Front Page: CNN's response to Michael Moore - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Humpy Leftnut · 07-15-2007, 03:38 PM

CNN should have also responded to their flag wavyness for how many years before they remembered they were supposed to pretend to be objective.

Theo · 07-15-2007, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420

if you read CNN's article closely, you'll see that they don't 'refute' Moore's points AT ALL. Where MM points out that their expert has a clear conflict of interest, CNN 'refutes' him by basically saying 'No he doesn't', with no explanation of why not when the facts of the matter point out that he CLEARLY does have an agenda, and a specific for profit, pro conservative agenda. He points out that they took an irrelevant number regarding elective health care, they say 'we think it's helpful' without telling why even though MM makes it very clear that it's totally irrelevant.

Smoke and mirrors from CNN, but I'm guessing that'll be good enough for pimpsticky and his ilk.

haha exactly.

georgeyw · 07-15-2007, 03:47 PM

OMFG.

This is absolutely hilarious, CNN actually comes across like a 3 year old child lying about who drew on the kitchen wall with a crayon.

Perfect example is :

CNN RESPONSE:

We believe our example of so-called "elective" procedures such as hip replacement and cataract surgery is accurate and is helpful information. More than 400,000 Americans have hip or knee replacements each year in the U.S. (http://www.niams.nih.gov/hi/topics/a...s/jointrep.htm). By age 80, half of all Americans either suffer from a cataract or have had cataract surgery (http://www.nei.nih.gov/health/catara...ract_facts.asp).

Basically Moore pointed out that CNN pulled out a stat from a survey of 6 countries for elective surgeries only...

leedsfan · 07-15-2007, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyMischief

It's all fucked up no matter where you go. I must say I'm glad I didn't have to pay for my c-sections in the US, you are right there, but for those who think the coverage in Canada is better, like I say they haven't had to deal with it. It might be paid for, but if you die waiting for the treatment that's needed, it doesn't do much good either way.

I have lived in both US and Canada. Frankly there is no comparison. If you can affords private care, US is best hands down.

If you can't afford health care in the US you don't get any period. You may be faced with bills that you will spend a lifetime to pay off if you need an emergency operation in the US, without coverage...

Lady Mischief, I understand what you're saying. Our health care system is as flawed as that in the UK, but it's WAY better than the situation in the US.

I have had care in both countries, I have the experience to make comments on this subject.

GreyWolf · 07-15-2007, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Humpy Leftnut

CNN should have also responded to their flag wavyness for how many years before they remembered they were supposed to pretend to be objective.

CNN do have a number of respected journalists on their staff or contracted, and they do produce balanced footage within their reporting. Much of this appears to be shot "on the ground" and the final result is what it is - hard to re-script or reshoot these events.

Where there appears to be a difference is when content comes from a studio. That opens up a whole range of possibilities to sway and it's a more controlled situation - from basic background graphics, "opinions" from pundits (who often have never been in these situations in their lives) - to anchor personalities who elect to give their "opinions" of the news they are supposed to be delivering to the public. (The latter is prob more "amateurism" than anything - doubt their "opinions" are scripted - just that they talk too much

)

CNN is more than capable and fully understand what delivery of straight news reports involve. The do exactly that on the CNN International version. It is hard to imagine the editorial staff in Altanta and New York get so carrying away attempting to produce colorful news delivered by "all hair and smiles" anchor girls that they manage to produce the same studio news stories in a totally different way for the US market (allowing leeway, since there is nothing wrong with regionalized news and accented on what affects people in that region).

On CNN's side - they have a commercial problem to overcome in that their revenue depends on sponsors. It would probably be a conflict of interest with sponsors when discussing, in this instance "Sicko", aspects of healthcare and the pharma industry when every ad slot is yet another advertisment trying to purvey pills and attempting to convince the US public they need them

But.. that's their biz angle problem...

dig420 · 07-15-2007, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

MM wold be a manager at Wendy's if he wasn't making movies - because that's about all that he's qualified for.

MM tells us that health care in other countries is "free". Great, let's do that in the US. Let's double my taxes - which would cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars a year personally - so I can go see the same doctor the homeless person down the street gets to see. That's a brilliant idea.

Three years ago I was told I had to have an operation. From my first contact with a doctor to the operation was a month. I had the operation early in the morning, was home in the late afternoon, and all it cost me was $20 for some post operation treatment. I had no problems.

to the best of my knowledge, you're an employee. Maybe a high priced one, but I doubt VERY much that your additional taxes would be hundreds of thousands of dollars. *I* don't pay hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes and I'm pretty damn sure you're not in my tax bracket.

Just because YOU didn't have any problems doesn't mean there aren't problems. You /= everybody else.

Are you saying the homeless guy down the street has no right to live because he's poverty stricken? Shall we eat his children?

