For Sale and I have to move it quickly! - GoFuckYourself.com

Tam · 07-08-2004, 11:59 PM

Ok folks, I am going to be completely honest, open and out there with this. Several months ago, I woke up to this "gift" handed to me that my partner had bought for me to run, I thought this was so cool of him to do this for me. I was very excited about it, and had EVERY intention of running this myself. BUT several things have happened to prevent me from doing this. One of which was my time, CSWCash keeps me way too busy for me to take the time out to try and LEARN a program that I honestly know less than anything about. TWO and the most important and pressing reason. I have been hit with some bills I wasn't prepared for and it has left me in a really nasty place financially... so I need to turn this over to a buyer and I need to do it FAST! If I didn't desperately need the cash, I probably would hold on to it and try and find a window to run it myself, it would be more profitable to me in the long run, but as luck would have it, people wanting money from ME don't want to wait the long haul, they want it NOW...... LOL

SO..... here is what I have:
http://coin4free.com/faq.html

I won't go all long winded about the specs as they are already on that page I linked you to. So you can take a look and see what the specs are and if you are interested, just give me a shout on ICQ at 423517 or email me at [email protected] and I'll gladly answer all I can about it.

As I stated, this isn't about the program sucking, it is about I need the money, I am not even going to attempt to blow it off to you as anything else, plain and simple, I NEED the money in the worst way possible right now. AND since I have no clue how to run this and I don't have the time, it has been elected as the "has to go item" tonight. LOL

And before anyone goes nuts about the cash flow problem? DON'T.... my cash program is doing ok, BUT I poured way more than I probably should have into getting it started and now need to get bills caught up here at home and fast..... and waiting isn't an option anymore. So don't go thinking that CSWCash is in trouble, it isn't..... FAR from it. The unexpected bills are personal, not business.

I have had this appraised at a high end of $8,000 and at a low end of $2800....... So, I would like to get the lowest end at the very least out of this...... so I'll say that the first one to pay me $2800 walks with it. ANYthing near that is, of course, negotiable.

I DID go long winded, sorry.. my bad! LOL

Jroc · 07-09-2004, 12:14 AM

I'll give you $250

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jroc
I'll give you $250

Add another zero at the end there, baby and we'll talk. LOL

psyko514 · 07-09-2004, 12:22 AM

Anyone looking for a business partner to split this 50/50?

JulianSosa · 07-09-2004, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
Add another zero at the end there, baby and we'll talk. LOL

How many no confirmed emails do you have to go along with this ?
And ps I offer $500

Edit I just tried to sign up and the link in the confimation email went to a blank page and my user name password did not work ?

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JulianSosa
How many no confirmed emails do you have to go along with this ?
And ps I offer $500

They are all opt-in........ and the list was and is cleaned often. These are my personal lists and I have never ever mailed to them.... another part of the "I haven't a clue how to do this" thing. I seem to always be able to collect a lot of emails, but when it comes to using them, I am clueless...... LOL

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JulianSosa

Edit I just tried to sign up and the link in the confimation email went to a blank page and my user name password did not work ?

It hasn't been launched...... I just uploaded it and left it there, I never set it up or launched it because I didn't have the time to do the marketing and such.... and I certainly didn't want webmasters to signup and start promoting it when it isn't active..... so I only uploaded it and started pulling in typeins and so on.

JulianSosa · 07-09-2004, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
It hasn't been launched...... I just uploaded it and left it there, I never set it up or launched it because I didn't have the time to do the marketing and such.... and I certainly didn't want webmasters to signup and start promoting it when it isn't active..... so I only uploaded it and started pulling in typeins and so on.

I dont understand. I signed up as a surfer to test the script not a webmaster.

JulianSosa · 07-09-2004, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
They are all opt-in........ and the list was and is cleaned often. These are my personal lists and I have never ever mailed to them.... another part of the "I haven't a clue how to do this" thing. I seem to always be able to collect a lot of emails, but when it comes to using them, I am clueless...... LOL

I meant non confirmed double optin sorry I was not so clear

psyko514 · 07-09-2004, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by psyko514
Anyone looking for a business partner to split this 50/50?

This is a serious request, btw.

If anyone here is interested in splitting this 50/50 and running it together, get in touch with me. Email is psyko @ gmx . at and icq is 214702014.

I'm off to bed now, but I'll get in touch with people in the morning.

body · 07-09-2004, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by psyko514
Anyone looking for a business partner to split this 50/50?

