Rap "musicality" challange.

"yea yea ytcracker uh uh yea yea"
- ytcracker

rap sucks mammoth cock, always has, always will. how many times can someone babble about controlling their bitches and how they're the ultimate gangster.. I hope they all kill each other off and the last one standing gets run over by me.

Perhaps one of the leading whit filled and story telling rappers, love him or hate him Eminem.


[Eminem as 'Stan']
Dear Slim, I wrote but you still ain't callin
I left my cell, my pager, and my home phone at the bottom
I sent two letters back in autumn, you must not-a got 'em
There probably was a problem at the post office or somethin
Sometimes I scribble addresses too sloppy when I jot 'em
but anyways; fuck it, what's been up? Man how's your daughter?
My girlfriend's pregnant too, I'm 'bout to be a father
If I have a daughter, guess what I'ma call her?
I'ma name her Bonnie
I read about your Uncle Ronnie too I'm sorry
I had a friend kill himself over some bitch who didn't want him
I know you probably hear this everyday, but I'm your biggest fan
I even got the underground shit that you did with Skam
I got a room full of your posters and your pictures man
I like the shit you did with Rawkus too, that shit was phat
Anyways, I hope you get this man, hit me back,
just to chat, truly yours, your biggest fan
This is Stan



[Eminem as 'Stan']
Dear Slim, you still ain't called or wrote, I hope you have a chance
I ain't mad - I just think it's FUCKED UP you don't answer fans
If you didn't wanna talk to me outside your concert
you didn't have to, but you coulda signed an autograph for Matthew
That's my little brother man, he's only six years old
We waited in the blistering cold for you,
four hours and you just said, "No."
That's pretty shitty man - you're like his fuckin idol
He wants to be just like you man, he likes you more than I do
I ain't that mad though, I just don't like bein lied to
Remember when we met in Denver - you said if I'd write you
you would write back - see I'm just like you in a way
I never knew my father neither;
he used to always cheat on my mom and beat her
I can relate to what you're saying in your songs
so when I have a shitty day, I drift away and put 'em on
cause I don't really got shit else so that shit helps when I'm depressed
I even got a tattoo of your name across the chest
Sometimes I even cut myself to see how much it bleeds
It's like adrenaline, the pain is such a sudden rush for me
See everything you say is real, and I respect you cause you tell it
My girlfriend's jealous cause I talk about you 24/7
But she don't know you like I know you Slim, no one does
She don't know what it was like for people like us growin up
You gotta call me man, I'll be the biggest fan you'll ever lose
Sincerely yours, Stan -- P.S.
We should be together too



[Eminem as 'Stan']
Dear Mister-I'm-Too-Good-To-Call-Or-Write-My-Fans,
this'll be the last package I ever send your ass
It's been six months and still no word - I don't deserve it?
I know you got my last two letters;
I wrote the addresses on 'em perfect
So this is my cassette I'm sending you, I hope you hear it
I'm in the car right now, I'm doing 90 on the freeway
Hey Slim, I drank a fifth of vodka, you dare me to drive?
You know the song by Phil Collins, "In the Air of the Night"
about that guy who coulda saved that other guy from drowning
but didn't, then Phil saw it all, then at a a show he found him?
That's kinda how this is, you coulda rescued me from drowning
Now it's too late - I'm on a 1000 downers now, I'm drowsy
and all I wanted was a lousy letter or a call
I hope you know I ripped ALL of your pictures off the wall
I love you Slim, we coulda been together, think about it
You ruined it now, I hope you can't sleep and you dream about it
And when you dream I hope you can't sleep and you SCREAM about it
I hope your conscience EATS AT YOU and you can't BREATHE without me
See Slim; {*screaming*} Shut up bitch! I'm tryin to talk!
Hey Slim, that's my girlfriend screamin in the trunk
but I didn't slit her throat, I just tied her up, see I ain't like you
cause if she suffocates she'll suffer more, and then she'll die too
Well, gotta go, I'm almost at the bridge now
Oh shit, I forgot, how'm I supposed to send this shit out?
{*car tires squeal*} {*CRASH*}
{*brief silence*}
{*LOUD splash*}



[Eminem]
Dear Stan, I meant to write you sooner but I just been busy
You said your girlfriend's pregnant now, how far along is she?
Look, I'm really flattered you would call your daughter that
and here's an autograph for your brother,
I wrote it on the Starter cap
I'm sorry I didn't see you at the show, I musta missed you
Don't think I did that shit intentionally just to diss you
But what's this shit you said about you like to cut your wrists too?
I say that shit just clownin dogg,
c'mon - how fucked up is you?
You got some issues Stan, I think you need some counselling
to help your ass from bouncing off the walls when you get down some
And what's this shit about us meant to be together?
That type of shit'll make me not want us to meet each other
I really think you and your girlfriend need each other
or maybe you just need to treat her better
I hope you get to read this letter, I just hope it reaches you in time
before you hurt yourself, I think that you'll be doin' just fine
if you relax a little, I'm glad I inspire you,
but Stan why are you so mad?
Try to understand, that I do want you as a fan
I just don't want you to do some crazy shit
I seen this one shit on the news a couple weeks ago that made me sick
Some dude was drunk and drove his car over a bridge
and had his girlfriend in the trunk, and she was pregnant with his kid
and in the car they found a tape, but they didn't say who it was to
Come to think about, his name was.. it was you
Damn!


And there you have it a complete and realistic story given to you from begining to end. Characters are layed out for you, it gives you the problems in a concise and clear mannor, the words make sense and are in english, it uses the names of real people in his life such as his uncle who he lost Ronnie and it uses the resources of his previous works such as Bonnie and Clyde which was a song about his daughter as well as the "Just drank a 5th of vodka, dare me to drive". This story was based on a fan he had who sent him multiple crazy letters. So I would like to see a logical detraction of this mans talent..... waiting.

That's why we sing for these kids, who don't have a thing
Except for a dream, and a fuckin' rap magazine
Who post pin-up pictures on their walls all day long
Idolize they favorite rappers and know all their songs
Or for anyone who's ever been through shit in their lives
Till they sit and they cry at night wishin' they'd die
Till they throw on a rap record and they sit, and they vibe
We're nothin' to you but we're the fuckin' shit in they eyes
That's why we seize the moment try to freeze it and own it, squeeze it and
hold it
Cause we consider these minutes golden
And maybe they'll admit it when we're gone
Just let our spirits live on, through our lyrics that you hear in our
songs and we can...

What bands/musicians/vocalist are you talking about?

Most music I listen to, the vocalist/singer does play an instrument.
and they are playing their own music. I think you are referring to cover bands playing others music.

Im not sure if your post makes too much sense, or you just didnt think it through before you posted it.

Says it all really.

Alright, my honest opinion on the subject is that I agree, rappers have 'talent' but not the same kind of talent that a proper band has.

Stereotypical view points:

'Rock music [Metal/Death/Heavy/Soft/All of em]' - Death, Sex, Media Portrayal, Pain, Love.

'Rap Music' - 'Bitches', guns, drugs, how they grew up in a rough hood... over and over and over, drugs again.

Thats just my opinion on the subject, I don't particularly like rap music, I liked old-school, with the turntables etc, but nowadays I find its a bunch of crapola.

Although the same could be said about rock music, I believe there are more variations when it comes to guitars etc.. you can have people like, Van Halen, or bands like Slipknot.. AAF, etc etc. So when someone says rock music sucks odd's are they just dont like guitars... or they heard slipknot.

You mentioned musicianship, I don't think that rappers are musicians, they have talent but not in a bog standard musical sense. I do believe most vocalists for rock bands have musical talent as they are using different tones, keys in their voice, as apposed to spilling some lyrics [exceptions are made but in general its not just a bunch of screaming and yelling]

Oh and I do like ytcrackers stuff.

Don't talk about YT like that punk.

im a fan of electronic music as well - i produce it as well as spin it.

i think some people don't see that as a viable form of music when in fact i feel it is just a natural, modern progression of symphonic music from the olden days.

i find it hard for people to argue that the involved, technical rock and roll of the 60s and 70s cannot be construed as some of the purest music ever. a lot of popular music now sucks largely in comparison. i can see how the argument can be made that all kinds of different music these days simply sucks and they are probably right. weve reached something of a musical plateau and are having a lot of difficulty evolving.

Not every rock band has a lead who plays guitar at the same time. Likewise every lead who is playing guitar is not playing while singing NOR is he or she doing anything other than playing a basic rip. The equivelent would be a rapper tapping on a mixer's button at specific points. Alot of the beats you hear in rap songs are actually made by the rappers themselves. Not all music played by a rock group is written by the members, and both types of music have ghost writters who come up with lyrics from time to time but more previlant in rock/r&b/ska/punk. This is an individual who is not known publicly "ghost" who writes the songs for them.


True a rappers vocal range is way more limited most of the time, way closer to monotone, but tonality does come into effect in some rappers music. Instead of learning to sing they instead concentrate on lyrical styling and a beat to back it up.

I actually have slipknots cd's, creaming aside the lead has a nice voice and the use of a percussionist and a drummer was inovative in contemporary music. Likewise it was one of the first contemporary non rap groups to use a sampler/turntables, I believe Limp was the first within the last 6 years.


Oh yeah by the way I am not some kid who just loves to listen to rap music. I have been around multiple forms of music my whole life and have spent much of my life as a percussionist, this is a person who plays more than one instrument that is hit or struck so no I am not just a set drummer. I learned on Piano and then got into rudimental snare drumming and then into melodic percussion like marimba and vibraphone. Did not even listen to rap till the mid to late 90's when snoop hit.

I see a lot of people talking about how all rap is the same..... there are actually multiple forms of rap and most rap does not hold to the "control the bitches" format you are talking about, that was a very specific point in rap's history, but of course closed minded people would have listened to one song and then turned a deaf ear to the whole genre lol

Oh do not get me wrong I have nothing against the 50-70's bands who had talent, anyone who says they did not really does not know anything about music at all. I feel that in the 80's with the introduction of hair bands the musicality of rock started to slip into nothing and by the mid 90's after the few talented grunge bands where overshadowed by the labels pushing garage band replicas into the game trying to capitalize, rock had fallen off sharply. Now I turn on the radio and hear a lame excuse for musical talent, kids who know nothing whinning about their lives, songs about how depressing their lives are and how everyone should have pitty on them. How life owed them something and how society should feel sorry for them not sucking it up and getting on with it.

In rap you have a few differant styles from differant times.
You have bounce rap, party rap, gangsta rap and floss rap. Usually the style is controled by the region the rapper is from. The south originated boucne and floss rap in its purist form. Gangsta rap really hit bigger on the east and west coast. Whit filled rap seems to come more from the midwest and of course you had the two poets that everyone raves about Biggie and Pac.

I would still like to see some lyrics from rock, it would not be fair for me to post contemporary because it would just look bad for a counter argument but I would be happy to post some Sting and the Police, Aerosmith, Whitesnake etc but we should all know these were real musicians by now.

dont forget nerd rap
<-

i'm not a huge Eminem fan but this verse is probably the best of his:

Since I'm in a position to talk to these kids and they listen
I ain't no politician but I'll kick it with 'em a minute
Cause see they call me a menace; and if the shoe fits I'll wear it
But if it don't, then y'all'll swallow the truth grin and bear it
Now who's these king of these rude ludicrous lucrative lyrics
Who could inherit the title, put the youth in hysterics
Usin his music to steer it, sharin his views and his merits
But there's a huge interference - they're sayin you shouldn't hear it
Maybe it's hatred I spew, maybe it's food for the spirit
Maybe it's beautiful music I made for you to just cherish
But I'm debated disputed hated and viewed in America
as a motherfuckin drug addict - like you didn't experiment?
Now now, that's when you start to stare at who's in the mirror
and see yourself as a kid again, and you get embarrased
And I got nothin to do but make you look stupid as parents
You fuckin do-gooders - too bad you couldn't do good at marriage!
(Ha ha!) And do you have any clue what I had to do to get here I don't
think you do so stay tuned and keep your ears glued to the stereo
Cause here we go - he's {*Jigga joint Jigga-chk-Jigga*}
And I'm the sinister, Mr. Kiss-My-Ass it's just the


taken from:
Renegade - Jay Z - The Blueprint

don't judge rap by what you see on mtv, whats there isnt there by the choice of the artists.

