Baghdad Burning

[The Duck]

Anyone reading this blog? Its a woman living in Iraq writing about everyday life from the front line, very interesting and many times it makes my heart ache to read it. Highly recommended.

http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/

As the situation continues to deteriorate both for Iraqis inside and outside of Iraq, and for Americans inside Iraq, Americans in America are still debating on the state of the war and occupation- are they winning or losing? Is it better or worse.

Let me clear it up for any moron with lingering doubts: It?s worse. It?s over. You lost. You lost the day your tanks rolled into Baghdad to the cheers of your imported, American-trained monkeys. You lost every single family whose home your soldiers violated. You lost every sane, red-blooded Iraqi when the Abu Ghraib pictures came out and verified your atrocities behind prison walls as well as the ones we see in our streets. You lost when you brought murderers, looters, gangsters and militia heads to power and hailed them as Iraq?s first democratic government. You lost when a gruesome execution was dubbed your biggest accomplishment. You lost the respect and reputation you once had. You lost more than 3000 troops. That is what you lost America. I hope the oil, at least, made it worthwhile.

[Mutt]

she's a crybaby, nobody likes a crybaby.

[WarChild]

Yeah, it's all about the oil .. Never mind that the cost of the war to date would buy more oil on the open market than Iraq could possibly pump out, even at pre gulf war 1 capacity.

[Agent 488]

yes it's an interesting read.

[Mutt]

why doesn't she talk about the good ol' days? as if there ever were any there - it was a shithole before and it's a shithole now. the united states didn't create the shithole - iraqis accomplished that all on their own.

[WarChild]

"People should know when they are conquered.".

[stickyfingerz]

Oh noes!!! Sweederland !!!

[mikesinner]

I find it hard to understand anyone who lives in the middle east. Hell you'd have to be fucking crazy to invade the central middle east, I mean look at whats happened to every single army that has tried in the last 2 thousand years. Religious fanatics cannot be taught democracy and they don't really want it even though some may say they do. America should have never gone to Iraq. I say wait until they get nuclear weapons and led that part of the world fall into chaos because it will when they get the ability to destroy themselves. There are some intelligent people there but they are drowned out by all the crazy religious extremist. Just look at how everyone hates Israel. When America says religious freedom they say there is no god our god.

[OG LennyT]

thanks for the propoganda and reminding me why I had you on ignore a while back

[BusterBunny]

Originally Posted by mikesinner

I find it hard to understand anyone who lives in the middle east. Hell you'd have to be fucking crazy to invade the central middle east, I mean look at whats happened to every single army that has tried in the last 2 thousand years. Religious fanatics cannot be taught democracy and they don't really want it even though some may say they do. America should have never gone to Iraq. I say wait until they get nuclear weapons and led that part of the world fall into chaos because it will when they get the ability to destroy themselves. There are some intelligent people there but they are drowned out by all the crazy religious extremist. Just look at how everyone hates Israel. When America says religious freedom they say there is no god our god.

logic and reason are not welcome in this thread

[pornguy]

Yeah I look back on the prison torture cases. and cringe. Makeing them pose naked while some dyke with a cigarette hanging out of her mouth points at them. Putting bags over thier head while they are being dealt with in one fashion or another,( which happens to be SOP ) it was a torture.

But it was a pleasant day to watch a man have his head sawed off with a fucking steak knife.

Stupid cunt.

[u-Bob]

oil? hehe, do people really stil believe this had anything to do with oil? lol

[12clicks]

yeah, it sucks once your sugar daddy saddam gets killed.

[ADL Colin]

Iraq the Model is another Iraqi blog. Quite a different point-of-view than that blog.

Monday, February 19, 2007

....

Although attacks happen here and there, the general feeling is still closer to hope and appreciation of the plan than pessimism. More families are returning to the homes they were once forced to leave, and we?re talking about some of the most dangerous districts such as Ghazaliya and Haifa Street.
Al-Sabah reports that yesterday alone 327 families returned home and that the scene of vans loaded with furniture of refugees leaving Baghdad is no more. There were times when the average was around 20 a day. The 327 figure brought the total to more than 500 families across Baghdad.

Al-Hurra TV aired a report on the story and interviewed some of the returning Baghdadis, one man said ?those who returned earlier and saw the change in the situation called us and encouraged us to return, and I too will encourage the rest to come back?. The report showed those families asking the army to stay and not abandon their neighborhood, and showed the officer in charge giving his number to the locals so that they can contact him directly in case of emergency.

Looking at the relative increase in the number of attacks and their geographic extent one can expect the coming days to bring more escalation, but with the amount of power available for US and Iraqi troops I think the bad guys will not be able to achieve much.

