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pornmonger 11-06-2005 04:30 PM

I am not a strong christian or religious but based upon the theory of evolution, the monkeys today will turn into humans in several million years.. Several million years from now, humans will turn into another species. Maybe human will be able to fly.

dig420 11-06-2005 04:33 PM

NO they WON'T!! sheeeesh.. just stop voting ok?

mutations are random, only 1 out of several million actually make an organism more fit to survive. The notion that a given species are going to develop sound enough mutations to become adaptations into a photocopy of a currently existing species is ridiculous.

I liked it better when educated people ie liberals ruled this country.

TheMaster 11-06-2005 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walrus
The Master,

Take a look at this really interesting article about Charles Darwin's great great grandson. I read that in the paper a few weeks ago, and was reminded about it from your post.

Can you imagine being Charles Darwin's great great grandson and sitting through those anti-evolution lectures?

- Walrus

thanks Walrus, start reading it now

TheMaster 11-06-2005 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan
Don't forget, our galaxy is really nothing different than a marble some alien kid keeps playing with.. MiB ;).

often wondered about that, now that's something I can believe in :thumbsup

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan
Science is a tricky thing, and things are always hard to beleive if they are not provable. And evolution can NOT be proven. Thats a fact, the reason for this simply is that it TAKES too long. I mean, please, we had evolution theories for about 150 years now, it takes a few million years for the human to fully evolve.. its simply impossible to prove this over a such short time period.

There are hints that natural selection is the only logical answer to all these things, but there also are a few gaps in the theory and a few unexplained things. I can understand that many people can not imagine that at some point, due to certain molecules simply existing and forming itself, single celled organisms started to appear which then mutated and eventually we popped up :) People simply also have to admit that it is kinda weird that chimps and humans have 99.4% _EXACT_ matching DNA sequences. Coincidence? Not really.. but OBVIOUSLY a chimp will not suddenly get a mutated baby that looks just like a damn human... mutations happen in tiny amounts, a few ten or maybe hundred changes in DNA sequences which control the actual general species.

BTW, medicin also makes witnessing evolution hard, because we simply fix the mutations that happen or do not let natural selection take its cause.

good, intelligent answer

what bothers me about this intelligent design or creationism, is that they don't have to give 1 shred of evidence, but they still call the truth

last week, there was this little report about intelligent design, and you had a US biology teacher explaining to his pupils, that "animals have those, not because of camouflage, but because got made them that way, so humans can enjoy the pretty colors"

OR

"lions don't have claws for hunting, they got them, while still in Eden, to be able to climb trees"

I mean jesus christ, that's a science teacher say this to 5 year olds :Oh crap

wyldblyss 11-06-2005 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornmonger
If you believe in evolution, you believe that spiders will evolve into cats, cats will evolve into horses, and monkeys will evolve into humans.

Evolution does exist only in species to better survive change not change into a different species. With the chopping of the Amazon, many chimps are being forced out of their habitat. If evolution was truly what it is, those chimps would evolve into humans to survive their habitat being destroyed. But..THEY DON'T!!!

You obviously did not pay attention in science class. Nothing evolves in a matter of weeks, months or years. Your post just goes to show how lacking the educational system is.

amalekite 11-06-2005 05:35 PM

There is still absolutely NO PROOF of macro-evolution... Man from APe etc

WHere's the missing link?... Find that and then the theory turns into fact... Right now it's just two sides fighting each other over dogma.. not science

Drake 11-06-2005 05:38 PM

Religion has no place in science but unfortunately it's being pushed:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051104/...NlYwN5bmNhdA--

Quote:

Intelligent design, or ID, proponents have also been active in pressing for the changes in Kansas, but school board members there stopped short of including intelligent design ideas in the state standards.

"ID is making enormous progress," said John Calvert, a Kansas City lawyer and ID proponent. "Is it going to happen overnight? No. Is it going to happen? Yes."
This is a shame, however, questioning the validity of some of the tenets of evolutionary theory, should be encouraged more. This doesn't mean that evolution should or needs to be replaced with a non-scientific belief such as ID or God.

It really does make one wonder why is it that America is still so deeply religious while the rest of the Western world isn't (anybody have theories as to why?). Evolution is taught here just the same as elsewhere.

