Lots of "designers" in this business ... - GoFuckYourself.com

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 11:53 AM

But about 20 % of them are pro ...

Seriously I see so much anti-design arround here ...

People do cheap work . But you get cheap shit too .

It piss me off sometimes to see some people call themselves designers

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 11:56 AM

I mean just look at that !

Quote:

Originally posted by bluevision
Hi everybody,
Here are just some of our current projects. As always your feedbacks are always appreciated.
1. http://www.bluevision.co.il/sbce
2. http://www.bluevision.co.il/kfir
3. http://www.bluevision.co.il/kfir/index2.html
4. http://www.phonesexaction.com

Always on the job, always ready to work.
Serving the international adult web community for almost 2 years.

To contact us please visit our website at:
http://www.bluevision.co.il

Or email us at:
[email protected]

AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE · 05-23-2004, 11:56 AM

Ya know what pisses me off...

Bitches that come crying about shitty designers when it was there business decision in the first place to be "On The Cheap" getting work done for them...

Then come here sniveling about it.

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 11:57 AM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by bignasty
that is a fine ass design
http://www.bluevision.co.il/sbce/
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WAY WAY WAY too much effects ... bevel on the orange, same on almost all text . Basic photoshop effects used everyhwere .

The girls light don't come from the same spot making it look very weird.

The 18 yo sing is all crispy.

WAY WAY too much effect on the most beautul ......

The only thing I like is the background ...

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AlienQ
Ya know what pisses me off...

Bitches that come crying about shitty designers when it was there business decision in the first place to be "On The Cheap" getting work done for them...

Then come here sniveling about it.

Duh that's the main reason why I don't do web for adult ... I charge 10-15 k for a mainsteam site . In adult you can charge like 3k ...

The only guy that can bring really good quality is standaman cauz he got 20 russian guys that are very good graphist at the same time .

I'm trying to build a team to do that kind of work but it will take some time :P

AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE · 05-23-2004, 12:02 PM

Oh this is where the spam starts?

Enjoy your own thread.

merlin77 · 05-23-2004, 12:04 PM

It seems that anyone and there dog can be a designer nowadays. However with ever 10 that I look at, I am lucky to find one that I would consider a pro.

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AlienQ
Oh this is where the spam starts?

Enjoy your own thread.

Did I spam anything ? I already got enough projects going right now I can't really take anymore . I've spent way less time here this month for that reason .

sexyclicks · 05-23-2004, 12:12 PM

come on its not that bad
could be better for sure, maybe the guy is just starting, but for sure I've seen much much worse.

And don't always blame the designers.
A lot of people come and say "here is my $10 zipcontent sets, now make me a millionaire"

Mutt · 05-23-2004, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor Dre
In adult you can charge like 3k ...

show me anybody other than MikeW who can get $3,000 for a paysite design today.

Stan can get that kind of money for affiliate program designs, maybe more, haven't asked for a quote.

kmanrox · 05-23-2004, 12:35 PM

quit posting and finish my god damned flier ;-P

pixelpusher · 05-23-2004, 12:55 PM

Shitty "designers" are not that much competition. If someone is looking for a job well done he will hire someone who can design.
Those clients who prefer to get "cheap" then "good" are really
not the kind of clients you want.

graphicsbytia · 05-23-2004, 12:56 PM

Doctor Dre

First let me say that I like your designs.. but to come onto the board and badmouth another designer.. well that's just not good in my opinion, it makes you look bad.. quit it

shima · 05-23-2004, 01:01 PM

Doctor Dre

Theo · 05-23-2004, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mutt
show me anybody other than MikeW who can get $3,000 for a paysite design today.
.

indeed

theS2O · 05-23-2004, 01:17 PM

i do cheap ones...

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mutt
show me anybody other than MikeW who can get $3,000 for a paysite design today.

Stan can get that kind of money for affiliate program designs, maybe more, haven't asked for a quote.

I'm talking about quality design ... Real pro . Not the average shit .

And stand charge arround 3k

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by graphicsbytia
Doctor Dre

First let me say that I like your designs.. but to come onto the board and badmouth another designer.. well that's just not good in my opinion, it makes you look bad.. quit it

I don't call them designers ...

I don't badmouth anybody that does good work, went to school and learned how to do graphics or have very good natural skills :P

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kmanrox
quit posting and finish my god damned flier ;-P

I haven't received the info for it yet :P

graphicsbytia · 05-23-2004, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor Dre
I don't call them designers ...