[Aussie Rebel]

Originally Posted by Mutt

she's a crybaby, nobody likes a crybaby.

[jayeff]

Originally Posted by u-Bob

oil? hehe, do people really stil believe this had anything to do with oil? lol

Of course it is to do with oil, although not in the narrow sense of Iraq's own (current) production.

The Middle East is Catch-22 for US foreign policy in the region. US response to the beginnings of Arab nationalism was to foster instability. Although many of those activities worked in the short term, longer term they encouraged nationalism, Moslem fundamentalism and anti-American sentiment. The more embedded these trends became, the fewer were the options for covert manipulation and the less effective such manipulation was. By the time of the first Gulf War, military intervention had become almost inevitable, unless there were to be an about-face in US foreign policy. Which was hardly likely...

Iran, Iraq, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia source more than 20% of the world's oil. They account for around 50% of the world's proven crude and gas reserves. Nominally Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are friendly countries, but both are ruled by unpopular regimes which, if overthrown, would be replaced by people likely to be as anti-American as the governments of Iran is and Iraq was. This is evidenced by the reality that - with little attempt at secrecy - most terrorist funding comes out of Saudi Arabia.

There are other sources of oil, notably Latin America. But our intervention in the internal affairs of countries to our south has hardly made us any more popular there than we are in the Middle East. Meanwhile, although we have had decades in which to react, we have done almost nothing to reduce our dependence on cheap oil. It is still the basis of the US economy and in many respects, our way of life.

So of course our activities in Iraq are all about oil. So are our activities in Afghanistan. It isn't just coincidence that the only areas of the world in which the "War on Terror" is being actively fought, have strong ties to oil. It may be that our activities will buy no more than a decade for the Al-Sauds and the Al-Sabahs, then our own chickens will come home to roost in a big way as well. But I guess our policymakers are hoping that since we cannot turn the clock back, something may happen to allow us to buy a little more time, then maybe a little more.

[Antonio]

did they hang Bush akready? I know they hanged his girlfriend Saddam for killing a few people here and there, now it's his turn - for exactly the same crimes (on a bigger scale though)

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by kandah

I forgot they aren't used to such horrific acts over there...

[u-Bob]

Originally Posted by jayeff

....

oil is just 1 small part of the puzzle.

some other things to think about:
US debt, US military spending, Russia, the USD, China (a country with more control over the USD than the US gov), the strategic importance of iraq (non-oil related), the Caspean Sea, major mineral deposists in countries such as Kazakhstan,..

If oil was the main reason for the invasion of Iraq, the US would now be all over the African continent preventing the deals the Chinese are making... The Iraqi oil was just a bonus. You have to look at the bigger picture...

[The Duck]

Originally Posted by Mutt

why doesn't she talk about the good ol' days? as if there ever were any there - it was a shithole before and it's a shithole now. the united states didn't create the shithole - iraqis accomplished that all on their own.

Did you even read the blog at all?

[ServerGenius]

Originally Posted by kandah

Did you even read the blog at all?

because he still likes to hold on to the idea that his goverment are brave
heroic saviours

[The Duck]

Originally Posted by u-Bob

oil is just 1 small part of the puzzle.

some other things to think about:
US debt, US military spending, Russia, the USD, China (a country with more control over the USD than the US gov), the strategic importance of iraq (non-oil related), the Caspean Sea, major mineral deposists in countries such as Kazakhstan,..

If oil was the main reason for the invasion of Iraq, the US would now be all over the African continent preventing the deals the Chinese are making... The Iraqi oil was just a bonus. You have to look at the bigger picture...

Exactly, even just a little research shows that this thing is bigger than just oil. It is about totalitarian world domination, the new world order. And the fact that some people here seem to be proud over it just shows the amount of brainwashing gone into the american public.

[Nikki_Licks]

Originally Posted by Mutt

why doesn't she talk about the good ol' days? as if there ever were any there - it was a shithole before and it's a shithole now. the united states didn't create the shithole - iraqis accomplished that all on their own.

and it will continue to be a stinking fucking shithole long after we are gone. Maybe then she will be able to write how great it is to live her wonderful shithole after the war is over and we cut off the aid........

[ServerGenius]

Originally Posted by Nikki_Licks

and it will continue to be a stinking fucking shithole long after we are gone. Maybe she will continue to write about how great it is to live her wonderful shithole after the war is over and we cut off the aid........

what aid? You mean the aid that goes to protecting the oil fields?

