I need legal advice?

[jd2004]

I got this email from 2checkout.com my former creditcard processor.




Dear Mr. Davis:

I am with the legal department. You opened an account with us, setting it up for web hosting. You clicked on a contract -- our terms of service. In Section IV, you agreed to not sell specific goods and services 2Checkout.com, Inc. prohibits with a link for the most up to date list. One such item is pornography. Our Director of Risk Management determined your site, allegedly a hosting site, is a porn site. The evidence was forwarded to me. This violates the Terms of Service. Most despicable was actively attempting to deceive us as to the site?s true nature. While we would normally instruct you to remove the offensive material immediately, in light of the blatant attempt to hide by masking the true contents of the site, we believe you knew this would meet with our disapproval. and took steps to conceal that from us. Therefore, we believe the best course is to terminate the account immediately for violating the terms of service. Moreover, you are hereby notified we have determined your conduct merits forfeitures of all monies earned and therefore demand all funds paid to you be returned to us immediately. I have advised 2Checkout that your course of conduct constitutes both civil and criminal misconduct and that should you fail to return the funds to us, they should without hesitation explore all potential legal remedies and immediately chose the best means proceeding with all dispatch. You may return the fees only by certified bank check or a money order made payable to 2Checkout.com, Inc in the amount of $1,886.79.


In conclusion, you tried to hide a porn site by disguising it as a web hosting site intentionally circumventing the contract. That conduct constitutes both civil and criminal violations of the law. Therefore, we are terminating your account immediately and demand the immediate refund of all monies paid you.

Sincerely,

Ronald H. Sebree, Esq.
Legal Department




Now this isn't completely true, when I opened the account it was for my hosting site which later on I closed, so since I already payed the fee to use 2checkout.com i decided to use them for my cam site, which isn't a porn site! Now they are telling me I have to pay them all the money they ever paid me $1,886.79. this is crazy I have had to pay most of that for the site, now they demand all money ever made back to them...what would YOU do?

[detoxed]

Post your URL

[jd2004]

www.aznfetish.com

[beergood]

If it isn't true and your account is already closed then fuck them don't even respond. Make the bitches serve you.

[jd2004]

Originally posted by beergood
If it isn't true and your account is already closed then fuck them don't even respond. Make the bitches serve you.

I just don't want to get fucked in the end, you think they can do anything?

[beergood]

I don't know if they can do anything in your situation all I know is in the past I always blown threats off till they take a more pro-active approach to getting ahold of me before I'll even consider them a problem. 90% of the time I've never heard from them (whatever lawyer) again.

[NoCarrier]

Those letters are boring..

"GIVE ME MY MONEY BACK U FUCKING ASSHOLE!

Sincerely,

Ronald H. Sebree, Esq.
Legal Department"

Would be more appropriate.

[jd2004]

Originally posted by beergood
I don't know if they can do anything in your situation all I know is in the past I always blown threats off till they take a more pro-active approach to getting ahold of me before I'll even consider them a problem. 90% of the time I've never heard from them (whatever lawyer) again.

I thinks its crazy as fuck that they want 2,000$ from me, thats like all the site has made, and my expenses are about that high as well on it, I even have to pay taxes on that damn money that the want back, it's not like they are going to give the money back to my customers.

[jd2004]

here is there stupid terms part he says I violated;

IV. Operational Requirements:
Goods and Services
The Company prohibits the registration or sale of specific goods and services. For a complete and up-to-date listing of prohibited items please click HERE (http://www.2checkout.com/products.htm).

Suppliers in violation of the prohibited products requirement will be warned to remove the products or services from the Company?s registered products offering. Failure to comply after the warning period expires will result in account termination and potential forfeiture of commission on account.


I was never warned!

[Michaelious]

I think it might be a good idea if u contacted a lawyer rather than ask on a notice board.

[beergood]

Originally posted by Michaelious
I think it might be a good idea if u contacted a lawyer rather than ask on a notice board.

yeah do that

[DVTimes]

One thing I must point out that I often tell others is that whatever you do, do not say ever that you do porn. I say I do Adult sites but not porn.

