who are the biggest hosting companies - GoFuckYourself.com

mammy · 04-12-2004, 07:53 AM

according to number of clients?

body · 04-12-2004, 08:10 AM

likewhoa

FrankWhite · 04-12-2004, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahahaha
likewhoa

ChewbaCreative · 04-12-2004, 08:23 AM

ISPrime.com
and Google

Oracle Porn · 04-12-2004, 08:29 AM

www.reflected.net

roly · 04-12-2004, 08:32 AM

rackshack/ev1

mammy · 04-12-2004, 08:36 AM

strange that no words bout national net and webair

Lykos · 04-12-2004, 08:52 AM

one of the bigest definitly is www.webair.com

$tandaman · 04-12-2004, 09:14 AM

I would say c.h.o.o.p.a. dot com

Official stats over 7.5 Gigabits

bluff · 04-12-2004, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by $tandaman
I would say c.h.o.o.p.a. dot com

Official stats over 7.5 Gigabits

isprime has 7 gbit too

bluff · 04-12-2004, 09:18 AM

but there is a lot more in hosting land, for a minute I thought you were talking about adut hosts

sexsup · 04-12-2004, 09:20 AM

I'd say ISPrime has the bigger clients

AWW - Kevin · 04-12-2004, 09:27 AM

better question would be
who has the happiest clients ?

AnalProbe · 04-12-2004, 09:35 AM

ISPRIME rocks.

And don't forget EV1.net

CaroMark · 04-12-2004, 09:37 AM

I would say that Lensman hit it about right back in the middle of November when he did the interview on XBiz!

Take a few minutes to search for it over there, I think it was in the second part of the interview where he discussed hosts!

And YES, Candid Hosting.com made even his top five!

pradaboy · 04-12-2004, 09:47 AM

are we talking adult or overall???

NatNet is my #1

Herb Kornfield · 04-12-2004, 09:52 AM

www.realitychecknetwork.com - They have quite a bit a high traffic players in their mix and the staff combined is at least 27 feet tall.

fris · 04-12-2004, 09:57 AM

mr memmer: is roadie still over there with you guys, i wanna get in touch with him.

PbG · 04-12-2004, 03:47 PM

I'm with you . . .

Quote:

Originally posted by AWW - Kevin
better question would be
who has the happiest clients ?

bufferover · 04-12-2004, 03:51 PM

Uhh i realy enjoy in this kind of threads

Sami · 04-12-2004, 03:54 PM

The biggest never means the best.

yahoo hosting , ev1servers

couple of the biggest ones.

jimmyf · 04-12-2004, 03:58 PM

I would say Verio

jpwhits · 04-12-2004, 04:01 PM

VideoVoyeur · 04-12-2004, 04:05 PM

Charlotte Colo AKA Verio's Charlotte datacenter.

OC192 connectivity woohoo, smokes almost 99% of the so called "adult hosts" and "adult hosting datacenters" including natnet, rackshack and Webair.

For connectivity, http://www.charlottecolo.com AKA Verio.

Moose · 04-12-2004, 04:09 PM

First a disclaimer....I have NO IDEA how accurate this is and doubt it is very accurate. But it might be able to be used as a barrometer of some sort.
http://www.hostcount.com/main.htm

Just some of the hosts off the top of my head that are around here have the follwoing ranking out of 30,000+ co's

natianal-net.com 57
candidhosting.com 128
isprime.com 148
phatservers.com 241
jupiterhosting.com 751
webair.com 112

Doctor Dre · 04-12-2004, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahahaha
likewhoa

ROFL

Doctor Dre · 04-12-2004, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lykos
one of the bigest definitly is www.webair.com

Yea

Hosting compagnies come and go ... pro hosters like woah etc . Lot of compagnies had their 2 mins of fame .