[Nikki_Licks]

Originally Posted by ServerGenius

what aid? You mean the aid that goes to protecting the oil fields?

yepers

[stev0]

Originally Posted by Mutt

why doesn't she talk about the good ol' days? as if there ever were any there - it was a shithole before and it's a shithole now. the united states didn't create the shithole - iraqis accomplished that all on their own.

Well, good... I feel better now. It seems that you certainly must have a better idea of whats going on than someone living there. Iraq was doing just fine before they were constantly bombed and put under sanctions, if the US wanted to clean up a shithole maybe they should have started with Detroit then worked over to the middle east.

[Adultnet]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

yeah, it sucks once your sugar daddy saddam gets killed.

now they are free they can build what they want.

[Tat2Jr]

Is there something going on in Iraq?

[Sick Bastard]

nuke a muslim

[WarChild]

Originally Posted by kandah

Exactly, even just a little research shows that this thing is bigger than just oil. It is about totalitarian world domination, the new world order. And the fact that some people here seem to be proud over it just shows the amount of brainwashing gone into the american public.

Back to The New World Order, World domination and Illumanti. Man I'm surprised you're still alive, after all you're sleuthing out and exposing all these ultra-secret and mega-powerful organizations.

[mikesinner]

I say we send in a million troops and start WW3, sure a lot of people will die but we can't let Al Qaeda remain a political power in the region. The American people won' stand that anyway after what happened on that day in September. I don't even have to say the date because every American will have that picture ingrained in their memory forever. Even those who have not been born yet will see it as the worst day for our country. Even those who don't want the war right now will change their minds after a time of peace if they see this terrorist organization still in operation or their voices will be drowned out by others who will cry with one voice for justice.

Jut look at our history. American has never been attacked like that, not deep inside our borders. America won't accept defeat. Even when we have lost wars we have found ways to win economically.

I don't see how Al Qaeda would be allowed to grow and flourish like Hezbollah. And since their will be a never ending supply of Muslims who look up to Bin Laden as a hero we will be fighting foe decades in one form or another and a lot of that will be in form of actual war

[Splum]

That blog isnt written by an Iraqi. No Iraqi would ever use the word "moron" and link to guerrilla news and juan cole lol.
That blog is 100% opinion and propaganda.
If by some remote chance that is a real Iraqi she/he/it is obviously SUNNI and that should tell you enough about the blog.

kandah you are a pathetic whining bitch.

[The Duck]

Originally Posted by Splum

That blog isnt written by an Iraqi. No Iraqi would ever use the word "moron" and link to guerrilla news and juan cole lol.
That blog is 100% opinion and propaganda.
If by some remote chance that is a real Iraqi she/he/it is obviously SUNNI and that should tell you enough about the blog.

kandah you are a pathetic whining bitch.

You are wrong, as always saying shit without researching it first. After reading the blog for a while the writer comes out as a sincere and gentle person, not interested in spreading propaganda.

Here is the book:

http://www.amazon.com/Baghdad-Burnin.../dp/1558614893

From Publishers Weekly
Iraqi women's voices have been virtually silent since the fall of Baghdad. Yet four months after Saddam's statue toppled in April 2003, the pseudonymous Riverbend, a Baghdad native then 24 years old, began blogging about life in the city in dryly idiomatic English and garnered an instant following that rivals Salam Pax's Where Is Raed? This year's worth of Riverbend's commentary--passionate, frustrated, sarcastic and sometimes hopeful--runs to September 2004. Before the war, Riverbend was a computer programmer ("yes, yes... a geek"), living with her parents and brother in relative affluence; as she chronicles the privations her family experiences under occupation, there is a good deal of "complaining and ranting" about erratic electricity, intermittent water supplies, near daily explosions, gas shortages and travel restrictions. She rails against the interim governing council ("the puppet government") and Bush and his administration--and is sardonic on Islamic fundamentalism: as Al Sadr and his followers begin to emerge, Riverbend quotes the Carpenters's "We've Only Just Begun." But Riverbend is most compelling when she gives cultural object lessons on everything from the changing status of Iraqi women to Ramadan, the Iraqi educational system, the significance of date palms and the details of mourning rituals. Just as fascinating are the mundane facts of daily life, like her unsuccessful attempt to go back to work--no one would guarantee the safety of a woman in the workplace. The blog continues at riverbendblog.blogspot.com; like this book, it offers quick takes on events as they occur, from a perspective too often overlooked, ignored or suppressed.
Copyright ? Reed Business Information, a division of Reed Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved.

