Ratios bad because of Free Porn? Or Bad Billing Practices?

[4Pics]

Do you think that the signup ratios are due to Tgp/Mgp/Free Sites or are they worse due to old billing practices that burned millions of members.

...

[boner 2.0]

Both

[boneprone]

You can hardly get off to free porn..

And "reality" paysites are a dime a dozen..

Too much blame put on "free" sites, and not on the over saturation of ordinary paysites..

Scrubbing and the cost containment of the billing compamies over the years have a factor in this as well. BUT Either adapt and evolve or be overtaken.. If you think things with billing are gunna get better you are wrong.

Keep in mind everyone has a paysite and paysite program now days..

The fit survive and will continue to do well.

The rest fall behind and blame thier failures on everything but themselves.

[EscortBiz]

they are bad because of the scamming website owners, surfers are scared to join because of the many sites they joined that had shit in the members area.

Take some time and join a few sites, many that people here keep on yapping about and see for yourself.

[ztik]

Because most free sites have more / better content than paysites.

Alot of people think they when they signup they are going to get fucked over (charged extra, cc stolen, ect..)it does happen to alot of them

I would say those are 2 of the main reasons

[4Pics]

Originally posted by EscortBiz
they are bad because of the scamming website owners, surfers are scared to join because of the many sites they joined that had shit in the members area.

Take some time and join a few sites, many that people here keep on yapping about and see for yourself.

Yes, but alot of this went away when Visa went to a 1% Chargeback ratio. Sure there are shit sites, but not as many as before.

[EscortBiz]

Originally posted by 4Pics
Yes, but alot of this went away when Visa went to a 1% Chargeback ratio. Sure there are shit sites, but not as many as before.

again the real reason for things not being as good is simply because the surfer doesnt trust us that much anymore, crossbilling, upsells, bullshit free trials, bad content, plugins that are everyone that make up the enitre members area, and the list goes on

[boneprone]

Originally posted by ztik
Because most free sites have more / better content than paysites.

Alot of people think they when they signup they are going to get fucked over (charged extra, cc stolen, ect..)it does happen to alot of them

I would say those are 2 of the main reasons

If your paysite's content cant compete with the free site's industry's content then you dont desirve to be in the paysite biz...

Again evolve, adapt or be overtaken..

If you cant compete with a free site, how for God's sake can you compete with the oversaturation of shitty paysites out there?

[Veterans Day]

Originally posted by boneprone
You can hardly get off to free porn..

That I highly disagree with. A person can surf your tgp's and get off 100's of times. Just like a zillion other tgp/mgp/linklists out there. The content in paysites is not much different in the grand scheme of things. Idiot webmasters craving big traffic numbers will use any content to reach xxxx amount of hits.

[boneprone]

The only free content I have on my free sites is the content of that supplied by the paysites themselves in the form of freehosted gallereis..

Its up to the paysite owner to determine how much "free" porn they want sites like my "free sites" to show to the surfer in thier galleries...

If the paysite owner shows too much in these galleries, yeah the surfer will blow thier load, and yeah loose the sale. Or if thier content is shitty and thier site looks like shit with a poor gimick the surfer is gunna move on.

But if the paysite owner does just the right balance to get the surfer intrested in thier content and gimick they will sell thier product.. I and sites like the hun, worldsex, shemp, sleazy, zilla and many others send a shitload of signups to paysites who have adapted to this dynamic..

Those who have not dont....

There are a lot of shitty tgps that yeah do show much.. But just with the shitty paysites, they too have to evolve and adapt or be overtaken.. Yeah those tgps may have a lot of traffic, but they cant sell shit.... They cant and wont last...

We are all in this biz to make m.oney, and even with tgps as with paysites, if they dont figure out how to evolve and make sales they will be taken out by the Darwinism that exists in our industry..

[detoxed]

Who has bad ratios?

[Veterans Day]

Originally posted by boneprone
The only free content I have on my free sites is the content of that supplied by the paysites themselves in the form of freehosted gallereis..

Its up to the paysite owner to determine how much "free" porn they want sites like my "free sites" to show to the surfer in thier galleries...

If the paysite owner shows too much in these galleries, yeah the surfer will blow thier load, and yeah loose the sale. Or if thier content is shitty and thier site looks like shit with a poor gimick the surfer is gunna move on.

