all big ifs..

the salt in the ocean is increasing cause 6 billion humans are bathing, drinking and cookng in the fresh stuff :)

the earths magnetic field fluctuates over time.. hell.. it's reversed polarity several times..

it's been around 2 million years and the earth IS OVERPOPULATED BY HUMANS! :)

i'll take your fossil record and flood thing to issue in a bit.. luckily i don't have paying client work for the next day or two, (otherwaise i wouldn't be here :)) but i do have my own!

as i have yours, yes we should.. LOL and vice versa! :)

Man, I can't go before replying. Shit, I might sober up by tomorrow and not be able to remember my response :1orglaugh


I am sure that adds to the salinity but the majority of it the salinity comes from erosion

Exactly. So the theory of uniformitarianism is out the window. With it goes radioactive dating because the rate of decay of elements is HIGHLY dependent on the Earth's magnetic field. Not to mention the Sun's violet and ultrviolet rays.

But mathematically,
if The population of the planet in 1985 was: 5 billion
in 1977: 4 billion
in 1900: 1 billion
in Jesus? day: 1/4 billion

Then over a few million years the popluation should be about 100,000 people per square inch!

I hope the dude that started this will at least let us come over and watch a movie or something

You know...I'm really impressed with the amount of debating going on in this thread and that the those who are doing the most debating are really in the wrong line of work.

I can see these three guys being 'Professors' at some state institution/college! :)

I mean, they're throwing out words like:

uniformitarianism
thermodynamics
closed system
enthropy
etc, etc.

and just when I was getting used to seeing words like:
"fuck"
'rude bitch'
"I got cheated by so-and-so"
"I fucked her!"

I hope this debate continues as I'm really looking forward to learning about creation & evolution from an unlikely source!
(Who would have ever guessed I would learn this shit on an 'ADULT" forum!)

Keep up the debate guys! PLEASE! :)

mathematically that is called an EXPONENTIAL increase.. i'd almost make a graph for you.. using your dates you can see that a billion people were added in 8 years just recently but only 3/4 of a billion in almost 1900 before! there are around 6 billion people on the planet now..we've put on 5 billion in the past 100 years.. 5 3/4 in the last 2000. 2 million years ago which is roughly the age of the race we would have numbered in the thousands/tens of thousands... it's NOT a linear progression as those numbers prove it;s fairly obvious that as our ability to manipulate the enviroment increased and we stopped being nomadic our population very slowly but steadily grew.. with our technicalogical advancements and industrialisation.. and pure numbers the last century has seen us explode fivefold.. theres nothing in those figures that suggest we haven't been around 2 million years.. nothing in the slightest.. in fact working backwards they almost show how many people were around back then.. but of course that doesn't take environmental factors into account.. this isn't just numbers.. yes.. from this century on the numbers are exploding and population projections look incredible.. but's it's an obvious fact that it was a slow wind up to get to here. and that if ten years ago there was 5 billion..a hundred years ago there was a billion, 2000 years ago there was a 1/4 of a billion then 4000 years ago there was probably an 8th of a billion... 8000 a 16th.. 16000 a 32nd, 32000 a 64th, 64000 7 mill, 128k 3.5 mill, 256k 1.75mill, 500k 870,000, 1mill 400,000, 2 million years ago 200,000.. you see? EXPONENTIAL growth is slow at first then explodes.. and is of course governed by environment and ability of the species.. of course my numbers above are just rough.. but it's quicker than making a diagram :)

Shit, one more quicky. I did not see this post until just a minute ago.


"Just how much water is there on (and in) the Earth? Here are some numbers you can think about:

The total water supply of the world is 326 million cubic miles (a cubic mile is an imaginary cube (a square box) measuring one mile on each side). A cubic mile of water equals more than one trillion gallons.

About 3,100 cubic miles of water, mostly in the form of water vapor, is in the atmosphere at any one time. If it all fell as precipitation at once, the Earth would be covered with only about 1 inch of water.

The 48 contiguous United States receives a total volume of about 4 cubic miles of precipitation each day.

Each day, 280 cubic miles of water evaporate or transpire into the atmosphere.

If all of the world's water was poured on the United States, it would cover the land to a depth of 90 miles.

Of the freshwater on Earth, much more is stored in the ground than is available in lakes and rivers. More than 2,000,000 cubic miles of fresh water is stored in the Earth, most within one-half mile of the surface. Contrast that with the 60,000 cubic miles of water stored as fresh water in lakes, inland seas, and rivers. But, if you really want to find fresh water, the most is stored in the 7,000,000 cubic miles of water found in glaciers and icecaps, mainly in the polar regions and in Greenland."