From Booklist
Riverbend is the pseudonym of a young Iraqi blogger; this book archives the first year of her blog, Baghdad Burning. Once a computer programmer who enjoyed considerable personal freedom, after Baghdad's fall, Riverbend finds herself unemployed and largely restricted to the safety of her family's home. In English that would put many Americans to shame, she chronicles daily life under the occupation, writing about water and electricity shortages with humor and exasperation, writing about violence with deep feeling. She also explains more complicated topics, painting a surprising picture of prewar harmony between religious groups (she herself lives in a mixed Sunni and Shiite household). Riverbend's take on politics is so perceptive that readers may wonder if she is actually a Beltway antiwar activist--although such readers should also question their assumption that an Iraqi couldn't write this well or be so well informed. But the greatest accomplishment of this intriguing book lies in its essential ordinariness. Riverbend is bright and opinionated, true, but like all voices of dissent worth remembering, she provides an urgent reminder that, whichever governments we struggle under, we are all the same. Keir Graff
Copyright ? American Library Association. All rights reserved

[The Duck]

Originally Posted by Splum

That blog isnt written by an Iraqi. No Iraqi would ever use the word "moron" and link to guerrilla news and juan cole lol.
That blog is 100% opinion and propaganda.
If by some remote chance that is a real Iraqi she/he/it is obviously SUNNI and that should tell you enough about the blog.

kandah you are a pathetic whining bitch.

What makes you think she is sunni? And even if she is why does it matter? How long have you been reading the blog and what makes you an expert in identifying propaganda? In my memory you usually defend Bush and the new world order, that to me means that you are a victim of propaganda, not one who can easily identify it.

[IllTestYourGirls]

Originally Posted by kandah

Anyone reading this blog? Its a woman living in Iraq writing about everyday life from the front line, very interesting and many times it makes my heart ache to read it. Highly recommended.

http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/

who wrote this Hillary Clinton?

[borked]

Originally Posted by kandah

Exactly, even just a little research shows that this thing is bigger than just oil. It is about totalitarian world domination, the new world order. And the fact that some people here seem to be proud over it just shows the amount of brainwashing gone into the american public.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/Re...asDefenses.pdf

[cones]

Originally Posted by Mutt

why doesn't she talk about the good ol' days? as if there ever were any there - it was a shithole before and it's a shithole now. the united states didn't create the shithole - iraqis accomplished that all on their own.

Come on mate! You sound like you have fox news mainlined in your arm. The woman LIVES in the country yet you totally dismiss her claims. How did the average Iraqi cause this problem? You got to be kidding me.

[TheJimmy]

Originally Posted by WarChild

"People should know when they are conquered.".

Great movie...interesting quote.

[jayeff]

Originally Posted by u-Bob

oil is just 1 small part of the puzzle.

I don't recall writing that it was the whole story. I was responding to a post in which you wrote "do people really stil believe this had anything to do with oil?" (emphasis mine).

Had you said originally that oil is "1 small part of the puzzle", I would have taken issue with you over the "small", if only because oil was at the center of US foreign policy in this region long before the other issues you mentioned existed.

And of course there is oil elsewhere, but in other places - you mentioned Africa - the situation is entirely different. In theory there is nothing to prevent us invading Nigeria for example, to secure their oil. But the oil companies (not all American) are managing very well on their own to help keep the country poverty stricken, so there is no need for such intervention even if we could come up with a palatable excuse for it.

[kane]

Here is some interesting info for those that like to form strong opinions about the blog even though they have never read it.

1. The woman that writes the blog lives in Baghdad with her family. She is in her early 20's and has gone to college. She worked as some kind of computer engineer before the invasion and the company that she worked for was destroyed and has yet to return. There is speculation that the company she worked for may have done work for the former government. So those that want to say it is a fake run by a liberal group are wrong. People from the BBC and her book publisher have met her.

2. She herself says that her family is made up of both Sunni and Shina, however it is widely assumed that much of her Baghdad based family are Sunni and hence had a pretty decent life under Saddam. If you were a Sunni during Saddam's reign your life wasn't all that bad. If you were Shina or Kurd it may well have been a different story.

3. The blog starts off as chronicle of what life is like living in a city that was invaded, the government overthrown and then occupied by foreign troops while they tried to build a new government. As the blog goes on, and time passes and the war drags on her mood changes. Gone is the person who was once optimistic that this war can eventually end on a positive note. She starts to feel like someone who is living under Marshall law - which is exactly what is happening.

4. years after the invasion much of the country still has no electricity or running water. She herself speaks of having the power go off all the time. Sometimes it is back on after a few hours, sometimes it is day. The weather is unbearably hot in the summer and very cold in the winter and no electricity means no heat or A/C. How long would stay upbeat and positive if everyday during the winter your heater went out - sometimes for days - or during the summer you were left to suffer in 100+ degree weather? All the while each day there is gunfighting and chaos in your city so you can't even go outside and relax without the fear of something bad happening to you or your family?

