OH SHIT: Sex Site Sues Credit Cards Over Pirated Erotica

[directfiesta]

This will not help our business! Visa/MC could use this as an excuse to pull out,

SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - Internet piracy has devastated the music business, threatened the movie industry and may now undercut one of the most successful corners of the Web: pornography.

A California publisher of a pornographic magazine and Web site sued Visa, MasterCard and other financial institutions on Wednesday, alleging they facilitated the illegal sale of pirated sex images flooding the Internet.

Perfect 10, whose slogan is "The World's Most Beautiful Models Expose All," based the case on claims other Web sites were stealing their sexual imagery to make money, often through duplicitous advertising.

In a complaint filed in the U.S. District Court for Northern California, the firm sued Visa International, First Data Corp.(FDC.N: Quote, Profile, Research) , Cardservice International, MasterCard International, Humboldt Bank (HBEK.O: Quote, Profile, Research) and Does 1-100.

"The defendants in this case ... are knowingly providing crucial transactional support services for the sale of millions of stolen photos and film clips worth billions of dollars that belong to Perfect 10 and third-parties," the suit reads.

The complaint says these firms have made large sums from the sale of pirated erotica and thus should have a responsibility for any related copyright violation.

"Perfect 10 has concluded that the only way to stop the proliferation of such Web sites is to go to the top, namely the payment card associations and the primary third-party processor, each of which is knowingly and effectively acting as fences for the sale of billions of dollars of stolen content," the lawsuit reads.

MasterCard officials did not return calls for comment. A Visa spokesman said he was unable to find company legal experts for their response.

A LOSING PROPOSITION

The publisher of Perfect 10, Norman Zada, said in an interview that he had lost $29 million since setting up his business in 1996, including $8 million on legal fees. He said the problem was that he was spending thousands of dollars for nude photography sessions while many Internet sites were stealing his and other images.

"The reason it was so hard to make money is because while we were paying for our content, there were many Web sites out there that were competing against us that were stealing theirs," said Zada said, whose business is based in Beverly Hills. "It's pretty impossible to compete in that situation."

The problem of Internet piracy has hit the bottom lines of many businesses, with the recording industry, Hollywood and software businesses the most prominent.

"There probably isn't a lot of sympathy for people in the adult magazine business and that might be part of the problem," Zada said. "But the thieves are stealing from everybody so all the copyright holders are suffering as a group."


http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.j...ryID=423403 0

Seems the new way to make money in this busines is to sue someone... Any volunteer ???

[WiredGuy]

Perfect 10 has a long history of lawsuits regarding copyright infringements. I hardly see them as a reason for Visa/MC pulling out of adult.

WG

[Pornwolf]

That could hurt. He's been really vocal about his problems though and successful in his lawsuits. This will be interesting.

[BRISK]

[WiredGuy]

btw, does anyone have a link to the actual court documents? I'd like to see the list of does 1-100 as the news article said.

WG

[Webby]

directfiesta:

Seems the new way to make money in this busines is to sue someone...

Some even make a career out of that - ain't too good on the cash flow side tho! Judges seem to get in the way with your financial planning

Acacia... where are ya??

[andi_germany]

Norman Zadeh is the biggest dipshit in adult. He sued all the billers and did not succeed now he sues Visa and Mastercard and he won't succeed either.
As 3rd party billers have already cleaned up the celebrity sector his suit has no merrit at all. Maybe for people with their own merchant accounts.

This moron will lose even more if VISA and MC pulls out of Adult.

[KRL]

What a moron move that is. He can kiss his merchant account goodbye.

[- Jesus Christ -]

Originally posted by KRL
What a moron move that is. He can kiss his merchant account goodbye.

Somones jelous.

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

It makes sense whether we like it or not.

Credit Card companies are in effect condoning the theft of content along with numerous other fraudulent and damaging business models.

[tbabe]

Well, they've sued everyone else, credit cards are the only ones left

[Paul Markham]

The way some have dealt with Piracy of all content makes this inevitable. Not only porn, buy music and films as well.