Information on this page is from "The Hydrologic Cycle (Pamphlet), U.S. Geological Survey, 1984"

accordingly, the square footage of the earth is: 57,268,900 square miles land and 139,668,500 square miles water. this gives approx. 197 million square miles. Easily covered by 326 million cubic miles.

Okay, I am seriously going to bed now. My head hurts :1orglaugh

oh thanks.. i forgot the big one doh! the land clearing for farming and subsequent erosion.. not to mention the farming irrigation washing the salt out.. the biggest human contribution to salinity by a factor of many many times.. im very sure a lot of the salination has been human induced and therefore not a constant linear increase.. and hey if everyone died tomorrow from a disease and vegetation started claiming back land after a few thousand years if martians landed they'd look at the falling salt levels and go "hmmm i wonder if we can calculate off this?" most everything is in flux.. big, almost incomprehensible (but slowly dying) negative feedback loops that keep things balanced..

yeah and how does the underground water get above ground? and close the door so it doesn't flow back? lol :)

Revolution vs Cremation

Okay, dammit, I am not going to do any math right now. There are a number of equations that are used for population growth.
dN = rN
dt

or

A=4 e 0.019(25)= 4 e0.475 = 6.43 (approx.)

But no matter how you stack it up, the math does not show humans existing millions or even hundreds of thousands of years ago. Start off with two and exponentially increase and you reach 6 billion really damn quick. Of course this does not account plagues, infertility, etc., etc., but it is a long way from millions of years.

Damnit, can I get some sleep now:sleep

Dr. Morris gives good theories in the book "The Genesis Flood". These eruptions of underground water had to be quite catastrophic and can also explain tectonic shifts and mountain formations. The heat and pressure brought about by a vapor canopy surrounding the earth (which gave the perfect environment for large plant eating dinosaurs) could cause massive disruptions with any fluids trapped under the earths crust. Between the canopy collapsing and the fluids under the earth erupting, theoretically there was plenty of water to cover the Earth. As far as it flowing back into the earth, much of it did. Much of it was also frozen at the polar caps by the sudden drastic change in temperature due to the lack of the vapor canopy.

Excuse me if I do not respond to this right now. I have to get some sleep. Thoroughly enjoyed your posts, man. I will respond tomorrow.

I am going to sleep. I swear it. :sleep

One last thing though (again:Graucho )

I am in complete agreement with your statement that everything is in flux. I laugh my ass off at the "scientific" statements that the earth has a hole in the ozone which is causing a "greenhouse" effect. Hell, I remember in the early 80's when they were warning us about a new "ice age". Humanity has only been taking measurements of any precision for a very limited time. It is hard to tell what earth was doing before we were measuring. And who is to say that there is even a pattern?

With that, I bid you adou. sleep time.

come here you fucking Mr. Sandman. I am going to make you my bitch. :1orglaugh

http://www.pbs.org/kcet/shapeoflife/

shit!!! we are all part sponge!!?!?!?

I read somewhere that if all the polar ice caps melted that it would be possible for most, maybe all, of the earth to be covered.

If evolution is the case, then why has no one ever seen a new species appear?

We ( big collective) are finding new species all the time...rain forests and Ocean depths for the most part.

If they are just appearing I don't know....though I doubt it....we ( collective again) are finding them.

Yes but they are not recently evolved species, they are just creatures that live in such remote and/or unaccessable places that we were unable to study and find untill now.

Does anyone here have any thoughts/facts/theories as to whether it would be possible to determine just how long a species has been around...if say...we found a new type of animal either in the rain forests or at some of the deeper depths of the oceans?

You'd probably have to find the remains of a bunch of the members of this species and start carbon dating...

didn't they find some three legged frogs in minnesota a fews years ago???

three legged frogs?


I caught a 2 tailed fish at the power plant outside of town... It fought pretty fuckin hard with 2 tails...

http://www.artbell.com/images/funnyfish.jpg

Id like to believe we have progressed from some lower level of the chain, Id like to.

Evolution.


anything else is a pipe dream.

Blinky !!!!

[IMG]http://***********/pics/blinky.jpg[/IMG]

Haha! Are you totally unaware of the time scales involved?

And how would you know whether it had just appeared vs. just having been discovered.

DUH!!!