Antigua Won! WTO Says US Can't Ban Internet Gambling. - GoFuckYourself.com

KRL · 11-10-2004, 10:50 PM

WASHINGTON (AFP) - Antigua and Barbuda beat long odds as the World Trade Organization confirmed a ruling that a ban in the United States on Internet gambling violates global trading rules.

The Geneva-based WTO, in a report released Wednesday, held that the US ban on web gambling is effectively an unfair trade barrier that hurts the gaming industry of the tiny two-island Caribbean nation.

US prohibitions on Internet gambling "are inconsistent with US obligations" under the 1995 General Agreement on Tariffs and Services, the WTO panel wrote in Geneva, affirming an interim decision in March.

In a statement, Antigua welcomed the decision and called it "reminiscent of the story of David and Goliath."

But Richard Mills of the office of the US Trade Representative called the decision "deeply flawed" and pointed out that Washington "clearly intended to exclude gambling from US services commitments" when the agreements were negotiated.

"We will vigorously appeal this deeply flawed report to the WTO Appellate Body and remain confident in the basis for reversing this panel report," he said.

A senior US trade official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that if the US appeal fails, Washington may simply revise its commitment under the GATS agreement to exclude gambling.

"The parties do retain rights to make changes under GATS," the official said.

The WTO panel ruling acknowledged that Washington may have intended to exclude gambling from the treaty but that Internet gambling is covered under the services agreement of global trade agreements.

"We have, therefore, some sympathy with the United States' point in this regard," the WTO panel wrote.

"However, the scope of a specific commitment cannot depend upon what a member intended or did not intend to do at the time of the negotiations."

A patchwork of regulations in US states regulate gambling, while federal laws ban any form of "interstate" betting. US Justice Department officials contend that any Internet gambling is illegal, but prosecution has been spotty.

Antigua argued that since many forms of wagering are permitted in the United States -- such as casino gambling in Las Vegas and elsewhere and horse track betting -- that a ban on gambling from "remote" gambling from the Internet was unfair.

The senior US official rejected this argument, saying, "I don't think it's fair to say because there's gambling in Las Vegas it undermines a ban on Internet gambling, where you could have minors participating."

The official added that because this ban applies to US and non-US gaming operators, "Antigua and Barbuda is not being treated any differently from any US company."

Washington also maintained that GATS allows each member country latitude in regulating "public morals."

But the WTO wrote that the arguments from Washington carry less weight because of the wide variety of gambling options that are legal in the United States.

Antigua had claimed it lost more than 90 million dollars and 4,000 jobs because of the US ban.

"The United States has taken an aggressive approach to betting services based overseas," the government said in a statement.

"However, the US government raises significant revenue from betting services within its own borders and the Interactive Gaming Council (trade group) suggests the United States is home to at least half the worldwide online gaming market."

"The US says it wants open competition," said Ronald Sanders, Antigua's former WTO ambassador.

"But it only wants free trade when it suits the US."

hershie · 11-10-2004, 11:03 PM

Here's the story from The New York Times:

November 11, 2004
W.T.O. Explains Ruling Against U.S. Internet Gambling Ban
By MATT RICHTEL

The World Trade Organization explained yesterday why it had ruled that the United States violated its international trade obligations by prohibiting Americans from gambling over the Internet.

A W.T.O. panel that resolves disputes among members gave specific reasons behind the decision, which was issued last March. At the time, the Department of Justice vowed to appeal the ruling and several members of Congress angrily asserted the decision was equivalent to having the rest of the world dictate United States policy.

In its explanation, the W.T.O. said it was not seeking to undermine the ability of the United States, or any of its members, to regulate industry within its borders. Rather, the panel said that the United States policy prohibiting Internet gambling was inconsistent with longstanding trade agreements.

The ruling stems from a case brought in June 2003 by the Caribbean island nation of Antigua and Barbuda. It argued that United States trade policy did not prohibit Internet gambling and that to do so would be hypocritical given the huge overseas presence of American gambling enterprises.

