:1orglaugh

Links please :winkwink:

Not only interstate, this has been applied internationally in several jurisdictions.

There is the example of Jay Cohen who was running an online sportsbook out of Antigua with all servers, employees, and operations there. A New York judge decided it didn't matter where the server was and that it was where the site was downloaded that established jurisdiction. You can read the whole story here http://www.freejaycohen.com/RealStoryJayPg.html

There's been other cases outside the US as well. This one in the UK established jurisdiction over an American in a libel case, "The material in question was stored on websites based in California, and related to another proceeding taking place in New York. The issue was whether the American defendant could be served outside of the UK. It was accepted that the tort had occurred in the UK, because in England, the tort of libel is committed where the publication takes place, and Internet text is published at the place it is downloaded."
http://www.heydary.com/internet-laws/20041104.html#4

And this one in Canada where the Washington Post was sued for libel and the province of Ontario established jurisdiction because "due to the fact the allegedly defamatory statements were published online and therefore accessible in Ontario, the Court had jurisdiction over the defendant."
http://www.heydary.com/internet-laws/20040205.html#1

Read my previous post :winkwink:

Do you honestly think the Hun will be pulled before the DOJ for hosting beast porn who's packets are being sent to US homes?
You think the DOJ will seriously be allowed to become Team America World Police by the NL government?

An American Citizen committing crimes tried by an American court.

Libel is an offence both in the US and the UK


Libel is an offence both in the US and the Canada.


You think China is going to be able to sentence an American to the gulags because they broke Chinese Laws and published an anti-chinese article on their website?

I'm not saying it's 110% super duper safe but they would be setting LARGE precedents.. precedents that will be fought and fought hard.

Why doesn't the US DOJ turn over US webmasters in droves to China. I mean, by the same logic, the moment a Chinese national buys porn from a US website, the website's owner is guilty of a crime in China, right?

No.

Did you read anything else I've said besides the quoted partial statement?

Interesting, but in all cases the 'other' country had corresponding laws or was for other reasons capitulating to Washington's requests.

The idea that I could be in any trouble for breaking a law in foreign country that would actually require me to break the law here just dosnt wash.

1. The DOJ doesn't have the authority.
2. That's why I had China blocked since I started.

I don't feel my local rights usurp the rights of other nations.



Bad buisness decision... maybe. But I can still go to China.

i predict another 2257 thread

Oh I read it, it's just if data packets is importing then the hun is importing animal porn.

Look, I'm also not suggesting that non US people don't become 2257 Compliant, why be the test case? lol.

Fair enough...

I think people are equating my stance to the DOJ's stance. That's just not the case. I'm just trying to inform and warn people. Just like I wouldn't advise Patrick to go to any US shows after the 23rd....

Hey that all I was trying to do and got nothing but trouble from people mostly Euros. Got call idiot and worse and got treated really bad. Fuck it, there is no sue trying to explain things to them. They are too defensive to actually try to udnerstand your point. My point was EXACTLY the same as yours. I will say so far they have been nicer to you.

Oh yeah.. you'd be silly to be complacent about it no matter where you are. I sure as fuck wouldn't ignore the new 2257 regs even in NL - why go out of your way to break another country's law especially one that provides so much income?

I'm just finding it very hard to see how they can create a precedent that would allow anyone from any country to be at the mercy of any other country's crazy laws. Especially from countries not entered into free trade agreements or other trade contracts that may specify internet use. Some countries won't mind a ruling that applies both ways (libel) but when it comes to extraditing 500 of their own citizens for something legal? And what of other countries not in the mood to be pushed around in a one way manner outside of the close knit western US/UK/CA/AU etc?

Then again thats probably because im not a lawyer :)

the true is the essence of the "US soil" definition...

Anyone who does not comply with 2257 shouldn't be surprised if their cash flow stream from US sources gets "interrupted". If you don't care about US sales, then don't worry about it, but even if you don't get extradited/prosecutes in the US, I think there's a really good chance US DOJ is going to be able to get other countries processors to stop processing transactions for non-compliant websites. And I think you can forget about Visa and Mastercard, even if you've got a merchant acount. If you don't need them, then you're ok. But who doesn't need them (at all)?

What you say may or may not happen, but even suggesting that people may be extradited is a joke. It wont happen, its one area of the law that I have, unfortunatly, first hand knowledge of.

We are all going to be affected by this but no-one outside the US should worry about criminal procedings. Of course, that said, dont plan on going to the US for a holiday anytime soon.

Well said :thumbsup

lol... lets be realistic here. 98% of the "pain" in complying 2257 is the new definition of producer and about how, what and where to keep records. Internet has "no borders", yes, but physical countries do and there is no way US authorities can inspect you at your home adress. So it make no sense to say you have to comply 100%, and get prosecuted or whatever may happen.
Besides that, US and foreign agencys are co-operating both ways, and if a US agency find a foreign suspicious website, I'm sure they will contact the local authorities.
Yes, Visa and processors may or may not stop transactions, but that is not new, it already happened. As long there are money there will be websites.

well, the one thing that can affect the non-us biz is visa... and that's all...

but as you all know bestiality, rape, shitting and other shit (pun... lol!) that is illegal in US and still getting sold... anyway the internet is full of that stuff (because it still getting sold... lol... how do you think surfers pay for that sick porn? i can be wrong but i suppose they use their visas and mastercards)

Great post :thumbsup we all have to do whats best for our business

I just think we shouldn't let kids see hardcore for free or anyone for that matter

Visa has banned Beastility, Rape, incest and any violent porn from being purchased via Visa credit card. Anyone selling with those is bouncing around merchant accounts where the bank doesn't know what its really selling.