This is why America needs MORE guns , especially loaded ones !!!!!

[Fake Nick]

Girl, 4, finds gun, shoots cousin in face

A 4-year-old girl shot her 2-year-old cousin in the face Monday morning after she found a gun at their uncle's house, police said.

Aurelio John Cereceres Jr. was in critical condition at St. Joseph's Hospital and Medical Center, Phoenix police Sgt. Lauri Williams said. The bullet lodged in the toddler's neck.

The shooting happened about 8 a.m. at the uncle's house, in the 2500 block of North 58th Lane. advertisement


The boy's father owns the .25-caliber semiautomatic pistol for protection because he has been threatened in the past, Williams said.

Normally he leaves it on top of the refrigerator, but on Monday he left it on top of a low entertainment center where the girl was able to reach up and grab it, Williams said.

"They're just naturally curious," she added.

The gun was unholstered and fully loaded.

The gun went off as the girl was playing with it. The girl played with the weapon at the end of a couch and accidentally shot her cousin, Williams said.

The homeowner was asleep at the time, and the boy's father was taking another child to school.

Detectives were interviewing witnesses and family members Monday.

A child psychologist was talking to the girl, who was traumatized, Williams said.

Detectives will send the case to the Maricopa County Attorney's Office, where prosecutors will decide whether to charge the boy's father with child neglect.



http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepu...kidshot05.html


yay , for more dumb people with loaded guns !keeping America SAFE

[Mango]

come on, folks... if this ain't the right sign, then something is wrong. How many others need to face death before the authorities will start thinking ?

[Dalai lama]

^You are so right

[psili]

For fuck's sake, the uncle's to blame, not the gun.

If an adult leaves a dangerous cleaning product out and a child drinks it and dies, should we ban all fucking cleaning products?

[who]

And because humans are so unintelligent, it takes a few of these accidents before anyone starts to think that having guns around the home might be a bad idea.

[adonthenet]

damn thats sooo sad!

[who]

Originally Posted by psili

For fuck's sake, the uncle's to blame, not the gun.

If an adult leaves a dangerous cleaning product out and a child drinks it and dies, should we ban all fucking cleaning products?

Cleaning products are designed to clean things. Hand guns are designed to kill things.

[VeriSexy]

Each bullet should cost $5000 Chris Rock For President!!!

[gregtx]

Originally Posted by psili

For fuck's sake, the uncle's to blame, not the gun.

If an adult leaves a dangerous cleaning product out and a child drinks it and dies, should we ban all fucking cleaning products?

thanks... for pointing that out..

now lets read how many more people are killed every minute by some drunk driver, driver talking on their cell phone and not paying attention, or a driver falling asleep at the wheel..

cars kill thousands more people than gun accidents... lets get rid of them too!

[gregtx]

Originally Posted by .?.

Cleaning products are designed to clean things. Hand guns are designed to kill things.

ok.. how about a bag of pesticide in the garage... want to use the same analogy?

[sickkittens]

The uncle is the problem not the gun.

[psili]

Originally Posted by .?.

Cleaning products are designed to clean things. Hand guns are designed to kill things.

Both are inanimate objects and both remain equally harmless until implemented in the hands of a person, regardless of design.

I see your point and I can understand where you come from. I'm just saying people blaming an object is pretty insane in my opinion. It's like that dumb chick who sued McDonalds for the hot coffee she spilled on herself. Yes, the coffee was exceedingly "hot", but she was the one doing the spilling.

In my opinion (and that's all it is, is opinion), the Uncle's at fault for leaving a potentially harmful object out in the open while a child is around.

[VeriSexy]

Originally Posted by gregtx

ok.. how about a bag of pesticide in the garage... want to use the same analogy?

I agree that if the gun was not kept loaded then things like this would never happen but how much pesticide would it take to kill a child? Have you ever tasted the stuff? I don't know what is taste like but I am pretty sure it don't taste like soda......... You think a child would guzzle the stuff down?

