Taz

Merde!!To those of you who think France rolled over during WWII...GFY...and then go spend some time reading a bit of history.

It was an occupied country taken over just like many others in the area.
Do you know anything at all about how critical the French Underground was to the US? Do you know anything at all about having someone roust you out of your home by setting it on fire? Do you know what it's like to be herded out onto the road with the women & girls on one side and the men & boys on the other and watch as those men & boys are gunned down in front of you. Do you know anything about being on forced marches with only custard to eat for weeks on end? Do you know anything about having a machine gun pointed in your face? Did you know that massive amounts of French civilian deaths during that war were caused by US bombers?

Most countries in Europe think Americans have their collective heads up their asses, the French people in general just don't hide the fact they think it. Hell, most Europeans speak more than one language fluently and English is mandatory in French schools from an early age, can we say the same here concerning other languages? I see Americans being insulting all the time to foreigners who are here and don't speak English, yet you blame the French for doing the same thing when you visit their country and expect them to speak English to you.

Yes, France will stand beside the US. Yes, France will be looking out for the safety of it's people as will the majority of other countries that will be shoulder to shoulder in this and I don't blame any of them one damn bit for taking that attitude.

Blessed Be to those who lost their lives in the terrorist attacks, but the US acts as if terrorism is something new only because it finally, tragically happened on home turf. The rest of the world has been dealing with what we sadly experienced first hand for years and we never got very upset about it since it was "over there". Who the hell are we to become upset when they take the attitude that it was "over there".

Peace,

drumsicle

BULLSHIT!!! Our embassies and ships have been getting it for years. Another one with the European superiority complex. I and most Americans don't give a fuck what you think of us. You hate us yet you climb over yourselves to come here.

TSB

One thing nobody mentioned. Algeria, which is now under islamic influence, was once owned by France. So now, something like 20% of France's population is of Arabic or islamic descent. More Islamic bombs have exploded in France and in Europe than in the US in the last 100 years. It's not a new problem for them, but rather a problem they've always feared because of their geographical and demographic situation.

Yes France agrees we (the coalition) all have to fight terrorism, but it must not be an american war.

Merci à la France pour votre support!

Sjayne

Name more than 10 non-wartime attacks on an American ship or Embassy in the past 10 years?

I can think of maybe half a dozen. Though I am totally willing to be corrected as that is part of learning. The two african bombings, the ship late last year? The Saudi base a few years back? Which other ones?

And as far as I am aware none of them involved France. Infact most of them involved the exact same people we are going after right now.

Try the decades it has been happening in the rest of the world.

Also, I don't know many French people that are climbing over each other to get to the States. Not everyone outside of the States is gagging to be American. Know why? Because the places they live are just as good. They have freedom of speech and all that good stuff.

Human rights aren't the sole property of the US.

Also, I think we better start caring what people think of us. I am not saying we should change to fit what other nations want us to be. Of course I am not saying that but we do ALOT of cultural impearlism around the world. The French get too anal about that but they are just acting out with how the the majority of the world (even our friends) feel at one level or another.

In some countries it is just the fact that Jerry Springer keeps popping up and annoying people and in others it is the States (the gov't) trying to change their politcal systems.

I mean look at the ignorance to REAL history shown in this thread. Can you blame other countries for getting a bit pissed off at stuff like that? We demand they be our 'friends' but that should require us showing them a bit of respect in return.


[This message has been edited by Sjayne (edited 09-17-2001).]

Sjayne

double post..again for some reason

[This message has been edited by Sjayne (edited 09-17-2001).]

Sjayne

uh that was weird.double post type thing

the indigo

80% is the pourcentage of people in usa that want vangeance and agree to kill more innocents and attack a whole country to get a "suspect". Get out, wake up, usa is nothing more than another country in the world. Nothing more.

Amputate Your Head

Again with the 80% shit... I think 80% of your brain cavity is empty.

Kimmykim

Reality is pretty much that the last time the French won a war, Napoleon was at the helm and look what they did to him.

Paris is one of my favorite cities ever, but the French produce fighters that are about the caliber of a bad night on Survivor.

Personally I'd say the problem is that they just don't commit to battle -- or it could be that 80% of their fighters think like that blue guy posting here...

