bluff

basically the aim of radiotherapy is to damage the DNA of the cell (both directly or indirectly) so much that it becomes useless.

The same goes for chemotherapy. There are different forms, some of which prevent replication of the DNA (which is one of the vital processes in division of the cell), for example by incorporating the drug in the DNA at places where something different should be, or by preventing the strands (DNA is a double-stranded helix-like molecule) to divide.

Maybe you should check out some sites to get more detailed information on this subject.

Therapy of advanced cancer of course depends on what kind of cancer it is, to what extend the 'sick' tissue has invaded healthy surrounding tissue, if there are any distant metastases, and if so, in what tissue these metastases have took place. For example, if we're talking about a metastase in a vertebra that gives neurological symptoms, the prognosis for the patient is poor, but to give him a certain quality of life the vertebra may need to be fixed to prevent it from collapsing, thereby compressing nearby nerves.

I'm not sure what the most used methods of palliative (non-curative) treatment are, but I think radio/chemo. For certain cancers, hormone treatment can also significantly shrinken the tumor.

Btw: I'm not sure if 'metastase' is commonly used in everyday language, it means something like 'seeding'.

marttali

"post a method"

needles
people who heal with hands
ancient chinese/indian methods
and so on..

It puzzles me why people dont belive in that shit, they have done it for thousands of years.

Simple example, friend of mine couldn't stop smoking (tried all the modern stuff - 0 - btw even my doc told that it all a big marketing game, they dont work,those chewing gums and stuff that is) So he went to see a healer and boom he became a non smoker ?!


If you wanna live u gotta try them, don't you ?

Imho the problem with modern medicine is it trys to heal the consequences not the originator or generator of the disease.

petepete

Yep... Exactly, Shemp is 100 % right.

My personal advice is: stick what the doctors order, although therapy is usually very hard on you. Before it's too late.
It can move very, very fast.

I know what radical surgery is and radiotherapy too.
Had it twice, 8 years ago.

Couldn't eat for weeks - couldn't even drink water because of pain... Imagine trying to swallow a razor with every sip.
Had to mix water and milk with painkillers to drink anything.

Weighted about 58 kg at the end of the therapy (normally over 90).

But I'm glad I went through it till the end and did not give up in the middle of the radiotherapy sessions. I'm still alive and it's been wonderful 8 years and I'm fucking grateful to my doctor...

Sorry for this but some of the other posts here are just bullshit.

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bluff

have you ever been in a hospital? Have you ever read a medical textbook? Don't talk about something you know nothing about.

bluff

The fact that your friend visited someone doesn't prove anything. Probably it was the extra mental support it gave him. The best way to stop is to just quit cold turkey imo.

goBigtime

- I don't claim to be a medical expert. A pissed off, fed up, citizen who thinks we are in dire need of healthcare reform? Most definitely.

I am just trying to shed light on the fact that the even the official medical experts aren't exactly experts either.

If they were, perhaps there wouldn't be row those rows of bald little children with Leukemia fighting for a shot at their lives


I'm not promoting anything specifically...
and definitely not for any financial gain.

The Billy Best thing just always stuck in my head - as did Linus Paulings story... I've posted about Pauling on GFY before as well.

I know a lot about how things work (and don't work) in US healthcare because at ~30 years old I've been through it's system a lot more than I have needed to due to it's scripted negligence & medocrity.

marttali

No i haven't been in a hospital because one can quite easily avoid
all the diseases.

the Shemp

So you believe coffee enemas cure cancer?

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marttali

All the diseases start from the mental state/level. That's where u need help if u can't manage on your own. BTW haven't seen even a dentist for 15 years, no need.

bluff

man...

cancer as well?

the Shemp

you have nobel potential.
there is a rumour that the earth isnt flat, can you believe that?

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bluff

wow

yes, and my neighbor got a heart arrest because his heart/emotions weren't balanced

and his wife has lower back pain because 'she has no backbone'.

True!

goBigtime

Drinking caffeine makes me way too jittery so I think I'll pass on the coffee enemas.


But who knows what they do really?

If they caused a little cancer & cured a little cancer then they would be right up there with some of the commonly used modern cancer treatments.

marttali

stress is the biggets factor, don't you agree ?
And stress is a mental sickness, isn it ?

bluff

but they don't, I assume. There happens to be no single piece of logic behind it. What is the theory again?

goBigtime

You're not from the UK are you?

Just kidding :P..

but curious... do you drink soda or coffee at all?

bluff

no

stress doesn't even cause hypertension or peptic/gastric ulcers

marttali

no soda, it tastes like shit. Coffee sometimes but rarely. And not from England. Is my english really that good ?

marttali

so what causes hypertension, enlighten me.

bluff

hehe not exactly. But in UK, visiting a dentist is probably a requirement to maintain a certain status in healthcare insurance

bluff

heridity, mostly. Overweight. Certain hormone-producing tumors. Probably there are more reasons I can't think of right now.

the Shemp

dont let your hate for the medical system allow you to make such stupid statements. why dont you donate some free time to your local cancer society/agency. they are always looking for people to drive patients in for outpatient therapy.

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goBigtime

You know the world is fucked when "Apple Cider Vinegar" isn't made from apple cider anymore & Aspirin is made from crude oil



Btw shemp... Aspirin used to be made from north american magic willow tree bark

Technically it still is... but you have to go to the "alternative medicine" sections to get it rather than the 'mainstream' versions that are now made out of crude oil.

goBigtime

My statement wasn't that stupid. Many cancer treaments cause new or spread existing cancer. Fact.

A) No free time during hours that people would need to be driven to their chemo courses.

B) Are you not listening? I think chemo does more harm than good. I don't like doctors. I don't like hospitals. I don't like pharma corps.

