Why would I comment on something without reading everything? Especially when the subject in question is a product that we utilize?

I'm talking to Alex. I am in no way talking down on anybody.

You know, both NATS and MPA are great programs. They are complex programs and like it or not folks, they are going to have bugs. I didn't understand when everyone jumped on the "mpa is shit" bandwagon not so long ago and now it seems that the glorious NATS is in the same boat. There aren't that many options out there when it comes to reliable affiliate software (and again, I think that NATS and MPA are both reliable.) Shaving features were initially added to programs because the webmasters wanted it and then the programs were ripped to shreds because of it. Not to mention, let's all just acknowledge that fact that unethical programs can find ways to shave if they want (as addressed earlier in this thread). I don't know why people won't just face that fact without placing so much blame everywhere else. Anyhow, now the programs have done away with the features because the webmasters wanted it. Running an affiliate program is not easy. You have to constantly watch your stats and get up your tech's asses all the time. And hopefully you have good techs. By the way, we use MPA and we've had our share of technical problems, but nothing that we couldn't handle. I am very happy there as many are happy with NATS. I think that this, and who knows what other problems are just going to be a part of running your own program if you do not have your own software written and a crew of programmers to keep it running. That's the facts folks. BTW, iBanker, I am really sorry to hear about your Electracash payout problems. Sounds like a real nightmare. Hopefully, the people at NATS will step up and get that fixed for you asap.

shocking isn't it? esp when you can pickup or get the stuff coded for anywhere from 2.5 to 25k...that's a small investment if you're seriously planning on doing biz, and if you can't self-generate that many sales, it might be best to consider learning how to do that BEFORE opening up an affiliate program.....the only sales you can really rely on are the ones you generate yourself...

Hey iBanker. I'm sorry to hear about the problems. I'm glad that you were able to catch an issue. Perhaps you have just uncovered something big.

Has anyone else found a similar problem?

I'm not saying you are wrong at all. Obviously you uncovered a big faux pas, but I'm always one to err to the side of caution.

I've heard nothing but good things about NATS, so I'd be surprised if there is a conspiracy, but I'm interested in hearing everything about this so that if there truly is a problem that it's exposed.

However, to be fair, I'd like to hear about more information on this including the accounts of any other folks affected.

Billie raises some good points. Basically the whole argument about shaving and not really comes down to the webmaster program, not the software they use. Do you trust who you are sending traffic to? Does you check look good every month... I mean is it about anything but that at the end of the day?

Send 10,000 to Sponsor X and make $500
or
Send 10,000 to Sponsor Y and make $750.

Who you gonna send to? Do you care what happens beyond that? People just like drama and to have something to go on about because otherwise they are bored. I'd be the same way if I wasn't so occupied beating off all the time.

During the time period of november 28 and up to a few weeks ago was everyone who was useing your software made aware of these issues?

No Steve, this is not a conspiracy. :) I do hope it was just us that experienced these problems. I would also like to know if other NATS users are experiencing the same problems we did. Mind you, we have only outlined one of what we consider major problems we encountered so far. There were others as well, some small, some big.

Maybe but there is no reason to make it easy for scammers to steal.

Yes, all our clients that were using electracash at the time were told about the issue. All new clients coming on board that used electracash were told about this also.

Couldn't agree with this more. And all indications are that our next payout will be our higher than when we were with NATS.

Would like to know more from the surfers about how they feel about their payout with nats v. using programs that don't us them.

Would make for an interesting conversation I think.

I use both products and All I can say is that it can be a really frustrating thing dealing with support issues. We constantly check our system, make sure hits are being track, make sure things are working and things do break or not work properly.. I think the main focus on stuff should be fixing issues quickly and not blaming the person who reported the issue that "you must have done something our program runs find" you know how many times I have heard of that? its all about support folks. there are going to be bugs with the amount of variables that needed in these types of programs.. granted I believe things arnt tested fully before being released which is sad..

when I worked in video games we had a staff of 20 testers working day and night to make sure there where no bugs in our game before it went to the public..
:2 cents:
[/rant]

This thread is about a drama of nothing.
Only a bug that was fixed, SO?! <----

I dont understand where is the shaving?

Nathan let us know of the problem with Electracash. He also showed me a HUGE problem with them, that called for immediate attention. He recommended that I switch to WTS until the problem was resolved. Between John at WTS and Nathan I was able to open an account with WTS and start billing with them instead of EC within just a few hours. Since then I've been very happy with WTS and haven't switched back to EC.

Yet, to us they claimed full integration. Maybe someone had it out for us? Who knows. Like I said, there were way more issues than this one, other that costs us money. This thread could go on for a long time with all of them posted...

I knew about the ElectraCash issue long ago, I had the same issue while using MPA. It isn't NATS or MPA's fault. It's ElectraCash, or was rather until it fixed.

We quickly changed over to WTS to avoid these issues. I may be wrong but I think I have seen this posted before about ElectraCash.

We explained the issue to you on November 28th. Not in the ticket system but on ICQ and on the phone.

You guys were the reason we found the issues and got all partys involved to get them fixed. Of course we told you about it, why else did you switch to WTS?

The only thing i can see from all these post that Nats did wrong is leave ElectraCash as a supported biller on there pages from the time the issue was reported till the time it was fixed If it was left up i dont know.

who the hell said anything about shaving?
This is the problem:

1) NATS advertised that they supported processing company XYZ. Affiliate program A uses their software.

2) Affiliate program A realizes their affiliates are getting fucked. Problem is never fixed.