Sjayne

No. Indigo is just being an agressive moron.

drumsicle

More bullshit! Because it has happened to other people more often or longer, our dead don't matter? BULLSHIT!

You say we ought to start caring about what people think of us. Who's us.

Frankly I'm tired of people hating on the US, they can lick my balls.

drumsicle

I don't find it impressive at all. What the hell were we even doing it that war? If we had a real president at the time, I doubt we would have even been there.

Taz

Another one with the European superiority complex. I and most Americans don't give a fuck what you think of us. You hate us yet you climb over yourselves to come here.
**********

Well, actually drumsicle I think you just proved yourself to be a bigot.

Which just illuminates the exact reason why most of the world, whether in the open or behind closed doors, feels ill will towards America since there are a lot of others just like you running around the countryside.

There's a very big difference between national pride and ethnic intolerance, I just hope you can one day learn what it is.

Taz

Personally I'd say the problem is that they just don't commit to battle -- or it could be that 80% of their fighters think like that blue guy posting here...
**********

KK, or it could possibly be that they've seen enough fighting during the past 100 years that have decimated their country and they don't care to see any more loss of life.

WWI
total troops mobilized
France- 8,410,000
total troop casualities
France- 6,160,800

WWII
France- Military- 340,000
France- Civilian- 470,000
total casualities-810,000

Korea - as a UN force
total troops mobilized
France - 3,421
total casualities
France - 1,656

drumsicle

Actually you just proved yourself a bigot.

Anyway, they sure don't hate us when they need help.

You and any other bigots who don't like Americans can go to hell!

Big Ben

drumsicle I think you need to realize that all of the countries in the world are in the same pot. And if someone shit in it, it effects all.

Aussie

Well you guys can luv 'em or hate them.

Don't you just love the way the say YES !

Sjayne

No of course not but their lives aren't worth less than Americans either.

And 'us' is the United States because I am American.

Sjayne

I think the difference in attitudes would be amazing if every American spent one year living in a diffferent country.

Not as a soldier on a base somewhere but rather as a member of their society. While they are at it maybe they would watch and read the news when they are there and see how little we are told as Americans.

I know it changed my view on the world.

drumsicle

Uh I knew that!

Taz

drumsicle,
Are you really this myopic?? A bigot is one who is intolerant of others. Nowhere have I been intolerant of you or anyone else. I simply pointed out the image being seen of the USA from the rest of the world. You took offense to that.

As to saying there are a lot of others who think the way you do running around the American countryside full of ethnic intolerance, that's been proven again and again recently in the news reports convering the attacks against US citizens who happen to be middle eastern in appearance or follow middles eastern based religions. So in that, I'm just stating facts.

What continues to amaze and amuse me is the fact that you say, (1) I don't like Americans and you have assumed that, (2) I'm European. To the first one, I just grin and to the second one I have to say thanks, since that means I have a expanded outlook on life. So how about you open your eyes and take a look at the world around you as it really exists. News flash, reality check, the world doesn't revolve around the USA. The US simply plays it's role in the whole global equasion.

So would it surprise you to know I was born here and raised in the south and can trace my paternal ancestors back to the American Revolution. That I've had family fight in the Revolution, both sides of the Civil War, WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam and the Gulf Conflict. That maybe I know so much about what the French went through during WWII because my father fought at the Battle of the Bulge and my mother is French and was in the Underground Resistance during WWII and has been a US citizen since 1949. Every question I asked about war in my initial post are things my mom went through.

As I stated before, you really need to learn exactly what national pride is all about. You may puff out your chest and be proud to be an American, but you still don't understand what that really means. National pride is the celebration of the blood, sweat and tears that built this country, from all the people of all the different nationalities involved in that building.

America is diverse in it's ethnic makeup, that's one of the foundations of the country. The people in NY that died were from a variety of ethnic background themselves. Sixty-two countries lost lives in NY. Maybe someday you'll see that it's not only a US tragedy, it's a world tragedy and it's one that the world unfortunately is used to dealing with. So to lash out at people from other countries is to deny them their losses, to belittle their grief and to lessen the value of the family members they no longer have either.