I don't badmouth anybody that does good work, went to school and learned how to do graphics or have very good natural skills :P

you shouldn't badmouth anyone .. let the idiots do that

just telling you what I think

What school did you go to? I'd have loved to do something like that

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by graphicsbytia
you shouldn't badmouth anyone .. let the idiots do that

just telling you what I think

What school did you go to? I'd have loved to do something like that

I'm not pretending to be a designer ... I got a team of designers that did that ... But I think I'm pretty good at judging work and motivating my people .

Any about bad mouthing people, I've got bad mouthed by people that don't even know me and I still take it . When something is true, I think it's good to say it .

FlyingIguana · 05-23-2004, 02:50 PM

you rarely get a ferrari for the price of a pinto. if you do, you might have been better off with the pinto

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 02:53 PM

And btw tia your shit looks good ... some original ideas in there .

Roald · 05-23-2004, 02:53 PM

Have to agree on some parts with you Dre. I am NOT calling myself a pro, far from that, but I am doing this for some time now and all works out very well for me. But I can tell you lots of guys won't be here next year or the year after if you ask me. So no worries from me about 'm, as long as my clients referer me to others I am happy and it is showing me that lots do respect what I do.

Keep up the good work and don't worrie to much about others

Zayne E. · 05-23-2004, 02:55 PM

Been a long time since I have seen a good rant about designers

The Truth Hurts · 05-23-2004, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zayne E.
Been a long time since I have seen a good rant about designers

this same thread gets started at least once a week.

in every one, 90% of the participants are talking out their asses, as is the case with this one.

cherrylula · 05-23-2004, 02:57 PM

Yeah more pixel abusers than designers.

Roald · 05-23-2004, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Truth Hurts
this same thread gets started at least once a week.

in every one, 90% of the participants are talking out their asses, as is the case with this one.

sorry

digifan · 05-23-2004, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AlienQ
Ya know what pisses me off...

Bitches that come crying about shitty designers when it was there business decision in the first place to be "On The Cheap" getting work done for them...

Then come here sniveling about it.

So true

blazi · 05-23-2004, 03:02 PM

I think some of the best designers are in this industry. part of the reason for that is it's a lot harder finding work doing non-adult sites.

abyss_al · 05-23-2004, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor Dre
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by bignasty
that is a fine ass design
http://www.bluevision.co.il/sbce/
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WAY WAY WAY too much effects ... bevel on the orange, same on almost all text . Basic photoshop effects used everyhwere .

The girls light don't come from the same spot making it look very weird.

The 18 yo sing is all crispy.

WAY WAY too much effect on the most beautul ......

The only thing I like is the background ...

thats some foul work

Sly_RJ · 05-23-2004, 03:10 PM

Most "designers" worth using have a waiting list. If they don't have a waiting list, I tend to wonder how good they are. So much of this business revolves around the "recurring" model, even business to business transactions. Repeat buyers are the best.

Newton - XXXAmigoz · 05-23-2004, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor Dre
When something is true, I think it's good to say it .

Where's the quote for my business cards?

Quote:

Originally posted by Sly_RJ Most "designers" worth using have a waiting list. If they don't have a waiting list, I tend to wonder how good they are. So much of this business revolves around the "recurring" model, even business to business transactions. Repeat buyers are the best. [/B]

Indeed

$tandaman · 05-23-2004, 03:34 PM

Doctor Dre, I agree with you on the most parts, but i also look at it from another side..

There are multiple layers in the market, and all of them need to be covered, it's a market economy as well as world wide in geographical sense, since we are all connected by the internet. There will always be market for '3 day ago i installed photoshop, now i call myself a designer' designers, but they are no competition to the quality companies.

Plethora of poor quality designers makes those that are good stand out a lot, the only thing that's pissing me off is that it's really hard to get the client to notice you, because they have to sift through lots of shit prior to finding ya.

So i don't get mad, my clients get very happy when they find me, and once they find me, they don't want to go anywhere else, which makes them keep coming back, and i just concentrate on producing high quality work for them.

I am very impressed after conversation with you how you found your own niche, and just taking advantage of it. It's a much better plan then trying to outshine all the crap designers in adult internet, for less pay. Keep up the good work

Roald · 05-23-2004, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by $tandaman
Doctor Dre, I agree with you on the most parts, but i also look at it from another side..

There are multiple layers in the market, and all of them need to be covered, it's a market economy as well as world wide in geographical sense, since we are all connected by the internet. There will always be market for '3 day ago i installed photoshop, now i call myself a designer' designers, but they are no competition to the quality companies.

