50.........

It's not the actual fact of burning it that would bother me.. it's burning it in a dramatic and inflammatory way that would bother me (like when a bunch of (I think) Iranians burned the US flag in NY a few weeks ago (I could be wrong on location and nationality of the perpetrators, forgive me) - it really didn't sit well with people. It was viewed as a massive sign of disrespect and quite rightly so).

Staged burnings on the street are bad for the morale of the country and THAT is why I disagree with it. ANY form of hate-mongering I disagree with.

My post was really to try to find out what people's thoughts were, NOT to attack people! Not being American, I'm not really up-to-date on the wheres and whyfores of the laws there/constitution etc.. so I ask and hopefully don't get flamed!

Grow some balls? I can't, sorry.. I'm of the female persuasion - but thanks for sharing your thoughts in a non-confrontational manner :winkwink:

Hate mongering? Hate mongering is taking action against groups of people solely because of their race, national origin, sexual orientation, etc. Protesting one's government is the most sacred thing freedom can offer. What else not good for the "morale of the country" would you like stamped into the US Constitution? I vote for rap music :winkwink:

Some people think that others that get on the internet and espouse ideas not consistent with the current administration is bad for the morale of the country. When they get to that one, it should be called Amendment 86, regardless of what number they are up to :upsidedow

Ironically, the best way to ensure that people will burn the flag is to make it illegal to do so.

If they make it illegal to burn the flag, I'd bet that the number of flag burnings will actually increase.

LOL - I'm not for suppression, oppression or anything like that. What I said had context based on the incident I described within that post.

Isn't it hate-mongering to burn the US flag as an immigrant?

I'm British and I moved to Canada several years ago, if I then burned the Canadian flag in the streets with a bunch of fellow Brits saying it's cos of how poorly the Canadians have treated my countrymen/women/etc, then wouldn't that be classified as hate-mongering? (I use this purely as an example, I realise there would be no basis for this event to occur in reality)

I understand wanting to protest the government if you don't like it, that's one of the basics of freedom of course - and I suppose burning the flag is ONE way you can do that - it just seems so useless, I mean, does burning the flag really make any difference other than pissing some people off and showing people that you know how to make a statement in a violent/aggressive way? Sure, it gets the publicity I guess, and publicity is what you want when fighting a cause, but doesn't it show more class to protest without violence?

Where's Gandhi when you need him! :winkwink:

(PS - All I was trying to do was understand where people were coming from cos flag burning just seems wrong to me :2 cents:)

The Boy Scouts burn flags -- it's the only way to respectfully retire them. So when a protestor gets arrested for it, it's not the BURNING that they're being arrested for. it's the thoughts in their minds at the time. In America, we shouldn't arrest people for their thoughts.

http://www.esquilax.com/flag/index2.html

Good link brisk, lots of good info there it seems.. I'm just on the 'history of flag burning' right now and see that to amend that law would be against constitutional rights, however earlier in this thread didn't someone say that the amendment had been passed?

Now I'm even more confused about the US legal system :helpme

Thanks for the link though, I'll check more of that out later on tonight. :thumbsup

The amendment passed the Congress today. It now goes to the senate and from monitoring a number of sources it looks to stand a good possibility of passing there.

I had to leave sudddenly earlier and somehow missed your post.
If/when our paths ever cross I offer you the biggest icyest cold beer we can find, you hit the nail I was pointing at right on the head :thumbsup

"Dude, where's my country?" :Oh crap

That sounds a while lot like political EXPRESSION. And that's what they are trying to ban.

Somemone said "I may not believe in what you say, but I defend your right to say it" Seems nowadays people think "You can say what you want, as long as it doesn't piss me off. Otherwise you should shut the fuck up"

Do you support the beleifs of the KKK? In you say no would you be for banning them from being able to protest or have a parade? I mean you can much for hateful than the KKK.

The 1st Admendment is not about protect sppech we all like or speech everyone agrees on. Why in the fuck would those need protecting in the first place? Just remember many people think OUR line of work isn't free speech either. So be careful who you align yourselves with.

One more thing you can't burn the Chinese flag in China. If you heard that protesters in China were arrested and sent to prison for burning the Chinese flag would you be in support of Communistic government or the flag burners? Because you can't have it both ways.

if it does pass, hopefully the supreme court will quickly strike it down.

i just don't understand trying to legislate things like this. the freedom that the flag represents, for better or worse, is the freedom to burn it. i don't agree with flag burning, i think it is a silly inflamitory thing that people who have weak issues use to get attention, but there should be nothing illegal about using that to express your opinion.

well said.

Historically no one has ever lived and does not live in a democracy...and this includes the USA. The USA is a Democratic Republic and has been since its inception. It would seem to me that someone such as yourself...Richy boy...that claims to have a Masters in History would be aware of this...eh?

To the best of my knowledge the Supreme Court cannot stike down a constitutional ammendment. They can stike down parts of...or all of...a law that is passed by congress if they interpret the law as being in violation of the constitution...but a constitutional ammemdment is not a law...it becomes a part of the constitution...thus the Court has to abide by the constitution.

I do not personally care if it becomes an ammendment or not...but I do no that no one will ever burn the flag/desecrate as "political expression" in my presence without rendering me to disabled to prevent the burning/descration.

I will suggest to you that the majority of Americans feel as I do.

Free speech includes the right to be disrespectful.

Including the right to be disrespectful to those that one finds to be disrespectful.

