Who here has an HDTV? (quality question) - GoFuckYourself.com

Arousal Design · 01-24-2005, 05:36 PM

I got a Sony 60" Wega that shows 1080i HDTV pretty sweet, but other HDTV channels arent as nice and regular TV either looks "ok" or downright crappy...

it seems to compress/pixelate regular TV. anyone know why? i can kinda understand the pixelation, but the compression i dont get =)

(using digital cable, not satellite).

swoop · 01-24-2005, 05:47 PM

Dont have one, but I've been reading on which ones to get and I'm suprised to read this. Was told that digital cable produces the better quality with HDTV

Worldnet · 01-24-2005, 05:55 PM

All Hi Def channels are not Hi Def all the time. Some also broadcast in a different format(not 1080I), which results in a different size picture. Since you are on cable, you have a Hi Def box. If you are seeing black pixels, or freeze frames, you have a bad signal. Make sure all connections are tight on the coax cables. You may have a bad Hi Def box from the cable company. Connect the cable tv line straight to your tv bypassing the box, and see what the picture looks like. I have a Wega 51" and it took some playing around to get the picture looking good on the regular channels. By the way, usually the first 80 channels on your digital box are not digital. The cable company keeps that little secret to themselves

Pete · 01-24-2005, 05:58 PM

I have HDTV and some channels are incredible while other are not so good. Over all it rocks!

DrewKole · 01-24-2005, 06:00 PM

Its the size... 60" of regular tv will look crappy regardless because of the resolution 480i I think

Worldnet · 01-24-2005, 06:52 PM

Here is a good place to see what each program is.(1080I,Etc)
http://www.hdtvgalaxy.com/broad.html

flashfire · 01-24-2005, 06:54 PM

its because of the size that regular TV looks crappy, digital channels should look decent and HD should look very good

aflex · 01-24-2005, 07:00 PM

I think the Digital tube HDTV's have better quality picture then projection. I have the 34" Toshiba "34hfx83".. the picture is unbelievable.

Ron Bennett · 01-24-2005, 07:31 PM

The cable/sat company compresses the signal so they can carry more channels; many of the speciality cable channels, in particular, are often way overcompressed - ie. MTV Classics, Nick, etc.

Not sure which Sony 60" you have ... if it's standard *CRT* rear-projection, then 1080i (for regular channels, the 4:3 override can sometimes help; try each setting) is what you want to be sure your cable/sat box is setup for; for Motorala boxes, turn Off power and then click Menu to access output setup.

Most all CRT rear-projections only have around 540 lines of resolution and thus why 1080i is preferrable for them.

If your 60" Sony is a *LCD* rear-projection, then be sure your cable/sat box is setup to output signals at 720p; all signals are converted to that by such TVs so it makes sense to send the signal in that resolution to begin with.

Oh, BE SURE you are using the *three* Component inputs on the T.V. for video as opposed to the one traditional RCA video jack. DVI / HDMI is often even better for video, but that depends on the output source ... when in doubt, go with the component video hookup - remember, it's 3 video cables, not one.

HDTV is awesome and well worth the hassles and expense to get working properly.

Good luck.

Ron

SleazyDream · 01-24-2005, 07:36 PM

i have a sony 60' lcd at my cottage- compared to my 60' panisonic DLP in my home the sony sucks - both about the same cost

both hdtv - but you have to set menu options on the tv and in the satelitte receiver to get true hdtv channels to show as good as they can show

Ron Bennett · 01-24-2005, 07:46 PM

The Sony 60" LCDs models vary a lot in the quality they offer; have somewhat improved.

DLP seems brighter, but some folks, including myself, find the rainbow effect to be disturbing (DLP uses a spinning color wheel to generate color; very high end DLP units have 3 separate DLP panels, but those cost tens of thousands the last I checked) - many folks aren't bothered/don't notice the rainbowing ... for those who aren't bothered by it, DLP often beats LCD.

