Where are all the non US webmasters that said 2257 wouldn't affect them? - GoFuckYourself.com

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:07 PM

Excerpt from Karups new policy.

"There are no exceptions to this no matter what country you live in. As of June 23, 2005 anyone caught promoting our sites after that date using hardcore content and not complying with the new 2257 legislation will have their account closed."

That would mean you = affected.

Nydahl · 06-07-2005, 01:10 PM

maybe time to built up powefull euro sponsor.....

polish_aristocrat · 06-07-2005, 01:10 PM

solution: change sponsor

problem solved

Theo · 06-07-2005, 01:11 PM

oh my,im gonna lose my sleep now

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by polish_aristocrat

solution: change sponsor

problem solved

If you had 5000 galleries listed with that sponsors content you couldn't just "change sponsors" as you say. This is just one, how many more will follow?

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:14 PM

And who knows what all of the US based TGP's etc will do. This is going to affect almost everyone in some way or another.

NoCarrier · 06-07-2005, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by polish_aristocrat

solution: change sponsor

problem solved

sexyclicks · 06-07-2005, 01:14 PM

yeah and with the same thinking if I'm sending 100 joins a day the sponsor will do NOTHING

VeriSexy · 06-07-2005, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chadglni

Excerpt from Karups new policy.

"There are no exceptions to this no matter what country you live in. As of June 23, 2005 anyone caught promoting our sites after that date using hardcore content and not complying with the new 2257 legislation will have their account closed."

That would mean you = affected.

Just don't use Karups then

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VeriSexy

Just don't use Karups then

Sure, but everyone already using them has lots of work to do. And how many sponsors will follow? I doubt most want to even worry about their affiliates getting them on the radar. Time will tell.

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sexyclicks

yeah and with the same thinking if I'm sending 100 joins a day the sponsor will do NOTHING

I guess it depends upon if the sponsor wants to take chances.

sexyclicks · 06-07-2005, 01:16 PM

the same way sponsors say "No mailings!" but they welcome all big mailers

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 01:17 PM

chadgini, I spent a whole night debating this witha few fools on the board who think this will not affect them in any way...don't waste your time they just don't get it..it truly shows you who is really business minded in this industry.

ronaldo · 06-07-2005, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronaldo

I don't believe people will specifically comply because the DOJ says we must, but a lot more people will be willing to comply when their SPONSORS say they must, or they won't get paid.

I expect to see a lot of accounts canned for not meeting the new tos's that will probably be implemented by a lot of sponsors shortly.

I said it over a week ago, so I'm not surprised in the LEAST.

06-07-2005, 01:19 PM

time to take their galleries off my TGP's then.
problem solved !

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eroswebmaster

chadgini, I spent a whole night debating this witha few fools on the board who think this will not affect them in any way...don't waste your time they just don't get it..it truly shows you who is really business minded in this industry.

I know man, I'm just going to keep reminding them anyway. This is exactly what I was worried about, and I don't live in the US. If my sponsors are affected by it then I know I can be. What a pain in the ass.

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

time to take their galleries off my TGP's then.
problem solved !

Congrats, now how many other US sponsors do you use?

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

time to take their galleries off my TGP's then.
problem solved !

How many more sponsors are you willing to do that for?

Because before it's all over with, I guarantee you almost all if not all US Based companies will be implementing this policy or something similar.

06-07-2005, 01:22 PM

well .......... I change if I have to, to only european sponsors.
problem solved !

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nydahl

maybe time to built up powefull euro sponsor.....

Good luck on trying to build the next TCG, NastyDollars, Karups...etc...etc...etc

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

well .......... I change if I have to, to only european sponsors.
problem solved !

good luck with that.

06-07-2005, 01:23 PM

there are big european sponsors and loads of smaller ones.
problem solved !

chadglni · 06-07-2005, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

well .......... I change if I have to, to only european sponsors.
problem solved !

Have fun. Meanwhile US based webmasters and those that won't give up US sponsors will be using non explicit promo and will be raking in the cash. You might gain some more freeloading traffic though.

mardigras · 06-07-2005, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

well .......... I change if I have to, to only european sponsors.
problem solved !