The ruling allowed Antigua and Barbuda to issue trade sanctions against the United States, said Sebastian Sinclair, an Internet gambling industry analyst with Christiansen Capital Advisors. But Mr. Sinclair said it would be unlikely that such sanctions would have any effect.

He said the larger issue was whether another, larger nation might use the ruling to challenge the United States' policy. And he said that the decision underscored a larger problem: that the United States is markedly out of step with many other nations, which not only allow Internet gambling but license and authorize Internet casinos within their shores.

Despite prohibitions against Internet gambling in the United States, millions of Americans participate in the activity, using credit cards or online payment services to wager on sports or games like poker, blackjack and roulette. Americans will be responsible for about half of the $7.6 billion lost this year on Internet wagers, Mr. Sinclair said.

The effort to regulate and prohibit Internet gambling has been particularly tricky for the United States because the operations are based overseas and players are logging on from home.

Mr. Sinclair said the challenges were similar to those facing the music industry, which has struggled to fight piracy over the Internet.

CyberTraffic · 11-10-2004, 11:34 PM

Does that mean sites like Google will allow it on their advertising again?

BoNgHiTtA · 11-10-2004, 11:37 PM

Well I guess we better go liberate the Antiqua people from there opressive government then.

I heard they had WMD

polish_aristocrat · 11-11-2004, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CyberTraffic
Does that mean sites like Google will allow it on their advertising again?

slavdogg · 11-11-2004, 03:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CyberTraffic
Does that mean sites like Google will allow it on their advertising again?

i doubt it
findwhat just pulled their gambling links or is about to
you can still buy gambling traffic from roar.com and espotting.com

BRISK · 11-11-2004, 03:39 AM

Am I the only one who's reading this and wondering why the "Land of the Free" is the one fighting to restrict the freedoms of its citizens, and Antigua is the one saying "C'mon man! Let the people gamble if they want to!"?

Here's a quote I like from Dave Matthews:

"For a country that's obsessed by its freedoms, it's amazing how much time we spend whittling away at them."

pornstar2pac · 11-11-2004, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by slavdogg
i doubt it
findwhat just pulled their gambling links or is about to
you can still buy gambling traffic from roar.com and espotting.com

When Party Poker goes public, that's when you will see some kind of reaction from the feds.

$3 Billion IPO

Spunky · 11-11-2004, 08:33 PM

Good news indeed

pornstar2pac · 11-11-2004, 08:49 PM

This is Antigua. I loved living down there. will go back soon

crockett · 11-11-2004, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pornstar2pac

This is Antigua. I loved living down there. will go back soon

nice looking pic.. what's the cost of living there and how's the internet access?

Fletch XXX · 11-11-2004, 09:42 PM

FlyingIguana · 11-11-2004, 09:52 PM

the states should have embraced online gaming instead of forcing companies to start up on the islands.

they cry like babies when they lose out on money

pornstar2pac · 11-11-2004, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crockett
nice looking pic.. what's the cost of living there and how's the internet access?

cost a shitload of money to live there and internet access cost money.

It's a place I will return too that's for sure

Paul Markham · 11-11-2004, 10:57 PM

So what are the chances of banning porn?

A lot less I would say.

detoxed · 11-11-2004, 10:59 PM

USA is appealing the decision of course....

pornstar2pac · 11-12-2004, 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by detoxed
USA is appealing the decision of course....

in 6 months they will see they are losing billions of dollars in tax rev. and will decide it's time to "Regulate It)

Webby · 11-12-2004, 04:17 AM

Damned skippy!!

This has been going on for years and time and again the US kept up shit to kill it - clearly absurd conduct for a supposed civilized country.

When I lived there the Anitguan govt verbal, at that time to Janet Reno, was "Why don't you run your bannana republic and leave this country to manage it's own affairs?"