Yo, maybe I'm

body · 07-09-2004, 12:38 AM

hey psyko, I added you on my list 109172935
Maybe we can work something out

Abyss_Vee · 07-09-2004, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by psyko514
Anyone looking for a business partner to split this 50/50?

Hit me up on ICQ.. 201636447

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JulianSosa
I dont understand. I signed up as a surfer to test the script not a webmaster.

That is all a part of that script and I never set that up..... it would be a 10 minute job for a person with script knowledge... but I am not familiar with this script and when I got it, I didn't have the time to do all of that and haven't since then either........ As I said, I know very precious little about this type of program and the time it would take for me to learn it would be more than I have at this time. It was given to me as a gift and I honestly don't know anything about it other than what I have dug thru there to find out.

I know this sounds pretty vague to you, but I did state that I haven't ever dealt with a program like this, I wanted to learn it, but just never had the time, and now I just need the cash.

Confirmed emails? Let me look that up and I'll get back to you, I don't want to lie to you on that one.

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:48 AM

Ok, the 562 are all confirmed..... and the list of the 30K plus is opt-in.....

I DID have one of the scripts working at one time, until I moved it and then got really busy. It is collecting about 5-10 new emails a day from typins....... so it is getting some SE traffic or typein traffic from somewhere.

I hope this helps.

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:49 AM

I have a bid of $1200 from someone else..... so you know. LOL

psyko514 · 07-09-2004, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
I have a bid of $1200 from someone else..... so you know. LOL

Well, if you're taking offers like that, I'll offer up $1300

Abyss and body, I'll get in touch with you in a few hours. Need sleep now or I'll die.

ZzZzZz...

boneprone · 07-09-2004, 01:08 AM

Id get in on this with ya psycho or even on my own if i could figure out how this thing could make money?

someone explain it to me. The billing system of the 4free thing here is already lined up? How does this work?

JulianSosa · 07-09-2004, 01:10 AM

Good luck Tam.

Veterans Day · 07-09-2004, 01:18 AM

want baddog selling or brokering this?

Veterans Day · 07-09-2004, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by boneprone
Id get in on this with ya psycho or even on my own if i could figure out how this thing could make money?

someone explain it to me. The billing system of the 4free thing here is already lined up? How does this work?

collect emails, and then spam the shit outta them?

Just a guess

Sylver7 · 07-09-2004, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by boneprone
Id get in on this with ya psycho or even on my own if i could figure out how this thing could make money?

someone explain it to me. The billing system of the 4free thing here is already lined up? How does this work?

Upsells inside,spamming the emails collected,exits,selling the email lists,etc..

rounders · 07-09-2004, 02:05 AM

looks nicee hrm.

GTS Mark · 07-09-2004, 02:39 AM

Not to put a damper on this for you Tam. But would'nt it be damn hard to turn a profit on this package with the new canspam crap?

Can someone explain to me how this affiliate program could be profitable in today's current market?

Sorry to hear about your financial situation Tam. Best of luck!

DH

Pun · 07-09-2004, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DrinkingHard
Not to put a damper on this for you Tam. But would'nt it be damn hard to turn a profit on this package with the new canspam crap?

Can someone explain to me how this affiliate program could be profitable in today's current market?

Sorry to hear about your financial situation Tam. Best of luck!

DH

If the users sign up for an account with the 4Free program, and you have something to the effect of "user xyz agrees to receive marketing offers from abc company", you'd be able to legally market via email because you have a direct relationship with the user. That's how I understand CAN-SPAM at least, which could very well be wrong. The experts will no doubt correct me if so.

mcmc · 07-09-2004, 04:51 AM

this sounds like a nice deal ...

=^..^= · 07-09-2004, 05:01 AM

BUMP for Tam

Tam · 07-09-2004, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Veterans Day
want baddog selling or brokering this?

He's been trying to help me with this, yes......

As for the rest, I am trying to get caught up here so bare with me, I needed a nap........ I have bid of $2000 on the table right now....

Pun, that's the way I am being told is the way to make money with this too. I have asked over and over about this one myself because I was going to do all of this myself, and from information I gathered, this is exactly how it is done.

Can it make money? Hell yes it can make money.... there are other join4free programs out there that seem to be extremely successful..... so I know the money is there, I just don't have the time to wait it out to see that happen, if I did, trust me, I would.

Reak · 07-09-2004, 06:49 AM

The rude bitch got some mad marketing skillz.

