SomeCreep

100 chargebacks

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Trax

lets fucking face it guys
he wouldnt have gotten 8k sales a day without webmasters, spammers,... supporting him....

i believe those numbers are real because i know about the hype

but its not only jon whos got no ethical values when it comes to money...
if any of you should have had the chance to do a similar scam he would have fucking done it for 1.5 million a day

maybe there are one or 2 who would not have done it
but the rest is rarely any better.. i still know guys who send him join after join every fucking minute

kenny

With all that money the Hilton family has can they pose a threat to the company running that site?

Seriously do they have any legal grounds to presue the site owner(s) for any kind of damages?

I am just curious because with all that attention and exposure that site isnt exactly underground. Hell everyone with a email address has had to hear about it by now

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quiet

nice my 200+ (no trials, no affiliates) daily joins cb percentage is, and always has been, WELL under 1% threshold.

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we'll miss you our friend. RIP

WiredGuy

But your members area actually has what's promised in the tours. This is rare

WG

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I play with Google.

Mutt

when reading that summary of the legal case between Lasrado and Atherton the thing that struck me is the judges who presided over it - the affidavits are filled with references to illegal shenanigans with credit cards, it's completely obvious. The legal system is a team - you have legislators, enforcement agencies i.e. the police, and then the judiciary - when a judge sees this kind of crap going on I think he is obligated to alert the proper authorities - in this case the cops and VISA Europe. These last two scams of Atherton's, the Jenna and Paris ones, might have been avoided if the judge did the right thing.

Only thing I give Atherton credit for is that his tour pages are always very creative and smart - he knows how to get the surfer to whip out his credit card.

When people get really dirty in this business that's when they step away from the chatboards. Atherton posted regularly on YNOT and Netpond and then disappeared when he went hardcore criminal. Same thing as Babenet, they used to have marketing reps on the boards. Then when they went evil they retreated to the shadows.

People were invited to take part in these last two scams privately - I guess they still have enough contacts that they were able to put a large list together of big spammers.

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johnbosh

1.6 mil is toooo much

Rorschach

I agree, that Paris Hilton tour is really well put together. Credit where credit's due.

Trax

what worries me is how many people entered their cc# on a page with no SSL certificate

 Smokey The Bear 

Its pretty bland really. And totally illegal so ?

com

Aggreed, I sit down to that show over a burbon and vodka, 32 of heini and a fist full of painkillers, and its actualy fucking hilarious

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sacX

I like the expression "morals you can afford to have". It's easy to say no to scams like these when you're not desperate for a buck..

Maturity also plays a part.. I can't help thinking when i was young, stupid and poor I might have sent traffic to something like this..

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Rorschach

No, actually the copy is really very well written for an adult site and IMO would do a good job of convincing joe surfer to sign up. The fact that it's all lies is neither here nor there, it's still good copywriting.

SomeCreep

lol, you cant help but post on this board huh? No matter how banned you are.

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Dildozer

We're very likely his only friends

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Spam link here

Theo

i wont be surprised if they exceed the numbers posted.

Ron2k1

I had never heard of this 'paris hilton' before this hype, what has she done in the past?

bigdog

how does he keep on getting new merchant accounts anyway?

RBC

Hooper

That't the tough part. Probably found some sucker bank who "trusted" him.

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dougeetx

You know your girlfriend is half BLACK, right?? She is the daughter of Mr. Commodore himself, LIONEL "FUCKING BIG ASS AFRO" RICHIE!!!

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quiet

yes, and it's obviously converting very well. which is what it's all about.

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we'll miss you our friend. RIP

Ice

That is awesome man If everyone followed your business model the industry wouldn't be in the mess it is in right now.

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icq 1904905

IKE

Does this link work for you guys?

jimmyf

I'm pretty sure they will make someones life miserable, it's not just the money they have it's the **POWER**.

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jimmyf

HollyWood Sq.'s

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Krome

Most people in this thread are hypocrites.

If you had the chance to pull in $30m for a few months work at the end of which you would have your merchant account removed and be depised by the adult industry would you not do it?

Why do you think Scott PB, Atherton, Greg etc had a company WRGAF ltd (Who really gives a fuck).

Do you think they care about 200 joins per day (Quiet)? Fuck no that is pocket change to them. So you dont like their tactics WRGAF.

