Why Do Revshare Sponsors Upsell to other paysites? - GoFuckYourself.com

Alex · 06-10-2005, 03:44 PM

Some sponsors that i push retain for 4+ mos.
Others barely get passed the trial signup.

I checked up some of the members' areas and they have the content and seem to update regurlary, but the upsells are everywhere.

How can you run a revshare program and then send the members your affiliates bring elsewhere.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 03:45 PM

because some customers will have memberships to multiple sites

JD · 06-10-2005, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

because some customers will have memberships to multiple sites

what he said. and it makes the owners money.

Mack · 06-10-2005, 03:47 PM

This is a great question Alex. We have always done our best to have little to Zero upsells in our members area's. We provide more than the user expect's and our webmaster and our company reap the benefits without the leaks.

Alex · 06-10-2005, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

because some customers will have memberships to multiple sites

Why risk it?

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 03:49 PM

great question i have a thing with not only upsells but crossells in revhshare as well. i went crazy in one thread if interested i can post it or tell ya

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Why risk it?

why risk making more money? I dunno, sounds like a good risk to me...

example: you have a teen site, why not upsell your members to a mature site or a facial site? Now, they have a membership to your site and another to a site with another niche that interests them....

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mack

This is a great question Alex. We have always done our best to have little to Zero upsells in our members area's. We provide more than the user expect's and our webmaster and our company reap the benefits without the leaks.

That is very good of u. I wish others would follow. Let me ask do you have crossells ?

Alex · 06-10-2005, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

why risk making more money? I dunno, sounds like a good risk to me...

example: you have a teen site, why not upsell your members to a mature site or a facial site? Now, they have a membership to your site and another to a site with another niche that interests them....

That is assuming that most sufers will have memberships to more than one site.

Alex · 06-10-2005, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

That is assuming that most sufers will have memberships to more than one site.

Also, its fucking over the webmaster.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Also, its fucking over the webmaster.

how is it fucking over the webmaster? Are you saying a site owner isn't allowed to make money from their own site?

most sponsors are paying 60% without deductions and no exits plus freehosted galleries, free content for affiliates, and now you're going to bitch about them making money? yeah, profit sucks I guess

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

That is assuming that most sufers will have memberships to more than one site.

why would you assume otherwise?

Mack · 06-10-2005, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanderweb

That is very good of u. I wish others would follow. Let me ask do you have crossells ?

No crossells no exit pops.

tranza · 06-10-2005, 03:55 PM

Do they all have upsells?

Alex · 06-10-2005, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

how is it fucking over the webmaster? Are you saying a site owner isn't allowed to make money from their own site?

most sponsors are paying 60% without deductions and no exits plus freehosted galleries, free content for affiliates, and now you're going to bitch about them making money? yeah, profit sucks I guess

If they cant profit going 50-50 with the webmaster on the membership cost itself, and if they cant retain long enough to make profit then i guess they shoudlnt be in the paysite biz. The whole point of the revhare system is that i get 50% of what the surfer that i sent spends. Are they paying me 50% of the upsells???

Tell me, would you send traffic to a sponsor's tour that didnt have your link code and didnt credit you for sales.

nudecanada · 06-10-2005, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mack

No crossells no exit pops, no upsells.

And I bet you still make money.

Maybe give sykboy some pointers.

06-10-2005, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

If they cant profit going 50-50 with the webmaster on the membership cost itself, and if they cant retain long enough to make profit then i guess they shoudlnt be in the paysite biz. The whole point of the revhare system is that i get 50% of what the surfer that i sent spends. Are they paying me 50% of the upsells???

Deduct the cost of hosting for the affiliate's hosted galleries, the processing fee, the content cost, legal representation, staff overhead, and the bandwidth used in the members area...Oh... and the price of a program like Pennywize to stop people from trading the PW's... After all that money is factored in, I'd say that the cost per sale in the owner's pocket is much less than you assume.

I have no problem with paysites offering upsells. Afterall, I got paid for the membership to their site already... What they offer inside of that site is their business.

I'm so tired of hearing affiliates bitching about program owners. If life is so bad, why not start your own sites?

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

If they cant profit going 50-50 with the webmaster on the membership cost itself, and if they cant retain long enough to make profit then i guess they shoudlnt be in the paysite biz. The whole point of the revhare system is that i get 50% of what the surfer that i sent spends. Are they paying me 50% of the upsells???