[Fake Nick]

Originally Posted by sickkittens

The uncle is the problem not the gun.

no the problem are the laws that allow that person to have a fully loaded gun

[gregtx]

Originally Posted by VeriSexy

I agree that if the gun was not kept loaded then things like this would never happen but how much pesticide would it take to kill a child? Have you ever tasted the stuff? I don't know what is taste like but I am pretty sure it don't taste like soda......... You think a child would guzzle the stuff down?

antifreeze looks and tastes like koolaide... yes a child would/could guzzle it down... that is why you never leave it down where a child could easily access it...

this story could easily have read.. child climbs on counter pulls knife and stabs cousin... the media just likes to ruffle feathers that it was a handgun... the uncle is an idiot for leaving it in such an accesible place.. its as bad as leaving kids in a running vehicle and walking off...

[gregtx]

Originally Posted by Fake Nick

no the problem are the laws that allow that person to have a fully loaded gun

so if they made a law that siad you counldn't have a loaded gun.. that would solve the problem correct???

wow you have more faith in laws than I do... I think there is a law against pot and cocaine.. but I dont' think people really care

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by gregtx

thanks... for pointing that out..

now lets read how many more people are killed every minute by some drunk driver, driver talking on their cell phone and not paying attention, or a driver falling asleep at the wheel..

cars kill thousands more people than gun accidents... lets get rid of them too!

Cars are needed in this society and are made to drive, not kill. Guns are not needed in this society and are made to kil...notice the difference?

Yes cars cause accidents, so do computers who catch fire, so do pavements if you step on them wrong...yet none of those things were made to kill.

All guns could dissapear tomorrow and nobody will miss them for a moment because they are not needed...how fucking hard is it to understand?

Simply put, if that gun wasnt there the girl wouldnt have accidently shot it.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by gregtx

antifreeze looks and tastes like koolaide... yes a child would/could guzzle it down... that is why you never leave it down where a child could easily access it...

this story could easily have read.. child climbs on counter pulls knife and stabs cousin... the media just likes to ruffle feathers that it was a handgun... the uncle is an idiot for leaving it in such an accesible place.. its as bad as leaving kids in a running vehicle and walking off...

Guns are made to kill. Anti freeze isnt.

[ssp]

Originally Posted by gregtx

so if they made a law that siad you counldn't have a loaded gun.. that would solve the problem correct???

wow you have more faith in laws than I do... I think there is a law against pot and cocaine.. but I dont' think people really care

Exactly. Guns are so common in the US that people even think "they can't live without them". I'd say visit Europe. You never hear stories about 4 year olds shooting 2 year olds. Why? Because we have laws that prevent people from buying guns. It works.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by sickkittens

The uncle is the problem not the gun.

No, if there was no gun the kid wouldnt have used it.

Yes the uncle is a total idiot yet the gun kills, not the uncle.

[Fake Nick]

Originally Posted by gregtx

so if they made a law that siad you counldn't have a loaded gun.. that would solve the problem correct???

wow you have more faith in laws than I do... I think there is a law against pot and cocaine.. but I dont' think people really care

thats putting things out of context,


all I am saying is there should be more requirements to own a gun,

making it easy for people to have guns, and having almost zip requirements is not a good thing and causes shit like this to happen

people that are not well educated on the dangers of guns , and that dont know how to use one should not be allowed to do so ,

if you want to drive you need a license ,and take some tests , that is what the law says,

to own a gun you just need "good" behaviour and some other requierements, but none that has to do with you being smart with your gun or you being able to prove you know how to handle a gun

also , it should be checked more often wether the people who legally own a gun are still fully aware on how to handle a gun and what the dangers are

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by ssp

Exactly. Guns are so common in the US that people even think "they can't live without them". I'd say visit Europe. You never hear stories about 4 year olds shooting 2 year olds. Why? Because we have laws that prevent people from buying guns. It works.