I'm as angry as the next person that it happened, but I'm not angry at a people, I'm angry at a concept. The concept that some humans condone,support and embrace the use of mass terror and murder to further their agendas without thought to the value of the lives they will effect.

And so I leave you with these thoughts:

"Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them."Apostle Matthew

"Not one of you is a believer until he loves for his brother what he loves for himself." Muhammad (pbuh)

"An it harm none, do what thou wilt." The Wiccan Rede

"To be able to judge of others by what is nigh in ourselves;-this may be called the art of virtue." Confucius

Amputate Your Head

"Adrian!" - Rocky Balboa.

-=HUNGRYMAN=-

Qui les soins ... Quand été la dernière fois vous avez entendu parler des français pied de coup d'un qui donne n'importe qui derrière ?!?

Aller Fuck Vous !!


(Who cares ... When was the last time you heard about the French kicking anybody's ass ?!?)

------------------
We're Comin' To Get Ya !!!
The Black Sheep of the Boneprone Family
I like to rub lemon jelly on my nipples



[This message has been edited by -=HUNGRYMAN=- (edited 09-19-2001).]

Kimmykim

Yup, I told you the last time they won a battle was when Napoleon was in charge.

shunga

Weren't the French hit by suicide bombers in Lebanon in 1982 (or was it 1983..?) at the same time the US Marines were hit..?

Sjayne

Just a thought - what was the last war that the US won where the French weren't involved?

Taz...beautiful post and tell your mother that some of think she and those like her are heros.

drumsicle

Ok and you keep telling me how the Europeans are superior, and look down at Americans...So it is you that makes the case that Europeans are bigots, not me.

And you support their view.

<sarcasm>I bow to you superior sensitivity and broad views. </sarcasm>

Aussie

Just some light reading....

Apocalypse/Armageddon?
Selected Prophecies of Nostradamus http://www.dreamscape.com/morgana/titan.htm

We all know this by now

Century 6, Quatrain 97
The sky will burn at forty-five degrees latitude,
Fire approaches the great new city [New York City lies between 40-45 degrees]
Immediately a huge, scattered flame leaps up
When they want to have verification from the Normans [French].

What I don't understand nowadays with all the Psychics around why did this happen.
Just look in your local paper you will find them all, not 1 contacted the media warning of this......Why ?

They only charge $5.40 a minute if you want to speak to them.

JeanClaude VanDamme

Time for a FRENCH to speak...
Nice to see all of you saying what you think about my country ! I understand the ones who do not like us and i thank the one who like us...

To answer the topic's subject : France will be with the us and other countries in the international coalition !

If you want my point of view about usa from France, i think that many French guys think that usa is a great country but also something like "we're god, you're nothing" (not only for france but usa think that there is only one country in the world)

I was recently in Argentina (Buenos-Aires) i met an arizona guy telling me that France and Sweden has a common border !!! that's everything, lots of american are not "open minded" it means that they eat american, they drive american, they sleep american, they think american, they fuck american, they understand amercian... Only Amercian but nothing else !

I think, personally, that all of you should try to think in another way... Just to discover other culture, other way of life other things...

I'm not trying to say that usa are shit, not really, i told you before that i though that usa was a great country but if you can, please, try to understand that there are other countries in the world and try to understand that many people live outside of the us it would be a great step for everybody !

I hope you understood everything i wrote, because as i told you i'm French and my english is not really good at all !

Ps : -=HUNGRYMAN=- your French is as bad as my english... but you are trying and that's why i said, you're tring to be open minded that's a great thing ! Thanks for trying to speak french guy !

Dieu bénisse l'amérique - god bless amercia

-=HUNGRYMAN=-

Jean Claude :

Canadian Quebequois French is very different from Parisian French ... you would probably say very slang and lazy french ... often peppered with many english words too !

A better name for our francophone language would be FRENGLISH

OH FUCK !!! The language police are gonna ass fuck me now !!!

------------------
We're Comin' To Get Ya !!!
The Black Sheep of the Boneprone Family
I like to rub lemon jelly on my nipples :D

Sjayne

Just to say that you all should watch your news today. If it isn't reported then all American press needs to examine itsself.

The French leader visited Washington today. The first leader to meet Bush since the attacks. Tony Blair will be there tomorrow. France pledged full support right there in the White House.