Tell me, would you send traffic to a sponsor's tour that didnt have your link code and didnt credit you for sales.

no, you get 50% of sales to their membership site(s). I can't think of any sponsors where you get 50% of everything they sale.

would I send to their tour with no code? of course, not that's what they pay me for...sales from their tour, not sales from the member's areas.

Think of it with you as a paysite owner. Why wouldn't you maximize your income? Don't you do what you can with your regular sites to maximize your income?

As for retention, surfers simply don't retain as much as they used to (this includes exclusive sites). They are more fickle, so why not offer them an alternative that'll make you more money than just losing them,?

Sexy Rex · 06-10-2005, 04:09 PM

We do crossells and upsells, affiliates only get paid on upsells to our other sites. This reprents over 20% of our total income if you add the money done upselling and the sales people you're upselling to are sendign you back in exchange. There is no way we could afford to pay 60% to our affiliates if we were not able to make that extra money.
Now we could pay 40% or 45% instead of 60% and refuse any members traffic trades, but who would signup to a cash program paying 40% when others pretend they pay 80% or more (and shave).
Thing is because of competition any cash program pays its affiliates as much as possible, trying to make its margin on volume. Not paying webmasters on crossells is just a way to pay more without shaving.
As for retention, we are the only cash program that publishes its numbers: http://www.totemcash.com/free/figures.php

My 2cc.

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shermsshack

Deduct the cost of hosting for the affiliate's hosted galleries, the processing fee, the content cost, legal representation, staff overhead, and the bandwidth used in the members area...Oh... and the price of a program like Pennywize to stop people from trading the PW's... After all that money is factored in, I'd say that the cost per sale in the owner's pocket is much less than you assume.

I have no problem with paysites offering upsells. Afterall, I got paid for the membership to their site already... What they offer inside of that site is their business.

I'm so tired of hearing affiliates bitching about program owners. If life is so bad, why not start your own sites?

Dont give me that shit. Next you are going to justify sponsors shaving, becuase they cant afford to pay $50 pps on a trial if they give away prizes for every three sales sent and have 8000 FHGs.

First of all hosting and bandwidth is dirt cheap now.

And you are too stupid to reallize taht you are promoting sponsors via pps. So you dont care what happens next, but it's different when it is revshare.

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mack

No crossells no exit pops.

Can you hit me up icq I think i may need to add another sponsor

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nudecanada

And I bet you still make money.

Maybe give sykboy some pointers.

I've forgotten more about this business than you'll ever know

I wouldn't doubt he makes money, but he'd be making more with upsells...toy stores, dvd stores, AEBN feeds, etc.

but, each person/company should run their business how they see fit

jayeff · 06-10-2005, 04:11 PM

Bear in mind too that the recurring-percentage model offers a wonderful opportunity to scam webmasters who assume that the site operator too is dependent on recurring income. In fact there is nothing to prevent the sponsor running a site much as if it were a PPS site (with upsells etc), but paying out much less to affiliates...

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

no, you get 50% of sales to their membership site(s). I can't think of any sponsors where you get 50% of everything they sale.

would I send to their tour with no code? of course, not that's what they pay me for...sales from their tour, not sales from the member's areas.

Think of it with you as a paysite owner. Why wouldn't you maximize your income? Don't you do what you can with your regular sites to maximize your income?

As for retention, surfers simply don't retain as much as they used to (this includes exclusive sites). They are more fickle, so why not offer them an alternative that'll make you more money than just losing them,?

No. The point of revshare is not to make money of SALES from the tour. That is PPS.

Revshare is based on retention. The profit for the webmaster is in retention not from initial sales.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

First of all hosting and bandwidth is dirt cheap now.

then why do affiliates expect tons of free hosted galleries and free hosting from the sponsors?

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:13 PM

Not what I wanted to hear I am tired of all the sponsors saying that they need to do this and that. Make your own sites sell. Why do you have to sell others.

nudecanada · 06-10-2005, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

I've forgotten more about this business than you'll ever know

Which is why you are an "employee"

Something has to help pay for you to hit reload on boards all day. lol
Hence, defending upsells of your "employer". ;)

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:14 PM

Lol had to edit because of wrong quote sorry about that

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

No. The point of revshare is not to make money of SALES from the tour. That is PPS.

