What are you guys in UK doing? - GoFuckYourself.com

Rose · 09-16-2001, 09:38 PM

http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/p...usa01086.html?

DaveKnell · 09-17-2001, 12:50 AM

We've been having a bit of a debate over this sort of thing. We might not have a constitution with a First Amendment, but we still have a society where (within certain limits) citizens are free openly to express their views. So we have a small lunatic Muslim fringe, one of whom is quoted in the article: "The aim of everyone here today and all Muslims in the world should be to achieve martyrdom in the defence of Islam." There'll be a couple of letters in the Times today, I predict, from Muslims pointing out that this sort of thing is as twisted a take on Islam as the Crusades were on Christianity and that these guys are utterly unrepresentative of the vast majority of our Islamic population. Which, thankfully, is true.

At the risk of fanning a fire, I'd observe that it wasn't too long ago that the Irish Republican Army (a terrorist group responsible, inter alia, for the killing of 11 musicians just down the road from here when they blew up a bandstand in 1989) was largely funded by Noraid. According to their website (at http://www.noraid.com), "Noraid is an Irish American support group registered and recognized by the US Government in good standing."

Freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom to express one's ideas, whatever they may be, are part of being a liberal democracy. Would we rather live in Afghanistan, where the Taleban do their best to suppress any ideas, thoughts or expression which don't conform to their fundamentalist Islamic ideals?

Dave

Thricedead · 09-17-2001, 02:02 AM

Very well put Sir,

------------------
I wonder what it's like
to be forgetful?

tenletters · 09-17-2001, 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DaveKnell:

Freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom to express one's ideas, whatever they may be, are part of being a liberal democracy. Would we rather live in Afghanistan, where the Taleban do their best to suppress any ideas, thoughts or expression which don't conform to their fundamentalist Islamic ideals?

Dave

Dave, I'm afraid you have confused freedom of speech with terroristic threats.

You and I can hold meetings all day long saying how much we dislike each other, think the other is a moron.. but when it comes to me telling my people to stick a car bomb under your pinto... it becomes more than just talk. That is a threat.

Guess you don't feel that way because there really aren't "Dave must die" meetings.

Sjayne · 09-17-2001, 04:19 AM

Dave that was perfect.

Guys..I am sure meetings like this are being held in places in the States too. After all these terrorists were living within the States and they can't be the only ones.

The British are behind the States. They have been wonderful.

Read this to see my first hand experiance of the British this week: http://www.digitalbuyingguide.com/today/

There were Nazi meetings in the States durring WW2. I am sure in your life you have seen the footage of them. I am glad that if these meetings are going to be held that they are reported. That way you know where people with these views are hiding.

I think the IRA question is one that will come up a lot more when things calm down. Just like Dave is near the bandstand, I can see Canary Warf from my window. All Brits will know about that being hit by the IRA. A tall builing hit by terrorism..sounds familiar. Yet in the bars of Boston (and I lived in Bostona and I love the place) people gave money to the IRA that night.

In every society there are idiots. Don't look for enemies where they aren't.

Rose · 09-17-2001, 09:28 AM

People like that should be kicked out of any civilised country.
I can hear screaming "Discrimination".
I am all for discrimination against terrorist
and their supporters.

Sjayne · 09-17-2001, 09:34 AM

This story has been in the news over here today. Those that are citizens cant be kicked out but they can be monitored. If they are citizens you can't send them home because as much as we may not like it they are home. However, they have been told to shut up or they will not get any protection.

Also a number of Islamic places of worship have publicly banned members of these groups from entering their building and therefore trying to 'convert' other muslims.

Rose · 09-17-2001, 09:36 AM

Naturalized citizens can be kicked out of country.Their citizenship can be taken away

Sjayne · 09-17-2001, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rose:
Naturalized citizens can be kicked out of country.Their citizenship can be taken away

Kicked out to where? We aren't exactly in the position right this moment to negotiate repatriation with enemy countries.

What is Canada doing about their extrimists?

Sjayne · 09-17-2001, 09:42 AM

And also you are assuming they are naturalized. Many were born here - second generation.