TheMaster 11-06-2005 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike33
Religion has no place in science but unfortunately it's being pushed:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051104/...NlYwN5bmNhdA--



This is a shame, however, questioning the validity of some of the tenets of evolutionary theory, should be encouraged more. This doesn't mean that evolution should or needs to be replaced with a non-scientific belief such as ID or God.

It really does make one wonder why is it that America is still so deeply religious while the rest of the Western world isn't (anybody have theories as to why?). Evolution is taught here just the same as elsewhere.

good question, in a way it defies all logics

most of the Western world has been trying to get away from the influence of religion in public life, religion held europe in a stranglehold for over 1200 year

or maybe it's because some americans, this idiot on this board, who think people fled to America 200 years ago to escape the communists
Marx hadn't even written his book :1orglaugh
also Marx never wrote about communism, he wrote about capitalism and what would happen if it didn't change, you know it did happen and it will happen again, it we keep promoting this wild west capitalism

lchaim 11-06-2005 06:11 PM

WOW!


That's depressing to see such high numbers on PURE creationism, I'm more of a fan of a more widely open minded possibility in the middle.


I'm in shock from seeing that poll.


:/

PixeLs 11-06-2005 06:14 PM

How about those who don't care at all; what percent do they take?

amalekite 11-06-2005 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike33
Religion has no place in science but unfortunately it's being pushed:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051104/...NlYwN5bmNhdA--

It really does make one wonder why is it that America is still so deeply religious while the rest of the Western world isn't (anybody have theories as to why?). Evolution is taught here just the same as elsewhere.

The answer is socialism

In socialist countries... government takes care of people. Government is viewed similiar to GOD.. IT can fix all problems. Read Hobbes "Leviathan"

In the US.. there is still limited socialism.. So individuals call on higher power to get them through difficult times. Read Thomas Paine's "Common Sense"

US christian population is decreasing.. partially due to increased government spending. People don't need GOD.. they got welfare checks

Darwinism is not only a scientific theory... social darwinism is also a philosophy. If life can be viewed as a evolving... then certain species can be more evolved and some forms of life can be viewed as lesser

Hitler made use of Darwin to promote his idea of a super race. Darwin was very popular with the Nazi's.

tranza 11-06-2005 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Waters

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh

AmateurFlix 11-06-2005 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane
Bush doesnt believe in evolution, but he's afraid of mutated birdflu and pandemic. Thats quite ironic isnt it? :1orglaugh

one can only hope there's a camera near him if/when this subject is ever brought up to him :1orglaugh

pornmonger 11-06-2005 07:28 PM

That's why you should open your eyes and not have "selective" reading and read my previous post

"I am not a strong christian or religious but based upon the theory of evolution, the monkeys today will turn into humans in several million years.. Several million years from now, humans will turn into another species. Maybe human will be able to fly."

Quote:

Originally Posted by wyldblyss
You obviously did not pay attention in science class. Nothing evolves in a matter of weeks, months or years. Your post just goes to show how lacking the educational system is.


Joe Citizen 11-06-2005 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornmonger
I am not a strong christian or religious but based upon the theory of evolution, the monkeys today will turn into humans in several million years.. Several million years from now, humans will turn into another species. Maybe human will be able to fly.

You have an extremely flawed understanding of evolution.

Before you open your mouth about something its a good idea to to know something about it first.

dig420 11-06-2005 07:38 PM

again, no. Not even remotely possible. Monkeys do not, at some point, suddenly turn into humans, no matter how far into the future you project it.

And Darwinism, more appropriately termed 'The Theory of Natural Selection' is no more of a philosophy than gravity. It's simply a body of knowledge that you incorporate (hopefully) into your own sphere of knowledge.

Hitler like dogs too, but that doesn't make them evil. Knowledge is neither good nor evil, it just is. If you want to blame anyone for Nazism, blame Neitzche and Ayn Rand, who are still heros among the adherents of the modern fascistic movement, the conservative wing of the Republican Party.

borys 11-06-2005 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornmonger
With the chopping of the Amazon, many chimps are being forced out of their habitat. If evolution was truly what it is, those chimps would evolve into humans to survive their habitat being destroyed. But..THEY DON'T!!!

There are no chimps in the Amazon forest in the first place. :helpme

reed_4 11-06-2005 07:48 PM

Evolution is not yet 100% proven dude and I would not accept that stupid theory that we came from a monkey. Where is the missing link they are talking about? are they tired of finding it? Science is being populated by people who are insisting stupid theories that they can't be proven. :disgust

bringer 11-06-2005 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420
again, no. Not even remotely possible. Monkeys do not, at some point, suddenly turn into humans, no matter how far into the future you project it.

