50 shitty programs

(and owned topicstarters :1orglaugh)

LOL

Jon

Which is exactly the reason we ran our program as a "private program" for 4 years, then recently decided to open it up to the public..

It's NOT easy to run your own program, and the reasons Raffi stated are very valid..

That's why we also don't do outrageous payouts. We've done our homework, we know what works for our program, and our wallet..

Sure, we don't get 1,000 affiliates joining per month, because we refuse to pay $35 per signup, but the affiliates we do get, ( to us anyway ) are quality affiliates, who do very well with us..

we have a winner....nice answer

I kinda have to disagree on the $70 payout thing :)

We have been paying some pretty high payouts, and we are not shaving or cheating anyone, however I also can not keep up $70 pay forever since I am loosing money on every sale, but we have gotten a ton of new affiliates off of our promotion. So with that said we are still paying the retarded $70 PPS. We are the number one converting/paying sponsor at good bad and ugly 2 months running. And by many other people who run open stats we are leadiing the pack in live cam sales. With that I have never had much success cracking the paysite recurring side of things. For a variety of reasons, most of which is lack of time to really put energy in to it when I am doing so well off of the live cam biz.

fraud can kill a program.

L$

Lars - just to be 100% clear, I was NOT in any way referring to you. I think you know that (and that most people reading this thread know exactly who I was referring to), but I wanted to be completely clear on that :)

ok cool thanks :)

and i agree one of the biggest hardships with running paysites is FRAUD

and billing !

you forgot to add
Affiliates program owner flying to 3rd world country and stealing all the money ;)

Most 'amateurs' as you call them provide much better content then the average big sponsor, therefore the affiliates love them. You are just naming a very few names in your list of 'pros' lets face it, where is others CECash, TrafficCasGold, AdultFriendFinder, LegendaryLars, Nastydollars and so on.

You're saying many people have no business experience of running a affiliate program, this includes YOU when you started AdultLounge. We all have to start somewhere and we ''arent this smart and intelligent to run such a big affiliate program as adultlounge.com''

With your statement: ''You are better off sending your traffic to them rather than starting your own. Think about it. You can be 50/50 partners with pros...just my 2 cents.''

You are just telling people, please keep sending me YOUR traffic and please DO NOT start your own paysite.

But of course, this wasnt your intention of starting this thread. Right?

Well we started our pay sites a few years back and once we were profitable and doing well we decided to start an affiliate program. If for some weird reason all our affiliates stopped sending sales today we would still be profitable.

Ok DUDE:

As far as I know, Raffi has been in the Adult Industry far longer than anyone I know...I admit he is an aggressive marketer but sooooooooo fucking what, the days that webmasters come flocking to your program are over, don't blame the guy for his efforts in trying to get webmasters.

All Raffi is saying is that the Adult Internet should be taken more seriously nowadays as a business and ran like a business with a business plan and a long term goal without the "get rich quick" mentality, I don't think he is trying to bash people, he is just telling it like it is, I have known Raffi to be very proffessional and dedicated, he is here for the long-run and he will be standing while others are not. Raffi is one of the hardest working, and focused people I know.

Raffi is a great believer in his product and a hard working mother fucker.

Anyone who joins his program is in good hands..

As for you MUTT, all I ever see you do is go around this board and talk shit to people, FUCK OFF IDIOT!!!

Hey Raffi which companies were you referring to

why don't you adultlounge guys mention it's $35 per active membership on your site

it was different sometimes? Damn, Im happy I missed that period.

Lack of critical mass. The big PPS companies are there because they had something go bonzo at one point. Once that happens we all get an account. Then when it is hot, and you are looking for a link for a blowjob site, you stick in the latest hot sponsor's blowjob site. You are looking at their stats anyways so lets send more traffic and spread it around. SEO, gallery guys and every body with 10 hits a day is sending.

It takes that big hit of a site. Who wasn't giving extra traffic to TCG last summer? Who was pushing Little April because they had an account from CFF? When was the lat time you made pages for Cecash?