At the end of this Atherton will be richer and wont give two fucks what you think of him as he will be flying around the world in his private jet laughing his balls off while you continue to be the honest people that you are.

MegaPussy

It's a total scam, billing-wise.

You sign up on a non-secure form, a form that was totally broken until over a week after the site was up. I tried and I had to fill it out twice since the fields were in a broken table.

There's no cancel link in the members area or the receipt. Half the links in the members area are no-notification $10 one time charge upgrades.

The terms (only found on the join page) say it's a 30 minute free trial but they bill you $2.95 anyhow. They leave themselves open to charging you a bunch of other 'silver' and 'gold' memberships up to around $200. There is no selection/options to choose which membership you are getting.

Another thing they have on their 'approval' page is a statement saying you will be billed $150 if you charge back. I found that funny enough to screenshot.

When you get into the members area, on an amusing note, the player for the Paris video has a little note that says you have to wait up to 15 minutes since there are 'so many' people in the queue. But the clip plays right away, oops. It was a nice attempt to scam the customer into rebilling though. They even put that the clip is 42 minutes long, right next to the windows media player window that says 2:56 in running time.

I had to find the www.pzest.com site to cancel my membership, which was at the bottom of about 30 pages of terms. And of course I still was billed.

All you need is a person with a clean tax ID and credit history to get a new merchant account, and whatever fees that bank requires.

So scammers like this are allowed to continue, as long as they can find bulletproof hosts and enough relatives to sign up with the banks for them.

- Titus

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sweet7

I would say power not money. Because power yields money, and more.

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quiet

thank you, captain obvious.

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we'll miss you our friend. RIP

MegaPussy

Most people in this thread are easily star-struck. And don't understand how the banks work, or how much effort it actually takes to net 30 million dollars

The days of even considering doing that many trial sales a day with a single affiliate-driven site are pretty much over. Anyone who can even show us stats of them doing 100 sales a day with the paris site would shock my socks off.

- Titus

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Wankenstein

I was getting 100-250 joins a day from that shit, I wish I could charge them 200 a pop, I'd fuckin retire.

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Madball

The hosting alone must cost a fortune.

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Wankenstein

To clarify, not THAT program, a honest one.

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Mutt

way to go Krome - we were all sitting here debating whether Atherton has any feelings of guilt. Thanks for clearing that up - I was on the fence but now I know.

and no i nor most of the people I know would do what he's done.
i am as envious of Jon Atherton as I am of a wealthy drug dealer.

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Madball

Did you say 100? Half a dozen ppl in this thread send them 100+ each, daily.

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MegaPussy

So at least 6 people in this thread make over $3000 a day?

Have them contact me and I'll match payouts, in that case.

ICQ 199346608

That's how confident I am this is more BS than truth.

- Titus

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Mutt

read the court documents I linked to - there are affidavits with info how these criminals get merchant accounts - in this case Lasrado had some mystery man in Europe who processed his transactions when he lost his merchant accounts, Lasrado never met him, had no clue who he was - when Atherton lost all his merchants he went to Lasrado who hooked him up with the mystery man - Atherton was required by the mystery man to put up $250,000 to cover his chargebacks and some other expenses -
even this mystery man according to Lasrado got nervous about doing business with them and stopped replying to his emails - Atherton sued Lasrado for the $250,000 claiming Lasrado stole the money from him and the mystery man never existed. Which is a fucking joke - judge decided against Atherton.

believe me this isn't as simple as Atherton using relatives or patsies to get merchant accounts for him to burn through - there are tens of millions being processed - this is a major operation -

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Krome

I think my post came out in the wrong way. Was i was trying to say is that over the past 5 plus years people have asked if they (Greg, Scott, Atherton, Shannon etc) give a fuck.

I think people pretty much know the answer.

But then again I am also trying to say that the majority of people would do the same for one month to get the money they have made.

MegaPussy

In that case it's only a matter of time. This kind of volume doesn't exactly go under the radar. There are a limited number of places/people in the world who process high risk in that kind of volume. The trail will eventually end, with Atherton knee deep in money and litigation.

Let's hope he doesn't do any more irreparable damage to the rest of us who are using VISA/MC as legitimate money sources.