The Internet has meant a lot of new business for some and the loss of business for others. Those losing it are looking for ways to stem that loss. Joining in the business is one way, but when people put up sites full of stolen content in competition what is the point?

APIC fought a long and hard battle against pirates with little to no support from the majority. Most of the time against some kid who was not worth suing. Some of the ISPs, third party, AVS and sponsor programs responded sensibly, some just said "Nothing to do with us" They would rather take the $40 a month from a pirate than clean up the industry.

How many people here have been asked to show they own what they are trying to sell? Everyone just turned a blind eye.

Now someone with the money and the balls has gone to the top. Whether it's the straw that breaks Visa's back is to be seen.

We are now worrying if we keep Visa on board because we did not clean out the bad 2%.

[VirtuMike]

It's not that this will keep Visa and Mastercard from processing adult anymore.

THIS WILL PISS CARDSERVICE OFF.

And since NOT ONE PERSON reading this board deals with Visa directly, and depends on either third party through an acquiring bank or deals direct with an acquiring bank, this is a HUGE problem.

The risk management people at the acquiring banks are going to FREAK THE FUCK OUT and take it out on us. We're talking posting million dollar bonds and personal liability guarantees to process!

FUCK! Doesn't this moron know what he's doing?

[scooby doo as scooby does]

WOW, minefield.

If he wins. The consequences.

1) VISA/MC (cardservice et all) become responsible for pay site content. No way. VISA/MC withdraw from adult on the net. High risk, 'no presence' Merchant accounts stopped. (don't forget, if VISA/MC become liable for copyright illegalities, next is liability for illegal content etc. such as in the Extreme Associates case if they lose)

2) Knockon affect, CCBill et all become responsible for pay site content, possibly with no VISA/MC. Anyway, third party processors die or hike charges massively.

3) All those business'es just destroyed, would they sue VISA/MC ? Would they sue Perfect 10 ? Who picks up the reins with a processing business model that includes ongoing and permanently monitoring of sites content ?

4) And as the guy above said, the acquiring banks must be watching as well.

This is one to watch.

[polish_aristocrat]

wtf, someone should kill him

[Vitasoy]

sigh..

[KRL]

Utter blindness, so many blind to the future.

[polish_aristocrat]

Someone who knows him should talk to him and enlighten him...

[Baal]

"Perfect 10 has concluded that the only way to stop the proliferation of such Web sites is to go to the top, namely the payment card associations and the primary third-party processor, each of which is knowingly and effectively acting as fences for the sale of billions of dollars of stolen content," the lawsuit reads.

So if there is a car stealing ring that uses U.S. currency to sell the stolen cars to chop shops, then the U.S. government should be held accountable for the crime because they provided the means of exchange (cash)?

[Mr.Fiction]

Is the guy who runs that company a lawyer?

He seems to enjoy suing people.

[slavdogg]

>>>> The publisher of Perfect 10, Norman Zada, said in an interview that he had lost $29 million since setting up his business in 1996, including $8 million on legal fees. He said the problem was that he was spending thousands of dollars for nude photography sessions while many Internet sites were stealing his and other images. <<<<<

this guy is a bigger moron than i thought

most dont remember this
but CEN had to drop their site at perfect10s.com and this was years ago

btw, have you guys notices perfect10 has been sponsoring many boxing and fight events os of late.

[slavdogg]

btw, i saw an interview with this guy on TV

he's a middle aged DORK, pretty much he's only doing this whole shtick for pussy

[WiredGuy]

Originally posted by slavdogg
btw, i saw an interview with this guy on TV

he's a middle aged DORK, pretty much he's only doing this whole shtick for pussy

You're up pretty late Slavik
WG

[polish_aristocrat]

Originally posted by scooby doo as scooby does

If he wins. The consequences.

1) VISA/MC (cardservice et all) become responsible for pay site content. No way. VISA/MC withdraw from adult on the net. High risk, 'no presence' Merchant accounts stopped. (don't forget, if VISA/MC become liable for copyright illegalities, next is liability for illegal content etc. such as in the Extreme Associates case if they lose)

2) Knockon affect, CCBill et all become responsible for pay site content, possibly with no VISA/MC. Anyway, third party processors die or hike charges massively.