As long as you don't make US sales with non-2257 compliant sponsors you may be OK. Otherwise if you ever step foot on US territory or cooperating you are fair game.

06-07-2005, 01:28 PM

well ........ IMHO it is the other way around, to you a copyrighted word ( by Juicy ) and used too many by SD ......... you are an idiot.
All american webmasters and the non americans that will follow ( the so-called sheep )
will loose at the end, there will be always a way to make money as long as european companies will not comply.
I urge everybody to comply to all stupid rules and regulations since it is owned by the American Laws and Sponsors LOL

Nydahl · 06-07-2005, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eroswebmaster

Good luck on trying to build the next TCG, NastyDollars, Karups...etc...etc...etc

basicly just a matter of some investments , few skilled people - the rest speaks for EU.

06-07-2005, 01:29 PM

I am NOT planning to ever set foot again on american soil, that is a promise !

s9ann0 · 06-07-2005, 01:31 PM

oh shit it is the end of the internet

3piece chicken Dinner · 06-07-2005, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

well .......... I change if I have to, to only european sponsors.
problem solved !

You know I have had great respect for the thumblord in the past. But this statement makes very little sense to me.

Euro webmasters always speak of changing to Euro sponsors only. Why are you bothering to use american sponsors to begin with then?

just asking because I really don't know.

06-07-2005, 01:36 PM

because I always used american sponsors as from the beginning, simple answer but true, if it is time to change well ......... I will protect my business and I dislike people trying to pass rules and regulations on me, that is all

mardigras · 06-07-2005, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

I am NOT planning to ever set foot again on american soil, that is a promise !

Well as long as the government presiding over the address you live at never cooperates with the US you are safe. Good luck with that

06-07-2005, 01:40 PM

whatever, I have to sign off, have to find non-american sponsors LOL

mardigras · 06-07-2005, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

because I always used american sponsors as from the beginning, simple answer but true, if it is time to change well ......... I will protect my business and I dislike people trying to pass rules and regulations on me, that is all

Hopefully your government won't cooperate with the US and any regulations that pass won't be retroactive.

SykkBoy · 06-07-2005, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

well ........ IMHO it is the other way around, to you a copyrighted word ( by Juicy ) and used too many by SD ......... you are an idiot.
All american webmasters and the non americans that will follow ( the so-called sheep )
will loose at the end, there will be always a way to make money as long as european companies will not comply.
I urge everybody to comply to all stupid rules and regulations since it is owned by the American Laws and Sponsors LOL

how the fuck is following the law being a sheep?

You're telling me the ONLY way you can make money is by giving away free hardcore?

as for stupid rules, I see quite a few on your TGP....what's with all of those silly rules? Are you afraid of your submitters making cash?

SykkBoy · 06-07-2005, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

whatever, I have to sign off, have to find non-american sponsors LOL

good luck with that

FilthyRob · 06-07-2005, 01:42 PM

Good point

mardigras · 06-07-2005, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThumbLord

whatever, I have to sign off, have to find non-american sponsors LOL

Good move. One should get away from the world's largest adult webmaster board to find adult companies. They don't know shit here.

Damian_Maxcash · 06-07-2005, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eroswebmaster

How many more sponsors are you willing to do that for?

Because before it's all over with, I guarantee you almost all if not all US Based companies will be implementing this policy or something similar.

The only one that I have seen before today that had a policy specifically for this was Extreme.

They said that you need to follow the laws in your country of residence. That seems fair to me.

I already choose sponsors based on various factors - good free content, epass payouts etc.

This will just be another item on my list.

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by damian2001

The only one that I have seen before today that had a policy specifically for this was Extreme.

They said that you need to follow the laws in your country of residence. That seems fair to me.

I already choose sponsors based on various factors - good free content, epass payouts etc.

This will just be another item on my list.

Just wait...you'll see more.
.