3) Company A switches away from NATS to MPA.

4) Everyone starts gossiping because this is the first time that has happened.

5) Company A says that the owners of NATS are trying to discredit Company A's credibility.

6) Company A says fuck it and posts why they switched and proof.

7) NATS hits up their ICQ list for support in this thread

8) End of storey.

The problem is, NATS has created this reputation of if you promote a sponsor that uses their software, as an affiliate you are 110% safe. Now we find out that there are tracking issues. It's not about maliscious intent. If some guy rapes you in your asshole, and then some other guy slips and falls and his dick ends up in your asshole, you're going to be equally pissed off. Or would you?

Obviously a lot of the program owners dont see this as *that* big of a deal. It's not like this is an issue fucking with *their* money. So we should all just shut up and go him. YA OK!

I promote a lot of NATS programs, and this issue alone wont make me stop promoting programs that use their software, but some of the replies in this thread really made me think twice about some of the programs using NATS.

We don't use electracash, but we *have* gone through the backend and compared every transaction to those recorded by our billers, and there are no discrepancies.
This isn't to take sides in the drama - just to let SmokeCash affiliates know that everything has been tracked perfectly :thumbsup

Just to clarify a bit. The lack of support was caused by an issue on Electracash's end and not on ours.

Also, I have not sent this thread to a single person for support. Anyone who has posted here has on their own. Have I in the past on other issues? Yes, occassionally I have asked for some support on the boards, however this time I have not solictited one post from anyone. Anything that has been said has been said by the author's own will.

Just to point out that "mensniche" is Andrews perspective on NATS. I personally believe both companies are excellent companies and NATS are going through the growing pains which MPA2/3 also experienced and every company does. Little issues like this will be resolved.

Now everyone make friends.

But in the meantime you claimed full integration with them still? Funny how that works.

Want to discuss any of this then?

How much money you cost us by letting our members stay in our members area utilizing plugin feeds AFTER the were expired?

How many times you told us this was resolved?

How often you blamed EC, CCBill, Paycom, or NetBilling for problems?

How often you actually admitted any sort of fault for errors?

Why the templates never worked on the config page?

How many times you had to fix our stock bonus page?

HOW MANY BOOKMARK JOINS CAME IN (ONE OF THE WORST)?

Why and if your software wasn't tracking properly with referral codes?

Why you have so many different screen-names (one I actually think you labeled Nathan-Hidden or something like that)?

Why it was always so hard to get a hold of you guys?

Why you close out tickets that weren?t resolved? (I know that we closed them all out in the end, but that was just because we gave up on you guys)

Why all the errors on the join pages?

Why the errors on the surfer pages?

Why there were different ratios under referrer statistics?

Why were payouts different in admin reports and admin stats? (sure its just a processing issue right? not like a program owner would want to know that they were all the same)

Why your documentation was so incomplete?

Why to my knowledge you STILL don?t have the rewards information in the documentation?

Why sections like "7.1 for payouts per reseller" were never completed or given to us?

Why you could never keep new affiliates from our automatically joining on our cross sales?

I could keep typing, but what is the point. Even if you could say you solved all of this, which I don't believe you can do honestly, you still use your clients to beta test your software and we take all the risk and you take all the rewards in my opinion.

As we saw with the Electracash issue there are two sides to every story (and/or complaint). Again, I wish you luck with your new solution.

The thread was sent to me by Eros asking if we had this problem. Nobody from NATS asked us to post here.


NATS isn't the only program that has ElectraCash built in, and NATS programs aren't the only ones using ElectraCash, and not all NATS programs use ElectraCash. ElectraCash hasn't been the only one with this issue either.

glad I brought a sandwich and a Big Gulp for this one. =)

Well I belive this is not "shaved on purpose" but a glitch somewhere, so you have to understand JSA decision to look for other solutions.

Kimmykim - what exactly did you added to this thread (besides avoiding the issue)?

you aren't sharing? I'm starved... i've been chained to icq all day

Damn....

John you are such a cheating fuck!! JUST JOKING!!

If what you show is correct looks more like a glitch then a shaving function :2 cents:

Hey while you are here do you guys rund any other programs?

this thread needs a pix..

http://virgula.terra.com.br/virgulagirl/g92/1/5_ftg.jpg

I dont remember iBanker stating it was a shaving issue. Someone correct me if i am wrong.

Ah thank you :thumbsup

I did not.

I'D HIT IT :thumbsup

Thanks i wanted to make that clear to the ones who did not read the whole thread.

understood and not a problem :thumbsup

THIS THREAD NEEDS SOME MAN LOVE

http://sexy-celebs.net/hotlink/rim.jpg

Long read but i read it.

Interesting to say the least.

-Juicy D. Links

NATS, brought to you by the man who was behind Porngraph.

:1orglaugh

http://virgula.terra.com.br/virgulagirl/g92/3/2_ftg.jpg

please no man love.. :)

if you sell software, its all about support support and support. :)

Alex and I will be in Phoenix. Anyone that would like to talk with us, call to set up some time. We will do our best :)

Chris
858-587-9000 (102)

mmm Gateway has good taste. when is the next counter-strike game? : )

it's real annoying when people start posting pics in important threads like this one .

Go custom. :thumbsup

These are the kind of threads I miss the most...

You think that chick would bang me if i had lamborghini doors on my escalade?

Maybe..but maybe not. I will tell you this though. If you had escalade doors on your lamborghini she would in a heart beat.

I agree..

no fucking doubt.