Revshare is based on retention. The profit for the webmaster is in retention not from initial sales.

Again, you are assuming that every member that buys from an upsell will just drop their current membership. Do you really think that because Jerkoff Joe has bought some fuzzy handcuffs and downloaded a couple videos from AEBN that they'll drop their membership to the current site?

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

then why do affiliates expect tons of free hosted galleries and free hosting from the sponsors?

YOu have to be fucking joking. Do you really expect me to give you an answer for an entire group of people. Not all affiliates need free hosting and FHGs.

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:15 PM

Totem Rex if you are around hit me up icq really quick thanks

nudecanada · 06-10-2005, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

then why do affiliates expect tons of free hosted galleries and free hosting from the sponsors?

Because you give it to them? Duh?
Why wouldn't they burn the bandwidth and content you give away instead of paying for it themselves?

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

Again, you are assuming that every member that buys from an upsell will just drop their current membership. Do you really think that because Jerkoff Joe has bought some fuzzy handcuffs and downloaded a couple videos from AEBN that they'll drop their membership to the current site?

No, but why would i want to risk it? I would rather have the surfer taht i pitched the site to and sold to stay a member there. So that i can profit more of the rebills, than have the chance of him leaving for another site and me not getting paid for it.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nudecanada

Which is why you are an "employee"

Something has to help pay for you to hit reload on boards all day. lol
Hence, defending upsells of your "employer". ;)

yeah, contractor is an employee, whatever...I get hired for who I know and what I know...

I've never had to defend anything I didn't believe in...I've ran paysites and even has a couple private sites that aren't part of any program. I will however defend any company in running their business how they see fit. They have staff, bills, etc. and have to run their businesses accordingly.

Just as you run your business how you see fit.

fedfest · 06-10-2005, 04:20 PM

Imo. revshare is a partnership between you and your affiliate.. Adding upsells, traffic leaks, crosssells or any other funny shit is simply the same as cheating your partner..

So, on revshare you should allways pay your partner 50+% of what money his traffic brings in, it's that simple !

With so much free porn, Adds and upsells really should not be in a members area.. That should be all about the content and pleasing the surfer, and naturaly surfers will be pissed if that's not the case and will not rebill..

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:20 PM

Skyboy.

Go try buying traffic/ad space from a reputable traffic dealer/Large website, and send it to popup/activex hell, and see if the the source of traffic likes it.

Which is the same situation i am in, if i am on a REVENUE SHARING PROGRAM, i expect to get 50% of all revenue the sponsor program generates from that surfer. So you see why i am mad that they would then sell that surfer something else, not pay me for it, and then collect 100% of the profits.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

YOu have to be fucking joking. Do you really expect me to give you an answer for an entire group of people. Not all affiliates need free hosting and FHGs.

Why not? I've managed affiliates. Do you want to know what % of my time was spent providing freebies or having requests for them? I agree, it sucks to be giving it all away for free, but it's a slippery slope for everyone.

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:20 PM

Yes this is the sad thing. If a site can't reccur on it's own they have to find other ways to profit. I thougt if site was good enough should be able to keep members on it's own. I guess when I really think about it every program upsells. You see cams in there or something. I think they should say reccuring + any other money we make off your member after he's ours and you don't get credit for.

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fedfest

Imo. revshare is a partnership between you and your affiliate.. Adding upsells, traffic leaks, crosssells or any other funny shit is simply the same as cheating your partner..

So, on revshare you should allways pay your partner 50+% of what money his traffic brings in, it's that simple !

With so much free porn, Adds and upsells really should not be in a members area.. That should be all about the content and pleasing the surfer, and naturaly surfers will be pissed if that's not the case and will not rebill..

Finially someone with a brain.

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

Why not? I've managed affiliates. Do you want to know what % of my time was spent providing freebies or having requests for them? I agree, it sucks to be giving it all away for free, but it's a slippery slope for everyone.

No i really dont care how much time you spent babying the affiliates cock, and then shaving or upselling the fuck out of the surfer so that you make back profit,

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:24 PM

Ok i got a few more hours making some popcorn

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Skyboy.

Go try buying traffic/ad space from a reputable traffic dealer/Large website, and send it to popup/activex hell, and see if the the source of traffic likes it.