Tempest · 07-15-2007, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Humpy Leftnut

I think Canada's problems come from over-treating people myself. Too many people with "free" healthcare forget that their government is being billed hundreds of dollars for every visit, test, checkup, exam etc they go for. I bet the numbers of doctor visits that result in no treatment other than the good feeling that comes from having a doctor tell you you're okay, is staggering here.

Bang on...

As for LadyMischief whining about our system... the grass is always greener... Even with our problems there's no way in hell I'd want to give it up for a US system of letting the uninsured die.

dig420 · 07-15-2007, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tempest

Bang on...

As for LadyMischief whining about our system... the grass is always greener... Even with our problems there's no way in hell I'd want to give it up for a US system of letting the uninsured die.

The problem MM is pointing out is that it's not just the uninsured who die. It's the underinsured who in many cases thought they had all the insurance they would ever need.

Whoever it was who pointed out that CNN and other news organizations have a conflict of interest due to corporate sponsorships, you're exactly right. At one time news divisions were excluded from the profit machine. They weren't expected and weren't asked to make a dime in order to prevent just such a situation as we have today. That system was preferable to our current one, I believe...

directfiesta · 07-15-2007, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axeman

The biggest problem with the Canadian system is caused by the American system. Canada's biggest issues is a shortage in doctors because we train them and then they head south as specialists for the big money in the for profit system. Couple that with the fact the US refused to build more medical schools to meet their demand in house, has cause a huge need to import their doctors from elsewhere. This is being slowly rectified as states are now green lighting more medical schools to meet their own demand.

Also in Canada we train a lot more GP's than the US does as most doctors in the US chase the gold as specialists. So the GP's we train up here eventually get filtered off to be GP's down south.

Canada needs to increase wages a bit to keep doctors and nurses here, but also I think a law needs to be put in place that if your trained in Canada you have to give X amount of years back to the country. Some will choose to go down south to do their medical school but with the lack of schools there, they may not get in anyway.

hit it right on the nail

Semi-Retired-Dave · 07-15-2007, 07:58 PM

That's a pretty insane letter. Well written.

madawgz · 07-15-2007, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuartD

We need Moore and CNN to both register on GFY and start bickering here so we can all comment through out.

that would be fun

Fap · 07-15-2007, 08:27 PM

i hate Michael Moore

Cman · 07-15-2007, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Humpy Leftnut

No it isn't, that's a lie. I've never paid money to a doctor for anything that was ever wrong with me.

Actually, there is a ton of stuff the govt doesn't pay for. Everytime I go to the dentist or get new glasses I have to pay for that stuff.

How often do most people get surgery? Probably almost never. So in my personal case, I pay for almost everything medical that I have to do.

Cman · 07-15-2007, 08:36 PM

The main problem with our "free" system, is that people abuse it. We literally have people who just go to the doctor (GP not specialist) for fun because they are unemployed and bored or simply have nothing better to do. Everytime someone gets a sniffle its, "uh oh better go see the doctor". Of course, this is stupid and it just increases their workload unecessarily. The people who are ACTUALLY sick have to wait in line until all these other losers are done.

starpimps · 07-15-2007, 08:40 PM

moore is a fat fuck...what a sloppy person, you cant listen to a sloppy fool l like moore

RawAlex · 07-15-2007, 09:18 PM

I will give credit to CNN on one point: They have the nuts to at least address the issue. If this was Fox News, they would be running a major smear campaign against Michael Moore and interviewing all the hookers he has been with.

CNN actually sound like they almost care. Almost.

notabook · 07-15-2007, 11:25 PM

I love how many people try to say that the wait times in Canada and other first world nations with universal healthcare are "unbearable". One of my aunts started getting severe headaches, then about a week later she started to see nothing but blackness for a few minutes at a time. Her doctor was somewhat concerned and wanted her to get a CT scan. It took them six weeks to see her! Six damn weeks to get a CT scan. She had blue cross/blue shield at the time… not sure if she had different insurance would there have been any difference in wait time.

On a note, they never found out what was wrong with her. She still has the 'blackouts' occasionally but the scans didn't reveal anything in her head.

GreyWolf · 07-16-2007, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axeman

The biggest problem with the Canadian system is caused by the American system. Canada's biggest issues is a shortage in doctors because we train them and then they head south as specialists for the big money in the for profit system. Couple that with the fact the US refused to build more medical schools to meet their demand in house, has cause a huge need to import their doctors from elsewhere. This is being slowly rectified as states are now green lighting more medical schools to meet their own demand.

Also in Canada we train a lot more GP's than the US does as most doctors in the US chase the gold as specialists. So the GP's we train up here eventually get filtered off to be GP's down south.

Canada needs to increase wages a bit to keep doctors and nurses here, but also I think a law needs to be put in place that if your trained in Canada you have to give X amount of years back to the country. Some will choose to go down south to do their medical school but with the lack of schools there, they may not get in anyway.

Will quote you an actual situation re Canada/US - tho it's only one example and can't say if this is a norm.

Was involved with coding of a "patient system" to permit healthcare professionals to access patient data as rapidly as possible. This depended on laws and whether private data would be permitted to be shared in this way etc and plenty other factors - too many and not relevant to the point.