Goodluck selling it Tam

PMdave · 07-09-2004, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pun
If the users sign up for an account with the 4Free program, and you have something to the effect of "user xyz agrees to receive marketing offers from abc company", you'd be able to legally market via email because you have a direct relationship with the user. That's how I understand CAN-SPAM at least, which could very well be wrong. The experts will no doubt correct me if so.

That is what CANSPAM says BUT most sponsors still require the "Sexually Explicit" phrase in the subject line and the "brown paperbag"

Nysus · 07-09-2004, 06:58 AM

You have 26,000 webmaster emails? Those alone are worth a lot, but I'm pretty sure most people would be slightly annoyed if they received an email from something they never signed up to.

Cheers,
Matt

Basic_man · 07-09-2004, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
Add another zero at the end there, baby and we'll talk. LOL

Lol ! Good luck !

Tam · 07-09-2004, 07:05 AM

For those who have been a little worried about content on this package...... I have just been told by Loch at Cool-content.com , that he will throw in one of his bulk packages of content to the buyer of this program..... this package includes anywhere from 900 to 4300 images in various sets, depending on your choice of these packages.

Thanks so much for this Casper....... you are a doll and a friend.

SongRider · 07-09-2004, 07:50 AM

Bump for da money!!!

Trax · 07-09-2004, 07:57 AM

Tam · 07-09-2004, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Trax
500

You are outbid, try it again, Sam....... rotfl

Raven · 07-09-2004, 08:20 AM

bump for tam.....

BradM · 07-09-2004, 08:25 AM

DH: You can legally market to anyone that agrees to a TOS when they enter their email address. If they double confirm it is even better.
So long as you have the email address, IP of signup and the datestamp you are complete and totally safe. If they tried to take you to court you would win hands down no questions asked.

Canspam blocks bulk mailing not legal optin mailing.

So this program is SAFE from anything canspam.

Tam · 07-09-2004, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BradM
DH: You can legally market to anyone that agrees to a TOS when they enter their email address. If they double confirm it is even better.
So long as you have the email address, IP of signup and the datestamp you are complete and totally safe. If they tried to take you to court you would win hands down no questions asked.

Canspam blocks bulk mailing not legal optin mailing.

So this program is SAFE from anything canspam.

THANK YOU!!! I wasn't sure about all of this part myself..... so I couldn't really give an educated response on this one. As I have stated many many times, I have ZERO experience with this type of program, but I DO know there are many out there that make a killing from this type of a site/program.

And this program/script DOES do all of that, it tracks the ips, time and date stamp and all of that. But like I also said, I didn't set it all up to run properly because I didn't know how to and I didn't have the TIME...... the time was the biggest thing at the time, but now it is a plain and simple, I need the money .. if I didn't I would bust my ass and learn this and keep it for myself. lol

Tam · 07-09-2004, 11:30 AM

Bump titty bump titty bump bump bump!!!!

Tam · 07-09-2004, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
Bump titty bump titty bump bump bump!!!!

I DID NOT do this..... somehow my husband and I keep getting logged in here as each other and posting...... so I am sorry for this, I didn't do it...... he did. LOL

latinasojourn · 07-09-2004, 12:03 PM

i'm always interested in ventures, but want nothing email based, even opt-in.

i have abandoned my existing email projects.

some big changes are coming down with email marketing, even low volume email marketing.

Tam · 07-09-2004, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by latinasojourn
i'm always interested in ventures, but want nothing email based, even opt-in.

i have abandoned my existing email projects.

some big changes are coming down with email marketing, even low volume email marketing.

So what you are trying to say is that you aren't interested and I can count out any bids from you, right? LOL

This is fine...... I have several other interested parties as we speak.

Just a matter of who puts the money in my account first is all that's going on now.

4Pics · 07-09-2004, 01:16 PM

bump to help ya out, but I thought baddog was selling this?

Guess he had no offers

Tam · 07-09-2004, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 4Pics
bump to help ya out, but I thought baddog was selling this?

Guess he had no offers

Yes baddog has been helping me.... but I need the money as fast as I can get it and this is the fastest way I know to get it done.. so we decided to try this approach. He has been working his butt off to help me get this done.

Tam · 07-09-2004, 06:07 PM

Well I wasn't going to do the bidding thing..... but it appears that this is how it is working out..... LMAO

I have a bid of $2050..... LOL
I'll leave this open til morning and then it is going to go to the highest bidder UNLESS someone jumps up and is willing to pay me my bottom asking price first.....

myjah · 07-09-2004, 06:12 PM

wish I could help. good luck

frankfortuna · 07-09-2004, 06:17 PM

How were the 26k webmaster emails obtained?