11-10-2004, 10:50 PM	#1
KRL Entrepreneur Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 31,429	Antigua Won! WTO Says US Can't Ban Internet Gambling. WASHINGTON (AFP) - Antigua and Barbuda beat long odds as the World Trade Organization confirmed a ruling that a ban in the United States on Internet gambling violates global trading rules. The Geneva-based WTO, in a report released Wednesday, held that the US ban on web gambling is effectively an unfair trade barrier that hurts the gaming industry of the tiny two-island Caribbean nation. US prohibitions on Internet gambling "are inconsistent with US obligations" under the 1995 General Agreement on Tariffs and Services, the WTO panel wrote in Geneva, affirming an interim decision in March. In a statement, Antigua welcomed the decision and called it "reminiscent of the story of David and Goliath." But Richard Mills of the office of the US Trade Representative called the decision "deeply flawed" and pointed out that Washington "clearly intended to exclude gambling from US services commitments" when the agreements were negotiated. "We will vigorously appeal this deeply flawed report to the WTO Appellate Body and remain confident in the basis for reversing this panel report," he said. A senior US trade official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that if the US appeal fails, Washington may simply revise its commitment under the GATS agreement to exclude gambling. "The parties do retain rights to make changes under GATS," the official said. The WTO panel ruling acknowledged that Washington may have intended to exclude gambling from the treaty but that Internet gambling is covered under the services agreement of global trade agreements. "We have, therefore, some sympathy with the United States' point in this regard," the WTO panel wrote. "However, the scope of a specific commitment cannot depend upon what a member intended or did not intend to do at the time of the negotiations." A patchwork of regulations in US states regulate gambling, while federal laws ban any form of "interstate" betting. US Justice Department officials contend that any Internet gambling is illegal, but prosecution has been spotty. Antigua argued that since many forms of wagering are permitted in the United States -- such as casino gambling in Las Vegas and elsewhere and horse track betting -- that a ban on gambling from "remote" gambling from the Internet was unfair. The senior US official rejected this argument, saying, "I don't think it's fair to say because there's gambling in Las Vegas it undermines a ban on Internet gambling, where you could have minors participating." The official added that because this ban applies to US and non-US gaming operators, "Antigua and Barbuda is not being treated any differently from any US company." Washington also maintained that GATS allows each member country latitude in regulating "public morals." But the WTO wrote that the arguments from Washington carry less weight because of the wide variety of gambling options that are legal in the United States. Antigua had claimed it lost more than 90 million dollars and 4,000 jobs because of the US ban. "The United States has taken an aggressive approach to betting services based overseas," the government said in a statement. "However, the US government raises significant revenue from betting services within its own borders and the Interactive Gaming Council (trade group) suggests the United States is home to at least half the worldwide online gaming market." "The US says it wants open competition," said Ronald Sanders, Antigua's former WTO ambassador. "But it only wants free trade when it suits the US." __________________ If you would like to develop your domains, you can lease inexpensive foreign labor from the leaders in the field at iWebmasters.com TO LOWER YOUR COSTS AND INCREASE YOUR PRODUCTION! * * * * * * * * * * * * Domains Adult News KRL's Newsletter Biz Tips Just Listed Domains

11-10-2004, 11:37 PM	#4
BoNgHiTtA Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Seattle Posts: 2,176	Well I guess we better go liberate the Antiqua people from there opressive government then. I heard they had WMD __________________ Wanna see how Adult Site Traffic Scammed me? Click Here:

11-11-2004, 03:39 AM	#7
BRISK Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,240	Am I the only one who's reading this and wondering why the "Land of the Free" is the one fighting to restrict the freedoms of its citizens, and Antigua is the one saying "C'mon man! Let the people gamble if they want to!"? Here's a quote I like from Dave Matthews: "For a country that's obsessed by its freedoms, it's amazing how much time we spend whittling away at them." __________________ I post on GFY so that when people ask me what I do, I can tell them that I work with the mentally retarded.

