Is 2257 not neaded for lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area? - GoFuckYourself.com

BV · 06-06-2005, 02:38 PM

I'm currently discussing this issue with our lawyer; However I am interested in other companies remarks.

Here is the 2257 doc I am reading from:

http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...7----000-.html

from "h" on this page i read:
(h) As used in this section?
(1) the term ?actual sexually explicit conduct? means actual but not simulated conduct as defined in subparagraphs (A) through (D) of paragraph (2) of section 2256 of this title;

Here is the 2256 doc I have:

http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...6----000-.html

here is 2 A thru E:

(2) ?sexually explicit conduct? means actual or simulated?
(A) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex;
(B) bestiality;
(C) masturbation;
(D) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or
(E) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person;

2257 says only refer to A thru D for the definition of ?sexually explicit conduct?

So does this mean that you are not required to keep records for content that has:
(E) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person;

and you are required only if it has:
(A) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex;
(B) bestiality;
(C) masturbation;
(D) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or

Discuss..............

hy777 · 06-06-2005, 03:25 PM

Check the revision to the regulatory statues after spring 2003. The definition might now be all inclusive for 2257 purposes but noone can say for sure. Not even lawyers. This is one source of confusion that may end up being resolved in court. You can play it safe and don't show genitals or pubic area but the best advise will come from your own lawyer.

TheWylders · 06-06-2005, 03:52 PM

Looks like you're on to something there.

wdsguy · 06-06-2005, 03:59 PM

bookmarked.

Mr Pheer · 06-06-2005, 04:07 PM

I went thru all of my 1st page stuff yesterday, replaced all my pics with new stuff, no genitals are shown now. Still showing butts and breasts though. I still need to fix my exit pages. Guess I had the same thoughts as you.

Since I dont run my own paysites anymore, not going to give much thought to this 2257 stuff and just keeping my content on the safe side for now.

chase · 06-06-2005, 04:22 PM

I've said this like five times and got ignored-glad someone noticed it when you did it, lol!

FilthyRob · 06-06-2005, 04:25 PM

Can't we just make the pics comply by adding a big star over the offending act?

LOL, just kidding, but I am sure people are considering it.

Kingfish · 06-06-2005, 04:30 PM

I have also said the same thing several times now, but people just go on ignoring it. Changes to the regulations do not change the text of 2257 or 2256.

BV · 06-06-2005, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hy777

Check the revision to the regulatory statues after spring 2003. The definition might now be all inclusive for 2257 purposes but noone can say for sure. Not even lawyers. This is one source of confusion that may end up being resolved in court. You can play it safe and don't show genitals or pubic area but the best advise will come from your own lawyer.

My lawyer is giving me advice. If it's the "Best" advice as you so put it, who knows for sure?

Right now I'm interested in hearing other sources of information on this topic.

Cheers,
BV

BV · 06-06-2005, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chase

I've said this like five times and got ignored-glad someone noticed it when you did it, lol!

This post first got my attention on this issue. http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showpo...&postcount=224

I have my lawyer researching it (a very good and very expensive lawyer)

But he might not know everything there is to know about 2257.

There has to be some experts on this subject.

I mean the law says what it says in black and white. (that "Sexually Explicit Conduct") means A thru D of 2256 Does not include E.

crockett · 06-06-2005, 04:49 PM

Yea someone posted that as a coment to a post I had made in the lightspeed 2257 topic. I'm assuming it means you can still show a fully nude, including pussy shots as long as there is no penetration or rubbing of any kind.

If so that leaves things a bit more open and it won't be quite as hard on some of us that deal in softcore stuff. I'd like to hear it was ok from a lawyer or two though.

crockett · 06-06-2005, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

This post first got my attention on this issue. http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showpo...&postcount=224

I have my lawyer researching it (a very good and very expensive lawyer)

But he might not know everything there is to know about 2257.

There has to be some experts on this subject.

I mean the law says what it says in black and white. (that "Sexually Explicit Conduct") means A thru D of 2256 Does not include E.

hey there it is..

hy777 · 06-06-2005, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

There has to be some experts on this subject.

Jurisprudence: the course of court decisions.

There are no experts because there is no jurisprudence. All these are matters to be resolved. This is why I said the best advice will come from your lawyer even if lawyers themselves have no jurisprudence to guide them. Because their work revolves around this type of obscurity and they are the ones who know how to maneuver through them.

You can ask here all you want and will still read this thread but when things are this vague only lawyers know the optimum course of action.

chase · 06-06-2005, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

This post first got my attention on this issue. http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showpo...&postcount=224

I have my lawyer researching it (a very good and very expensive lawyer)

But he might not know everything there is to know about 2257.

There has to be some experts on this subject.

I mean the law says what it says in black and white. (that "Sexually Explicit Conduct") means A thru D of 2256 Does not include E.

I was in the middle of a good post and my fucking browser crashed...and it WAS Fx, before you boneheads start yelling at me about IE, lol.

Anyway, here's the short version, lol: that's exactly how I understand it. I would avoid any spread shots where she is actually spreading her lips open, but if she has her knees spread and they blossom like the proverbial flower, well, lucky lucky, huh?

Again, I'm no lawyer, but I have studied to be a paralegal and I can grasp a lot of legalese.

BV · 06-06-2005, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hy777

Jurisprudence: the course of court decisions.

There are no experts because there is no jurisprudence. All these are matters to be resolved. This is why I said the best advice will come from your lawyer even if lawyers themselves have no jurisprudence to guide them. Because their work revolves around this type of obscurity and they are the ones who know how to maneuver through them.

You can ask here all you want and will still read this thread but when things are this vague only lawyers know the optimum course of action.