I said it before, its now too late for an anti gun law in the states. Too many of them around already. Nobody is gonna return their gun if they know their neighbour still has one. They shouldve made guns illegal from day 1. That wouldve been the only solution. But you know Americans and their 'freedom" thing. Touchy subject

[Rinaldo]

I sleep with mine loaded.
Oh wait were talking about pistols not cannons... my bad

[ssp]

Originally Posted by Franck

I said it before, its now too late for an anti gun law in the states. Too many of them around already. Nobody is gonna return their gun if they know their neighbour still has one. They shouldve made guns illegal from day 1. That wouldve been the only solution. But you know Americans and their 'freedom" thing. Touchy subject

If tomorrow all the things were gone
I've worked for all my life
and I had to start again
With just my family by my side
I'd thank my god above
To be living here today
'Cause the flag still stands for freedom
and they can't take that away hey

CHORUS:
I'm proud to be an American
where at least I know I'm free
And I won't forget the men who died
who gave that right to me
And I gladly stand up next to you
And defend her still today
'Cause there ain't no doubt I love this land
God bless the USA

From the lakes of Minnesota
To the hills of Tennessee
Across the plains of Texas
From sea to shining sea
From Detroit down to Houston
And New York to L.A.
There's pride in every American heart
And it's time we stand and say

I'm proud to be an American
where at least I know I'm free
And I won't forget the men who died
who gave that right to me
And I gladly stand up next to you
And defend her still today
'Cause there ain't no doubt I love this land
God bless the USA

I'm proud to be an American
where at least I know I'm free
And I won't forget the men who died
who gave that right to me
And I gladly stand up next to you
And defend her still today
'Cause there ain't no doubt I love this land
God bless the USA

I'm proud to be an American
where at least I know I'm free
And I won't forget the men who died
who gave that right to me
And I gladly stand up next to you
And defend her still today
'Cause there ain't no doubt I love this land
God bless the USA

[Choker]

The lobby for gun owners rights is to big and powerfull. Guns are as American as apple pie. I keep my guns loaded but locked up in a gun safe. The ones in my cars I keep unloaded in a locked box in the glove compartment. Florida does a FBI background check and checks you for any restraining orders before you buy a gun. I think this is enough. There is a three day wait on handguns but none on shotguns or rifles. I think there should be one on any gun.

[SmokeyTheBear]

They already have finger locks , people just arent using them..

You wear a ring with a special code chip built into it. The ring must be worn in order for the trigger mechanism to fire..

PROBLEM SOLVED , no more gun accidents ,next

[SmokeyTheBear]

It also eliminates the risk of your gun being stolen from you. Or taken while your protecting yourself

[psili]

Didn't we have a thread about this a couple of months ago?

For the record, I totally see your point and understand what you're saying.

I have to ask, however, would you be making the same point back before guns, in the days of swords, that they aren't needed and shouldn't exist? How about back when people threw stones at each other - should the stones not exist?

People are the problem. Plain and simple. They always have been the problem and always will. From the stone age to the day there are devices the size of a ring that can simply vaporize a city block.

Originally Posted by Franck

Cars are needed in this society and are made to drive, not kill. Guns are not needed in this society and are made to kil...notice the difference?

Yes cars cause accidents, so do computers who catch fire, so do pavements if you step on them wrong...yet none of those things were made to kill.

All guns could dissapear tomorrow and nobody will miss them for a moment because they are not needed...how fucking hard is it to understand?

Simply put, if that gun wasnt there the girl wouldnt have accidently shot it.

[Skillz Unlimited]

I'm not really sure why this is such a big argument. It's pretty simple. The uncle is at fault for leaving the gun in a place where the child can get it. Guns alone dont kill people, people with guns kills people. You dont ban guns, you deal with the uncle and teach him a lesson about being irresponsible with it. The option of owning a gun in America is a freedom that I dont think anyone wants to give up. If the freedom of choice is taken away on guns, whats going to be next? They need to press charges against the uncle, atleast probation and a fine.

[jayeff]

One of bizarre thing about all these gun threads is how every gun owner who pipes up is always so damn responsible: loaded guns in a safe, unloaded guns in the car, etc. It never seems to strike any of them that these precautions render the guns (at least those intended for protection), practically useless. Some burglar, car-jacker or whatever, is going to wait while you go find your gun or load it...?

I have a lot of trouble believing someone who feels insecure enough to want a gun, then renders it harmless or puts it so far out of reach to be useless. And if most gun owners did behave that way, how come there are still so many tragic accidents?

The analogy with cars and cleaners really doesn't work. Life itself is dangerous. I was walking down the street a couple of days ago and got hit by a - thankfully small - falling branch. But a gun has no purpose except to harm. Introduce one into your environment and you have introduced a risk which has no positive side unless one day your safety is threatened. And only then if you can get to it fast enough and use it effectively.

