
I used Iballs for about 6 years when they used to be the biggest and the best.
When it was sold to Penthouse i started to removed them from our program as i was concerned about another program owning the main billing company i used for my affiliate information and payouts ( i made a post about this on GFY ). I had also seen payouts with Iballs start to become erratic and customer service almost stopped over night. I was tipped off by my Iballs rep about some issues she started to witness, so we sent out e-mails to all affiliates to remove their Iballs code. Most did but a few did not as they believed that Iballs was still #1. Within a 3 month period all affiliates had been switched to Epoch or CCbill except a few dozen who insisted on staying with Iballs despite my urgent warnings.
When the shit finally hit the fan we had maybe 55 rebills left on Iball's and our rep arranged for us to switch them over to CCbill. Unfortunately CCbill was not interested in switching so small a number so we lost them. Our loss was an insignificant $4,125.00. And attorneys cost to get that back would have been at least $10,000.

My point is that if a lowly sales rep new about issues with the company so early on, how on earth did higher management not know ?

This i do not believe for one second :2 cents:

Didn´t see you tried it out in Vienna. Nice vehicle...:thumbsup

+1 vote on the "I don't believe for 1 sec that the CEO didn't know, or any of the staff" bullshit. No way she didn't know.

Whether segpay is okay now or not, time will tell, i wouldn't use them, but i don't operate an affiliate program either, so it's not mine to say. I've seen some big companies process with them, and i've seen them process for alot of shady stuff ccbill/epoch wouldn't process.

Fuck it.. maybe John can fire them all & put in his own people

:1orglaugh

hopefully it wont be the same person who was responsible for the admin passwords that got out. :2 cents: who ever that was. No room for errors when it comes to billing.

Fiddy connections

There are a few ex-iBill employees who found themselves with time on their hands and were employed by SegPay Will. Obviously these people have experience of the TTP business and have something to offer. As you said, Ms Greer is one such person.

It's prob relevant to draw distinctions between actual instigators - senior management and officers of the company and employees or individuals not specifically "employed" by iBill, but engaged as consultants/contractors to achieve specific aims. The "actual" management of the company are the people ultimately responsible for the conduct of iBill.

As to what degree the other people you mentioned have failed the clients and creditors of iBill, I can't say. It's impossible to know who knew what, when, and what action they took at that time.

However, it is worth pulling one name out of the hat, specifically Christopher Williams. Mr Williams has conducted himself honorably throughout the iBill fiasco and is directly responsible for successfully ensuring many webmasters were actually paid amounts owing - in the region of several million dollars. This was no thanks to iBill who were an obstacle course during that negotiation process.

Again, it depends on timing and can't be specific on this - at varying times the "actual management" (namely people holding the real power - they were often known as "consultants") of iBill were individuals with slimy backgrounds, some of whom were convicted felons and with "associations" with others in the same league.

Unfortunately when people enter or participate in a business where the real control is in the hands of crooks, this obviously can lead to contamination of others (front-end faces) who had little more than good intentions. It just a matter of distinguishing one from the other :winkwink: