Well, chimps do solve problems and we can climb trees. ;-)

You didn't even read it! You have no idea what it is you're blowing off.

Keep believing because everybody else does. I'm schooled. I'm no redneck. I have nothing in common with rednecks. I'm not religious. I'm scientifically grounded. Science is #1 in my book. I wish I could include Evolution into in one day. Maybe when their is evidence for it, I will include it among the other sciences.

ummmm

How you doin kettle?

Gravity has not been absotely proven, we have yet to find the graviton.

Yes. Thank you ;)

How do you explain bacterial resistance to antibiotics if not by evolution?

Oh yeah? Strange, I don't see that very often. I'd like to see where chimps are able to problems solve.

Also strange how you left out the part where I mentioned "we can build and innovate but they can't, we can talk and they can't"

They are 99% similar to us after all.

Their DNA is 99% similar, not "they" are 99% similar.

Exactly my point.

What you're looking at in terms of genetics or dna isn't the end all be all. It obviously isn't.

Right, it's a probability.

If a gene is in just one of your parents then you have about a 50% chance of receiving that gene minus about a one in a million chance of a mutation. If both parents have the gene you have a 100% - 1 in a million chance of mutation of receiving that gene.

If a population has a number of organisms with Gene A and Gene B and Gene A organisms have a better chance of surviving than the Gene B organisms then the chances increase that both of your parents carried the gene.

Overall, this leads to a greater probability of Gene A being passed to the next generation and for a group of organisms you will find that Gene A increased its frequency in the next generation.

Would you agree with that?

People are using the word "believe" as in do you "believe" in evolution. There is alot of evidence to indicate that micro-evolution has taken place. There is far less evidence (if any) to indicate macro-evolution has taken place. There is zero evidence to indicate that abiogenesis has taken place. The book is still open on "evolution" and "believe" is the proper word to use...just as "believe" is the proper word to use for "creationism".

You said that lots of people die in hospitals because they trust their doctor. You bruoght it up, I called you on it.

BTW, evolution is very important in medicine, that's why doctors have to know what antibiotics you've had before. That's also why there's a different flu vaccine every year.

I didn't say I wouldn't read it. Don't have time now, it's a mile long.

What the crap? How are they doing that?! We can't do that!
http://www.perrochon.com/photo/Santa...lderRanch2.jpg

Half of Americans don't :glugglug

The pope wasn't diametrically opposed to god, but he was to evolution and had to change the official church position due to "overwhelming evidence".

Yes I agree with that.

Let's take for example being in a theatre and their is a fire. The smart guy runs for the exit door first....everybody else gets burned alive and dies.

Now, will this "gene" of avoiding fire be passed on since it is what allowed the smart guy to adapt to the situation rather than die? No, there is no evidence for this.

You see what I'm saying. We can isolate certain facts and twist them to suit our theory while ignoring other ones that contradict it.

hey, they're not swinging from vines and jumping to other trees now are they?


Also strange how you failed to address the other part where I mentioned "we can build and innovate but they can't, we can talk and they can't"

You should take a biologist's word for it before you take a preacher's word for it.

what's the fossil record and vestigial organs limbs.. Microevolution itself is evidence for macroevolution..

Of course they cant, they havn't evolved as much as us yet :thumbsup

"Creationism" does not require a belief in the Bible or any other religious writings. Without proof of abiogenesis having taken place..."creationism" is more than viable.

Maybe, but both can be wrong, no?

Thus you have to accept at least micro-evolution, because person A is now fit and person B is not. Person A will reproduce and have children that are more fit for their environment then person B would have.

lol

You are wrong Sgt. Speedbump and you clearly know nothing of the subject at hand.

The evolution for macroevolution is exceptionally well documented. I have given a link multiple times in this thread. If you are intereested, click it.

Abiogenesis is not the subject under discussion this evening.

Now kindly fuck off.

You keep thinking of things from a one person perspective, in a single episode. You need to think over the population.

Like in Africa people who have sickle-cell trait are more resistant to malaria.
This trait provides an advantage in this population and IS a gene and IS passed on.

I've watched enough Jane Goodall to know this one. Chimps make tools and have a language. Maybe not as advance as man but "similar" to man.

You continue to speak shit.

There is no scientific basis for 'creationism'.

Hang a banana from a ceiling and put boxes in a corner. A chimp will go pick up the boxes and stack them in such a way as to be able to climb the boxes and reach the banana.

There are thousands of such examples in the literature. If you're interested in some fascinating books on chimp behavior Frans De Waal's books are very good.

1. I have trouble believing the stats given, they're way too far fetched and they were never substantiated.

2. Just because it is not taught does not mean it was the teacher's idea. Teachers have to use the cirriculum given them by their district board, and non-scientists and parents sit on those boards and vote for what the cirriculum is going to be.

Conclusion: Even if those stats are true, they prove nothing outside of the fact that idiots run school districts, which we already know.

If you are willing to take take the leap of "belief"...for there is little...if any...evidence of macro-evolution.

I was almost certain the opposite was true. The chimp never gets the banana.

"I'm so persecuted because someone disagrees with me! Boo hoo!"

You do a terrible job at playing the victim.

right, and so what is your contention with the fossil record? microevolution? vestigial limbs. Surely you must have some better explanation, or at least a good reason for doubting it?

I'm in no way saying evolution is rock solid, but it is FAR better than any other current explanation.

sickle cell may make them more resistant to malaria, but you're certainly not saying we should all hope to have a sickle cell trait are you? Blacks seem to have problems with that sometimes.

It's a gene that is passed on. Yes I agree. What does that have to do with evolution?

Just as there is zero scientific basis for the origin of life..."abiogenesis". Thus "creationism" is as good an alternative that can be preseneted...at this point in time.

Then you have to deny genetics and that you share all of your genes with your mother and father.

No, they are not swinging from vines. Chimpanzees and humans are similar, not the same. i.e. related. 7 million years of being separate species is quite a bit of time.

It wasn't strange. I just didn't take the time. Chimps do use language and they (along with gorillas) can be taught sign language. As titmowse said, hit the Goodall literature. Also De Waals.

I don't know where the stats are from or how they were collected. Ask Johnny he posted them.

Then stop being willfully ignorant and read the scientific literature!

BTW, what you have in common with red necks is your non-acceptance of evolution. It's interesting that most of the people, not all but most, that don't accept evolution are usually at the shallow end of the gene pool.

I was almost certain the recent studies indicated the opposite with regard to sign language.

With regard to language, you and I can't make heads or tales out of screaming they produce as a viable language for them. It's communication, but I wouldn't go as far as language.

Well fellas, it's been fun to be the chick in this little intellectual gang bang but I must be off to do the duties of a mom.

GFY night shift is the best shift! :Graucho

We are not arguing abiogenesis and this has been explained to you more than once.

Like I said, 'creationism' is not scientific.

Heard of the scientific method?

Who said that I "doubt it"? I am just like you and the rest of the entire population of this earth...I don't know. One can "believe" but belief is not a substitute for fact.

I guess it depends how hungry the hairy little fucker is :glugglug

So they just happened to not evolve over 7 million years while we did and they live in the same areas as many of us? Hmmm