Anyways... The software was developed in Canada and was implemented there are various centers. Among others, a fair number of US healthcare companies expressed interest. It was astounding that the attitude to pricing of that system (it cost a good lump of serious money) was more than doubled for the US market. Why? Because that is what they expected to pay and reflected the ROI by using it. There was no real sense in this - it was just another group of US healthcare corps who were charging excessively high costs to patients who felt they could throw away money at this level (and presumably attempting to reduce the balance on their profit/loss accounts).

Can't say - there is a benefit to a system of this type, but smells very similar to US pharma companies who have a blank check on what they can charge hospital groups for their product. US laws allow this is to specifically happen and without any tenders or competitive quotes. Who pays? Individual patients. It's too swamplife and immoral - tho "legal".

The vendor corp in Canada was, of course, happy to do that biz - they never got more money from any other country for the background abuse of patients - tho that could still possible under any healthcare system.

V_RocKs · 07-16-2007, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyMischief

There has been a bunch of Michael Moore controversy lately... He really kind of twisted things in "Sicko" to suit his own demands. Acting like health care in Canada is free and there are no waiting lists is a big load of bullshit. Canadians pay ridiculous amounts of tax, so the health care system is far from being free, since a lot of those tax dollars go to support the social healthcare... and waiting lists? Don't even get me started.. I waited over 5 months to see a specialist over a medical emergency, and I am very much not alone....

We pay a lot of taxes... They go to ear-marks... Why does the entire nation need to pay for a bridge in Alaska or drug programs in Memphis? Let their own states and localities handle that shit.

Also here in America we sit in line just as much as the rest of the world. Call your doctor and tell them your ear is ringing for some unknown reason... How long are they making you wait for an appointment? Mine is making me wait 3 fucking weeks... Tell me that doesn't compare to socialized medicine.

07-15-2007, 03:38 PM	#51
Humpy Leftnut Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 1,292	CNN should have also responded to their flag wavyness for how many years before they remembered they were supposed to pretend to be objective. __________________ Humpy Leftnut - Pornsumer Reviews

07-15-2007, 03:47 PM	#53
georgeyw 58008 53773 Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 9,864	OMFG. This is absolutely hilarious, CNN actually comes across like a 3 year old child lying about who drew on the kitchen wall with a crayon. Perfect example is : CNN RESPONSE: We believe our example of so-called "elective" procedures such as hip replacement and cataract surgery is accurate and is helpful information. More than 400,000 Americans have hip or knee replacements each year in the U.S. (http://www.niams.nih.gov/hi/topics/a...s/jointrep.htm). By age 80, half of all Americans either suffer from a cataract or have had cataract surgery (http://www.nei.nih.gov/health/catara...ract_facts.asp). Basically Moore pointed out that CNN pulled out a stat from a survey of 6 countries for elective surgeries only... __________________ TripleXPrint on Megan Fox "I would STILL suck her pussy until her face caved in. And then blow her up and do it again!"

07-15-2007, 07:58 PM	#60
Semi-Retired-Dave Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: LA Posts: 11,190	That's a pretty insane letter. Well written. __________________ Support a Good Cause

07-15-2007, 08:36 PM	#64
Cman Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 697	The main problem with our "free" system, is that people abuse it. We literally have people who just go to the doctor (GP not specialist) for fun because they are unemployed and bored or simply have nothing better to do. Everytime someone gets a sniffle its, "uh oh better go see the doctor". Of course, this is stupid and it just increases their workload unecessarily. The people who are ACTUALLY sick have to wait in line until all these other losers are done. __________________ I could put stuff here, but you don't care.

07-15-2007, 08:40 PM	#65
starpimps Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: internets Posts: 6,954	moore is a fat fuck...what a sloppy person, you cant listen to a sloppy fool l like moore __________________ Teen Porn Models / Solo Girls

07-15-2007, 08:27 PM	#62
Fap Just Du It Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 12,094	i hate Michael Moore

07-15-2007, 09:18 PM	#66
RawAlex So Fucking Banned Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: In a house. Posts: 9,465	I will give credit to CNN on one point: They have the nuts to at least address the issue. If this was Fox News, they would be running a major smear campaign against Michael Moore and interviewing all the hookers he has been with. CNN actually sound like they almost care. Almost.

07-15-2007, 11:25 PM	#67
notabook Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Not a Library! Posts: 9,748	I love how many people try to say that the wait times in Canada and other first world nations with universal healthcare are "unbearable". One of my aunts started getting severe headaches, then about a week later she started to see nothing but blackness for a few minutes at a time. Her doctor was somewhat concerned and wanted her to get a CT scan. It took them six weeks to see her! Six damn weeks to get a CT scan. She had blue cross/blue shield at the time… not sure if she had different insurance would there have been any difference in wait time. On a note, they never found out what was wrong with her. She still has the 'blackouts' occasionally but the scans didn't reveal anything in her head. __________________