ELK

Hi all!

Yes, finaly! Why?
Everytime someone find out, that we're from Russia - they are always have to say something rude about it. Why do we have to hide our roots everywhere, to avoid banning or something like that?
Why almost all affiliate programs doesn't accept webmasters from Russia? What's wrong with us?

Why? Why? Why?

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[Labret]

98% of you cheat.
Ron will dispute that the remaining 2% do as well.
But I am willing to give you the benefit of the doubt.

chodadog

lol

DrewKole

Because a good deal of you guys hide behind your country and our (US+CANADA) ability to prosecute you.

Your laws are way more fitting for warez and cheating than ours are.

Will I ever promote a russian site that isnt payed out by a processing company? Umm, no.

Plus, $5 for 1000 impressions? How long do you plan on being in this business exactly? Because I've got like... erm, I dunno, 800k exits a day I could throw your way at that price?

Id like to cash out after the first day aswell please.

You owe me $4k.

Thanks. Drive through to the next window please.

ELK

I think you have a wrong percentage information....
Anyway, I'm sure that it's not 98%.
And, do you really think that there's no cheaters in U.S.?
Cheaters isn't just an our country problem...
Cheaters are everywhere.
I even don't want to remind you that russians are everywhere. In the whole world, and in U.S. too, btw....
So... um.. I think it's a bit stupid
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Forkbeard

Perhaps because generations of living under bureaucratic despots has ingrained reflexive theft & fraud into the depths of the Russian soul?

When rules are arbitrary, pointless, or unfair, one learns contempt for rules. That unthinking "the rules don't apply to me" attitude that one sees on every ulitsa and pedestrian crosswalk in Russia (where the authorities haven't given up and installed perihods, that is) has translated into a certain agressive approach to capitalism. Which is the polite way of saying that when a Russian wants to do business with me, I keep a tight hand on my wallet. At least until we've sat down and drunk a few bottles of vodka together....

The fact that it's essentially impossible to sue a Russian for breach of contract or anything else, does not help.

Aussie Rebel

LOL I could'nt of said it better myself

ELK

Oh, well.. we pay for 1000 impressions. But!
for 1000 real impressions (not closed in the first second of loading). And also... Only for US/Canada/Europe/Aus visitors.. Feel the difference. It won't be $4k a day, anyway...
But! Yes, you can cash out after the first day, btw...
Cause there's no limitations in our rules....
Just try it out for one day, if you don't believe us.

LoveAsianChicks

ELK - Many people believe the % of cheaters is higher in Russia then other countries. There also seems to be alot of lolita and cp sites that are Russian as well. It is a shame for the honest people living there.

I remember topbucks had a click-thru program and had banned BC, Canada from joining. (Now BC, Canada can join)
but I couldn't join at the time I wanted to, and was annoying because I had no plans to cheat.
It's just a case of a few people ruining it for the majority.

ELK

That's what I'm talking about! Why do we all have to pay such a big price for some stupid people living here.... They are everywhere. And not only in Russia.

Concerning CP.. Well. You're right. But i think they are not only russian sites! Anyway, i don't think it's a good idea to blame the whole country or nation for a some cheaters, CP designers and so on?

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Jakke PNG

Russia tried to invade finland a bit over 50 years ago. Mainly that.

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vidsweb

There are cheaters in the US/Canada, but for every cheater here, there are 10 cheaters in Russia.

Its just not worth the trouble of doing business with people in Russia.

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ELK

Yeah, that has much in common with the business today....
May be you'd better remember what was 1000 years ago?

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mule

ELK, I'm with LoveAsianChicks on this one. Ever since getting into this business, on every adult board I've visited, I've read horror stories of guys being burned by Russians. And while I like to keep an open mind and not judge individuals based on where they live, it's made me nervous of having dealings with people from Russia. It really is a shame if you're an honest person, but unfortunately that's just the way things have grown. The only thing you can do is work twice as hard at proving you're honest, and in the end it will pay off for you, hopefully.