Ron

Polak · 01-24-2005, 07:48 PM

I got 50 inch HDTV plasma but only got 15 HDTV channels and most of them are crap. But the quality is better than DVD

Ron Bennett · 01-24-2005, 08:07 PM

Most all lower priced, relatively speaking of course, plasmas aren't true HDTV. Decent HDTV plasmas start in around the $6K range ... and that's minimum ... quality doesn't come cheap.

Check the manual (or google the model number) to see what it's screen resolution is ... it's likely either going to be something like 852x480 (EDTV; a deceptive acroynm, since SD [standard definition] is really more what it is) or 1280x720 (basically the minimum to even be considered HDTV).

If you truly have a HDTV plasma (1280+x720+), check your cable/sat box setup; call your provider and have them send a tech out to make the necessary adjustments.

A high quality HDTV plasma will blow away just about anything else out there ...

Ron

Midwest Shane · 01-24-2005, 08:13 PM

I just got a 42'' Panosonic Plasma TV it's also a widescreen and flat screen so I can put it on the wall. Now I was never really a TV person before but on the the true HD channels with the HD sound sometimes I want to go and touch the scree because it looks that real lol. I was really shocked at how good it really looked but for the ammount I paid it better. On the other hand the channels that are not HD picture and sound well there not much better then a regular TV. I did here somewhere that all stations had to be HD over the next 2 years but I am not sure if that is true. I sure hope so! Melissa

Arousal Design · 01-24-2005, 09:39 PM

Ron I have the Sony Rear Project LCD 60" Wega something rather (newest model they have)..

Thing looks gorgeous in 1080i High Def like the PBSHD channel, and certain fox/nbc shows etc... (better than DVD) But like, ESPNHD, I was just watching the syracuse game and it doesnt have the same sharpness and detail as say INHD2 ...

the digital cable channels i get, look good (no noise) but have compression (mpeg/jpeg looking artifacts)

the regular channels i have have no compression, but have some noise (i think thats a problem with my line strength, maybe my cable provider can fix that).

I'm constantly having to swtich between wide zoom, and full modes for the HD channels that are broadcasting in 16:9 and the ones that are broadcasting in 4:3... that's annoying as well.

All in all though, this TV is a beauty to watch (especially with my surround sound system and DVD's)

Ron Bennett · 01-24-2005, 11:19 PM

I too have the one of the newest models LCD 60" Sony WEGA's ...

Many of ESPNHD's broadcasts are 4:3 superimposed centered on the screen - they have the funky side borders a lot.

The cameras used make a big difference ... much of the FOX's coverage of the Eagles/Falcons game was mediocre due to poor cameras and high compression - according to some knowledgeable folks, FOX has limited satellite bandwidth for HDTV content.

One would expect ESPNHD to be awesome, but the best HDTV sports I've seen so far are on ABC, CBS, and NBC - Monday Night football in particular is excellent ... shame the Superbowl is on FOX ... many folks with HDTV sets don't realize how good it can really be due to inferior equipment some networks, such as FOX, continue to use ... end of rant LOL!

If you have a Motorola box, tune to the channel you want to check signal quality for and then Turn Off the box (if TV is plugged into box, be sure outlet is set to Unswitched) and then *within 2 seconds* click the Select button on the Remote - that will bring up a funky screen ... click Select to get to the diagnostics menu, then scroll down to In Band status and observe the numbers ... in particular the errors counts ... both should remain zero most all the time ... if either, especially the "uncorrectable" count is often showing a non-zero value, that's an indication the signal is a problem ... call for a tech to come out and redo splitters/connectors, etc; in extreme situations, the cable company may even install a special signal booster - they work very well.

Lastly, in regards to 4:3 and 16:9 ... no need for zoom ... on a LCD, burn in isn't a problem - the black bars, while annoying at first, tend to be less annoying once one gets used to them; even at 4:3, the viewable screen, diagonally measured, will still be around 4 feet! Another advantage of owning a 60+" set ... even 4:3 programs, without zoom, are still quite large and easily viewable from a distance.

I agree, it's definitely an awesome set - can't wait for HD-DVD to come out; I'm spoiled now - everything should be in HD.