But if the paysite owner does just the right balance to get the surfer intrested in thier content and gimick they will sell thier product.. I and sites like the hun, worldsex, shemp, sleazy, zilla and many others send a shitload of signups to paysites who have adapted to this dynamic..

Those who have not dont....

the percentage of tgp/mgp that adhere to this philosophy and perform is so miniscule.

[boneprone]

The modern day black man.....

What was once blamed by the hard working white man for taking his women and taking his jobs, the black man of the modern era is now that of the tgps and mgps.

You crackers are just scared.. Scared of N1ggers like me.

I fuck your women, take your traffic, and take your sales..

Bow to the Power bitches..

Im the new N1gger in town.

[European Lee]

Ratios are bad because the sites that we, as webmasters send our traffic to are not built to convert or retain the surfer.

They are built to make the program owner money, nothing more, nothing less.

Regards,

Lee

[Kimmykim]

Eventually we're going to run out of "fresh" surfers. With that fact alone, ratios will go to hell.

That's before you add in all the spyware apps that are replacing ref codes and worse. I'm not classifying ANYONE in particular as doing this, I don't care who's doing it and I don't want to know who's doing it. But at the end of the day, if I were to guess, I'd say upwards of 30% of referral code links are probably being replaced with something else.

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Originally posted by Kimmykim
Eventually we're going to run out of "fresh" surfers. With that fact alone, ratios will go to hell.

That's before you add in all the spyware apps that are replacing ref codes and worse. I'm not classifying ANYONE in particular as doing this, I don't care who's doing it and I don't want to know who's doing it. But at the end of the day, if I were to guess, I'd say upwards of 30% of referral code links are probably being replaced with something else.

This is indeed happening.

[Kimmykim]

Originally posted by AlienQ

This is indeed happening.

Oh, absolutely. You couple that with the more than over abundance of affiliates in this industry and there's no way that affiliate sales can't be hurting. Smaller pieces of a shrinking pie.

Same thing for site owners, just on a larger scale.

I'd bet I can count on one hand the number of sponsors doing 2500+ sales a day without cross-sales and other tricks. Two or three years ago I could count them on two hands, yes, but it still took two hands.

[hydro]

porn pics and vids is the past. The new thing is live webcams and adult personals like adult friend finder.

[chatradio]

content content and more content.
we have been seeing nice retention numbers with ourmembers area latley. It has an easy explorer type navigation window.
we wre also going to add a live nude mebers area host as well.
veryimportanr to make sure they have thebupto date players too.
our members area prompts new subscribers to download the latest quick timeand windows player. we spend a lot of time updating the members area and are always adding new content.
this helpscretention alot

[onlymovies]

Originally posted by EscortBiz
they are bad because of the scamming website owners, surfers are scared to join because of the many sites they joined that had shit in the members area.

Take some time and join a few sites, many that people here keep on yapping about and see for yourself.

[onlymovies]

Originally posted by ztik
Because most free sites have more / better content than paysites.

That's usally not an issue with some well built recurring sites out there. It really depends which paysites/business model your referring to. Pay per signup and recurring are two totally different business models. Sure lots of paysite are pure junk, but that's partially because most webmasters want the instant gratification of a pay per signup. For me though, since my primary model is recurring, I always view the members area before sending traffic. And these paysites with a good members area always outshine any tgp/mgp with tons more content and always have the best ratios/recurring....at least from my experiences.

[boneprone]

Reel Profits is an example of how a paysite program should be like.

Equally so for thier MGP site onlymovies.

They are indeed the evolved man, in a caveman world of webmasters and programs.

[iwantu]

Market saturation!

Simple rule of demand and offer

Thanks god our conversions and retentions have only been getting better and better year after year though! ;-)

[onlymovies]

Originally posted by boneprone
Reel Profits is an example of how a paysite program should be like.

Equally so for thier MGP site onlymovies.

They are indeed the evolved man, in a caveman world of webmasters and programs.

Appreciate the vote of confidence bro.

Our bread and butter at reelprofits IS retention, nothing more. If we don't recur members, we don't make money and our affiliates don't make money. And no, we don't make up for any lost recurring by tons of exits, upsells, cross sells, or any of that shit. Last thing we want to do is be caught up in that trap of fancy gimmics and having to rely on them (been there, done that). So our members better recur...and keep recurring. It's as simple as that and is all we focus on, period. That's our model.