<extreme sarcasm>
Why don't I just sell crack instead? At least that way I could share in some of the profits of peoples demise.
</extreme sarcasm>

I doubt the hospital would even pay me gas money for bringing them their hit-and-miss victims.


Sorry Shemp... I have seen people go through chemo. I know people survive through the cancer (or the chemo), but I just don't think it's a good thing.

Not when there are so other things out there with promise that they refuse to look at.

goBigtime

And why the hell is it that when people undergo some ALTERNATIVE treatment for cancer and it goes away,

modern medicine will ALWAYS say "Ah...well the cancer obviously just went into remission by itself".


But if THEY do it by filling you up with nukes, zaping your with radiation or putting you on $1000/mo worth of pills -- then it was all their doing as a direct result of their expertise.

eh?

bluff

what is it in doctors that you don't like, and what in hospitals?

Chemo does more harm than good? In what way can a treatment do more harm than it does good in preventing death?

Now for once name the methods we are talking about! Of course, new things are being trialled all the time. 'Alternative medicine' isn't studied by qualified people because, looking at it with a 'sience-view', there is absolutely no sense in doing so. If people who believe in it's benefits want to devote time and money to it, why aren't they doing so? I still haven't read any such article in nature or the like.

bluff

exactly. Because the effectiveness of regular treatments, at least radiation, chemo, hormone and surgery have been proven. Is that the case with alternative medicine? I don't think so, prove me wrong.

the Shemp

such as? its easy to throw out general statements.

specifically, what alternative treatments are you talking about and what types of cancer can they cure?

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goBigtime

By putting your body in a state where an opportunistic infection can kill you.

Chemo kills your immune system.

Remember bubble boy? No immunities. That's you on chemo. You're bubble boy.

But because you are already in such bad shape, and bubbles aren't very cost or space effective - no bubble for you - just more drugs to help fight off the fungi and bacteria.


Probably for the same reason that FightThisPatent Brandon stepped down on his advocacy.

For whatever reasons, people just don't care. People don't like to get involved these days -- even when it's their own ass on the line.

(I personally think that we're sedated in various ways to keep us in check... but that's a whole different thread requiring a foil hat and a password just to get inside )

bluff

I've been asking the same question for two hours - no response

angeleyes

A few years ago I had to get a "mass" surgically removed from my neck to biopsy it for cancer.... I had a good 3 weeks waiting for the surgeory to think about what I was going to do. I had a good friend that was an Oncologist that sat me down as a friend and not my Doctor and explained everything to me. I also have a friend that is a Doctor of Oriental Medicine that did the same.....

Luckily it was benign, but if it had been cancer I was resolved to integrate both mainstream and alternative treatments.

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richard123

Yes, I think the volcano idea would work for me too. My grandkids would have something they could really amaze the other kids with.

As far as a cure, I go with http://www.smile.org.au

bluff

please don't talk to me as if I'm a moron

goBigtime

How could I? The only tests that would be acknowledged by mainstream would costs millions to fund.

And even then they would be instantly blocked by a followup tests from mainstream medicine organizations that would be testing specifically to find INEFFECTIVENESS rather than being unbiased.

That's how it works & you know it


Btw... most 'cancer cures' that you hear of involve effectiveness through regular treament & complete lifestyle/dietary changes as well... just like mainstream.

bluff

no that's not how it works. Not everything is a conspiracy theory. When something really good is discovered, it'll be all over us. It's nonsense that companies would try to hide that

goBigtime

Right back at ya.




You're asking me to tell you why I don't believe chemotherapy is safe, or a best-choice treatment for cancer.

richard123

As long as there's money in it for them. Otherwise, it won't happen. Example: Hemp.

bluff

I wasn't really impressed by your argumentation

bluff

hemp?

goBigtime

Perhaps if both you and Shemp dropped the Rx pads, and actually read what I said rather than just replying and saying you disagree, you would see that I have already mentioned a couple things.

And no shemp, not magnets or copper bracelets - that was your version of alternative medicine, not mine.

goBigtime

Do people get opportunistic infections while on, as a result of being chemotherapy and die from them?

And if they do, do you chalk that death up to cancer or chemo?

richard123

You don't know what hemp is? It was banned as a result of a campaign by DuPont in the 1930s. Unbanned temporarily during the 2nd world war because of necessity. It's a remarkably useful substance but it threatens quite a few companies out there that have loads of $$$.

So the companies spend a lot of cash keeping it out of the market, Most people have no idea what hemp is, so I can't blame you, really...

goBigtime

See... this is the WHOLE ARGUEMENT.

Nobody who believes in mainstream medicinde fucking cares about Alternative treatments.

They aren't open or receptive to even the possibility of such things.

Shemp comes out right away talking about magic tree bark and magnetic bracelets.




These guys asked me like 5 or 6 times to post an alternative treatment.

There is one in the first fucking post this thread.

Hello. Is this thing on?

Ugh.

bluff

are you talking about ESSAIC/Apple Cider Vinegar?

bluff

you are really getting mad aren't you? btw reading back your post I noticed you changed 'in your own words' to 'not your-doctor-in-training words'. Did you understand my explaining post?

bluff

sites?

goBigtime

This story in the first post of this thread is about the kid who beat cancer taking ESSAIC and 714x.

I've read a lot about ESSIAC.

If nothing else, it has a very interesting past.

------

And I'm not talking specfically cancer cures here... this has become more about alternative medicine in general not getting its fair shake.

goBigtime

completely

the Shemp

with you giving no specifics, you allow me to fill in the blanks...
but what about the coffee enema?

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bluff

wow these are some impressive rethorical questions.

Yes, it's quite likely people die from opportunistic infections. I have no data at hand at this moment, so I can't give you any percentages now.