Nydahl · 06-07-2005, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eroswebmaster

Just wait...you'll see more.
.

who knows man - maye some EU sponsors will grow up really
who knows
I am just sure that we will see lot of our friends in Mcdonalds before xmass

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nydahl

who knows man - maye some EU sponsors will grow up really
who knows
I am just sure that we will see lot of our friends in Mcdonalds before xmass

Which is exactly how this will affect everyone..what I've been stressing all along.

When you have less webmasters out there submitting, you have less webmasters buying content, less webmasters using servers, less webmasters hiring gallery designers...the B2B effect of this will be interesting to watch play out over the next year.

skillfull · 06-07-2005, 02:04 PM

hey guys
2257 dont affect me at all
there is a lot of canadian good sponsor (PlatinumBucks and StandAhead for exemple)
and btw
i cant comply to the 2257 cause its again the Canadian Privacy Law
so sorry, if a us sponsor dont want my traffic i will send him to another sponsors
you guys should move out of Jesusland

jayeff · 06-07-2005, 02:06 PM

People are jumping on this because it likely suits their own agendas, but a little analysis wouldn't hurt.

The provision of sexually explicit material by a primary producer to a secondary producer - without the required documentation - is itself an offense. The new regulations do not specifically state that this also applies to transactions between secondary producers, but I doubt any lawyer would recommend a client to put himself in the position of potentially needing to defend himself on this technicality. Likewise, I wouldn't want to have to argue that by making content available, I wasn't actually providing it.

So although the effect of Karup applying the same rules to US and non-US affiliates is to keep the playing field level, if they had good legal advice, it was done out of self-interest. That isn't a criticism, just an observation and a suggestion to recognize that US-based sponsors who do not similarly protect themselves could find themselves hosting gentlemen from the DOJ before too long. They might be baskets into which you don't put too many of your eggs.

It happens that I have respected Karups for years, so I'm not bothered by their statement that they will terminate anyone using their hardcore to promote them (unless they are 2257 compliant, which they cannot be unless Karup provide the docs). But that is potentially one heck of a catch-all in the hands of less scrupulous sponsors and we can all think of examples from the past. It will be an even worse idea in future to sign up with a sponsor with carefully reading the fine print.

Finally, we can expect the people who are hoping to see the end of free porn, those who don't want to have to maintain records and the - I suspect very few - with genuine concerns about the models, to applaud this kind of policy. Just don't let their enthusiasm disguise the fact that the only effect of these moves (and therefore of the legislation itself) is to put US sponsors and (most) US webmasters at a disadvantage.

Yes I know we can use softcore to promote hardcore sites (at least so long as the softcore pics don't come from partially hardcore sets and wouldn't the consequences be unpleasant if you didn't realize that's what you were doing and got caught?) and I know we can promote anything with text alone. But that "we" isn't "we" at all... it's "some of us". It takes a special creativity to do either of those things. Some webmasters have it and have always gone that route, but there are a lot of people who will soon discover they don't have the necessary talent. Before you get too caught up in the general hysteria, just recognize that many of those who are cheering on policies such as the one Karup has announced, are doing so because they fully expect a lot less competition in future.

Postmaster · 06-07-2005, 02:16 PM

Looks clear to me: Dump Karups.
Respect,

Selio M

06-07-2005, 02:17 PM

ok now we are getting some serious response here, thanks Nydal, Eroswebmaster and jayeff and others.
I am not really worried seriously, but I like to have a plan B, and yes I was planning to get most american sponsors changed for non-americans, the new 2257 just speeded the process, so ........

rednet · 06-07-2005, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mardigras

As long as you don't make US sales with non-2257 compliant sponsors you may be OK. Otherwise if you ever step foot on US territory or cooperating you are fair game.

well... if go to Netherlands, buy some marijuana and smoke it within the Netherlands territory - you do not break any laws... don't you think so? (and it doesn't matter who you are... US or New Zealand citizen)

porn is the same commodity...

if my porn site is located outside the US, I use non US billings and the models are not US citizens - i do not break any US laws... because that porn is sold outside the US territory... so, US laws do not work!

eroswebmaster · 06-07-2005, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rednet

well... if go to Netherlands, buy some marijuana and smoke it within the Netherlands territory - you do not break any laws... don't you think so? (and it doesn't matter who you are... US or New Zealand citizen)

porn is the same commodity...

if my porn site is located outside the US, I use non US billings and the models are not US citizens - i do not break any US laws... because that porn is sold outside the US territory... so, US laws do not work!

comparing apples to oranges...I don't have time to search out the text but there is text involving this matter directly..that if you want to sell adult related materials to a US market you have to comply.