[European Lee]

The UNCLE leaves a loaded gun in a house where he is supposed to be watching the child while her father takes another one to school but (and this is the kicker of the story) the FATHER is the one who faces child neglect charges

Only im America LOL

Regards,

Lee

[tranza]

And you guys elected Bush again... go figure!

[Choker]

Originally Posted by jayeff

One of bizarre thing about all these gun threads is how every gun owner who pipes up is always so damn responsible: loaded guns in a safe, unloaded guns in the car, etc. It never seems to strike any of them that these precautions render the guns (at least those intended for protection), practically useless. Some burglar, car-jacker or whatever, is going to wait while you go find your gun or load it...?

I have a lot of trouble believing someone who feels insecure enough to want a gun, then renders it harmless or puts it so far out of reach to be useless. And if most gun owners did behave that way, how come there are still so many tragic accidents?

The analogy with cars and cleaners really doesn't work. Life itself is dangerous. I was walking down the street a couple of days ago and got hit by a - thankfully small - falling branch. But a gun has no purpose except to harm. Introduce one into your environment and you have introduced a risk which has no positive side unless one day your safety is threatened. And only then if you can get to it fast enough and use it effectively.

Well... my gun safe is electronic, I can open it in the dark in less than 2 secs. I sleep with my bedroom door locked and the safe wide open. As far as the guns in the car, I can unlock and load them within 5 secs. Florida has the three action law as far as guns in your car. You have to have the gun so it takes 3 seperate motions to fire it. Mine are unl 1. Unlock the box 2. Load the catridge 3. Cock the gun . 5 seconds is all this takes

[dready]

In Canada he'd be fucked. It's totally illegal here to keep a firearm unlocked and loaded. It has to have a trigger lock and ammo in a separate location.

[SmokeyTheBear]

Originally Posted by dready

In Canada he'd be fucked. It's totally illegal here to keep a firearm unlocked and loaded. It has to have a trigger lock and ammo in a separate location.

I dont think you have to have trigger locks , but you have to have them unloaded and ammo in seperate location.

I have a locked gun locker and no trigger locks for my rifles..

But a handgun is useless without being loaded and ready to use so...

[dready]

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

I dont think you have to have trigger locks , but you have to have them unloaded and ammo in seperate location.

I have a locked gun locker and no trigger locks for my rifles..

But a handgun is useless without being loaded and ready to use so...

Yes you don't need trigger locks if you have a locked safe.

[jayeff]

Originally Posted by Choker

I sleep with my bedroom door locked and the safe wide open.

If I ever felt the need to live that way, I would move. I don't lock my front door... I can't even imagine feeling the need to lock myself in a room.

I lived in London most of my life, but also in New York, San Francisco, lots of European cities and in Israel. I haven't felt threatened anywhere, except maybe in an apartment within sight of the Israel/Lebanon border where the sound of guns punctuated most nights. That took a little getting used to, but even there I figured there wouldn't be too much I could do if someone put a Katuysha missile through the wall...

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by jayeff

One of bizarre thing about all these gun threads is how every gun owner who pipes up is always so damn responsible: loaded guns in a safe, unloaded guns in the car, etc. It never seems to strike any of them that these precautions render the guns (at least those intended for protection), practically useless. Some burglar, car-jacker or whatever, is going to wait while you go find your gun or load it...?

I have a lot of trouble believing someone who feels insecure enough to want a gun, then renders it harmless or puts it so far out of reach to be useless. And if most gun owners did behave that way, how come there are still so many tragic accidents?

The analogy with cars and cleaners really doesn't work. Life itself is dangerous. I was walking down the street a couple of days ago and got hit by a - thankfully small - falling branch. But a gun has no purpose except to harm. Introduce one into your environment and you have introduced a risk which has no positive side unless one day your safety is threatened. And only then if you can get to it fast enough and use it effectively.

Aks ANY gun owner and he will say he is a totally responsible gun owner...they ALL say it...where do all these accidents come from then im wonderning.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by jayeff

If I ever felt the need to live that way, I would move. I don't lock my front door... I can't even imagine feeling the need to lock myself in a room.