Plethora of poor quality designers makes those that are good stand out a lot, the only thing that's pissing me off is that it's really hard to get the client to notice you, because they have to sift through lots of shit prior to finding ya.

So i don't get mad, my clients get very happy when they find me, and once they find me, they don't want to go anywhere else, which makes them keep coming back, and i just concentrate on producing high quality work for them.

I am very impressed after conversation with you how you found your own niche, and just taking advantage of it. It's a much better plan then trying to outshine all the crap designers in adult internet, for less pay. Keep up the good work

Well said

EviLGuY · 05-23-2004, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor Dre
But about 20 % of them are pro ...

Seriously I see so much anti-design arround here ...

People do cheap work . But you get cheap shit too .

It piss me off sometimes to see some people call themselves designers

Designer is just a word until there is some kind of certification system.

AdultNex · 05-23-2004, 04:28 PM

You think design in adult is bad? Just wait till you get into mainstream.

With all the foreign designers jumping aboard, people want complete designs and content management for $50.

Esbee · 05-23-2004, 04:33 PM

Part of the problem is economics.

When I started looking at designing for adult, I figured designing galleries would make a good start. Decent enough area to build up a portfolio, almost impossible to put yourself way over your head, chance to develop copywriting skills in Adult, etc.

Looking around the (rather saturated) market, looked like the high end I might be able to pull would be $50/gallery. Assuming I was ready to work at a depressed $20/hour to break into the market, translates to 2.5 hours per gallery. So in that timespan I'd need to:

1. Review the client site and figure out what makes the site marketable (many, many paysite designs make that a difficult task in and of itself)
2. Sit down and write my copy.
3. Come up with a basic layout.
4. Drop my text copy into the layout.
5. Place the imagery and decor around the layout and text.
6. Retouch it, Wacom it, etc.
7. Splice.
8. Tweak and optimize Imageready'd output into more legitimage page.
9. Replace placeholder images with thumbs, link to full size pics/movies, etc.
10. Fix the intangible problems that arise with every project.

I have 8+ years experience marketing and advertising in the travel industry (not an exact fit, but a stronger background than I suspect many enter the industry with). There's not much of anything in Photoshop I don't know - I'm more efficient with some tools than others, but can do most anything. In short, I'm in a pretty good position experience-wise to do these fairly quick.

Yet it quickly became obvious there was no fucking way I could do the above in 2.5 hours. I'd be lucky to open Photoshop in the first 2.5 hours. The above is more like a 5 hour task. So that left three options:

a) Charge $100/gallery. Too far above market rates for that to work.
b) Skimp on the design angle, use PS Styles as a quick crutch. Course now you can only charge $25-$30 gallery.
c) Nearly wipe out steps 1 and 2. Focus solely on design.

None of these options look good to me so I haven't gone any route, but I have the luxury of a full-time job and can translate what I learn researching adult into my other job. Not many have that lxuury.

Of the three, option b) is probably the best. Problem is you get painted as a quick-and-dirty designer and once labeled, it's hard to extend beyond that.

I also see plenty of option c)'s out there - beautiful PS work but the sales message is obscurred. Ironically this might be the faster means to move to the more lucrative paysite designs.

Already established designers are, of course, exempt from the above restrictions. But for the newbie designers around here, it's pretty rough to produce high-end design with marketable features, at the pricing the current market dictates.

Mind you, I'm not crying here. I didn't expect an easy and open armed transition into adult designing. But I am sympathetic to other designers fending their way just as I am. That said, publicly blasting a designer's work seems far out of line, particularly when your solution is hiring eastern European graphic designers. Somehow I can't see non-native English speaking graphic designers writing great sales copy geared towards (mostly) U.S. consumers.

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QuaShe
Have to agree on some parts with you Dre. I am NOT calling myself a pro, far from that, but I am doing this for some time now and all works out very well for me. But I can tell you lots of guys won't be here next year or the year after if you ask me. So no worries from me about 'm, as long as my clients referer me to others I am happy and it is showing me that lots do respect what I do.

Keep up the good work and don't worrie to much about others

What you do is good ... and have common sence . Not just use of right click / effects

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Newton - XXXAmigoz
Where's the quote for my business cards?

Indeed

Ugh ???? email me [email protected] or icq : 23606902

Doctor Dre · 05-23-2004, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AdultNex
You think design in adult is bad? Just wait till you get into mainstream.

With all the foreign designers jumping aboard, people want complete designs and content management for $50.

I am in mainstream and I have some very good clients ...