Nydahl · 06-07-2005, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skillfull

hey guys
2257 dont affect me at all
there is a lot of canadian good sponsor (PlatinumBucks and StandAhead for exemple)
and btw
i cant comply to the 2257 cause its again the Canadian Privacy Law
so sorry, if a us sponsor dont want my traffic i will send him to another sponsors
you guys should move out of Jesusland

very well and logicaly said - "if a us sponsor dont want my traffic i will send him to another sponsors"
anyway we all know that its not so simple.
True is that US gov fights hard against you US porn guys but they still like your dirty money/taxes.You should fuck them - they show no respect so why should you

Nydahl · 06-07-2005, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eroswebmaster

comparing apples to oranges...I don't have time to search out the text but there is text involving this matter directly..that if you want to sell adult related materials to a US market you have to comply.

internet is not US market - its the very first "planet earth market "

WarChild · 06-07-2005, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eroswebmaster

How many more sponsors are you willing to do that for?

Because before it's all over with, I guarantee you almost all if not all US Based companies will be implementing this policy or something similar.

And yet sponsors, large ones, keep telling me not to worry. As long as I send the joins, they won't ask and don't care. Amazing how money works, no?

06-07-2005, 01:07 PM	#1
chadglni Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: PEI, Canada Posts: 6,924	Where are all the non US webmasters that said 2257 wouldn't affect them? Excerpt from Karups new policy. "There are no exceptions to this no matter what country you live in. As of June 23, 2005 anyone caught promoting our sites after that date using hardcore content and not complying with the new 2257 legislation will have their account closed." That would mean you = affected. __________________ Sign up here - Dating Site affiliate program

06-07-2005, 01:10 PM	#2
Nydahl Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: closer then it appears Posts: 6,655	maybe time to built up powefull euro sponsor..... __________________ www.garciniatrio.com www.acaitrio.com www.greencoffeetrio.com ICQ 153918034 email [email protected]

06-07-2005, 01:10 PM	#3
polish_aristocrat Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 40,377	solution: change sponsor problem solved __________________ I don't use ICQ anymore.

06-07-2005, 01:14 PM	#6
chadglni Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: PEI, Canada Posts: 6,924	And who knows what all of the US based TGP's etc will do. This is going to affect almost everyone in some way or another. __________________ Sign up here - Dating Site affiliate program

06-07-2005, 01:17 PM	#13
eroswebmaster March 1st, 2003 Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Seat 4 @ Venetian Poker Room Posts: 20,295	chadgini, I spent a whole night debating this witha few fools on the board who think this will not affect them in any way...don't waste your time they just don't get it..it truly shows you who is really business minded in this industry. __________________ For rent - ICQ 127-027-910 Click here for more details

06-07-2005, 01:11 PM	#4
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	oh my,im gonna lose my sleep now

06-07-2005, 01:14 PM	#8
sexyclicks Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: c9media.com Posts: 3,240	yeah and with the same thinking if I'm sending 100 joins a day the sponsor will do NOTHING

06-07-2005, 01:16 PM	#12
sexyclicks Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: c9media.com Posts: 3,240	the same way sponsors say "No mailings!" but they welcome all big mailers

06-07-2005, 01:19 PM	#15
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	time to take their galleries off my TGP's then. problem solved !

06-07-2005, 01:22 PM	#19
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	well .......... I change if I have to, to only european sponsors. problem solved !

06-07-2005, 01:23 PM	#22
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	there are big european sponsors and loads of smaller ones. problem solved !