I lived in London most of my life, but also in New York, San Francisco, lots of European cities and in Israel. I haven't felt threatened anywhere, except maybe in an apartment within sight of the Israel/Lebanon border where the sound of guns punctuated most nights. That took a little getting used to, but even there I figured there wouldn't be too much I could do if someone put a Katuysha missile through the wall...

Ya, locking your bedroom door is fucking insane!!

[Tala]

My daddy had an interesting way of teaching us kids gun safety. For our sixth birthdays, my brothers and I were allowed to shoot daddy's gun.

Daddy's gun of choice for this little exercise was a 12 gauge shotgun. He would take out to the hayfield where there was nothing to shoot but haybales, show us the bale, hand us the shotgun, help us to position it and tell us, "Wait until I get behind you...Now shoot that bale of hay down there."

Anyone ever felt the kick of a 12 gauge? To a six year old who weighs maybe 50 pounds, it's like getting kicked in the shoulder by a mule. I was flat on the ground anout three feet away from where I had started, and there's my daddy, grinning at me, holding the gun in his hand. I remember he cleared it, (unloaded it), then checked my shoulder, which was going to be bruised. (Now that I think about it, I bet he wanted it bruised)

"Hurt?"

"uh huh" *sniffle*

"Guess this ain't something you want to play with, then?"

"No way!"

"Good, then you'll keep your hands off it. Don't ever touch it, don't even think about it. We'll find you a toy that you like, how's that?"

"Okay Daddy"

Not a one of us kids EVER touched that gun again. Matter of fact, the only guns we ever touched were the ones that Daddy taught us to shoot with, and that took a lot of convincing on his part.

[johancruijff]

fake nick,

i love you!

[Choker]

Originally Posted by jayeff

If I ever felt the need to live that way, I would move. I don't lock my front door... I can't even imagine feeling the need to lock myself in a room.

I lived in London most of my life, but also in New York, San Francisco, lots of European cities and in Israel. I haven't felt threatened anywhere, except maybe in an apartment within sight of the Israel/Lebanon border where the sound of guns punctuated most nights. That took a little getting used to, but even there I figured there wouldn't be too much I could do if someone put a Katuysha missile through the wall...

LOL, I don't want my kids coming into my bedroom when I am busy or sleeping man. It's not a matter of being paranoid about robbers. Although I am. I live in a very safe area, but it only takes one time getting robbed to go on the defensive. I live in a big house in a exclusive area. Robbers target homes like man. Better safe than sorry.

[dready]

Geez, most of my life we never locked the front door. Hell, for years I left the keys in the ignition of my car with the windows rolled down and bills on the dash.

[loverboy]

where is responsible parenting here? dumb fucks

[Head]

And this happens so often too. You'd think they'd learn.

[justsexxx]

At least the kids are prorected from seeing naked things on the tv

[The Heron]

Here's a qoute for you fools:
"Blaming a gun for Columbine is like blaming spoons for Rosie O'Donnell being fat"

[gregtx]

Originally Posted by jayeff

The analogy with cars and cleaners really doesn't work. Life itself is dangerous. I was walking down the street a couple of days ago and got hit by a - thankfully small - falling branch. But a gun has no purpose except to harm. Introduce one into your environment and you have introduced a risk which has no positive side unless one day your safety is threatened. And only then if you can get to it fast enough and use it effectively.

you've apperantly never shot a hand gun for sport... nor have you ever seen anyone drive a car over 100mph the analogies are the same... both can easily kill if used improperly.. and yes cleaners and pesticides as well if not stored correctly.. thus the governement already forcing labels etc on them...

for being adult site owners/operators/webmasters.. why in the hell do you want to give the govnerment more power.. and also take more powers away from the citizens of the country???

doesn't the UK have and Canada have extremely high "mugging" and robbery rates.. due to the fact that they know the owner won't shoot them???

I love the fact taht if you are to as much be in my back yard past sunset.. I can shoot your ass dead for trespassing... God Bless Texas

[gregtx]

Originally Posted by The Heron

Here's a qoute for you fools:
"Blaming a gun for Columbine is like blaming spoons for Rosie O'Donnell being fat"

lol


no no no.. spoons are not made to harm others... its not the same.. please have the government put more laws on us...

[Susan F]

Poor kids, the trauma for both!