Doctor Dre · 04-12-2004, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by $tandaman
I would say c.h.o.o.p.a. dot com

Official stats over 7.5 Gigabits

Clement got everything big :P He ordered like 2000 $ of bizz card at the same time from me

Doctor Dre · 04-12-2004, 04:14 PM

Hrmm now I know ... GEOCITIES !!!

VideoVoyeur · 04-12-2004, 04:15 PM

BTW
Charlotte colo is not really a "hosting" copany per se, they are a data center, but if they did hosting, figures of 5 gigs of space and 300 gigs of bandwidth a month for around $300 a month would be ballpark.

I have a full cabinet there, I pay $600 a month for a 42U cabinet and 3000 GIGS of bandwidth a month with $1 overages.

Just my

They have the same connectivity as Sprint.

Datacenters and Hosts really are like apples and oranges, any datacenter can easily beat any hosting company's prices for hosting.

On-top · 04-12-2004, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahahaha
likewhoa

Indeed.

zagi · 04-12-2004, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VideoVoyeur
BTW
Charlotte colo is not really a "hosting"
I have a full cabinet there, I pay $600 a month for a 42U cabinet and 3000 GIGS of bandwidth a month with $1 overages.

So if they are not hosting, but colo, sure you got the Rack there, but who provides you the 10mbps 3000G connection for a total of $600/month?

Brad Mitchell · 04-12-2004, 05:39 PM

Host count is a joke IMHO

http://www.hostcount.com/cgi-bin/cgi...SINHOST.COM%22

http://www.hostcount.com/cgi-bin/cgi...&submit=Search

http://www.hostcount.com/cgi-bin/cgi...&Find=mojohost

I'm all three of those.. I can assure you their numbers are a guess, at best.

I might never be the biggest.. just aim to be the best

Brad

SoundMan · 04-12-2004, 05:41 PM

there is a site that lists this, i lost the url.

ev-rack is like #7

CaroMark · 04-12-2004, 05:51 PM

Hi Fris,

I am sorry to say that Raodie is no longer with us and I don't know how to contact him!

Veterans Day · 04-12-2004, 05:51 PM

sig, truly an awesome hosting outfit is ISPrime.

mammy · 04-12-2004, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Veterans Day
sig, truly an awesome hosting outfit is ISPrime.

and of course isprime has one of the best looking hosting sites

Veterans Day · 04-12-2004, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mammy

and of course isprime has one of the best looking hosting sites

They go so far beyond looks too, the support is exactly what you would expect from Denis and crew. Simply the best

psyko514 · 04-12-2004, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by roly
rackshack/ev1

yeah, they're pretty fucking huge. mainstream too.

chaze · 04-12-2004, 11:08 PM

Sorry but this thread is junk nohahahaha really knows, and any reputable service doesn't tell. Posting your friends hosting company as the biggest for 10 seconds of fame is lame.. sorry,

Any company that says they host 2 million is lying, in fact I have noticed for the most part most the ones that brag like 1and1 really are the smallest and are trying too hard to look big.

But if I had to guess, then I would say yahoo and sbc global they are partners. But they don't host adult sites.

As far as adult sites then it's probably say rackshack.

A better question is what hosting screws more people and the answer is also rackshack. Why deal with a fake spam complaint or bandwidth spikes when you don't need to care about a single customer. Also they run Cogent and Verio the biggest crap networks in the world no wonder there so cheap. Also their hardware fails all the time since it's self ran by the owners of the servers they fuck up the system and then quit and guess who gets it next,

Another good questions is who's the best... and that's DWHS Web Hosting Plain and Simple

VideoVoyeur · 04-13-2004, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by zagi

So if they are not hosting, but colo, sure you got the Rack there, but who provides you the 10mbps 3000G connection for a total of $600/month?

Charlotte Colo does, I have dedicated servers.

Just so MOST of you are aware, almost EVERY hosting company mentioned in this thread is NOTHING more then a rack or two of dedicated servers in someones datacenter.

In fact the trend that I have seen is the people open up maybe 2 or 4 U of servers space, install Hsphere and claim to have a massive data center.