3) All those business'es just destroyed, would they sue VISA/MC ? Would they sue Perfect 10 ? Who picks up the reins with a processing business model that includes ongoing and permanently monitoring of sites content ?

4) And as the guy above said, the acquiring banks must be watching as well.

so we should simply hope that he loses and then there will be no consequences....... ( ? )

[Sausage]

Originally posted by WiredGuy
Perfect 10 has a long history of lawsuits regarding copyright infringements. I hardly see them as a reason for Visa/MC pulling out of adult.

WG

Hahaha ... no.

I could tell you the exact reason VISA brought in the regs ... or should we say the thing that finally convinced them to go ahead ... and I hate to say it was an Aussie ;)

[polish_aristocrat]

Originally posted by Sausage


Hahaha ... no.

I could tell you the exact reason VISA brought in the regs ... or should we say the thing that finally convinced them to go ahead ... and I hate to say it was an Aussie ;)

ah, youre the one with a friend in Visa management...
any hint what's coming next?

[scooby doo as scooby does]

Originally posted by polish_aristocrat

so we should simply hope that he loses and then there will be no consequences....... ( ? )

Hmmm, I would say 'pray' is a better word than 'hope'. I'm not saying something wouldn't rise from the ashes, but this would effectively destroy our business. Well, mine anyway.

Mind you. I think he'll lose. Look at it another way. You buy a toy for your kid from toy'r'us. It so happens it's a cheap toy with spikey bits of metal in it and the kid gets hurt. The toys are withdrawn. The toy manufacturer may get sued. The shop may get sued, I've never heard of VISA/MC or an acquiring bank getting sued for something like that and it's effectively the same thing in structure. Course, I'm not a lawyer but I don't think you can hold VISA/MC responsible for the actions of millions of outlets that use their cards. It makes no sense. Problem is this is law, and a lot of judges are very stupid.

[BRISK]

Scary, but I don't think he'll nail Visa & MC

[arg]

The CC companies simply won't lose, because losing would have repercussions for them well beyond porn. They'd get new legislation enacted to absolve them before they accepted defeat. Not that porn is worthless to them either...they make good money off adult, and while they've made tougher rules, it's to reduce fraud, not to stop adult CC processing.

[BRISK]

If a pawn shop is found to be selling stolen products and they sold some of the products to people who paid with Visa or MC, should Visa and MC be held liable for enabling the sale of stolen products?

[scoreman]

Interesting article, although they misspelled his name.

I would disagree with those who would say Norman Zadeh is a moron or dipshit. I believe Zadeh is a wealthy man who is upset at the seeing his content abused and has decided he wants to take action. Not everyone is motivated entirely by profitability. To his credit, Zadeh's lawsuits have resulted in some cleaning up of the industry. Look at what he has done with AVS content and celebrity sites, both of which IMO were good things for those who own content and those who would want to protect their likeness from being promoted aggressively by third parties.

If, however, Zadeh is claiming unprofitability solely because of infringement of his content, I dont think this is entirely accurate. The fact that they are quarterly tells you something, that they are not selling enough issues to warrant going bimonthly or monthly. The soft newsstand sales of the their magazine cannot be said to have been impacted solely by the prevalence (whether alleged or actual) of their content online. The real truth I would say is that they are having a tough time competing in the softcore niche, and Maxim and FHM are taking too much market share.

[NetRodent]

Originally posted by WiredGuy
btw, does anyone have a link to the actual court documents? I'd like to see the list of does 1-100 as the news article said.

WG

Its doubtful the John Does have been "discovered" yet. They were likely included so if during the case anyone else with deep pockets is found they can be added to the case.

[NetRodent]

Originally posted by andi_germany
Norman Zadeh is the biggest dipshit in adult. He sued all the billers and did not succeed now he sues Visa and Mastercard and he won't succeed either.
As 3rd party billers have already cleaned up the celebrity sector his suit has no merrit at all. Maybe for people with their own merchant accounts.

This moron will lose even more if VISA and MC pulls out of Adult.

He's still suing (or suing again) atleast 2 of the major IPSPs.