And Darwinism, more appropriately termed 'The Theory of Natural Selection' is no more of a philosophy than gravity. It's simply a body of knowledge that you incorporate (hopefully) into your own sphere of knowledge.

:thumbsup

Quote:

Hitler like dogs too, but that doesn't make them evil. Knowledge is neither good nor evil, it just is. If you want to blame anyone for Nazism, blame Neitzche and Ayn Rand, who are still heros among the adherents of the modern fascistic movement, the conservative wing of the Republican Party.
:laughing- :Buck:

pornmonger 11-06-2005 08:00 PM

Reason why so many in Czech are atheist because during the communist reign religion was prohibited.

But as you see living in Prague, there are many Christian churches and themes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMaster
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in965223.shtml

only 15% of Americans seem to believe in evolution, so my question as a European: What is wrong with the majority of your country men?

Most Americans that travel to Europe seem to be okay, I can't believe that the rest of the country has turned their backs to the last 200 years of scientific research. I mean are you guys really our religieus fundamentalist cousins?

In my home country, Belgium, 5% of the people go to search and everyone is asking themselves, who are those 5% :1orglaugh
I now live in Prague, Czech Republic, where 90% is flat out atheist or agnost, so this all seems to be so fundamentalist like say Saudi-Arabian / Iranian / Taliban.

Will the USA be renamed to US of AJ (United States of America for Jesus) soon?

or just Jesusland?

Sorry, but was very shocked by this


pornmonger 11-06-2005 08:01 PM

I don't believe we came from Adam & Eve. I do believe a higher being created us. Maybe some of you have Primates for cousins but I don't.

pornmonger 11-06-2005 08:05 PM

And yes you know everything about evolution. I guess you living in Australia and being Aboriginal and all that you are closing related to primates.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Citizen
You have an extremely flawed understanding of evolution.

Before you open your mouth about something its a good idea to to know something about it first.


dig420 11-06-2005 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reed_4
Evolution is not yet 100% proven dude and I would not accept that stupid theory that we came from a monkey. Where is the missing link they are talking about? are they tired of finding it? Science is being populated by people who are insisting stupid theories that they can't be proven. :disgust

There is no missing link. Google Australopithecus, then learn some basic homo sapiens history before you try to pretend your opinion has some value in this thread. The 'missing link' merely refers to an ancient ancestor we theorize exists because of some gaps in the known evolution of our skeletal features. And actually I think they already found the species they theorized must have existed, so if there was ever a missing link he's not missing anymore.

pornmonger I don't care if you believe humans can live off of sunlight and pretty songs, that doesn't make it so. Evolution, as a theory, is about as 'theoretical' as electricity. You can't see that either, but I guarantee you it exists. Google 'fossil record' while you're at it, I'll make it easy for you.

dig420 11-06-2005 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornmonger
And yes you know everything about evolution. I guess you living in Australia and being Aboriginal and all that you are closing related to primates.

google 'coccyx' and 'appendix'. Just for fun. But especially 'coccyx' :1orglaugh

High Quality 11-06-2005 08:37 PM

Evolution is hardly fact, but it does seem the most plausable explanation as of now.

TheMaster 11-06-2005 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420
Hitler like dogs too, but that doesn't make them evil. Knowledge is neither good nor evil, it just is.

agree,

another of those ways of thinking: "Hitler was a vegetarian, so vegetarians commit genocides" :winkwink:

TheMaster 11-06-2005 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by borys
There are no chimps in the Amazon forest in the first place. :helpme

sweat :thumbsup see knowledge is power, unless you're Bush, than you just keep lying, until people incorporate it in their beliefs

nice example: "Saddam has something to do with 9/11" (all the world KNOWS he didn't, even US intelligence services say he didn't)
but Bush keeps repeating the lie, so many americans BELIEF Saddam was involved

TheMaster 11-06-2005 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornmonger
Reason why so many in Czech are atheist because during the communist reign religion was prohibited.

But as you see living in Prague, there are many Christian churches and themes.

that's not all the whole truth, because in other eastern european countries you see them go back to religion much, because of poverty & bad educational systems

Czech are highly educated people, with strong humanistic beliefs, that's why they will not lickely be enticed by religion, even the US poll proves it, highest percentage of people who don't believe in creatism, have had higher learning

the churches predate communism & that doesn't change the fact that they are empty

TheMaster 11-06-2005 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornmonger
And yes you know everything about evolution. I guess you living in Australia and being Aboriginal and all that you are closing related to primates.

