CNN: We Were Warned (Special On Impending Oil Crisis) (No Repubs In Here, Please)

August 13 tomorrow at 8pm

http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/presents/index.oil.html

Thanks for the link.

Best thing I have seen on CNN for quite some time.

Never saw it, but flex fuel is definately the way to go - works well in several other countries.

funny thing is most people i know consider energy sources that are not the ones the u.s. is using to be only for hippies. my ex has been driving his mercedes on biodiesel for years, which uses i think 1/4 real diesel - the rest is vegetable oil. works fine - no problems or issues at all.

and some businesses here and in other run on solar power, which they store, and it works fine.

months ago i read an article on cnn. bush was very involved in helping set up agreements with south american countries which would make them the primary suppliers of the corn that would be turned into ethanol in case that became popular. some u.s. states were very upset because it would keep them from helping supply the ethanol in this country, again making more money for the biggest oil companies and keeping money from the farmers here

Big Gov, hell even local gov will never really support alternative fuels, they make way to much money on gas taxes at the pump. You got 30 cents per gallon tax in say California, 20 cents per gallon in most other states, plus some other sales or excise taxes added on per purchase.

But Fox News tells me how great oil is and that the more we use the better our health and the richer we will all be.

I like how you say no Repubs in here, as if Republicans all suck down oil like there's no tomorrow while Democrats take every possible step to conserve. Laughable really.

There are just as many Democrats sucking down gas in their SUVs, consuming plastics, flying in airplanes et all as there are Republicans.

I'll have to cjeck it out tomorrow...

I think Im going to buy a stretch SUV hummer just to drive around to the store and pick up the kids at school...

I caught parts of it too Brazil I think it was is doing great work with flex fuel Growing sugar cane to make it

Love driving rollerskate size death trap rice burners...

go with E85

Not that u on the East coast would know what corn looked like

I think it has less to do with the usage and more to do with the fact that Republicans suck the oil companies dick.

Hey president bush is doing great in researching alternative resources to oil! Coal and Nuclear power. He's 'pledged' like 20 billion to nuclear and coal in research, while at the same time less than a hundred million to true alternative power sources to fossil fuels such as solar, wind, hydro, etc.

supporting the countries that support terror way to go, sheep lol

Uh... 90% of all plastics you use are a byproduct of oil, which means by you typing on a computer you support terrorism. =(

Be afraid, be very afraid. The tear-ore-ests are AFTER JOO!

Er...

Nuclear energy is the only viable "alternative" energy source we have. Period.

Do the research. Other options are simply either a net energy loss at this time (ethanol, biodiesel), are too intermitent and present storage issues (solar, wind), simply not enough to supply demand and may cause other environmental issues (hydro), or the tech simply isn't quite up there yet (hydrogen as a means to convert electric (nuclear) power to a transportable fuel source).

I'm not saying considerable effort and research should not go into the alternatives - obviously we need to figure out a way to get off fossil fuel dependence ASAP. However, any near-term solution in the next couple decades will have to have a very large part of it being nuclear based, or some huge leap in tech will have to happen to make something else viable.

Right now, things like Biodiesel work because people are throwing away old fuel sources (vegetable oil), and demand is simply not high. More petroleum goes into growing said plants that make the oil, then you actually get out. Same goes for ethanol derived from corn (although it's starting to become promising, which is cool) - it's debateable about ethanol derived from sugarcane however.

What I see happening "when the oil finally runs out" is actually a pretty natural transition. As oil becomes more and more expensive, you will see the "hippies" being overruled on blocking all other forms of energy. Nuclear is the only viable stop-gap (aside from coal, but I really hope we don't start burning more of that...), until "something better" makes sense. In the future, I more or less see energy being provided by "the grid" - e.g. nuclear, solar, hyrdo, whatever and then for non-electric means being converted into some transportable and high-density form of energy. For example, nuclear plants dedicated towards simply making hydrogen for cars. Or dedicated simply to distilling corn to create ethanol, etc. This is sort of starting to happen to the electric grid - for the first time since.. well, before I was born, there have been new nuclear power plants approved. This to me is a good sign in the right direction, but we'll see how it goes.