Ron

Arousal Design · 01-24-2005, 11:25 PM

I agree i can't wait for everything to be in HD. HD-DVD will be sick.

My last question for our resident HD expert, Ron...

On stations like, MSG or TNT, they oftentimes say they're going to broadcast a certain game in HD..

can regular channels broadcast in high def or does it have to be a high definition channel...

Ron Bennett · 01-25-2005, 12:53 AM

Short answer: separate channels.

It would be on a "HD" channel for two reasons ...

1. analog/SD signal is very different from HD; requires much more bandwidth.

2. folks with a regular TV / standard cable box can't view HD channels; they can listen to them though LOL!

My guess is they partner with another channel like ESPNHD or whatever; perhaps they have separate dedicated HD channels, but your cable company doesn't carry them.

Ron

cool1g · 01-25-2005, 01:08 AM

i picked up last the a 42" Panasonic ED plasma....even in 480i some shows look amazing on the HD channels...NFL on CBS, all ABC/ESPN football looks great; INHD has some great stuff and HBO always looks killer. for broadcast channels...seems to depend on the program as mentioned above....

01-24-2005, 05:36 PM	#1
Arousal Design Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Connecticut. Posts: 1,358	Who here has an HDTV? (quality question) I got a Sony 60" Wega that shows 1080i HDTV pretty sweet, but other HDTV channels arent as nice and regular TV either looks "ok" or downright crappy... it seems to compress/pixelate regular TV. anyone know why? i can kinda understand the pixelation, but the compression i dont get =) (using digital cable, not satellite). __________________ Make Major Bank With Major Personality - NaughtyBank! Featuring NaughtyAllie and NaughtyJulie!

01-24-2005, 05:47 PM	#2
swoop Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 3,903	Dont have one, but I've been reading on which ones to get and I'm suprised to read this. Was told that digital cable produces the better quality with HDTV __________________ Earn 50 % Per Sale - Weekly Payments by check, wire, PayPal, or ePassporte

01-24-2005, 05:58 PM	#4
Pete Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Mr. Rogers Neighborhood Posts: 6,617	I have HDTV and some channels are incredible while other are not so good. Over all it rocks! __________________ Evoke Electronics

01-24-2005, 07:00 PM	#8
aflex Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: New Jersey - adaptweb at gmail.com Posts: 3,127	I think the Digital tube HDTV's have better quality picture then projection. I have the 34" Toshiba "34hfx83".. the picture is unbelievable. __________________ self made mothafucka. buying premium domains & developed sites with revenue/traffic -> adaptweb at gmail.com

01-24-2005, 07:31 PM	#9
Ron Bennett Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,653	The cable/sat company compresses the signal so they can carry more channels; many of the speciality cable channels, in particular, are often way overcompressed - ie. MTV Classics, Nick, etc. Not sure which Sony 60" you have ... if it's standard CRT rear-projection, then 1080i (for regular channels, the 4:3 override can sometimes help; try each setting) is what you want to be sure your cable/sat box is setup for; for Motorala boxes, turn Off power and then click Menu to access output setup. Most all CRT rear-projections only have around 540 lines of resolution and thus why 1080i is preferrable for them. If your 60" Sony is a LCD rear-projection, then be sure your cable/sat box is setup to output signals at 720p; all signals are converted to that by such TVs so it makes sense to send the signal in that resolution to begin with. Oh, BE SURE you are using the three Component inputs on the T.V. for video as opposed to the one traditional RCA video jack. DVI / HDMI is often even better for video, but that depends on the output source ... when in doubt, go with the component video hookup - remember, it's 3 video cables, not one. HDTV is awesome and well worth the hassles and expense to get working properly. Good luck. Ron __________________ Domagon - Website Management and Domain Name Sales

01-24-2005, 05:55 PM	#3
Worldnet Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Atlanta Posts: 996	All Hi Def channels are not Hi Def all the time. Some also broadcast in a different format(not 1080I), which results in a different size picture. Since you are on cable, you have a Hi Def box. If you are seeing black pixels, or freeze frames, you have a bad signal. Make sure all connections are tight on the coax cables. You may have a bad Hi Def box from the cable company. Connect the cable tv line straight to your tv bypassing the box, and see what the picture looks like. I have a Wega 51" and it took some playing around to get the picture looking good on the regular channels. By the way, usually the first 80 channels on your digital box are not digital. The cable company keeps that little secret to themselves