Rose · 09-17-2001, 09:46 AM

Canada kicked out few people(not relating
to NYC bombing).They didnt tell the truth
about their criminal past on their citizenship aplication

Rose · 09-17-2001, 09:49 AM

Most I study about Islam fanatics,more
I think they should be wiped out,no matter where they live US, Canada, UK, Afghanistan...)with any means available.

09-16-2001, 09:38 PM	#1
Rose Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: ON,Canada Posts: 1,456	What are you guys in UK doing? http://www.sunday-times.co.uk/news/p...usa01086.html?

09-17-2001, 12:50 AM	#2
DaveKnell Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: London, England Posts: 76	We've been having a bit of a debate over this sort of thing. We might not have a constitution with a First Amendment, but we still have a society where (within certain limits) citizens are free openly to express their views. So we have a small lunatic Muslim fringe, one of whom is quoted in the article: "The aim of everyone here today and all Muslims in the world should be to achieve martyrdom in the defence of Islam." There'll be a couple of letters in the Times today, I predict, from Muslims pointing out that this sort of thing is as twisted a take on Islam as the Crusades were on Christianity and that these guys are utterly unrepresentative of the vast majority of our Islamic population. Which, thankfully, is true. At the risk of fanning a fire, I'd observe that it wasn't too long ago that the Irish Republican Army (a terrorist group responsible, inter alia, for the killing of 11 musicians just down the road from here when they blew up a bandstand in 1989) was largely funded by Noraid. According to their website (at http://www.noraid.com), "Noraid is an Irish American support group registered and recognized by the US Government in good standing." Freedom of speech, freedom of association and freedom to express one's ideas, whatever they may be, are part of being a liberal democracy. Would we rather live in Afghanistan, where the Taleban do their best to suppress any ideas, thoughts or expression which don't conform to their fundamentalist Islamic ideals? Dave

09-17-2001, 02:02 AM	#3
Thricedead Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: hereabouts Posts: 211	Very well put Sir, ------------------ I wonder what it's like to be forgetful?

09-17-2001, 04:19 AM	#5
Sjayne Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 1,182	Dave that was perfect. Guys..I am sure meetings like this are being held in places in the States too. After all these terrorists were living within the States and they can't be the only ones. The British are behind the States. They have been wonderful. Read this to see my first hand experiance of the British this week: http://www.digitalbuyingguide.com/today/ There were Nazi meetings in the States durring WW2. I am sure in your life you have seen the footage of them. I am glad that if these meetings are going to be held that they are reported. That way you know where people with these views are hiding. I think the IRA question is one that will come up a lot more when things calm down. Just like Dave is near the bandstand, I can see Canary Warf from my window. All Brits will know about that being hit by the IRA. A tall builing hit by terrorism..sounds familiar. Yet in the bars of Boston (and I lived in Bostona and I love the place) people gave money to the IRA that night. In every society there are idiots. Don't look for enemies where they aren't.

09-17-2001, 09:28 AM	#6
Rose Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: ON,Canada Posts: 1,456	People like that should be kicked out of any civilised country. I can hear screaming "Discrimination". I am all for discrimination against terrorist and their supporters.

09-17-2001, 09:34 AM	#7
Sjayne Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 1,182	This story has been in the news over here today. Those that are citizens cant be kicked out but they can be monitored. If they are citizens you can't send them home because as much as we may not like it they are home. However, they have been told to shut up or they will not get any protection. Also a number of Islamic places of worship have publicly banned members of these groups from entering their building and therefore trying to 'convert' other muslims.

09-17-2001, 09:36 AM	#8
Rose Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: ON,Canada Posts: 1,456	Naturalized citizens can be kicked out of country.Their citizenship can be taken away

09-17-2001, 09:42 AM	#10
Sjayne Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 1,182	And also you are assuming they are naturalized. Many were born here - second generation.

09-17-2001, 09:46 AM	#11
Rose Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: ON,Canada Posts: 1,456	Canada kicked out few people(not relating to NYC bombing).They didnt tell the truth about their criminal past on their citizenship aplication

09-17-2001, 09:49 AM	#12
Rose Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: ON,Canada Posts: 1,456	Most I study about Islam fanatics,more I think they should be wiped out,no matter where they live US, Canada, UK, Afghanistan...)with any means available.