The Eddie Van Halens and Joe Satrianis of the world had to work their asses off to get to their levels of ability.

Likewise, the Tupacs and the Eminems of the world had to do the same thing.

One form of expression isn't any more valid than any other.

WU TANG CLAN at their best are truly amazing

See if anyone even knows who this is. This will test even the hard core old school people. Unless someone goes and cheats and searches on the lyrics in Google which will probably happen.

music in any form, rock, hip-hop, whatever has shitbags in their ranks. standout artists are the ones that touch people, not matter how they do it. its a formula. you either got it or you don't. if one element of the entire arrangement is off its ruined.

heres the lyrics.

Tell me who it is without searching.

Broken glass everywhere
People pissing on the stairs, you know they just don't care
I can't take the smell, I can't take the noise
Got no money to move out, I guess I got no choice
Rats in the front room, roaches in the back
Junkie's in the alley with a baseball bat
I tried to get away, but I couldn't get far
Cause the man with the tow-truck repossessed my car
Chorus:
Don't push me, cause I'm close to the edge
I'm trying not to loose my head
It's like a jungle sometimes, it makes me wonder
How I keep from going under

Standing on the front stoop, hangin' out the window
Watching all the cars go by, roaring as the breezes blow
Crazy lady, livin' in a bag
Eating out of garbage piles, used to be a fag-hag
Search and test a tango, skips the life and then go
To search a prince to see the last of senses
Down at the peepshow, watching all the creeps
So she can tell the stories to the girls back home
She went to the city and got Social Security
She had to get a pimp, she couldn't make it on her own

Chorus:
It's like a jungle sometimes, it makes me wonder
How I keep from goin' under

My brother's doing fast on my mother's T.V.
Says she watches to much, is just not healthy
All my children in the daytime, Dallas at night
Can't even see the game or the Sugar Ray fight
Bill collectors they ring my phone
And scare my wife when I'm not home
Got a bum education, double-digit inflation
Can't take the train to the job, there's a strike at the station
Neon King Kong standin' on my back
Can't stop to turn around, broke my sacroiliac
Midrange, migraine, cancered membrane
Sometimes I think I'm going insane, I swear I might hijack a plane!

Chorus:

My son said daddy I don't wanna go to school
Cause the teacher's a jerk, he must think I'm a fool
And all the kids smoke reefer, I think it'd be cheaper
If I just got a job, learned to be a street sweeper
I dance to the beat, shuffle my feet
Wear a shirt and tie and run with the creeps
Cause it's all about money, ain't a damn thing funny
You got to have a con in this land of milk and honey
They push that girl in front of a train
Took her to a doctor, sowed the arm on again
Stabbed that man, right in his heart
Gave him a transplant before a brand new start
I can't walk through the park, cause it's crazy after the dark
Keep my hand on the gun, cause they got me on the run
I feel like an outlaw, broke my last fast jaw
Hear them say you want some more, livin' on a seesaw

Chorus:

A child was born, with no state of mind
Blind to the ways of mankind
God is smiling on you but he's frownin too,
Cause only god knows what you go through
You grow in the ghetto, living second rate
And your eyes will sing a song of deep hate
The places you play and where you stay
Looks like one great big alley way
You'll admire all the number book takers
Dogpitchers, pushers and the big money makers
Driving big cars, spending twenties and tens
And you wanna grow up to be just like them
Smugglers, scrambles, burglars, gamblers
Pickpockets, peddlers and even pan-handlers
You say I'm cool, I'm no fool
But then you wind up dropping out of high school
Now you're unemployed, all null 'n' void
Walking around like you're pretty boy Floyd
Turned stickup kid, look what you done did
Got send up for a eight year bid
Now your man is took and you're a May tag
Spend the next two years as an undercover fag
Being used and abused, and served like hell
Till one day you was find hung dead in a cell
It was plain to see that your life was lost
You was cold and your body swung back and forth
But now your eyes sing the sad sad song
Of how you lived so fast and died so young