Maybe they just need to make us money and we keep making them money. Not dogging Purecash as Wegcash is solid as hell for me. They probably never got over that critical mass spot.

Just tossing in my :2 cents: and my experience from back when before affiliate programs were so common.

A: Affiliate programs are nothing except a form of advertising.

B: Its not the program that does not make it, its the site. The program is only a form of advertising for the site.

C: Affiliate programs are not a mark of a good or successful site.

- many successful sites know how to market their sites without large affiliate programs. Doing so helps the webmaster keep more of his/her money.
D: Sites dont make it because they do not know how to market their site, if they cannot market their site, then they will not be able to market their affiliate program.

E: You have to be honest with affiliates / advertisers. If you are not honest and shave, lie, do not payout, promise payouts more then you can afford, then the site will not make it.
- new sites who think they can offer big money forget they have to be able to pay their affiliates, usually more then half what they make and still be able to pay for their webhosting, content and what ever else bills their site has.
- once you pay the affiliate half or all of the price of the membership and pay the website bills, there is not much left for yourself.

Any site can make it with out an affiliate program, if you have a good product and even half way know how to market it, amateur sites do better because they have exclusive content, personality and a certain appeal that "canned" sites do not have. Canned sites have a harder time and probably need an affiliate program even more so then amateur ones do but can still get their site off the ground and build a bank account prior to starting an affiliate program.

Just my :2 cents: from 8 years of running a paysite with both an affiliate program and no affiliate program and watching allot of "players" shut down and only to move on to other jobs, working for other sites, still trying to act like "players".

billing should not be an issue unless your using third party billing.
Personally I had it with third party when DMR went down. third party billing is so unstable that is does not make sense to use them any more - at least for me. For me, if I have a problem with my merchent bank, I can move to another bank or off shore and all my rebills stay intact.

very well said

Hey Raffi, you forgot to mention MEGAPARTNER.COM. LMAO :1orglaugh

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Ya but, how long will you last w/out new sales?

Still waiting on raffi's response

Suprised TCG or ND wasnt mentioned
They have been paying $35pps for as long as i can remember and are pretty fuckin profitable.

I send my traffic to programs that offer $35 pps on trials, but i use the 60% rev-share because i know thier shit will retain.

You can't move if there aren't banks available. Having your own merchant account is no guarantee that you'll have banking, if you think that, then you need to re-think your business model. Many people with no chargeback problems doing decent volume have been terminated and had to scramble to find a new bank (some didn't find one) because their bank decided to get out of adult. Card Services (First Data) in the US and Pago (Deutschebank) in the EU are two very recent examples of this happening.

Well, now that I've posted a little in this thread, I'll continue.

Purecash was not a new program started by someone without a clue (I'm just going on the comments about Purecash in here, if Raffi was referring to someone else, that's not my issue), that just up and closed down one day.

Purecash has been around for a long time. My original Purecash ID dates back to '99 when I started in this business, and while the program was taken private for several years, it has always existed. Hi Rise has been in this business since the beginning, it's owner, MikeAI, is also a partner in DirectNIC, a little company I'm sure you've all heard of once or twice.

WEG has been around forever and a day as well. One of it's owners used to manage sex.com during it's highly lucrative and tremendously profitable period years ago. They also happen to have started the original Join4Free concept way back when, and were the most successful with the idea as well, and anyone who's been here for more than a couple of years will recall how the 4Free concept changed the industry as much as reality sites did.

The combined assets of the owners of these two companies is probably enough to buy and sell most of the posters on this board in one lump.

I like Raffi, and I certainly hope that his post was not directed towards this situation, since that would not only be out of line but also very foolish. I'm curious at this point to see what company he is talking about, perhaps he'll come back and enlighten us. If it was indeed Purecash, then I'm sure he'll be back to apologize, since I can't imagine him stirring up such a shit storm on purpose, especially with the particular companies involved.

revshare is the way to go for new affiliate programs.

The unbelievable portion of this thread is that I posted kind words about Raffi on another board yesterday.

And I too hope this thread was not directed at Purecash.