While I don't think the transition will be all too easy, I also don't see the world ending like folks say. Oil will gradually rise in price, baring any super wars and such, and as it does, alternatives will start to make economic sense and you will see investment poured into them. You already are seeing this on a small scale, and as oil continues to rise it will grow exponentially.

Of course, we could all face complete economic collapse and be totally fucked. Who the hell am I to predict the future?

-Phil

Brazil is the smart country. They burn sugar cane to heat up the sugar cane to make fuel.

Guess what the US uses to heat up corn to make fuel.......oil. Fucking brilliant.

Classic example of "flex fuel" in use is in Brazil - over 70% of cars sold have duel/triple fuel options.

The main fuel being ethanol which is cleaner and cheaper than oil - a no brainer.

At the rate Brazil has backed alternative energy sources like this - their requirement for oil in 10 years will be peanuts - and a massive plus on trade balances.

Yeah.. Brazil has a pretty good model. It's debateable though if that would work in the US at that scale (same percentage penetration to consumers). Sugar cane obviously grows a bit better in Brazil, and they are definitely more de-centralized which makes it a little easier to transistion.

However, why do you think US ethanol producers burn fossile fuel to make it? One word: cost. Once other energy sources become cheaper, they'll start using them.

It's all about the dollar at the end of the day.. That's the one constant you can count on - human nature and greed. I'm banking on it saving us

-Phil

Here's the issue. The US isn't one big country when it comes to fuels like
the rest of the world is. It's 50 different states that all have their own requirements and agenda etc. when it comes to energy so you'll never get one substance (except oil) that they all will agree on until the cost/benefit ratio makes them to change away from oil.

For example, states with massive amounts of coal are pushing clean coal by-products for vehicle fuel while corn growning states are pushing ethanol. Others with massive air polution are pushing electric cars that actually require coal to be burned to generate the electric for the cars.

I think it's 5-10 years away where fuel cells will be the energy source most of the USA goes to. They have a fuel cell now that's about the size of an air conditioner that can run an entire house for a year. The only issue it costs $20,000 per year. In 5-10 years it'll be down to $1200 per year.

So the bottom line is the USA will be an oil country until the cost/benefit ratio changes this !

O&G deals are ultra hot right now.

fucking typical of the us government to be looking into this now, when the world situation is dire.

they should of looked at alternatives properly years ago

oh noes, a politics thread

interesting.....

I said no republicans in here because they are usually the first to say something stupid. Which is not surprising, Republicans typically are, on average, dumber than Democrats. Not that Democrats are that smart either, because they arent.

The special said Brazil is almost to the point that they will be able to declare energy independance. They use sugar cane to make ethanol, which is super smart since that shit will grow almost anywhere down there. We should use corn, as the midwest would be a perfect place for growing it. Right now, we pay farmers subsidies to grow corn, there is a surplus of it, so they burn it. Absoultely stupid.

And E85 is a crock of shit. Its still 15% oil, and thats 15% too much. Its another half measure that was put forth by the idiots in Detroit. These are the same people that have created the mess we have now. For years, they have made engines in cars more efficent and able to produce better mileage. But all of that extra efficency was used to make the vechile bigger, or heavier instead of making the out the door mileage better too. Truth be told, gas mileage has stagnated on Detrioit vechiles since about the 1980s.

I bet.

No doubts whatsoever on any of that man

On a somewhat related note, that story made me think of this movie coming out:

http://www.sonyclassics.com/whokilledtheelectriccar/

If your sitting on the most profitable commodity on the planet you don't let people change to an alterate fuel until that commodity has ran out.

What kind of emissions does the ethanol produce compared to oil ?

Pretty amazing what Brazil is doing