Thanks, but like I said, I allready have my own lawyers advice, I want to hear other companies advice that their lawyers gave them.

(That is if any actually brought this particular issue up)

BV · 06-06-2005, 07:37 PM

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BV · 06-06-2005, 10:06 PM

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BV · 06-07-2005, 10:13 AM

........

V_RocKs · 06-07-2005, 10:40 AM

lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person

This means spread eagle with camera pointing up at her genitals or her spreading them open to show you her vaginal canal, etc... If she is a 'nude' as in playboy centerfold, she is OK.

BUT.... but you must state that this person is NOT included in 2257 and why she is not. So all of your galleries need either/or, either its 2257 applicable and here is where the papers are stored, or it isn't applicable and this is why.

Apparently there are a ton of so called 'legal' nudist sites with the proper wording for the not applicable, or else they'd have been closed for child porn a long time ago.

Dirty-Dough · 06-07-2005, 01:36 PM

bump for this interesting topic..

BV · 06-07-2005, 02:17 PM

It appears that 2256 was amended and the definition of sexually explicit conduct is no longer broken down into subparts A -E.

But 2257 still refers to 2256's (old) subparts A thru E.

Mr.Fiction · 06-07-2005, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

It appears that 2256 was amended and the definition of sexually explicit conduct is no longer broken down into subparts A -E.

But 2257 still refers to 2256's (old) subparts A thru E.

The links from 2257 to 2256 are 404.

06-06-2005, 02:38 PM	#1
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	Is 2257 not neaded for lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area? I'm currently discussing this issue with our lawyer; However I am interested in other companies remarks. Here is the 2257 doc I am reading from: http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...7----000-.html from "h" on this page i read: (h) As used in this section? (1) the term ?actual sexually explicit conduct? means actual but not simulated conduct as defined in subparagraphs (A) through (D) of paragraph (2) of section 2256 of this title; Here is the 2256 doc I have: http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...6----000-.html here is 2 A thru E: (2) ?sexually explicit conduct? means actual or simulated? (A) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex; (B) bestiality; (C) masturbation; (D) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or (E) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person; 2257 says only refer to A thru D for the definition of ?sexually explicit conduct? So does this mean that you are not required to keep records for content that has: (E) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person; and you are required only if it has: (A) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex; (B) bestiality; (C) masturbation; (D) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or Discuss.............. Last edited by BV; 06-06-2005 at 02:39 PM..

06-06-2005, 04:07 PM	#5
Mr Pheer Retired Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 21,292	I went thru all of my 1st page stuff yesterday, replaced all my pics with new stuff, no genitals are shown now. Still showing butts and breasts though. I still need to fix my exit pages. Guess I had the same thoughts as you. Since I dont run my own paysites anymore, not going to give much thought to this 2257 stuff and just keeping my content on the safe side for now. __________________ 2 lifeguards for Jessica

06-06-2005, 04:22 PM	#6
chase Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,019	I've said this like five times and got ignored-glad someone noticed it when you did it, lol! __________________ Need Hosting? Reality Check Network services me purrrfectly!

06-06-2005, 04:25 PM	#7
FilthyRob Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Anaheim - CA Posts: 6,741	Can't we just make the pics comply by adding a big star over the offending act? LOL, just kidding, but I am sure people are considering it. __________________ AKA - Clubsexy

06-06-2005, 04:49 PM	#11
crockett in a van by the river Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 76,806	Yea someone posted that as a coment to a post I had made in the lightspeed 2257 topic. I'm assuming it means you can still show a fully nude, including pussy shots as long as there is no penetration or rubbing of any kind. If so that leaves things a bit more open and it won't be quite as hard on some of us that deal in softcore stuff. I'd like to hear it was ok from a lawyer or two though. __________________ In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.

06-06-2005, 03:25 PM	#2
hy777 I have 6 credit cards, each buying 1 trial a day Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 56	Check the revision to the regulatory statues after spring 2003. The definition might now be all inclusive for 2257 purposes but noone can say for sure. Not even lawyers. This is one source of confusion that may end up being resolved in court. You can play it safe and don't show genitals or pubic area but the best advise will come from your own lawyer.

06-06-2005, 03:52 PM	#3
TheWylders Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 623	Looks like you're on to something there.

06-06-2005, 03:59 PM	#4
wdsguy Ryde or Die Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: California-Shanghai Posts: 19,568	bookmarked.

06-06-2005, 04:30 PM	#8
Kingfish Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 668	I have also said the same thing several times now, but people just go on ignoring it. Changes to the regulations do not change the text of 2257 or 2256.

06-06-2005, 07:37 PM	#16
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	........

06-06-2005, 10:06 PM	#17
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	........

06-07-2005, 10:13 AM	#18
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	........

06-07-2005, 10:40 AM	#19
V_RocKs Damn Right I Kiss Ass! Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Cowtown, USA Posts: 32,409	lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person This means spread eagle with camera pointing up at her genitals or her spreading them open to show you her vaginal canal, etc... If she is a 'nude' as in playboy centerfold, she is OK. BUT.... but you must state that this person is NOT included in 2257 and why she is not. So all of your galleries need either/or, either its 2257 applicable and here is where the papers are stored, or it isn't applicable and this is why. Apparently there are a ton of so called 'legal' nudist sites with the proper wording for the not applicable, or else they'd have been closed for child porn a long time ago.

06-07-2005, 01:36 PM	#20
Dirty-Dough Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 496	bump for this interesting topic..

06-07-2005, 02:17 PM	#21
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	It appears that 2256 was amended and the definition of sexually explicit conduct is no longer broken down into subparts A -E. But 2257 still refers to 2256's (old) subparts A thru E.