5. Reading the blog gives you a great insight into that part of the world. Many of the people who we have worked to put into power are people the Iraqis don't like. We, of course, seem to think we know what is best for them and try to force our choices on them.

6. She talks about how, under Saddam, there were no warlords or street gangs. A woman could walk the streets in relative safety. now any woman must be accompanied by a man or she risks being attacked. Gangs run the streets of Baghdad and it will take years and years for the Iraqis to get a strong enough military and police force to deal with them. She doesn't say Saddam was a saint, just that things are different and not for the better.

In the end the blog is good. It is one person's view on what they see, what their opinion is and what feel about the situation that is happening right outside their front door. You can choose to agree or disagree with her all you want but it doesn't change the fact that many of the people in that country want us out. There was a recent department of defense poll that showed 65% of the people in Iraq want us to leave and now see us as occupiers not liberators. Every US-friendly middle eastern leader warned us not to go into Iraq because we didn't understand what we were getting into. now years, billions of dollars and many lives later it looks they were right.

Every time I read or see something about Iraq I am reminded of something I once heard someone say, "You can't spread democracy through the barrel of a gun."

We lost this war before we ever started it.

[IllTestYourGirls]

Originally Posted by kane

Every time I read or see something about Iraq I am reminded of something I once heard someone say, "You can't spread democracy through the barrel of a gun."

We lost this war before we ever started it.

Dont tell that the England, France and USA. I believe we got democracy through a barrel of a gun.

[kane]

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls

Dont tell that the England, France and USA. I believe we got democracy through a barrel of a gun.

you are correct. But we were the ones that wanted it and we pointed the guns at the people who were trying to keep it from us. You can't walk into a country point a gun at them and force them to adopt democracy. If they want it bad enough, they will take it.

[hardcoreblogger]

Originally Posted by kandah

Exactly, even just a little research shows that this thing is bigger than just oil. It is about totalitarian world domination, the new world order. And the fact that some people here seem to be proud over it just shows the amount of brainwashing gone into the american public.

you got it, mate - i feel pity for that part of the american public that also surfaces on here

[Splum]

Originally Posted by hardcoreblogger

you got it, mate - i feel pity for that part of the american public that also surfaces on here

Originally Posted by hardcoreblogger

Location: Ganjaland

And we feel pity for you druggie, go suck some dick for another bag.

What kind of homo uses the term "mate" when referring to other males?

[Splum]

Originally Posted by kane

you are correct. But we were the ones that wanted it and we pointed the guns at the people who were trying to keep it from us. You can't walk into a country point a gun at them and force them to adopt democracy. If they want it bad enough, they will take it.

You CAN force democracy on people we have done it all over the world for the last 50+ years. I realize you were only born like 15 years ago but dig up some of your fathers history books I am sure you can find many examples of United States imperialism.

FTW.

[kane]

Originally Posted by Splum

You CAN force democracy on people we have done it all over the world for the last 50+ years. I realize you were only born like 15 years ago but dig up some of your fathers history books I am sure you can find many examples of United States imperialism.

FTW.

And these imperialist nations that we created lasted exactly how long? Enlighten my idiot mind and show me a few.

[Splum]

Originally Posted by cones

Come on mate! You sound like you have fox news mainlined in your arm. The woman LIVES in the country yet you totally dismiss her claims. How did the average Iraqi cause this problem? You got to be kidding me.

Average Iraqis have helped fuel the violence by not doing anything about the insurgents within their midst. Also that "woman" in her blog is defending a known insurgent facilitator and sympathizer so that blogger cant be all the "noble".
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/...ape/index.html

[Splum]

Originally Posted by kane

And these imperialist nations that we created lasted exactly how long? Enlighten my idiot mind and show me a few.

South Korea and Germany are two that have come to mind that are still very powerful governments that initially WE set up.
Also dont be so ignorant as to think Imperialism cant come in forms like cultural and economic as well.
Just ask any average Russian, the USA changed the face of Russia and all its states, fact is the USA has changed the world many times over.

[Odin]

Watched an interesting documentary on TV here, made by a doctor in Baghdad. Was kind of interesting to see and hear how 90% of people he knew were actually hoping the American's stayed, as they were the only ones capable of bringing any stability right now. Kind of different to what I've heard in the media previously.

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by Mutt

why doesn't she talk about the good ol' days? as if there ever were any there - it was a shithole before and it's a shithole now. the united states didn't create the shithole - iraqis accomplished that all on their own.