you're shitting us right? :disgust

and have shitty traffic.

Yes that sucks a lot.
I hate such a sites. For example I know few very big sites (they call their sites TGPs), which are about 200-300K big, but they send about 30% to galleries and the rest to trades...which sucks!!

Yeah but you are going to make a lot less money long run with 200k shit traffic compared to 200k bookmarkers. Who cares if it takes longer to get the traffic, it wont disappear if trades fuck up, etc. plus you'll get tons more sales

well let's get honest, it's going to take a long time to build up 200k bookmarkers. I didn't start this post meaning traffic trading with scripts is bad. Hell I do it, but I think there is a very big diffrence in the "quality" of the traffic coming from sites in the 70%-100% to0 the sites in the 50%-and lower range.

I think 60%-70% is a very fine line in the middle and those sites can go either way depending on which group of sites they trade with. I personally rarely have have producitive trades with sites in the 60%'s and I've never had a productive trade with anything lower than 60% the traffic is pure crap IMO.

The thing about pure bookmarkers is that those people aren't the people that make you as much money because if they're coming back to your site daily and getting content 80%+ of the time, why the hell would they join up with a paysite ???

exactly right! nobody makes any joins off sites loaded with bookmarkers, like The Hun, Mark's Bookmarks, Snake's World, etc etc

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Please tell me you are kidding or have just entered this business within the last week.

Well, I've been in the biz for over 10 years now, have 7 TGPs that do 1.2-1.4 million visitors per day and I earn $1,000-$1,500 per day, so I'd say that I know what I'm talking about.

Name your TGP's please. I'll check them out.

50 CJ's called TGPs :thumbsup

i send 90% to galleries. :)

Its not about the bookmarkers, but WHY they bookmark your page. If you feed them with 50 new galleries every day...yes - bad for sales. But if they bookmark you because you are a good salesman with your website(s) - then bookmarkers are good. :pimp

I spoken to several surfers that come back and sign up to new paysites. Act like a salesman, don't tell them to leave :thumbsup

Slick defiantly knows what he is doing he has some big one's.. last time I checked his sites were in what I call the high skim groups. However he seems to be making some money with them. :winkwink:

The Bravo media group is another bunch of sites that are high skim but they know what they are doing and are making money. I can't trade with any of them for the life of me because of productivity issues. However it seems to work for them.

My personal opinion is these sites are more CJ'ish than TGP'ish, mainly because of the high skim ratio's. However when looking at both Slick's and the Bravo group's sites, seems it can work out well. I guess it just depends on personal preference.

Over 1 million potential customers and only 1K+ per day? No fense - that is good traffic - but also waste, when you could make the same with far less traffic. It's really not that hard to make 100$ out of 10.000 visitors, if you play on the right strings :)

I saw your follow up on this. But bookmarkers are pure surfers who just happen to start at your page. The quality of a bookmarker is higher since the bots do not do it. They still react the same way to a site they feel that they must see more of.

I still want to know what "TGP's" he runs

Not when you send 80% to gallery like me :thumbsup

Even better :)

Nowadays, its harder to grow a tgp and you cant start from 0 with a 90% skim, if you wan to grow quickly. And i prefer to have a 100k with 50% skim than a 7k with 90% skim.

Good site I do :)

:1orglaugh

Slick, what TGP(s) do you run?

only a tgp newbie does not know what sites slick runs.

<-----always looking for new TGP's please post the names!

slick owns thehun.net

Let me get this straight your busting his chops because he makes $365,000 - $547,500 a year plus with his TGPS?

thats why a few quality ones like that hun that dont trade traffic have great amounts of quality traffic that convert to sales!

I don't know maybe you should place 80% to galleries is bold text on your page. Hell you should close your auto signup page if your dealing with quality traffic.

Not because of what he make, but what he claims; That skimming is good.
Making 1000$ out of 1 million visitors....thats 0.001$ per visitor minus bandwidth costs and so on. Most TGP owners have less visitors per day, and if that ratio is called good, I cant really see the point in why the average TGP owner do what he do. Why build a site that way, when you can make 10 times more money another way?
Your reply illustrates exactly why this fails for most, because the big TGP owners says "look at what I make" (in total), everyone else use the big TGPs as motivation and so do those who develop and sell the scripts.
Problem is just that the amount of porn-surfers on internet is limited and everyone can't make big money. :upsidedow

Crocket... I love you..
 