Yes but some here have advocated BEATING or MURDERING flag burners. I certainly hope you do not think they have THAT right.

okay honestly i am an american, and i can burn a flag because it is my right to burn a flag, even this countrys flag, now there are times like when bush decided to go to war with iraq that i felt like burning this flag because this country has turned into a pile of shit so to take our right away to disagree with how things are going fuck that, i believe in a foundation this country was formed on and now its nothing but a lie, so i hope this law doesnt pass, its a bunch of shit

I give myself the right to do anything I choose to do...and I do not care if it is deemed by someone else to be illegal...or immoral...and I am willing to pay whatever the consequences this society or any other society decides is appropriate for my actions.

I am a free person with the right to do as I choose...which includes beating or killing another human being...I have done both...and my conscience does not bother me in the least.

I have stated multiple times that no one will burn the flag as "polictical dessent" in my presence without first rendering me unable to stop it.

amen :) preach on

I agree that it would never hold up in court.

The courts cannot challenge a constitutional ammendent...it is not within their power to do so.

So you would throw your life away in prison by killing a flag burner? Do you value your freedom and life so little? I'm sure you wife and kids and friends and family will understand that.

I know thing or two about hate. I hate more people right NOW than you will in your whole life if you live to be 150 years old, yet I can't think of anyone I hate enough to go to jail for LIFE over.

Mmmm.. it's just too sad that anyone is wasting their time on the flag crap. There are far more relevant things to sort than bothering about a bit of cloth.

I was born under the flag...I have spent a lifetime enjoying the privileges that the flag represents...I served under that flag for 12 years of my life. I engaged in combat operations under the flag multiple times...and have payed a heavy price for doing so. I was willing to kill or die under the flag and I still am...so if I had to go to prison for defending the flag...it would be far less than I have already done and sacrificed for the flag.

FYI...I do not have a wife and will never have another wife. I do not have children and will never have children. I have friends but they respect my thinking...even if not all agree to my thinking...but guess what most do...which is not a surprise. I do not have any family other than those that I call my two brothers and my two sisters.

So if I burned a flag in front of you you are willing to kill me and deny my son a father just so you can feel like a man? You are sad and I wish you had as much reverance for the Constitution and the freedom the flag symboilizes as much aas you do the flag itself. I bet if I had afacsimilie of the Delcarartion of Independance or the Constituion and I burned one of those you wouldn't even give a shit.

Answer this. If a perosn in China burned the flag of China in protest of the communist government would be in SUPPORT of him or the communist government that would most likely kill him? If you support the flag burner then you are a HYPOCRITE. If you support communists well...........so which is it? Are you a hypcorite or a communist? You CAN NOT have it both ways.

I support the right of a citizen of China to burn their flag if they so choose. I support the right of the Chinese government to punish the man if they so choose. I support the right of a Chinese citizen to beat the fuck out of or to kill someone that is disrespecting the flag of China.

I support the right of any individual anywhere to do as they choose to do...as long as they are willing to pay whatever consequences that may ensue.

A free person is someone that gives themselves the right to do as they choose...but it does not mean there will not be a reaction to their action...comprende.

You know what you are proposing is ANARCHY that what you are supporting.

No...I support the following...thank you very much.

I pledge alligence to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands.

I support anyone that burns a flag in your yard you fucking hypocritical POS. So you'll go to war to protect your fellow citizens rights to burn a flag but will kill them if they do it in front of you? You are a fucking moron of the highest degree.

Un fucking believable. If I weren't so busy I'd fly down just to burn a flag in your driveway you crippled jerkoff.

I did not spend 12 years in the military to protect anyones right to burn/desecrate the flag...or to abuse the rights...that the flag which represents our Republic has provided to its citizens...thank you very much. You are now dismissed.

Your republic is not democratic. It would seem to me that an old drunk fool who lives in his mothers basement and fakes his own death for attention on a message board such as yourself would be a.... hmm, never mind.

Oh, I understand your drivel perfectly clear. You helped protect the rights of US citizens unless they do something you don't like. Then you'll gladly violate their rights yourself. :321GFY

Mmmm.. bullshit, pointlessness, patriotism and some taught belief in a nation are alive and well?? :-)

Do you support the right for them to kill anyone for anything that offends them, or just flag burning?

So, do you support the right for people to kill others for any other things that insult them... or just flag burning? :disgust

BTW, it's allegiance you so blindly pledge to.

I've been having this debate with an active duty person. What you are saying is, "I wore a uniform to give you free speech, now you will use it in the manner I specify". Hipocritical rubbish.

What about a picture of the flag? Will you kill someone if they burn that? Or is it just flags on material that you will kill for?

LOL :1orglaugh But to be accurate the caption should say, "Lemme know if a neighbor burns a flag in their yard". As it's stated there she would have a legitimate gripe if someone burned her property. :upsidedow

Actually this is the oath you took if you actually served.

"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

Technically, a flag on a postage stamp that has been postmarked is a desecrated flag. :2 cents:

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Benjamin Franklin

Always liked that quote :thumbsup

Ok now if I fuck and get sex juice all over my American flag bedsheets am I desecrating the flag? How about if I unintentially leave poop stains in my American flag underwear? If a set a drink on my American flag coasters and they get wet am I desecrating the flag? If I eat one of these am I desecrating the flag?

http://www.littledebbie.com/Images/p...tarbrownie.gif

scarey, so the king would kill or seriously hurt someone or at least untill they first render him unable to stop it, if they burnt a stamp?

Having flag sheets or underwear is flag desecration in the first place :1orglaugh

Reminds me of people who blindly support "The Patriot Act"...

What if some guy licks a stamp?

Will theking lick his ass?

:1orglaugh

Then you support this guy:

http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/cr...ighmugcrop.GIF