Many times i click on a web host link on this board only to see it say

" Our services are located in Texas and our data center is located in BumFuck Egypt."

That should be a big tip off right there that they really dont have a data center, all they really have is 1 or 2 servers IN a data center.

Anyone can get a box hosted in a data center, its the BEST webhost you can actually get.

If you know linux or know someone who will remote admin your box for you, theres no reason to even BUY hosting ANYWHERE.

Simply make a server, call up the data center, and send them your server.

ALMOST EVERY SINGLE hosting company I see in sigs on this board is nothing more then just that, a 1U or 2U server in a data center. Is it their data center? Fuck no, but they do try and say it is

OC192, fastest connection available to man right now.

UUNET
Sprint
Verio
AOL
Time Warner Telecom
Charlotte Colo ( Verio South)

Everyone else says Multiple OC38's and crap, they get their bandwidth FROM the places above.

Brad Mitchell · 04-13-2004, 06:43 AM

I think it's worth saying a few things...

Of course colo-ing your server and buying bandwidth direct are a great option... mostly in theory. Although not true in every instance, please consider the following:

1) As a single client you will not have the size or economies of scale to achieve a good price from your upstream provider. I can assure you that for the most part not a single Tier 1 sells bandwidth at reasonable prices for low commitment levels. And any large colo is unlikely to sell you just 1u, rather, they want to sell you 1/2 rack minimum.

2) Let's assume that all viable hosts are in a data center even though we know many BS and are simply in office buildings... Hosting is as much about providing good service as it is about the bandwidth space.

3) We're all owners of internet businesses. As site owners our time is best spent finding and converting traffic. Stepping out of the box of being a host, which I am, I am also a site owner. I value my time at several hundred an hour. It wouldn't take but one small instance in a month to buy an awful lot of server management.

4) If you know how to manage your server, great! Most do not. If you did know how to manage your own server your best bet would still most likely be colo with a large hosting company instead of direct with a carrier and facility. You will likely have the savings from their bulk purchase of space and bandwidth passed on to you. Also, remote hands are usually cheaper with a hosting company than with an upstream provider. I can assure you that you wouldn't like Verio's bill for such a service.

"Just so MOST of you are aware, almost EVERY hosting company mentioned in this thread is NOTHING more then a rack or two of dedicated servers in someones datacenter." VideoVoyeur

I couldn't agree more! A lot of the stuff I see posted online and read on hosting websites makes me giggle. One thing is for sure, far too many don't keep their sales pitch "real". I often think that we'd be well served by an independant watchdog group that could travel around and report back on what they found at each hosting operation... lol pipe dream!

I think some of the top companies in size are definitely:

RackShack
ev1servers.net
RackSpace

Choosing what is best really is a client-by-client decision. If you're a very competant server administrator then your best bet is to colo locally or colo with another hosting company elsewhere and manage your server remotely. At a certain point in revenue for a one man shop, however, managing your own server makes a lot less sense. Under the presumption you were with a great provider, which in some instances is alot to assume, then it would likely be cheaper and easier to have them fully manage your gear.

Just my

Brad

hanii · 04-13-2004, 06:57 AM

theplanet.com(servermatrix.com)
ev1servers.net
rackspace.com

XxXotic · 04-13-2004, 07:04 AM

Oxeo we were here before the hosting drama, through it and will be here after it settles too. Rock Solid

CaroMark · 04-13-2004, 07:24 AM

As usual, Brad has posted some very insightful prose above!

Techie Media · 04-13-2004, 07:41 AM

Brad you saved me a ton of typing

You hit the nail on the head bro, ...nice post

Herb Kornfield · 04-13-2004, 07:44 AM

http://news.netcraft.com/ -> Dotster in the US / 1&1 internet in Europe.

Brad Mitchell · 04-13-2004, 09:12 AM

MMemmer, Lightning - I'm happy to have you and several others as competition. We all see things for what they are and come by our successes honestly... can't ask for more than that!