There are many other programs that focus on this as well. And these are the diamond in the rough programs for anyone looking for awesome retention...programs like NScash, Bangbros, hahaha, BrainCash, Duke Dollars, VideosZ, ...programs who give what they say and have tons of happy members. Awesome ratios that usually translates into awesome rentention.

[onlymovies]

Originally posted by 4Pics
Do you think that the signup ratios are due to Tgp/Mgp/Free Sites or are they worse due to old billing practices that burned millions of members.

...

And to answer the original question about TGP's/MGP's helping lower ratios, i certainly don't see it. Obviously if free sites didn't exist at all on the web, people wouldn't have a choice but to pay for porn. But i'm perfectly happy with the current ratios. And after years of crunching numbers, i haven't seen any indication over the past few years that would indicate any major change in the marketplace.

As for deceptive billing practices being a cause, don't have any data that would justify an opinion.

[bret]

Originally posted by boneprone
You can hardly get off to free porn..

And "reality" paysites are a dime a dozen..

Too much blame put on "free" sites, and not on the over saturation of ordinary paysites..

Scrubbing and the cost containment of the billing compamies over the years have a factor in this as well. BUT Either adapt and evolve or be overtaken.. If you think things with billing are gunna get better you are wrong.

Keep in mind everyone has a paysite and paysite program now days..

The fit survive and will continue to do well.

The rest fall behind and blame thier failures on everything but themselves.

of course if you offer something unique you will do well.

but to argue that free porn does not kill sales is rediculous.

free porn kills sales . (period)

there is enough variety and with a google savy surfer, enough content to get just about anyone off.

ask yourself, would you pay for porn (knowing you can get it for free)?

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Originally posted by boneprone
Reel Profits is an example of how a paysite program should be like.

Equally so for thier MGP site onlymovies.

They are indeed the evolved man, in a caveman world of webmasters and programs.

THis is true.

Fade and his folks have paid there dues not to mention great guys. Thats fucken RARE!

[onlymovies]

Originally posted by bret
of course if you offer something unique you will do well.

but to argue that free porn does not kill sales is rediculous.

free porn kills sales . (period)

there is enough variety and with a google savy surfer, enough content to get just about anyone off.

ask yourself, would you pay for porn (knowing you can get it for free)?

Free porn kill sales if it's not marketed properly. Free porn is a tool, nothing more. And like everything else, tools can be abused.

Your analogy about people not buying porn because you can get it for free, is flawed. Reason being, everyone is different. A few free pics or movies that can be satisfactory to you, might not be satisfactory to the next guy. If we we're all satisfied by the amount of free porn out there, who are all these mysterious buyers? The question you should ask is weather the most basic human psychological element of 'wanting more' plays a viable part in porn. In my opinion, it certainly does.

Generally speaking, human nature itself will lead the surfer to wanting more. For instance...you have some surfers who can get off a 10-30 sec video clip. But give it some time and that 30 sec video clip won't be enough to satisfy after a while. He'll fight the urge to want more, but eventually he'll break down and buy a membership looking for a better fix/thrill. Some may take longer then others. I'm not at all saying this is how it is, but just a general opinion.

[bigdog]

Originally posted by Kimmykim
Eventually we're going to run out of "fresh" surfers. With that fact alone, ratios will go to hell.

That's before you add in all the spyware apps that are replacing ref codes and worse. I'm not classifying ANYONE in particular as doing this, I don't care who's doing it and I don't want to know who's doing it. But at the end of the day, if I were to guess, I'd say upwards of 30% of referral code links are probably being replaced with something else.

Damn didn't realize spyware was that bad these days.

[detoxed]

We wont run out of fresh surfers. People will never stop turning 18 and getting bank accounts and credit cards and moving into dorms with internet access.
Some people in the US today still dont even have telephone. 10 years from now people will still be just getting the internet. More and more will use the internet every day. Broadband is not available in a lot of the US in small towns. I sure as hell wouldnt pay for porn on dialup.

Wanna know why there are less sponsors doing 2500 sales a day? Because there are MORE and more doing 100 a day. Doesnt mean there is less potential out there, and maybe its better to own 10 affiliate programs each doing 250 sales a day, than 1 doing 2500 a day.