- Titus

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Ice

In some cases like for the majority of celeb sites the damage has already been done

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Madball

This guy brought you the Visa paranoia of Oct. 2002, let's see what he brings us next

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MadCap

Out of anyone who has the right to bitch about this i think the number 1 would be HANK (mr. skin). Something like this celeb scam could really hurt him and a few others in the long run. I know He does allot of shows and other marketing but I think is is one of the people with the most to lose. I feel bad for that. I only met him once a few years ago very breifly at a show but he struck me as a good guy. And this could end up sucking ass for him.

Ice

Hank isn't the only celeb paysite out there. I know alot of sites that have already had their processing pulled. I think this marks the end for cc processing for celeb sites. Anyone left is living on borrowed time. Doesn't matter if you are a review site, considered "news worthy", etc. The credit card companys are looking for a way to get out of adult and things like this keep giving them reasons to do so.

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Krome

Visa attitude to group everyone in Adult together is pathetic. Have all accoutants had to have increased payments due to regulation because of Enron and Anderson?

If the Austrailian porn mafia could just be grouped together it would make life alot easier then everyone could just say WRGAF about them.

SR

With those 200 sales a day you don't have to run and hide and watch your back for a long time.
Because those people will get arrested for this scam.

I rather make 3 million a year the honest way without having to worry about many things.

Ice

I agree it is unfair to group everyone in adult together but Visa does this because they don't care. They are looking for a way to get out of processing adult all together IMO.

American Express was the first to do this years ago, followed by PayPal. The introduction of charge backs being less than 1% is just another way Visa is putting a nail in the coffin. They are not stupid, they know that it will only take a few people pushing huge numbers to put the overall average over 1% and give them yet another reason to say fuck adult processing.

Now we have the payment processors charging us what 25 bucks per charge back in an attempt to hold on to visa for a bit longer.

Shit falls down hill and picks up speed and in the end the only person that gets fucked is the webmaster.

Perfect example. I had a guy that was a member of my site for about a year and a half. He contacts me via emal and says he didn't know he was being charged that whole time even though he agreed to the terms and conditions when he joined.

I offer a trial then recurring program and everything is very clear on my sites.

So he tries to tell me that he didn't access the site after the trial period even though my logs show that he did.

Now Im not one to argue too much I tried to meet in the middle and offered to refund half the money.

Well guess what I never heard from him again. He went straight to Visa, Visa contacted my cc processor, my processor refunded him everything including the trial amount.

So in the end Visa looks like the good guy, the processor looks like the good guy, buddy has his fucking money back and I get screwed and my cb ratio goes up.

Visa doesn't give a shit about us the make enough from mainstream internet and non internet related sales...

The credit card processors IMO don't give a shit about us and will bend over and take it in the ass if Visa wants them to...

and if the surfer can get something for free they will knowing there is nothing we can do to stop them from getting a refund.

Just my

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icq 1904905

davidd

I agree with your comments (edited for brevity), but you are missing some bigger points.

I have been around for a long time and have had the opportunity to do business with most of the original participants in this 'industry', and can clearly state, there are those who have made some coin and then there are those that own the treasury that produces that coin (literally banks in some cases).

Until anyone in this thread has exceeded 10mil in yearly or even total earnings since day one, you should keep your opinions closely guarded. People who observe and take notes before running at the mouth still have an open mind and can learn.

This entire thread is derived from assumptions, accusations, slander, and jealousy.

With the latest ISPS rules and regulations, everyone should be more concerned about their own backyard instead of opining about other people's 'perceived' wrong doings. As everyone now has the ability to seal their own fate, whether good or bad.

The bigger point of this thread's topic is I find all too often that when someone feels they should be making big money, and they aren't, they instantly resort to name calling and the instant assumptions that the 'other guy' must be doing something wrong. When in actuality the people who have made money in this business, know the concepts of timing, marketing, foresight, and innovation. When the light is shined, it is not cockroaches that scatter, it is usually an epiphany for those who want to accept it.

This is a generalized statement and not defending any actual or assumed wrong doings by anyone. I have never had the pleasure of meeting Lasrado, Phillips, or Atherton in person. On the same token, I can safely assume no one in this thread would refuse the chat.

Quiet - this obviously was not directed at you. As the day I saw your concept in action (back in '99), it was obvious you were on the right track. Since then, you know you did it right, while others could assume you cheated or sleezed your way into your success. Viewpoints and clarity.

-dd

AdultNex

I concur. These scammers doing it for the quick buck are ruining our reputation and business.

BradShaw

Get back to your tgp. 100 sales an hour easy. That site is/was EVERYWHERE.

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