Which is the same situation i am in, if i am on a REVENUE SHARING PROGRAM, i expect to get 50% of all revenue the sponsor program generates from that surfer. So you see why i am mad that they would then sell that surfer something else, not pay me for it, and then collect 100% of the profits.

having a few banners or recomendations to other sites in your members areas is not the same as a popup hell/active x installer.

Think of it this way as a site owner. You have a loyal customer base who lvoes you and your product and more improtantly they TRUST you. Why wouldn't you then make money from that trust my offering them other things to buy? Keep an eye on who you're upselling to and now you have reucrring income from them as a member who trusts you and the sites you recomend and recurring income from the upsell.

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

having a few banners or recomendations to other sites in your members areas is not the same as a popup hell/active x installer.

Think of it this way as a site owner. You have a loyal customer base who lvoes you and your product and more improtantly they TRUST you. Why wouldn't you then make money from that trust my offering them other things to buy? Keep an eye on who you're upselling to and now you have reucrring income from them as a member who trusts you and the sites you recomend and recurring income from the upsell.

There are VERY FEW SITES THAT HAVE A LOYAL CUSTMER BASE. Very few surffers join a site becuase of the brand name like Bangbus. Now its about the content,

They only stay and rebill because they get the content they want. Why have the leave your site to get content from somewhere else.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanderweb

Yes this is the sad thing. If a site can't reccur on it's own they have to find other ways to profit. I thougt if site was good enough should be able to keep members on it's own. I guess when I really think about it every program upsells. You see cams in there or something. I think they should say reccuring + any other money we make off your member after he's ours and you don't get credit for.

I was posting as were posting this, so I'd refer you to that post ;-)

Now, if a program promises you 50% of EVERYTHING, then, I agree it should be of everything. However, if they only offer you 50% of sales to their sites and that's what they pay on and it states clearly that's what they pay on, you can make a decision if they deserve your traffic or not.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanderweb

Ok i got a few more hours making some popcorn

Get me some too ;-)

Really, I'm not here to argue, just discuss some differing opinions....isn't that what this board is supposed to be for?

Alex · 06-10-2005, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

Get me some too ;-)

Really, I'm not here to argue, just discuss some differing opinions....isn't that what this board is supposed to be for?

Yea, but by the next page or so, someone is bound to be called an idiot and this opinion sharing thread will go down quickly

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:31 PM

Yep I removed about 10+ sponsors I felt were taking unfair advantage of my traffic. It is their biz and they can do what they want. However times are changing. Take a look at alexa stats for tgps vs blogs. Surfers and webmasters do not like to be screwed anymore. They are way to smart. I am adapting as we speak

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

I was posting as were posting this, so I'd refer you to that post ;-)

Now, if a program promises you 50% of EVERYTHING, then, I agree it should be of everything. However, if they only offer you 50% of sales to their sites and that's what they pay on and it states clearly that's what they pay on, you can make a decision if they deserve your traffic or not.

SykkBoy · 06-10-2005, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

There are VERY FEW SITES THAT HAVE A LOYAL CUSTMER BASE. Very few surffers join a site becuase of the brand name like Bangbus. Now its about the content,

They only stay and rebill because they get the content they want. Why have the leave your site to get content from somewhere else.

I agree, but there IS a contingent of loyal customers.

However, like my example above, if you have a niche site that is teen, or maybe it's a narrow niche like balloons. Your members might also be interested in pantyhose or feet. Why not offer them a quality site that will offer them those niches? If you don't sell them on it, someone else will.

xxxice · 06-10-2005, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SykkBoy2

Get me some too ;-)

Really, I'm not here to argue, just discuss some differing opinions....isn't that what this board is supposed to be for?

I agree but soon we will get angry sponsors here telling us they are tired of us complaining. Ok I want to push traffic to them LOL

06-10-2005, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

Dont give me that shit. Next you are going to justify sponsors shaving, becuase they cant afford to pay $50 pps on a trial if they give away prizes for every three sales sent and have 8000 FHGs.

First of all hosting and bandwidth is dirt cheap now.

And you are too stupid to reallize taht you are promoting sponsors via pps. So you dont care what happens next, but it's different when it is revshare.

What are you talking about? The more I read your posts, the more I realize that you are a drama queen who takes things to extremes. You assume that if anybody has a different opinion than yourself, then they are idiots/cheaters/scumbags. You're a pornographer. Open your mind and realize that diversity is what makes this industry unique.