But even if it wasn't, the obvious disregard for our announcement shows a real lack of class.

Purecash was a profitable model. It was an issue of resources.

Purecash did not come into the hands of Weg as a failed program, but as a profitable and succesful one.

Weg was not mentioned either.

wow....i am not sure how to reply to this one but if i were you i would think twice before speaking this way to someone you dont know...already done so we shall meet someday.

I only used some of those programs including my company only because they happen to come to mind for only the purpose of having a long term plan....not comparing AdultLounge with them...there are many others who i could have listed here which may also have a long term business plan but i wasnt about to list all of them...that is just an example and YES, i do relate to those companies because we have a long term business plan...there is nothing wrong with that. There is nothing wrong with comparing myself with companies in regards to have a long term business plan which we do and i strongly believe those companies i mention here do also...no i dont and havent compared myself with those companies as far as how big they are, they may be larger than AL and thats because they have been operating an affiliate program longer than we have.

ps; we will be buying a banner here but our priorities are to build a solid program, invest in quality content and everything else an affiliate program must have to be around for the next 5 - 10 years....like i said we have a long term business plan...yes silvercash , platinum bucks and many other have banners on this board or skinned it is because they have been running affiliate programs longer and may have the funds to spend on marketing than we do. Its all relevant.....

Again, this thread was only for discussion and not specifically targeting anyone.....its an overall look on affiliate programs not one specifically. Your reply was very rude, unprofessional and amateur. With that kind of attitude, you will not go anywhere in life. You must have some problems, sorry to hear that....wish i can help.

Oh and btw, we will be launching AdultLounge.com Version 4.0 which will have 7 new ways of making money...coming soon this month! :-)

sincerely,
raffi

I am pretty sure Mutt has already been a few places in this industry.

I'm not in Raffi's head, so I can't say exactly what he was thinking, and wouldn't speak for him even if I could.

However, I HIGHLY doubt that he was being malicious in his intentions. The WORST case scenario I can imagine is he was maybe misinformed. Again, I don't know, so I can't say.

Looking beyond that, his posts may be "Spammy", but they're also usually business related...something sorely lacking on GFY. He started a thread that ended up with some good information in it from other posters. If I don't like someone or something they do regularly, I'll look past their posts in the hopes that maybe there's something else useful inside that thread. Threads like this are a hell of a lot more useful than the daily "Would you hit it" threads. Take it for what it's worth.

We've all made posts where our chosen words were perhaps not the best. Thankfully, I can say I was drunk whenever I made mine :winkwink:

i agree, more people need to take this biz more seriously

I don't care if he spams. I am the last one to care. I have things to do other than care about the context of his threads. If I cared, I would complain. Weg, although not on Raffi's list, does advertise here. Our complaints are taken serious.

His post was timely as it closely followed our Purecash announcement. It created a thread with misinformation, something we (I) strive not to allow to happen. Sure, it is "ok" to start a thread, but sometimes paying attention to the surrounding environment benefits everyone.

If a program makes a change on Monday, you go make a thread about the context of it on Tuesday without naming the company, it is logical to assume what will unfold.

Well put.

Regardless of the intention, the timing was unfortunate at best.

I don't think that Raffi meant to misalign anyone, and I don't really give a shit if he spams or not, hell everyone does at some point. I can also see very easily how it could have been taken as a stab at Purecash, especially if someone didn't realize who they were talking about.

Mutt's been around since before I started and has definite opinions on things. He's not afraid to speak his mind either, and since he's got a rather ascerbic wit, he sometimes freaks people out a bit. I like his directness, personally, even when the barbs have sometimes been aimed at me ;)

Oh wow...i just realized that some of you think i posted this thread because of Purecash???? Wow...i dont know Purecash and i havent spoken with Wegcash and didnt know they are some how related or were?

I honestly and truthfully did not start this thread because of Purecash...i honestly never knew until this thread that they closed?

I wanted to start this thread just to have overall discussion about why affiliate can close doors and help friends and everyone who run affiliate programs to get some ideas and see the light on things....