Cheers,

Brad

Brad Mitchell · 04-13-2004, 10:37 AM

Damn, I killed the thread.

SetTheWorldonFire · 04-13-2004, 10:44 AM

Oxeo Web Hosting

04-12-2004, 08:10 AM	#2
body Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 5,012	likewhoa __________________ The Goddess Of Steps

04-12-2004, 08:23 AM	#4
ChewbaCreative Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 1,118	ISPrime.com and Google __________________ high design. high creative. adultcreative

04-12-2004, 08:29 AM	#5
Oracle Porn Affiliate Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Icq: 94-399-723 Posts: 24,433	www.reflected.net __________________

04-12-2004, 08:52 AM	#8
Lykos Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: World Posts: 31,027	one of the bigest definitly is www.webair.com __________________

04-12-2004, 09:14 AM	#9
$tandaman Pimping 8EZ Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: New Jersey Posts: 3,529	I would say c.h.o.o.p.a. dot com Official stats over 7.5 Gigabits __________________ CentroProfits.com - Make money with 3000+ Models! ModelCentro.com - Multiple award winning hosted CMS designed to run solo model sites, with affiliate program built in. Launch your model site in 24 hrs or less! FanCentro.com - Premium social network for SWs & Fans!

04-12-2004, 07:53 AM	#1
mammy Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 2,279	who are the biggest hosting companies according to number of clients? __________________ million dollars for paysite design icq 434954667

04-12-2004, 08:32 AM	#6
roly Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 1,844	rackshack/ev1

04-12-2004, 08:36 AM	#7
mammy Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 2,279	strange that no words bout national net and webair __________________ million dollars for paysite design icq 434954667

04-12-2004, 09:18 AM	#11
bluff Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Bluffville Posts: 6,253	but there is a lot more in hosting land, for a minute I thought you were talking about adut hosts

04-12-2004, 09:20 AM	#12
sexsup Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,004	I'd say ISPrime has the bigger clients

04-12-2004, 09:27 AM	#13
AWW - Kevin Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: AdultWebmasterInfo Posts: 2,353	better question would be who has the happiest clients ? __________________ Add Your Resource ICQ: 1212-58311

04-12-2004, 09:35 AM	#14
AnalProbe pain in the Ass Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 3,727	ISPRIME rocks. And don't forget EV1.net

04-12-2004, 09:37 AM	#15
CaroMark Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Tampa, Florida Posts: 1,357	I would say that Lensman hit it about right back in the middle of November when he did the interview on XBiz! Take a few minutes to search for it over there, I think it was in the second part of the interview where he discussed hosts! And YES, Candid Hosting.com made even his top five! __________________ Mark M, 727-433-0745 [email protected] Support is everything! ICQ# 40467849, AIM MMemmer333

04-12-2004, 09:47 AM	#16
pradaboy sell me your banners Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: on the tubes Posts: 12,931	are we talking adult or overall??? NatNet is my #1 __________________ Media Buyer - Sell me your traffic! FREE to register domains... Better than 99% of the crap sold here!

04-12-2004, 09:52 AM	#17
Herb Kornfield Is on the 1 Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Philly Burbs Posts: 4,996	www.realitychecknetwork.com - They have quite a bit a high traffic players in their mix and the staff combined is at least 27 feet tall.

04-12-2004, 09:57 AM	#18
fris Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 55,372	mr memmer: is roadie still over there with you guys, i wanna get in touch with him. __________________ Since 1999: 69 Adult Industry awards for Best Hosting Company and professional excellence. WP Stuff

04-12-2004, 03:51 PM	#20
bufferover Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 25,203	Uhh i realy enjoy in this kind of threads

04-12-2004, 03:54 PM	#21
Sami Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 2,047	The biggest never means the best. yahoo hosting , ev1servers couple of the biggest ones. __________________ ServerProvider.com ICQ#: 311-848-143

04-12-2004, 03:58 PM	#22
jimmyf OU812 Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: California Posts: 12,651	I would say Verio __________________ Epic CashEpic Cash works for me Solar Cash Paysite Plugin Gallery of the day freesites,POTD,Gallery generator with free hosting

04-12-2004, 04:01 PM	#23
jpwhits Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 1,045	1&1

04-12-2004, 04:05 PM	#24
VideoVoyeur So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 2,181	Charlotte Colo AKA Verio's Charlotte datacenter. OC192 connectivity woohoo, smokes almost 99% of the so called "adult hosts" and "adult hosting datacenters" including natnet, rackshack and Webair. For connectivity, http://www.charlottecolo.com AKA Verio.