Abyss_Vee · 07-09-2004, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tam
Well I wasn't going to do the bidding thing..... but it appears that this is how it is working out..... LMAO

I have a bid of $2050..... LOL
I'll leave this open til morning and then it is going to go to the highest bidder UNLESS someone jumps up and is willing to pay me my bottom asking price first.....

tomorrow what time???

pood · 07-09-2004, 06:28 PM

DAMn, i thought u were moving drugs...

almost sounds like it

07-08-2004, 11:59 PM	#1
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,501	For Sale and I have to move it quickly! Ok folks, I am going to be completely honest, open and out there with this. Several months ago, I woke up to this "gift" handed to me that my partner had bought for me to run, I thought this was so cool of him to do this for me. I was very excited about it, and had EVERY intention of running this myself. BUT several things have happened to prevent me from doing this. One of which was my time, CSWCash keeps me way too busy for me to take the time out to try and LEARN a program that I honestly know less than anything about. TWO and the most important and pressing reason. I have been hit with some bills I wasn't prepared for and it has left me in a really nasty place financially... so I need to turn this over to a buyer and I need to do it FAST! If I didn't desperately need the cash, I probably would hold on to it and try and find a window to run it myself, it would be more profitable to me in the long run, but as luck would have it, people wanting money from ME don't want to wait the long haul, they want it NOW...... LOL SO..... here is what I have: http://coin4free.com/faq.html I won't go all long winded about the specs as they are already on that page I linked you to. So you can take a look and see what the specs are and if you are interested, just give me a shout on ICQ at 423517 or email me at [email protected] and I'll gladly answer all I can about it. As I stated, this isn't about the program sucking, it is about I need the money, I am not even going to attempt to blow it off to you as anything else, plain and simple, I NEED the money in the worst way possible right now. AND since I have no clue how to run this and I don't have the time, it has been elected as the "has to go item" tonight. LOL And before anyone goes nuts about the cash flow problem? DON'T.... my cash program is doing ok, BUT I poured way more than I probably should have into getting it started and now need to get bills caught up here at home and fast..... and waiting isn't an option anymore. So don't go thinking that CSWCash is in trouble, it isn't..... FAR from it. The unexpected bills are personal, not business. I have had this appraised at a high end of $8,000 and at a low end of $2800....... So, I would like to get the lowest end at the very least out of this...... so I'll say that the first one to pay me $2800 walks with it. ANYthing near that is, of course, negotiable. I DID go long winded, sorry.. my bad! LOL __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999) - All About Me!

07-09-2004, 12:14 AM	#2
Jroc Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Halifax, NS Posts: 48	I'll give you $250 __________________ - Microphone assassin

07-09-2004, 12:22 AM	#4
psyko514 See sig. Join Epic Cash. Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec. ICQ: 214702014 Posts: 22,366	Anyone looking for a business partner to split this 50/50? __________________ Bad Girl Bucks - 50% Revshare through CCBill. Promote BrandyDDD, Pixie's Pillows, Action Allie and more! Phoenix Forum Pics \| Webmaster Access Montreal pics email: psyko514(a)gmail.com \| icq: 214-702-014

07-09-2004, 12:38 AM	#12
body Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 5,015	hey psyko, I added you on my list 109172935 Maybe we can work something out __________________ The Goddess Of Steps

07-09-2004, 12:48 AM	#15
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,501	Ok, the 562 are all confirmed..... and the list of the 30K plus is opt-in..... I DID have one of the scripts working at one time, until I moved it and then got really busy. It is collecting about 5-10 new emails a day from typins....... so it is getting some SE traffic or typein traffic from somewhere. I hope this helps. __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999) - All About Me!

07-09-2004, 12:49 AM	#16
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,501	I have a bid of $1200 from someone else..... so you know. LOL __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999) - All About Me!

07-09-2004, 01:08 AM	#18
boneprone Hall Of Fame Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Portland Oregon USA Posts: 34,415	Id get in on this with ya psycho or even on my own if i could figure out how this thing could make money? someone explain it to me. The billing system of the 4free thing here is already lined up? How does this work? __________________ Industry Hall Of Fame Legend Mike Jones Bow to the Power - Still BP4L http://gfyawards.com/hall-of-fame Learn about it kids.

07-09-2004, 01:10 AM	#19
JulianSosa Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 3,042	Good luck Tam.