The reason for this is that in the UK (and I suspect other countries) there has never been a defined statement of what porn is or is not. Thus it is for others to first prove you do porn.

I would seek legal advise though. But make sure that you state you deal with adult and not porn.

[twistyneck]

I could see them closing your account but trying to get the money back that they paid you is ridiculous. Tell them to fuck off.

[jd2004]

this guy blows

Dear Jason:

Reproduced below are the relevant sections of the TOS contract you agreed to when you became a vendor.

Terms of Service
?Supplier Agreement?

II. Legal Notice:

2Checkout.com, Inc. will hereafter be referred to as ?the Company.? Individuals or business entities under contract to provide services or products to the Company will hereafter be referred to as ?the Supplier(s)? or ?a Supplier.?

The Supplier assumes full responsibility for the decision to utilize 2Checkout.com affiliated services ?as is? and disclaims any implied warranties including for merchantability, fitness for a particular purpose and non-infringement.


Term and Cancellation
The term of this Agreement shall continue until a notice of cancellation by the Company or Supplier is given, or until terminated under other provisions of this Agreement.

Suppliers may close their account with the Company at any time.

The Company reserves the right to terminate this agreement and close a Supplier account at any time

IV. Operational Requirements:
Goods and Services
The Company prohibits the registration or sale of specific goods and services. For a complete and up-to-date listing of prohibited items please click HERE (http://www.2checkout.com/products.htm).

Suppliers in violation of the prohibited products requirement will be warned to remove the products or services from the Company?s registered products offering. Failure to comply after the warning period expires will result in account termination and potential forfeiture of commission on account.

III. Fulfillment Contract:
Hereafter 2Checkout.com, Inc. shall be referred to as ?the Company.?

The contracting individual or business shall hereafter be referred to as ?the Supplier.?

The 2Checkout.com, Inc. Fulfillment Contract is the contract between the Company and the 2Checkout.com, Inc. Supplier (You).


Sale of Goods
If you register products with the Company you agree that the Company will purchase your product for possible resale to retail consumers.



What types of products/services can be sold?



Your products/services must be legal for sale in all states, provinces, and countries where you accept customers.

The following products and services cannot be sold:

Online Subscription Pornography & Adult Subscription Content
You can NOT sell any Adult subscription services, chat, or any pornography (pictures, videos, DVDs, magazines).

pornography

[pôr-'nä-gre-fe]

: material that depicts erotic behavior and is intended to cause sexual excitement
Note: Pornographic material is protected expression unless it is determined to be obscene. However, child pornography is illegal under federal and state laws prohibiting the depiction of minors in sexual acts.

Now, let?s look at some things here. I have in my possession several nude photographs taken from your site.


There is one picture of Jen where she is simulating masturbation and another close up of her hand on her vagina. There are several of Battina engaged in French kissing another girl. This material depicts erotic behavior and is intended to cause sexual excitement. Additionally, one has to wonder about the ages of several of these girls.

Let?s also talk about links. The following links are on your site.

Ø aznFETISH.com <http://www.aznfetish.com>
> aznWHORES.com <http://www.aznwhores.com>
> modelCHIX.net <http://www.modelchix.net>
> Roxy-Cam.com <http://www.roxy-cam.com>
> JayHosting.com <http://www.jayhosting.com>



These lead to nude sites. For example modelchix.net has a link to j18.com which shows male genitalia and masturbation by a young Asian woman using a vibrator. Some of the other sites offer video chat. Do I really need to go any further?



Yes, Jason, you site is pornographic.