WOW, yep, that's the thinking, we've come to expect from these religieus ones: racist, white supremacist fucker

I mean, that's just being a dick, that's like those assholes who say black people are monkeys

broke 11-06-2005 09:05 PM

Seriously -- the average American spends more time figuring how they'll acquire 1000 square feet for each person in their household and a new shiny car than they will ever spend in scientific inquiry.

phypon 11-06-2005 09:09 PM

We either came from rocks (think about it) or a creator...it's up to you as to what makes sense

dig420 11-06-2005 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broke
Seriously -- the average American spends more time figuring how they'll acquire 1000 square feet for each person in their household and a new shiny car than they will ever spend in scientific inquiry.

that's why we have Universities, aka 'liberal camps'. To educate us.

of course, the right wingers are highly suspicious of education, since educated people tend to turn into liberals at an alarming rate, hence we have a lot of conservatives who think that the 'theory' of natural selection is just something some liberal thought up during the Carter administration.

bringer 11-06-2005 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420
that's why we have Universities, aka 'liberal camps'. To educate us.

of course, the right wingers are highly suspicious of education, since educated people tend to turn into liberals at an alarming rate, hence we have a lot of conservatives who think that the 'theory' of natural selection is just something some liberal thought up during the Carter administration.

its sad how ignorant you really are. its 8:21pm PST... shouldn't you be drawing swastikas on bibles and burning them in front of school children?

TheMaster 11-06-2005 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420
that's why we have Universities, aka 'liberal camps'. To educate us.

of course, the right wingers are highly suspicious of education, since educated people tend to turn into liberals at an alarming rate, hence we have a lot of conservatives who think that the 'theory' of natural selection is just something some liberal thought up during the Carter administration.

conservatives are fighting back, with their 'universities', where you can learn to be a lawyer, so you can get the 10 commandments incorporated into the constitution

AmateurFlix 11-06-2005 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420
If you want to blame anyone for Nazism, blame Neitzche and Ayn Rand

Huh?

Ayn Rand published all of her works long after the Nazi party was formed. They have absolutely nothing to do with nazism at all.

Likewise, Nietzsche passed away three decades before the nazis came about. His philosophy was admired by some of them, but its inception can't be attributed to him.

TheMaster 11-07-2005 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by High Quality
Evolution is hardly fact, but it does seem the most plausable explanation as of now.

:thumbsup right answer

MacDaddyPlaya 11-07-2005 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMaster
I can't believe that the rest of the country has turned their backs to the last 200 years of scientific research. I mean are you guys really our religieus fundamentalist cousins?

That is the scary, unfortunate truth of what is happening here in the U.S. A country founded by many men of science, knowledge and exploration such as Jefferson and Franklin is turning way too far to the religous right. Science is loosing more and more ground every day. Just look at the latest ridiculous bullshit they are trying...Intelligent Design. Just another ploy to try and get relgion in the classroom and science out.

Drake 11-07-2005 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phypon
We either came from rocks (think about it) or a creator...it's up to you as to what makes sense

Or a 3rd theory which could argue that we've essentially been as we are today with slight variations due to the ebb and flow of micro evolution, natural selection. habitat, and diet. It's just as plausible to me as saying that life began with a big bang, or that some omnipresent supernatural force created us. I could probably incorporate ID into this third theory as well as use all Evolutionary evidence to support it.

Maxy 11-07-2005 10:42 AM

So the red states finally bought themselves some computers...

TheMaster 11-07-2005 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacDaddyPlaya
That is the scary, unfortunate truth of what is happening here in the U.S. A country founded by many men of science, knowledge and exploration such as Jefferson and Franklin is turning way too far to the religous right. Science is loosing more and more ground every day. Just look at the latest ridiculous bullshit they are trying...Intelligent Design. Just another ploy to try and get relgion in the classroom and science out.

amazing that we are having this conversation in this day and age

I mean, the catholic church, which has been powerfull in Belgium, wouldn't even dare to bring god in the science classes anymore

thank you also for that first remark, I mean the only Founding Father, who wanted a national religion and to write god into the constitution was Sam Adams, the others were dead set against it


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