I don't think so and I hope not either because you guys are great people.

Fuck, didnt even know Stupid cash was closed. I remember them cos of that stupid ugly dude that was on the banners, LOL, bummer.

I think most sponsors close down because they either make some good cash and dont bother continuing to work at their business, or they take the wrong road with paying too much for affiliates and they break bank because of this.

Anyone have good experience and want to make a small affiliate program for me?

Mutt...you just like to come and pull your pants down anywhere and take a shit don?t you? I have heard about from people who know you, don?t have many friends do you? And a little bitter I can see.

Be careful what and who you say it to, that is some friendly advice from me to you. I don?t generally like calling people names especially those who I have not met and don?t know personally.

I would assume you don?t go to shows ever, because if you did you would get to meet and teach who these people you are that you are trying to bash. You seem to be such an expert in who is who and programs, maybe you can meet us down in Phoenix and teach us something huh?

Been to almost every show this year and I don?t think I have ever met you, I have only seen what you throw up onto this board with your always negative shitty posts.

Take a look at this Mutt-boy the programs that XXXJay posts who convert best for him out of all the programs in the world, not because they skin boards, or buy banners or suck dicks?just cause the sites converts. You will see Top Bucks, Platinum Bucks and Smashbucks.

http://www.jays-xxx-links.com/links/webmasters.html

:321GFY

Purecash really isnt closing the name purecash is but they have the other programs if I read correctly. I dont understand how programs work , to pay so much for a signup and have expenses and make a profit. I cant see it , something is missing.

how long will you live without air ;) We don't need the sales from affiliates. Affiliate sales are the cherry on top. I have never had a problem getting enough of my own sales to be profitable. Before the pay sites I ran AVS sites and they are still earning sales today as well.

BUMP for Raffi :thumbsup :thumbsup

Looks like a misunderstanding with threads. I'm so sure that Raffi just posted
this Biz thread at the wrong time. :2 cents:

I've been seeing many programs sold, shut down, and just a response of
moving on to other ventures.

So Raffi's topic might be valid. One of the main reasons his company name
was mention with other bigger companies was for the fact that he's here
to stay and they are in the same boat as his company.. for the long haul

Peace out all :pimp

I didn't think you directed this at purecash, I took it for what you posted about, just a discussion on why programs close - not about anyone in general.

Marty, you've known me for half your life...and when i told this post was NOT again NOT because of 1 particular company closing, it was an overall view i wanted to discuss...man, what timing i posted about closing...we have talking more about bashing or being bashed that i almost forgot the true reason of this thread....what a waste of posts...can we get back and talk about what do you think are some of the reasons affiliate programs close? I really would like to hear everyones opinions and there are some interesting ones on this thread already...

come on everyone, lets stick to the topic....

interesting what imafuckingaussie said :

" I think most sponsors close down because they either make some good cash and dont bother continuing to work at their business, or they take the wrong road with paying too much for affiliates and they break bank because of this."

There is no reason to re-think something that works for me - I have been using my merchant account since 1998 or 99, cant remember, but personally I trust my merchant bank over third party billing services any day, you may not and thats fine. This is just my personal opinion and not ment to say third party is bad, I just do not trust using them. I also like the total control I have over my money and how I process.

I agree back on topic, its kinda interesting to see what people think reasons are behind programs shutting down.

Of course he didnt direct this at Purecash or anyone in particular...Everyone lighten the fuck up. :1orglaugh

Mike i love your straight up style man. I'm the same way. Say it
like it is. Yo let's do lunch man all of us :thumbsup

Hit me up when your around

Ya, lets all go to lunch...next week...i will buy :-)

Lets go eat Pho ! Its addicting!

Raffi....hell yeah buddy,

Hey also remember most people on this board and in general are socialy retarded and never had a job outside sitting behind there computer screen, and lack the very important skills with it comes down to doing real biz. Next time at the upcoming show, just stand back and watch :1orglaugh


Being direct is the only way, right? Dont like to beat around the bush...lol

Your on! Make sure Mike comes :thumbsup