07-09-2004, 01:18 AM	#20
Veterans Day Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Windy City Posts: 8,403	want baddog selling or brokering this? __________________ Build a Massive Traffic Network, Hands FREE, Totally Automated

07-09-2004, 02:05 AM	#23
rounders Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: p0rn0stars & h0es Posts: 2,931	looks nicee hrm. __________________ ICQ#: 153923840

07-09-2004, 02:39 AM	#24
GTS Mark Vrume Mark Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 20,912	Not to put a damper on this for you Tam. But would'nt it be damn hard to turn a profit on this package with the new canspam crap? Can someone explain to me how this affiliate program could be profitable in today's current market? Sorry to hear about your financial situation Tam. Best of luck! DH

07-09-2004, 04:51 AM	#26
mcmc Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Switzerland Posts: 1,705	this sounds like a nice deal ... __________________ http://www.AdultDVDdb.com Conversion: 1:149 (so far this year with more than 650 000 unique hits) @ http://www.pimproll.com

07-09-2004, 05:01 AM	#27
=^..^= Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: ICQ 380-366 Posts: 6,935	BUMP for Tam __________________ #RememberYourRoots #AaronMForGFYHOF

07-09-2004, 06:49 AM	#29
Reak So Fucking Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: 420Calendar.com Posts: 17,920	The rude bitch got some mad marketing skillz. Goodluck selling it Tam

07-09-2004, 06:58 AM	#31
Nysus Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,817	You have 26,000 webmaster emails? Those alone are worth a lot, but I'm pretty sure most people would be slightly annoyed if they received an email from something they never signed up to. Cheers, Matt __________________ What name is pr0 / Untouched Markets using these days? Untouched Markets - pr0 - Refund My Money Now Someone owes me $2,000 because they didn't do any work that was paid for pointing at pr0 / William / UntouchedMarkets See https://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-business-discussion/948258-untouchedmarkets-pr0-refund-money-post16744521.html and for more detailed see https://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-business-discussion/948645-re-recent-bullshit-drama-explained-detail-pr0-untouched-markets.html

07-09-2004, 07:05 AM	#33
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,501	For those who have been a little worried about content on this package...... I have just been told by Loch at Cool-content.com , that he will throw in one of his bulk packages of content to the buyer of this program..... this package includes anywhere from 900 to 4300 images in various sets, depending on your choice of these packages. Thanks so much for this Casper....... you are a doll and a friend. __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999) - All About Me!

07-09-2004, 07:50 AM	#34
SongRider Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: KY- The state not the jelly Posts: 648	Bump for da money!!!

07-09-2004, 07:57 AM	#35
Trax [----------------------] Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 14,486	500

07-09-2004, 08:20 AM	#37
Raven Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,874	bump for tam..... __________________ Raven ~RETIRED~

07-09-2004, 08:25 AM	#38
BradM Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: 1123,6536,5231 Posts: 3,397	DH: You can legally market to anyone that agrees to a TOS when they enter their email address. If they double confirm it is even better. So long as you have the email address, IP of signup and the datestamp you are complete and totally safe. If they tried to take you to court you would win hands down no questions asked. Canspam blocks bulk mailing not legal optin mailing. So this program is SAFE from anything canspam.

07-09-2004, 11:30 AM	#40
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,501	Bump titty bump titty bump bump bump!!!! __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999) - All About Me!

07-09-2004, 12:03 PM	#42
latinasojourn Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 3,191	i'm always interested in ventures, but want nothing email based, even opt-in. i have abandoned my existing email projects. some big changes are coming down with email marketing, even low volume email marketing.

07-09-2004, 01:16 PM	#44
4Pics Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 7,952	bump to help ya out, but I thought baddog was selling this? Guess he had no offers

07-09-2004, 06:07 PM	#46
Tam Rude Bitch Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: In your face Posts: 8,501	Well I wasn't going to do the bidding thing..... but it appears that this is how it is working out..... LMAO I have a bid of $2050..... LOL I'll leave this open til morning and then it is going to go to the highest bidder UNLESS someone jumps up and is willing to pay me my bottom asking price first..... __________________ Get in Touch on Telegram if you need a hardworker - (since 1999) - All About Me!

07-09-2004, 06:12 PM	#47
myjah Back in the harbor Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 11,482	wish I could help. good luck __________________ VP of Marketing AVN Media Network Skype: AVNJill [email protected]

07-09-2004, 06:17 PM	#48
frankfortuna Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 1,504	How were the 26k webmaster emails obtained?

07-09-2004, 06:28 PM	#50
pood Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Seattle Posts: 1,609	DAMn, i thought u were moving drugs... almost sounds like it