05-23-2004, 11:56 AM	#3
AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE best designer on GFY Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IALIEN.COM - High Definition Video and Photographic Productions -ICQ 78943384 Posts: 30,307	Ya know what pisses me off... Bitches that come crying about shitty designers when it was there business decision in the first place to be "On The Cheap" getting work done for them... Then come here sniveling about it. __________________ NAKED HOSTING FTW!11 I'm On The INSANE PLAN $9.95/mo! \| The Alien Blog Adult News Worth Reading Updated Daily \| Content For Sale! 641 PICS 216 MINUTES OF VIDEO $350.00 \|ICQ: 78943384 \| Last edited by AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE; 05-23-2004 at 11:58 AM..

05-23-2004, 12:02 PM	#6
AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE best designer on GFY Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IALIEN.COM - High Definition Video and Photographic Productions -ICQ 78943384 Posts: 30,307	Oh this is where the spam starts? Enjoy your own thread. __________________ NAKED HOSTING FTW!11 I'm On The INSANE PLAN $9.95/mo! \| The Alien Blog Adult News Worth Reading Updated Daily \| Content For Sale! 641 PICS 216 MINUTES OF VIDEO $350.00 \|ICQ: 78943384 \|

05-23-2004, 12:04 PM	#7
merlin77 Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Vancouver,BC Posts: 546	It seems that anyone and there dog can be a designer nowadays. However with ever 10 that I look at, I am lucky to find one that I would consider a pro. __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

05-23-2004, 12:35 PM	#11
kmanrox aka K-Man Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: The Gutter Posts: 29,293	quit posting and finish my god damned flier ;-P __________________ Crypto HODLr Crypto mining Angel investor

05-23-2004, 12:55 PM	#12
pixelpusher Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 169	Shitty "designers" are not that much competition. If someone is looking for a job well done he will hire someone who can design. Those clients who prefer to get "cheap" then "good" are really not the kind of clients you want. __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

05-23-2004, 12:12 PM	#9
sexyclicks Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: c9media.com Posts: 3,240	come on its not that bad could be better for sure, maybe the guy is just starting, but for sure I've seen much much worse. And don't always blame the designers. A lot of people come and say "here is my $10 zipcontent sets, now make me a millionaire"

05-23-2004, 12:56 PM	#13
graphicsbytia Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Tennessee Posts: 2,618	Doctor Dre First let me say that I like your designs.. but to come onto the board and badmouth another designer.. well that's just not good in my opinion, it makes you look bad.. quit it

05-23-2004, 01:01 PM	#14
shima Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Location: Office, as usual Posts: 1,753	Doctor Dre

05-23-2004, 01:17 PM	#16
theS2O Adult Design Since 2003 Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: s2odesigns.com Posts: 4,784	i do cheap ones... __________________ EMAIL ME at [email protected] for Design Inquiries! \| SKYPE: s2odesigns \| ICQ: 280646555 Adult/Mainstream Website Designs \| Illustrations, Toons & Corporate Logos S2O Designs - Making Awesome Logos & Websites Since 2003!

05-23-2004, 02:50 PM	#22
FlyingIguana aspiring banker Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: toronto Posts: 10,870	you rarely get a ferrari for the price of a pinto. if you do, you might have been better off with the pinto

05-23-2004, 02:53 PM	#24
Roald SecretFriends.com Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Location: IMC Headquarters Posts: 27,896	Have to agree on some parts with you Dre. I am NOT calling myself a pro, far from that, but I am doing this for some time now and all works out very well for me. But I can tell you lots of guys won't be here next year or the year after if you ask me. So no worries from me about 'm, as long as my clients referer me to others I am happy and it is showing me that lots do respect what I do. Keep up the good work and don't worrie to much about others __________________ WE ARE BUYING PAY SITES! CONTACT ME ClubSweethearts \| ManUpFilms \| SinfulXXX \| HOT * AdultPrime * HOT Paying webmasters since 1996! Contact: r.riepen @ sansylgroup.com \| telegram: roaldr

05-23-2004, 02:55 PM	#25
Zayne E. Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 1,383	Been a long time since I have seen a good rant about designers

05-23-2004, 02:57 PM	#27
cherrylula lol Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 15,969	Yeah more pixel abusers than designers.