Chorus:

http://www.viperrecords.com/imtech/r...y2samples.html

you hit the nail on the freakin head. luckily for us, theres tons of big time artists that are walking down electronic avenue, and its a matter of time. hell, theres artists doing electronic now,people are listening, and they don't even know that its electronic or dance driven.

As a person who has mixed and played both hear diz. I have been playing guitar and drums both about 15 years seriously. It takes a hell of alot more time/work to play than mix.

Additionaly please note almost no rapper mixes his own music. So at best they are poets. ;) Nuff said.

See A1 has got "the message"

thats easy
i even have it on vinyl

gm flash and furious five

A1R3K - thats not a real test, too easy ;)

Also as quoted....Immortal Technique is pretty good, I like his 'Dance with the devil'

Most rappers do not start producing beats that you know about untill they become producers. But even then they are usually outshadowed by those who do nothing BUT produce beats like The Neptunes and Timberland

Have you guys heard what most def did with the hook from the message. Check out Close edge.

ive played guitar for 7 years and i agree.

i somewhat equate it to realist and abstract art.

people who can draw faces and real shit are very talented no question about it. (real musicians)

abstract artists can suck major fucking dick and there could be a million of them but only a select few make work that is actually any good. (real lyricists)

[Verse 1: 2Pac]
She was born a heavy set girl with pigtails and curls
A heart full of gold, still it won't change the world
Though she could never understand why
Some underhanded plans witnessed a man die
Was only fifteen, should have been a beauty queen, still
See her crying by the caskets when her parents got killed
Little girl don't cry, cuz even though they died
You can best believe they're watching over thee from the sky
Never asked for this misery, but look at what you're getting
Is a blessing in disguise when you find out you're pregnant
No money, no home, and even though you're all alone
You gots to do this on your own, so baby go
I wish you luck and if you need me, call
Just come to me and let me feed you all
I can understand the way it feels when you're fighting the world
Facing all this drama when Mama's just a little girl

[Chorus]
Mama don't know why
Mama's just a little girl
Living if she is or not
Time ain't on her side
'Cause Mama's just a little girl
She gotta hold her head up high

[Verse 2: 2Pac]
At sixteen, what a beautiful thing
The very essence of a jet-black ebony queen
And who could tell she'd get pregnant at an early age? (what?!)
She didn't listen, had sex, watch her belly raise (hey)
Got violated by someone she dated, if this is fate
I'd hate to see the seeds she created, and so we waited
Though it takes time to build a body and a mind
She reclines nine months then finally it's time
What do we find? Little growing boy of mine
With a tortured soul, addicted to a life of crime
Had no time for the growing stage
He learned his values on the streets at an early age
Watch for police, don't come home (why?)
Cuz Mama's acting crazy at the hospital
About to have another baby, like a rose from the concrete
Growing within, blessed with twins
How the hell can Mama raise three men?
So we began, closest family, such insanity
A happy home from one act of inhumanity
Plus Mama said they seed was corrupt, it used to rub
Her belly, begging to let us breathe if she loved us
Now, Mama, since quiet, sipping peppermint Schnapps
Turned the house into a spot and made her watch for cops
How could Mama bring a thug like me into the world?
She ain't the cause of all this drama
'Cause Mama's just a little girl

[Chorus]