I have a few affiliates who run so called TGP's and on Sunday I took a look at one of them. He has a special page called indexclean.htm where all he has are links to my FHG and to another pay site. I tried one of the links to my galleries and it took 10 attempts to get to it. Considering this guy lists over 25 of my galleries, I would think Joe Surfer would get pissed off PDQ...

Thank god got people like Tommy, Shemp and Richards Realm to name just three of the good guys I am lucky to work with when I am in the mood to submit a gallery or two myself.. At least the surfer gets to where he wants...

How they can make money when all the surfer gets most of the time is other tgp's/links sites I have no idea..

Right on :thumbsup Thanks for the comment :)

Dirty Dane, I'm not saying that skimming is good, but with my setup, I'm doing well with the skim. If it was up to me, I'd have my skim to galleries set at 90%, but from a traffic aspect, it'd take a while to grow it unless you blast the hell outta it with feeder traffic for a while.

As far as your comments about making $1000 off of 1 million visitors goes, How much total traffic do you have and how much do you make off of it. I'd rather make $1000 off of 1 million visitors than $400 off of 200K visitors.

I do honestly believe that it's the first time visitor to your site that's gonna give you the best shot at making money, not the person that comes to it day after day after day. If you wanna believe differently, then that's fine with me.

In time, I'd like to send more to galleries because it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that more traffic to galleries equals more sales, but it's not easy to do when you're used to the traffic that you're getting. I guess that on the plus side, it'd be a hell of a lot easier to take a high traffic site and increase the traffic to galleries than it'd be to try to start out a new site with higher gallery %s.

I'm not here to start shit, I expressed my opinion and it seems to have stirred people up. I'm doing excellent here with my methods, if you're doing good with your methods, that's great to hear, I'm always happy to hear about others making money in this biz because we're all in this together :winkwink:

My thoughts exactly :)

Na Slick I don't think your starting shit.. I know your sites and I wish I had the amount of traffic you have. I'd love it if I could trade with you because of the amount of traffic you have, however those kind of sites never work with mine..

You are clearly playing the numbers game and it seems to be working well for you. My main gripe with the start of this post, I guess was more about people that can't read. :1orglaugh

On my trade page I have this.. "At least 70% to galleries No more 60% and lower" yet when ever I leave it open, it's almost guaranteed that at least 1 to 2 sites a day will sign up that skims in the 50% range.

See myself I'm all about that productivity. I don't keep a trade that isn't productive on my sites. I don't like doing unique trades, especially when their traffic doesn't click, which is typically the case for me on high skim trades.

The main problem I see is everyone and their brother is caught up on having a 200k a day site. They are unwilling to take a little time to grow it.. so they skim at 50%,40% and I've even seen 20% to make a big bandwidth burner. The sites might grow very fast but the traffic is crap IMO.

I've seen it a few times, I'll have a good trade going, then next thing you know the guy is trading with one of these big high skim sites that takes over the top list. Next thing you know, the trade goes to crap because the traffic from the bandwidth burner doesn't click through. Seems like more and more of these sites are popping up everyday and diluting the traffic pool of quality traffic.

I'm looking for more movie trades 1k and up 75% to the galleries 25% to trades
www.vidsmania.com
Hey Crockett , I think you hit me up yesterday I was going to ask you for trade but forgot.
icq 137469529
[email protected]

I know that what bring most money on the bank account in the end, is what count. But that's not the same thing as saying that is the way to do things. Only few succeed on to a higher level. You are a good example of that, but the majority is not. That's the hole point.
My guess is that the amount of skimming TGPs has reached the limit, and the only way to get more surfers into those networks, is by "stealing" from the clean sites. But that would be difficult if the clean sites stops trading? It's a bad circle. I followed the development for years now, and its really disturbing. Just take a look at the trade forum and you see what I mean. Everyone is focused on PR and skim percents. Personally I dont bother about others, but I'm not really happy about trading with skimming sites. I prefer 10000 happy surfers to my sites, than 20000 pissed ones :)

yea that site I was looking to trade with is a new MGP.. It can't trade 1k a day yet. However I think I'll be hitting you up in a week or so because it's steadly growing.

Please, shut the fuck up.

Just a comment about surfers. They get smarter and the demand for surfer-friendly browsers/ads is increasing.
A bird told me that they are developing an addon, like the popup blocks, that will identify blind linkings and skimmings. When implemented as a part of the browser, that will be the end of skimming TGPs as we know them today.

I really love constructive arguments :weihnacht