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Tipsy

ELK you're missing the point. vidasweb just summed it up. Yes there are cheaters in every country but.... the % in Russia is sooo much higher than elsewhere. The 98% figure isn't as unrealistic as it sounds. If companies started dealing with Russians they wouldn't be in business for very long.
Yes it's a major pain for the few honest Russian WM's but unfortunately it is only a few.

__________________
Ignorance is never bliss.

ELK

Well. I think you have much more internet users/webmasters in US/Canada than in Russia. Much more! So, it's not 1/10... Otherwise - all Russians are cheaters. And that's not true....

Dualcpu

The financial situation in Russia is not good and the incomes are low compared to the Western countries, therefor it is more likely that someone from Russia would cheat than someone from the UK or US.

It is bad that you have to suffer for what other people did, but that is just the way it goes. Companies rather protect themselves by banning all of Russia than possibly losing many thousands of dollars by allowing a few cheaters to join.

twistyneck

Yes it is. Russia sucks. GO FINLAND!

ELK

Well, i know about Russian cheaters. I saw many cheater sites.
But I wanna say.. It's not such a big percent..... And most of them, are just singles with $1 in the pocket. Most cheaters doesn't have anything to offer, btw. They are just trying to cheat. And that's all. Without trying something to offer. And most of them are not a real webmasters. Just a surfers (with a 1-minute-made page with a few links how to cheat). All I can say.. We are a big company and we are working hard to promote our affiliate program technology in a russian internet. These 2 projects are our own affiliate programs that we manage ourselfs.
And we're not going to cheat someone.

Sexymail

word up

Cirrus

I would never deal with myself too

ELK

Yes. But it also a reason why russian webmasters still are the big part of an adult business. Cause it can be their only job.. Do you know why? And they just aren't able to make such a big money as western WM can.....

Dualcpu

btw: http://www.sextraffic.org/

Shows 2 of the same sentences:

"Your site should be in English".

Not sure if you wanted that up there twice.

vidsweb

People feel the way they do about russian webmasters for legitimate reasons.

Its not like people one day everybody just decided to not like working with russian webmasters just for the fun of it.

__________________
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ELK

lol

I think it was like a double reminder ;)

Anyway, thanks. I've mentioned it a few times before, but I had no time to fix it. Ok. I'll fix it now in a few minutes

vidsweb

If russians are such a big part of adult websites, then why do you say that people's sites should be in english? why not russian?

__________________
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Tipsy

ELk you really are totally underestimating the amount of Russian WM's that cheat. A good example is TGP reviews. All (as I can think of no exceptions I had) TGP subs from Russian sites/e-mail addys were either redirects,multiple submissions from the same person using different e-mail or ignoring even the most basic rules posted on every TGP. Many were all of the above.
You may well be the most honest guy/company on the planet but a sad fact of life if that you are the exception and not the rule.
Fortunately cheating TGP subs are no more than annoying and cost little if any money. However for a sponsor paying $35+ a go it's a totally different matter.

__________________
Ignorance is never bliss.

ELK

1. Most russian surfers would never pay for porn! They just don't have credit cards. That's true. And they will never buy anything on english resources for the same reason. Even if they want to.
2. Anyway, I don't think there are any russian-language adult sites exists, even if they were made by russian webmasters

So, I don't think it's a big problem, even for russian adult webmasters.

ELK

As i've previously said - russian surfers will never sign up for $35+. And all russian WM are mostly searching for US/UK/Europe traffic. They don't need russian traffic as well.
And that makes no difference between russian/or any other WM.

mika

Do they actually HATE you, or dont they just wanna do business with you?
Why take it so personally, maybe it's not HATE

I dont HATE you

ELK

And, actually - the biggest part of russian cheaters are not WEBMASTERS! THEY ARE JUST SURFERS, CLICKERS or anything else like that! But they are not webmasters. And of course they don't work in a big companies.