05-23-2004, 03:02 PM	#30
blazi Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Closer now Posts: 4,321	I think some of the best designers are in this industry. part of the reason for that is it's a lot harder finding work doing non-adult sites. __________________ makingcoin.com - 100% payouts coinscuties.com

05-23-2004, 03:10 PM	#32
Sly_RJ Live Hard - Die Hard Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Ready to leave... Posts: 17,042	Most "designers" worth using have a waiting list. If they don't have a waiting list, I tend to wonder how good they are. So much of this business revolves around the "recurring" model, even business to business transactions. Repeat buyers are the best. __________________ PHAT SERVERS - Quality dedicated hosting at a quality price! sly AT phatservers DOT com - 147479144

05-23-2004, 03:34 PM	#34
$tandaman Pimping 8EZ Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: New Jersey Posts: 3,530	Doctor Dre, I agree with you on the most parts, but i also look at it from another side.. There are multiple layers in the market, and all of them need to be covered, it's a market economy as well as world wide in geographical sense, since we are all connected by the internet. There will always be market for '3 day ago i installed photoshop, now i call myself a designer' designers, but they are no competition to the quality companies. Plethora of poor quality designers makes those that are good stand out a lot, the only thing that's pissing me off is that it's really hard to get the client to notice you, because they have to sift through lots of shit prior to finding ya. So i don't get mad, my clients get very happy when they find me, and once they find me, they don't want to go anywhere else, which makes them keep coming back, and i just concentrate on producing high quality work for them. I am very impressed after conversation with you how you found your own niche, and just taking advantage of it. It's a much better plan then trying to outshine all the crap designers in adult internet, for less pay. Keep up the good work __________________ CentroProfits.com - Make money with 3000+ Models! ModelCentro.com - Multiple award winning hosted CMS designed to run solo model sites, with affiliate program built in. Launch your model site in 24 hrs or less! FanCentro.com - Premium social network for SWs & Fans!

05-23-2004, 04:28 PM	#37
AdultNex Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Bostonnnn Posts: 8,985	You think design in adult is bad? Just wait till you get into mainstream. With all the foreign designers jumping aboard, people want complete designs and content management for $50.

05-23-2004, 04:33 PM	#38
Esbee Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Northern CA Posts: 109	Part of the problem is economics. When I started looking at designing for adult, I figured designing galleries would make a good start. Decent enough area to build up a portfolio, almost impossible to put yourself way over your head, chance to develop copywriting skills in Adult, etc. Looking around the (rather saturated) market, looked like the high end I might be able to pull would be $50/gallery. Assuming I was ready to work at a depressed $20/hour to break into the market, translates to 2.5 hours per gallery. So in that timespan I'd need to: 1. Review the client site and figure out what makes the site marketable (many, many paysite designs make that a difficult task in and of itself) 2. Sit down and write my copy. 3. Come up with a basic layout. 4. Drop my text copy into the layout. 5. Place the imagery and decor around the layout and text. 6. Retouch it, Wacom it, etc. 7. Splice. 8. Tweak and optimize Imageready'd output into more legitimage page. 9. Replace placeholder images with thumbs, link to full size pics/movies, etc. 10. Fix the intangible problems that arise with every project. I have 8+ years experience marketing and advertising in the travel industry (not an exact fit, but a stronger background than I suspect many enter the industry with). There's not much of anything in Photoshop I don't know - I'm more efficient with some tools than others, but can do most anything. In short, I'm in a pretty good position experience-wise to do these fairly quick. Yet it quickly became obvious there was no fucking way I could do the above in 2.5 hours. I'd be lucky to open Photoshop in the first 2.5 hours. The above is more like a 5 hour task. So that left three options: a) Charge $100/gallery. Too far above market rates for that to work. b) Skimp on the design angle, use PS Styles as a quick crutch. Course now you can only charge $25-$30 gallery. c) Nearly wipe out steps 1 and 2. Focus solely on design. None of these options look good to me so I haven't gone any route, but I have the luxury of a full-time job and can translate what I learn researching adult into my other job. Not many have that lxuury. Of the three, option b) is probably the best. Problem is you get painted as a quick-and-dirty designer and once labeled, it's hard to extend beyond that. I also see plenty of option c)'s out there - beautiful PS work but the sales message is obscurred. Ironically this might be the faster means to move to the more lucrative paysite designs. Already established designers are, of course, exempt from the above restrictions. But for the newbie designers around here, it's pretty rough to produce high-end design with marketable features, at the pricing the current market dictates. Mind you, I'm not crying here. I didn't expect an easy and open armed transition into adult designing. But I am sympathetic to other designers fending their way just as I am. That said, publicly blasting a designer's work seems far out of line, particularly when your solution is hiring eastern European graphic designers. Somehow I can't see non-native English speaking graphic designers writing great sales copy geared towards (mostly) U.S. consumers.