04-12-2004, 04:09 PM	#25
Moose Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Here Posts: 1,548	First a disclaimer....I have NO IDEA how accurate this is and doubt it is very accurate. But it might be able to be used as a barrometer of some sort. http://www.hostcount.com/main.htm Just some of the hosts off the top of my head that are around here have the follwoing ranking out of 30,000+ co's natianal-net.com 57 candidhosting.com 128 isprime.com 148 phatservers.com 241 jupiterhosting.com 751 webair.com 112

04-12-2004, 04:15 PM	#30
VideoVoyeur So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 2,181	BTW Charlotte colo is not really a "hosting" copany per se, they are a data center, but if they did hosting, figures of 5 gigs of space and 300 gigs of bandwidth a month for around $300 a month would be ballpark. I have a full cabinet there, I pay $600 a month for a 42U cabinet and 3000 GIGS of bandwidth a month with $1 overages. Just my They have the same connectivity as Sprint. Datacenters and Hosts really are like apples and oranges, any datacenter can easily beat any hosting company's prices for hosting.

04-12-2004, 05:39 PM	#33
Brad Mitchell Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southfield, MI Posts: 9,812	Host count is a joke IMHO http://www.hostcount.com/cgi-bin/cgi...SINHOST.COM%22 http://www.hostcount.com/cgi-bin/cgi...&submit=Search http://www.hostcount.com/cgi-bin/cgi...&Find=mojohost I'm all three of those.. I can assure you their numbers are a guess, at best. I might never be the biggest.. just aim to be the best Brad __________________ President at MojoHost \| brad at mojohost dot com \| Skype MojoHostBrad 71 industry awards for hosting and professional excellence since 1999

04-12-2004, 05:41 PM	#34
SoundMan So Fucking Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: MidWest Posts: 3,471	there is a site that lists this, i lost the url. ev-rack is like #7

04-12-2004, 05:51 PM	#35
CaroMark Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Tampa, Florida Posts: 1,357	Hi Fris, I am sorry to say that Raodie is no longer with us and I don't know how to contact him! __________________ Mark M, 727-433-0745 [email protected] Support is everything! ICQ# 40467849, AIM MMemmer333

04-12-2004, 05:51 PM	#36
Veterans Day Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Windy City Posts: 8,403	sig, truly an awesome hosting outfit is ISPrime. __________________ Build a Massive Traffic Network, Hands FREE, Totally Automated

04-12-2004, 11:08 PM	#40
chaze Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 9,752	Sorry but this thread is junk nohahahaha really knows, and any reputable service doesn't tell. Posting your friends hosting company as the biggest for 10 seconds of fame is lame.. sorry, Any company that says they host 2 million is lying, in fact I have noticed for the most part most the ones that brag like 1and1 really are the smallest and are trying too hard to look big. But if I had to guess, then I would say yahoo and sbc global they are partners. But they don't host adult sites. As far as adult sites then it's probably say rackshack. A better question is what hosting screws more people and the answer is also rackshack. Why deal with a fake spam complaint or bandwidth spikes when you don't need to care about a single customer. Also they run Cogent and Verio the biggest crap networks in the world no wonder there so cheap. Also their hardware fails all the time since it's self ran by the owners of the servers they fuck up the system and then quit and guess who gets it next, Another good questions is who's the best... and that's DWHS Web Hosting Plain and Simple