01-24-2005, 06:00 PM	#5
DrewKole Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 5,193	Its the size... 60" of regular tv will look crappy regardless because of the resolution 480i I think

01-24-2005, 06:52 PM	#6
Worldnet Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Atlanta Posts: 996	Here is a good place to see what each program is.(1080I,Etc) http://www.hdtvgalaxy.com/broad.html

01-24-2005, 06:54 PM	#7
flashfire ICQ 1 6 7 8 5 3 4 9 2 Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 13,098	its because of the size that regular TV looks crappy, digital channels should look decent and HD should look very good

01-24-2005, 07:36 PM	#10
SleazyDream I'm here for SPORT Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phone # (401) 285-0696 Posts: 41,470	i have a sony 60' lcd at my cottage- compared to my 60' panisonic DLP in my home the sony sucks - both about the same cost both hdtv - but you have to set menu options on the tv and in the satelitte receiver to get true hdtv channels to show as good as they can show __________________ This dog, is dog, a dog, good dog, way dog, to dog, keep dog, an dog, idiot dog, busy dog, for dog, 20 dog, seconds dog! Now read without the word dog.

01-24-2005, 07:46 PM	#11
Ron Bennett Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,653	The Sony 60" LCDs models vary a lot in the quality they offer; have somewhat improved. DLP seems brighter, but some folks, including myself, find the rainbow effect to be disturbing (DLP uses a spinning color wheel to generate color; very high end DLP units have 3 separate DLP panels, but those cost tens of thousands the last I checked) - many folks aren't bothered/don't notice the rainbowing ... for those who aren't bothered by it, DLP often beats LCD. Ron __________________ Domagon - Website Management and Domain Name Sales

01-24-2005, 07:48 PM	#12
Polak Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 620	I got 50 inch HDTV plasma but only got 15 HDTV channels and most of them are crap. But the quality is better than DVD

01-24-2005, 08:07 PM	#13
Ron Bennett Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,653	Most all lower priced, relatively speaking of course, plasmas aren't true HDTV. Decent HDTV plasmas start in around the $6K range ... and that's minimum ... quality doesn't come cheap. Check the manual (or google the model number) to see what it's screen resolution is ... it's likely either going to be something like 852x480 (EDTV; a deceptive acroynm, since SD [standard definition] is really more what it is) or 1280x720 (basically the minimum to even be considered HDTV). If you truly have a HDTV plasma (1280+x720+), check your cable/sat box setup; call your provider and have them send a tech out to make the necessary adjustments. A high quality HDTV plasma will blow away just about anything else out there ... Ron __________________ Domagon - Website Management and Domain Name Sales Last edited by Ron Bennett; 01-24-2005 at 08:08 PM..

01-24-2005, 08:13 PM	#14
Midwest Shane ValMidwest rocks Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Lincoln, Nebraska Posts: 1,202	I just got a 42'' Panosonic Plasma TV it's also a widescreen and flat screen so I can put it on the wall. Now I was never really a TV person before but on the the true HD channels with the HD sound sometimes I want to go and touch the scree because it looks that real lol. I was really shocked at how good it really looked but for the ammount I paid it better. On the other hand the channels that are not HD picture and sound well there not much better then a regular TV. I did here somewhere that all stations had to be HD over the next 2 years but I am not sure if that is true. I sure hope so! Melissa __________________ ValMidWest.com MelissaMidwest.com FoxyJacky.com SweetAdri.com