[Verse 3: 2Pac]
Now, will she remain in the same spot?
The gunshots rang, they came from the 'caine spot
Now, look here, I see her clutching her son in her arms, she's hurt
Her heart bleeds, now she watched her seed die in the dirt
Fulfil prophecies, but who could stop the grief
I walk around trying to hold the world up on top of me
Probably be an innocent man, still I'm the victim of a curse
What could be worse? Nothing but pain since my birth
Only functions at the pen, cuz everybody's in
Paying back society, I'm guilty of a life of sin
I watch the drama occur, my eyes blur before I jetted
I wonder why we all have to die before we get it
Though we shed tears, so many peers I've done buried
Worried and scared, knowing I'm going to see the cemetery
Must be prepared in this cold world no one cares
Knowing it ain't fair, but we all bear and do our share
In this land of the underhanded schemes and plans
Vivid dreams of a nigga having G's in hand
Mama told me not to be a punk
Fuck what you talking about, coward, what you niggaz want? (hey)
There ain't a thing I wouldn't do for my Mama in this world
'Cause you know I ain't mad at cha, you're just a little girl

I been in this game for years, it made me a animal
It's rules to this shit, I wrote me a manual
A step by step booklet for you to get
your game on track, not your wig pushed back

Rule nombre uno: never let no one know
how much, dough you hold, cause you know
The cheddar breed jealousy 'specially
if that man fucked up, get your ass stuck up

Number two: never let em know your next move
Don't you know Bad Boys move in silence or violence
Take it from your highness (uh-huh)
I done squeezed mad clips at these cats for they bricks and chips

Number three: never trust no-bo-dy
Your moms'll set that ass up, properly gassed up
Hoodie to mask up, shit, for that fast buck
she be layin in the bushes to light that ass up

Number four: know you heard this before
Never get high, on your own supply

Number five: never sell no crack where you rest at
I don't care if they want a ounce, tell em bounce

Number six: that god damn credit, dead it
You think a crackhead payin you back, shit forget it

Seven: this rule is so underrated
Keep your family and business completely seperated
Money and blood don't mix like two dicks and no bitch
Find yourself in serious shit

Number eight: never keep no weight on you
Them cats that squeeze your guns can hold jobs too

Number nine shoulda been number one to me
If you ain't gettin bags stay the fuck from police (uh-huh)
If niggaz think you snitchin ain't tryin listen
They be sittin in your kitchen, waitin to start hittin

Number ten: a strong word called consignment
Strictly for live men, not for freshmen
If you ain't got the clientele say hell no
Cause they gon want they money rain sleet hail snow
Follow these rules you'll have mad bread to break up
If not, twenty-four years, on the wake up
Slug hit your temple, watch your frame shake up
Caretaker did your makeup, when you pass
Your girl fucked my man Jake up, heard in three weeks
she sniffed a whole half of cake up
Heard she suck a good dick, and can hook a steak up
Gotta go gotta go, more pies to bake up, word up, uhh


Im sure with a little adjustment it could be applied to porn

YT lets here the 10 Porn commandments!

Homicide's illegal and death is the penalty
What justifies the homicide, when he dies?
In his own iniquity it's the
Master of the Mantis Rapture comin at cha
we have an APB on an MC Killer
look like the work of a Master
evidence indicates that's it's stature
merciless like a terrorist hard to capture
the flow changes like a chameleon
plays like a friend, and stabs you like a dagger
this technique attacks the immune system
the styles like alive paralyzin the victim
you scream, as it enters your bloodstream
erupts your brain from the pain these thoughts contain
movin on a nigga with the speed of a centipede
and injure any motha fuckin' contender.

i think this guy trill did the ten spam commandments

I bomb atomically, Socrates' philosophies
and hypotheses can't define how I be droppin these
mockeries, lyrically perform armed robbery
Flee with the lottery, possibly they spotted me
Battle-scarred shogun, explosion when my pen hits
tremendous, ultra-violet shine blind forensics
I inspect view through the future see millenium
Killa Beez sold fifty gold sixty platinum
Shckling the masses with drastic rap tactics
Graphic displays melt the steel like blacksmiths
Black Wu jackets Queen Beez ease the guns in
Rumblein patrolmen tear gas laced the function
Heads by the score take flight incite a war
Chicks hit the floor, diehard fans demand more
Behold the bold soldier, control the globe slowly
Proceeds to blow swingin swords like Shinobi
Stomp grounds I pound footprints in solid rock
Wu got it locked, Performin live on you hottest block