04-13-2004, 06:43 AM	#42
Brad Mitchell Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southfield, MI Posts: 9,812	I think it's worth saying a few things... Of course colo-ing your server and buying bandwidth direct are a great option... mostly in theory. Although not true in every instance, please consider the following: 1) As a single client you will not have the size or economies of scale to achieve a good price from your upstream provider. I can assure you that for the most part not a single Tier 1 sells bandwidth at reasonable prices for low commitment levels. And any large colo is unlikely to sell you just 1u, rather, they want to sell you 1/2 rack minimum. 2) Let's assume that all viable hosts are in a data center even though we know many BS and are simply in office buildings... Hosting is as much about providing good service as it is about the bandwidth space. 3) We're all owners of internet businesses. As site owners our time is best spent finding and converting traffic. Stepping out of the box of being a host, which I am, I am also a site owner. I value my time at several hundred an hour. It wouldn't take but one small instance in a month to buy an awful lot of server management. 4) If you know how to manage your server, great! Most do not. If you did know how to manage your own server your best bet would still most likely be colo with a large hosting company instead of direct with a carrier and facility. You will likely have the savings from their bulk purchase of space and bandwidth passed on to you. Also, remote hands are usually cheaper with a hosting company than with an upstream provider. I can assure you that you wouldn't like Verio's bill for such a service. "Just so MOST of you are aware, almost EVERY hosting company mentioned in this thread is NOTHING more then a rack or two of dedicated servers in someones datacenter." VideoVoyeur I couldn't agree more! A lot of the stuff I see posted online and read on hosting websites makes me giggle. One thing is for sure, far too many don't keep their sales pitch "real". I often think that we'd be well served by an independant watchdog group that could travel around and report back on what they found at each hosting operation... lol pipe dream! I think some of the top companies in size are definitely: RackShack ev1servers.net RackSpace Choosing what is best really is a client-by-client decision. If you're a very competant server administrator then your best bet is to colo locally or colo with another hosting company elsewhere and manage your server remotely. At a certain point in revenue for a one man shop, however, managing your own server makes a lot less sense. Under the presumption you were with a great provider, which in some instances is alot to assume, then it would likely be cheaper and easier to have them fully manage your gear. Just my Brad __________________ President at MojoHost \| brad at mojohost dot com \| Skype MojoHostBrad 71 industry awards for hosting and professional excellence since 1999

04-13-2004, 06:57 AM	#43
hanii Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Moon Posts: 449	theplanet.com(servermatrix.com) ev1servers.net rackspace.com

04-13-2004, 07:04 AM	#44
XxXotic Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Da Swamps Posts: 8,500	Oxeo we were here before the hosting drama, through it and will be here after it settles too. Rock Solid __________________ Sponsors.. Tired of people not using your shitty RSS Feeds? Let Us Help You! Oxeo - Serious Hosting For Serious Webmasters. iCQ:135.887013

04-13-2004, 07:24 AM	#45
CaroMark Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Tampa, Florida Posts: 1,357	As usual, Brad has posted some very insightful prose above! __________________ Mark M, 727-433-0745 [email protected] Support is everything! ICQ# 40467849, AIM MMemmer333

04-13-2004, 07:41 AM	#46
Techie Media Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 3,092	Brad you saved me a ton of typing You hit the nail on the head bro, ...nice post __________________ sales [AT] techiemedia.com

04-13-2004, 07:44 AM	#47
Herb Kornfield Is on the 1 Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Philly Burbs Posts: 4,996	http://news.netcraft.com/ -> Dotster in the US / 1&1 internet in Europe.

04-13-2004, 09:12 AM	#48
Brad Mitchell Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Southfield, MI Posts: 9,812	MMemmer, Lightning - I'm happy to have you and several others as competition. We all see things for what they are and come by our successes honestly... can't ask for more than that! Cheers, Brad __________________ President at MojoHost \| brad at mojohost dot com \| Skype MojoHostBrad 71 industry awards for hosting and professional excellence since 1999