01-24-2005, 09:39 PM	#15
Arousal Design Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Connecticut. Posts: 1,358	Ron I have the Sony Rear Project LCD 60" Wega something rather (newest model they have).. Thing looks gorgeous in 1080i High Def like the PBSHD channel, and certain fox/nbc shows etc... (better than DVD) But like, ESPNHD, I was just watching the syracuse game and it doesnt have the same sharpness and detail as say INHD2 ... the digital cable channels i get, look good (no noise) but have compression (mpeg/jpeg looking artifacts) the regular channels i have have no compression, but have some noise (i think thats a problem with my line strength, maybe my cable provider can fix that). I'm constantly having to swtich between wide zoom, and full modes for the HD channels that are broadcasting in 16:9 and the ones that are broadcasting in 4:3... that's annoying as well. All in all though, this TV is a beauty to watch (especially with my surround sound system and DVD's) __________________ Make Major Bank With Major Personality - NaughtyBank! Featuring NaughtyAllie and NaughtyJulie!

01-24-2005, 11:19 PM	#16
Ron Bennett Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,653	I too have the one of the newest models LCD 60" Sony WEGA's ... Many of ESPNHD's broadcasts are 4:3 superimposed centered on the screen - they have the funky side borders a lot. The cameras used make a big difference ... much of the FOX's coverage of the Eagles/Falcons game was mediocre due to poor cameras and high compression - according to some knowledgeable folks, FOX has limited satellite bandwidth for HDTV content. One would expect ESPNHD to be awesome, but the best HDTV sports I've seen so far are on ABC, CBS, and NBC - Monday Night football in particular is excellent ... shame the Superbowl is on FOX ... many folks with HDTV sets don't realize how good it can really be due to inferior equipment some networks, such as FOX, continue to use ... end of rant LOL! If you have a Motorola box, tune to the channel you want to check signal quality for and then Turn Off the box (if TV is plugged into box, be sure outlet is set to Unswitched) and then within 2 seconds click the Select button on the Remote - that will bring up a funky screen ... click Select to get to the diagnostics menu, then scroll down to In Band status and observe the numbers ... in particular the errors counts ... both should remain zero most all the time ... if either, especially the "uncorrectable" count is often showing a non-zero value, that's an indication the signal is a problem ... call for a tech to come out and redo splitters/connectors, etc; in extreme situations, the cable company may even install a special signal booster - they work very well. Lastly, in regards to 4:3 and 16:9 ... no need for zoom ... on a LCD, burn in isn't a problem - the black bars, while annoying at first, tend to be less annoying once one gets used to them; even at 4:3, the viewable screen, diagonally measured, will still be around 4 feet! Another advantage of owning a 60+" set ... even 4:3 programs, without zoom, are still quite large and easily viewable from a distance. I agree, it's definitely an awesome set - can't wait for HD-DVD to come out; I'm spoiled now - everything should be in HD. Ron __________________ Domagon - Website Management and Domain Name Sales

01-24-2005, 11:25 PM	#17
Arousal Design Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Connecticut. Posts: 1,358	I agree i can't wait for everything to be in HD. HD-DVD will be sick. My last question for our resident HD expert, Ron... On stations like, MSG or TNT, they oftentimes say they're going to broadcast a certain game in HD.. can regular channels broadcast in high def or does it have to be a high definition channel... __________________ Make Major Bank With Major Personality - NaughtyBank! Featuring NaughtyAllie and NaughtyJulie!

01-25-2005, 12:53 AM	#18
Ron Bennett Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,653	Short answer: separate channels. It would be on a "HD" channel for two reasons ... 1. analog/SD signal is very different from HD; requires much more bandwidth. 2. folks with a regular TV / standard cable box can't view HD channels; they can listen to them though LOL! My guess is they partner with another channel like ESPNHD or whatever; perhaps they have separate dedicated HD channels, but your cable company doesn't carry them. Ron __________________ Domagon - Website Management and Domain Name Sales

01-25-2005, 01:08 AM	#19
cool1g Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Hollyweird adjacent Posts: 977	i picked up last the a 42" Panasonic ED plasma....even in 480i some shows look amazing on the HD channels...NFL on CBS, all ABC/ESPN football looks great; INHD has some great stuff and HBO always looks killer. for broadcast channels...seems to depend on the program as mentioned above.... __________________ InterG Media affiliate network (dating, pay per call) EDM Life Affiliates Cash In