ELK

Um.. Well. They don't personally hate me, but I just see the general attitude... I'm bit confused about it...

Thanks, that you don't hate me! I'm very pleased to know it.

sarcasticbastard

your dot org domains are very impressive
not

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ELK

What do you mean?
What's wrong with .org domains?

vidsweb

Nobody will take a .org domain seriously.

Its all about .com

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ELK

Very nice...
At least .org is not a .ru
I don't think there's a big difference between .org and .com

vidsweb

A .com domain is for businesses.

A .org domain is for non-profit organizations like www.greenpeace.org

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ELK

Yes, that was an idea of the past.
But now, when almost all good-sounding domains in .com are sold out, it's only the past. Many businesses have an .org domain now too.

vidsweb

You just wish it was the past, but I'm sorry to tell you that it isn't.

Having a .org domain makes you look like a huge newbie, nobody will take you seriously and very few people will do business with you.

I suggest you get a .com domain or maybe a .net

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ELK

Btw, if you really think that it's a problem for us. You're wrong.
SO! If you'll be able to throw our way a high quality traffic - you'll get your $4k per day.

So, just try it out. You won't loose anything.

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DatsMyStapler

this 22 year old russian kid I know owes $250,000 for a credit card scam that he did. hes got 2 kids too. bummer

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ELK

Do you really think that it's such a big problem to get a .com or .net domain for us? I think you don't.... So, do you really think it has such a big difference?

I affraid, that is only your personal opinion. But it's not the fact.
Does anybody think the same way?

ELK

LOL Not funny....
I don't have any kids.. I'm not talking about credit card scam.... ;(

Angel Q

As for me, Russian WEBMASTERS are fine. But only if you're a very serious webmasters.

I've known lots of them and I guess I understand the problem.
You see, the thing is that serious Russian webmaster is really worth having in program 'coz those guys really know what to do. Russian people is very poor people in general and the money these webmasters make is huge in that country. It keeps them working even harder. And those guys are really great.

On the other hand - Russians are used to cheat from the beginning. There're exceptions just like in every rule but in general this is so. And every russian newbie in our biz who shows up tries to cheat. He understands that he cannot earn a thing after a while and if he's smart enough - he'll start serious hard work. But this is enough for all of us to think all russians cheat.

This is why we accept Russians, but we always keep an eye on them and ask them to show there traffic sources and prove they own them before joining.

These guys make good money for us and everybody's happy. But there few of honest ones anyways, I must admit

ELK

btw, how did you find out that i'm 22 years old?
that's the second right thing you told us, except that i'm russian.

vidsweb

OK, then why don't you give me some examples of .org websites that are well respected money making businesses?

__________________
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vidsweb

You will realize that I'm correct about .org being a bad domain when you discover that you are not making any money and nobody will do business with you.

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ELK

I don't really remember URL's at this moment, but I'm sure I saw some of them!

ELK

Very useful advice, thanks...
We'll think about it. But at this moment I'm not sure we're going to change domains....

ServerGenius

I know a couple quite a few russians really well, I have been to Moscow at least 20 times and I have spent quite some time in
Russia so I know there are good russians too.... I can
name you a good russian webmaster....he runs www.germesia.com. The creator of brownie and tgbush.

That does not change the fact that there are many russian
cheaters. This does not mean that all russian people are bad.
But a high percentage that has internet access is. I agree with
you that it is very frustrating and it's a shame too because I can
confirm that there are MANY really smart and good programmers
in Russia.

If you want to make it do fair business and gain "our" trust.
I have never asked Germes for the reason but if you buy his
software he will first install everything and after it's done you
get the invoice... Many people use his software and all seem
very happy with it, including me.

So use it as an example that if you deliver a good product
you can do good business....but yes you probably have to
work a bit harder then western people to gain initial trust
but once you have proven yourself there won't be too many
problem I think....

DynaMite

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