06-07-2005, 01:28 PM	#25
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	well ........ IMHO it is the other way around, to you a copyrighted word ( by Juicy ) and used too many by SD ......... you are an idiot. All american webmasters and the non americans that will follow ( the so-called sheep ) will loose at the end, there will be always a way to make money as long as european companies will not comply. I urge everybody to comply to all stupid rules and regulations since it is owned by the American Laws and Sponsors LOL

06-07-2005, 01:29 PM	#27
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	I am NOT planning to ever set foot again on american soil, that is a promise !

06-07-2005, 01:31 PM	#28
s9ann0 Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 4,873	oh shit it is the end of the internet

06-07-2005, 01:36 PM	#30
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	because I always used american sponsors as from the beginning, simple answer but true, if it is time to change well ......... I will protect my business and I dislike people trying to pass rules and regulations on me, that is all

06-07-2005, 01:40 PM	#32
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	whatever, I have to sign off, have to find non-american sponsors LOL

06-07-2005, 01:42 PM	#36
FilthyRob Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Anaheim - CA Posts: 6,741	Good point __________________ AKA - Clubsexy

06-07-2005, 02:04 PM	#42
skillfull Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Quebec Calisse Posts: 4,716	hey guys 2257 dont affect me at all there is a lot of canadian good sponsor (PlatinumBucks and StandAhead for exemple) and btw i cant comply to the 2257 cause its again the Canadian Privacy Law so sorry, if a us sponsor dont want my traffic i will send him to another sponsors you guys should move out of Jesusland __________________ mind at underdark dot cc SEO Analyst Thunder-Ball.net - Member

06-07-2005, 02:06 PM	#43
jayeff Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 2,944	People are jumping on this because it likely suits their own agendas, but a little analysis wouldn't hurt. The provision of sexually explicit material by a primary producer to a secondary producer - without the required documentation - is itself an offense. The new regulations do not specifically state that this also applies to transactions between secondary producers, but I doubt any lawyer would recommend a client to put himself in the position of potentially needing to defend himself on this technicality. Likewise, I wouldn't want to have to argue that by making content available, I wasn't actually providing it. So although the effect of Karup applying the same rules to US and non-US affiliates is to keep the playing field level, if they had good legal advice, it was done out of self-interest. That isn't a criticism, just an observation and a suggestion to recognize that US-based sponsors who do not similarly protect themselves could find themselves hosting gentlemen from the DOJ before too long. They might be baskets into which you don't put too many of your eggs. It happens that I have respected Karups for years, so I'm not bothered by their statement that they will terminate anyone using their hardcore to promote them (unless they are 2257 compliant, which they cannot be unless Karup provide the docs). But that is potentially one heck of a catch-all in the hands of less scrupulous sponsors and we can all think of examples from the past. It will be an even worse idea in future to sign up with a sponsor with carefully reading the fine print. Finally, we can expect the people who are hoping to see the end of free porn, those who don't want to have to maintain records and the - I suspect very few - with genuine concerns about the models, to applaud this kind of policy. Just don't let their enthusiasm disguise the fact that the only effect of these moves (and therefore of the legislation itself) is to put US sponsors and (most) US webmasters at a disadvantage. Yes I know we can use softcore to promote hardcore sites (at least so long as the softcore pics don't come from partially hardcore sets and wouldn't the consequences be unpleasant if you didn't realize that's what you were doing and got caught?) and I know we can promote anything with text alone. But that "we" isn't "we" at all... it's "some of us". It takes a special creativity to do either of those things. Some webmasters have it and have always gone that route, but there are a lot of people who will soon discover they don't have the necessary talent. Before you get too caught up in the general hysteria, just recognize that many of those who are cheering on policies such as the one Karup has announced, are doing so because they fully expect a lot less competition in future.

06-07-2005, 02:16 PM	#44
Postmaster Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: EE Posts: 260	Looks clear to me: Dump Karups. Respect, Selio M __________________ It's not the quantity of posts that matters, but the quality. Contact me to buy my sig.

06-07-2005, 02:17 PM	#45
ThumbLord Guest Posts: n/a	ok now we are getting some serious response here, thanks Nydal, Eroswebmaster and jayeff and others. I am not really worried seriously, but I like to have a plan B, and yes I was planning to get most american sponsors changed for non-americans, the new 2257 just speeded the process, so ........