11-11-2004, 08:33 PM	#9
Spunky I need a beer Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: ♠ Toiletville ♠ Posts: 133,947	Good news indeed __________________ *YOUR INFORMATION HERE*

11-11-2004, 08:49 PM	#10
pornstar2pac Omaha Hi/Lo Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 17,380	This is Antigua. I loved living down there. will go back soon __________________ Trump haters gonna hate. that's all they can do

11-10-2004, 11:03 PM	#2
hershie Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 4,642	Here's the story from The New York Times: November 11, 2004 W.T.O. Explains Ruling Against U.S. Internet Gambling Ban By MATT RICHTEL The World Trade Organization explained yesterday why it had ruled that the United States violated its international trade obligations by prohibiting Americans from gambling over the Internet. A W.T.O. panel that resolves disputes among members gave specific reasons behind the decision, which was issued last March. At the time, the Department of Justice vowed to appeal the ruling and several members of Congress angrily asserted the decision was equivalent to having the rest of the world dictate United States policy. In its explanation, the W.T.O. said it was not seeking to undermine the ability of the United States, or any of its members, to regulate industry within its borders. Rather, the panel said that the United States policy prohibiting Internet gambling was inconsistent with longstanding trade agreements. The ruling stems from a case brought in June 2003 by the Caribbean island nation of Antigua and Barbuda. It argued that United States trade policy did not prohibit Internet gambling and that to do so would be hypocritical given the huge overseas presence of American gambling enterprises. The ruling allowed Antigua and Barbuda to issue trade sanctions against the United States, said Sebastian Sinclair, an Internet gambling industry analyst with Christiansen Capital Advisors. But Mr. Sinclair said it would be unlikely that such sanctions would have any effect. He said the larger issue was whether another, larger nation might use the ruling to challenge the United States' policy. And he said that the decision underscored a larger problem: that the United States is markedly out of step with many other nations, which not only allow Internet gambling but license and authorize Internet casinos within their shores. Despite prohibitions against Internet gambling in the United States, millions of Americans participate in the activity, using credit cards or online payment services to wager on sports or games like poker, blackjack and roulette. Americans will be responsible for about half of the $7.6 billion lost this year on Internet wagers, Mr. Sinclair said. The effort to regulate and prohibit Internet gambling has been particularly tricky for the United States because the operations are based overseas and players are logging on from home. Mr. Sinclair said the challenges were similar to those facing the music industry, which has struggled to fight piracy over the Internet.

11-10-2004, 11:34 PM	#3
CyberTraffic Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Traffic Land ~ ICQ:213666533 Posts: 2,187	Does that mean sites like Google will allow it on their advertising again?

11-11-2004, 09:42 PM	#12
Fletch XXX GFY HALL OF FAME DAMMIT!!! Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: that 504 Posts: 60,840	__________________ Want an Android App for your tube, membership, or free site? Need banners or promo material? Hit us up (ICQ Fletch: 148841377) or email me fletchxxx at gmail.com - recent work - About me

11-11-2004, 09:52 PM	#13
FlyingIguana aspiring banker Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: toronto Posts: 10,870	the states should have embraced online gaming instead of forcing companies to start up on the islands. they cry like babies when they lose out on money

11-11-2004, 10:57 PM	#15
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	So what are the chances of banning porn? A lot less I would say. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

11-11-2004, 10:59 PM	#16
detoxed vip member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 17,798	USA is appealing the decision of course....

11-12-2004, 04:17 AM	#18
Webby Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Far far away - as possible Posts: 14,956	Damned skippy!! This has been going on for years and time and again the US kept up shit to kill it - clearly absurd conduct for a supposed civilized country. When I lived there the Anitguan govt verbal, at that time to Janet Reno, was "Why don't you run your bannana republic and leave this country to manage it's own affairs?" __________________ XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.