That violates the TOS. Moreover, you get to your alleged non nude by going through what appears to be a legitimate web hosting site. In short, you are hiding what you are doing. This gives us the right to shut you down. However, when you are also representing to us that your site is doing something kosher will taking money for doing something that violates the TOS, you are stealing from us ? fraud



fraud

Latin fraud- fraus

1 a: any act, expression, omission, or concealment calculated to deceive another to his or her disadvantage

specif
: a misrepresentation or concealment with reference to some fact material to a transaction that is made with knowledge of its falsity or in reckless disregard of its truth or falsity and with the intent to deceive another and that is reasonably relied on by the other who is injured thereby

b: the affirmative defense of having acted in response to a fraud

2: the crime or tort of committing fraud
Example: convicted of securities fraud
(see also misrepresentation)
Note: A tort action based on fraud is also referred to as an action of deceit.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

actual fraud
: fraud committed with the actual intent to deceive and thereby injure another
(called also fraud in fact)
(compare constructive fraud in this entry)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

constructive fraud
: conduct that is considered fraud under the law despite the absence of an intent to deceive because it has the same consequences as an actual fraud would have and it is against public interests (as because of the violation of a public or private trust or confidence, the breach of a fiduciary duty, or the use of undue influence)
(called also legal fraud)
(compare actual fraud in this entry)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

equitable fraud
: "constructive fraud" in this entry (used esp. in New Jersey)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

extrinsic fraud
: fraud (as that involved in making a false offer of compromise) that induces one not to present a case in court or deprives one of the opportunity to be heard

also
: fraud that is not involved in the actual issues presented to a court and that prevents a full and fair hearing
(called also collateral fraud)
(compare intrinsic fraud in this entry)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

fraud in fact
: "actual fraud" in this entry


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

fraud in law
: fraud that is presumed to have occurred in light of the circumstances irrespective of intent to deceive


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

fraud in the factum
: fraud in which the deception causes the other party to misunderstand the nature of the transaction in which he or she is engaging esp. with regard to the contents of an instrument (as a contract or promissory note)
(called also fraud in the execution)
(compare fraud in the inducement in this entry)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This fraud gives us the right to demand you return all money paid to you by 2Checkout.com.


Ronald Sebree, Esq.
Legal Department
2Checkout.com

[CDSmith]

Originally posted by jd2004
i decided to use them for my cam site, which isn't a porn site!

Originally posted by jd2004
www.aznfetish.com

Posted on that site:

"Q. Is there any nudity?
- This started out as a non-nude site but has gradually started to include some nudity"


I hear you, and I understand where you're coming from, but frankly you're in the wrong here. Most mainstream people and companies I know of all view sites showing nudity and sexiness as "porn". Conversely, most of those on our side of the fence view it as softcore, reserving the title "porn" for those sites that actually show some further sexual interraction. So from the point of view of the webmaster your site is okay, but from the point of view of anyone not part of our industry, your site IS pornographic in nature.

Thus it is in violation of their TOS.



Best advice in this thead: Go talk to a lawyer, preferably one that is net-savvy.

[integrated]

this is what i do in a similar situation to get more time


you reseal the envolope so it looks like it hasnt been open you drive 100kms and put it in someone elses mailbox

problem solved for the moment

[Vox]

Get rid of the paypal option, if you don't wan't your account closed down.
As for 2checkout, you did violate the TOS, you first started out as a hosting company then switched it over to your cam site with out informing the billing company, any company would shut you down. Time to talk to a lawyer and see if you can settle something out, or It might cost you even more in the future.

[CDSmith]

Originally posted by integrated
this is what i do in a similar situation to get more time


you reseal the envolope so it looks like it hasnt been open you drive 100kms and put it in someone elses mailbox

problem solved for the moment

Ahh, sounds like you've read one of my all-time favorite mottos.....

No problem is too big that can't be run away from. :D

[jd2004]

I guess I will just pay the asshole and take it has a 3 month loss

[Vox]

Originally posted by jd2004
I guess I will just pay the asshole and take it has a 3 month loss

Talk to a lawyer, i'm sure there is some online consultation for a cheap fee, you might be able to get away with only paying 1/4 of what they demand with a good sob story.

[Veterans Day]

Originally posted by jd2004
I guess I will just pay the asshole and take it has a 3 month loss

no i certainly wouldnt yet.

[jd2004]

Jason:

You need not shut your site down. It has been shut down. You are done. If the money is not returned, you may well be sued or turned over to the authorities. We will use what ever means we need to employ to recover the funds.

Ronald Sebree, Esq.
Legal Departmet
2Checkout.com

[detoxed]

Its obviously selling adult content, but dont give them the money back.