I send traffic to Revshare based on retention. They can sell bags of dogshit in their members area for all I care, as long as they convert and retain. In the end retention is all that matters. They have a qualified surfer in their area...Why not upsell to a different niche to recoup some of their costs for maintaining an affiliate program?

Keep your childish insults to yourself. If you want something 100% customized to your needs, get off your ass and do it. Nobody wants an affiliate that bitches as much as you do anyways.

06-10-2005, 03:44 PM	#1
Alex So Fucking Banned (YEA!!) Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 10,963	Why Do Revshare Sponsors Upsell to other paysites? Some sponsors that i push retain for 4+ mos. Others barely get passed the trial signup. I checked up some of the members' areas and they have the content and seem to update regurlary, but the upsells are everywhere. How can you run a revshare program and then send the members your affiliates bring elsewhere. __________________ Care about me? Who? Me! Who?

06-10-2005, 03:55 PM	#14
tranza ICQ: 197-556-237 Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: BRASIL !!! Posts: 57,559	Do they all have upsells? __________________ I'm just a newbie.

06-10-2005, 04:09 PM	#19
Sexy Rex Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: President/CEO - iStripper.com Posts: 1,164	We do crossells and upsells, affiliates only get paid on upsells to our other sites. This reprents over 20% of our total income if you add the money done upselling and the sales people you're upselling to are sendign you back in exchange. There is no way we could afford to pay 60% to our affiliates if we were not able to make that extra money. Now we could pay 40% or 45% instead of 60% and refuse any members traffic trades, but who would signup to a cash program paying 40% when others pretend they pay 80% or more (and shave). Thing is because of competition any cash program pays its affiliates as much as possible, trying to make its margin on volume. Not paying webmasters on crossells is just a way to pay more without shaving. As for retention, we are the only cash program that publishes its numbers: http://www.totemcash.com/free/figures.php My 2cc. __________________ WWW.ISTRIPPER.COM Unique Desktop Strippers since 1998, 20+ Millions users, 3000+ Girls to choose from, All UHD Exclusive Content.

06-10-2005, 04:13 PM	#26
xxxice Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,042	Not what I wanted to hear I am tired of all the sponsors saying that they need to do this and that. Make your own sites sell. Why do you have to sell others. Last edited by xxxice; 06-10-2005 at 04:14 PM..

06-10-2005, 04:20 PM	#35
fedfest Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,334	Imo. revshare is a partnership between you and your affiliate.. Adding upsells, traffic leaks, crosssells or any other funny shit is simply the same as cheating your partner.. So, on revshare you should allways pay your partner 50+% of what money his traffic brings in, it's that simple ! With so much free porn, Adds and upsells really should not be in a members area.. That should be all about the content and pleasing the surfer, and naturaly surfers will be pissed if that's not the case and will not rebill.. __________________ RewardThem Now Paying Up To 70% Revshare ! Top Converting CCbill affiliate program that will keep your members rebilling. No Traffic Leaks, No Popups, No Bullshit.. You get Credited For EVERYTHING !

06-10-2005, 03:45 PM	#2
SykkBoy Jesus loves bacon Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Sin City, Motherfucker Posts: 19,969	because some customers will have memberships to multiple sites

06-10-2005, 03:47 PM	#4
Mack Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,017	This is a great question Alex. We have always done our best to have little to Zero upsells in our members area's. We provide more than the user expect's and our webmaster and our company reap the benefits without the leaks.

06-10-2005, 03:49 PM	#6
xxxice Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,042	great question i have a thing with not only upsells but crossells in revhshare as well. i went crazy in one thread if interested i can post it or tell ya

06-10-2005, 04:11 PM	#23
jayeff Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 2,944	Bear in mind too that the recurring-percentage model offers a wonderful opportunity to scam webmasters who assume that the site operator too is dependent on recurring income. In fact there is nothing to prevent the sponsor running a site much as if it were a PPS site (with upsells etc), but paying out much less to affiliates...

06-10-2005, 04:14 PM	#28
xxxice Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,042	Lol had to edit because of wrong quote sorry about that

06-10-2005, 04:15 PM	#31
xxxice Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,042	Totem Rex if you are around hit me up icq really quick thanks

06-10-2005, 04:24 PM	#41
xxxice Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,042	Ok i got a few more hours making some popcorn