End of shaving? - GoFuckYourself.com

monro · 11-08-2003, 12:48 PM

An employee (friend) at an European IPSP told me that all the major IPSP's had a meeting where they decided to hire some security people to do test payments in new created affiliate accounts in order to find out which sponsors do steal from their affiliates. Those sponsors will be blacklisted at all IPSP's and their funds confiscated to cover claims from the affiliates. This steps are taken to stop the risk for the IPSP's to be involved in the federal and international crime "shaving" is.. The employees at lover levels at the IPSP's are not informed of this to minimize the risk of leaks.

Indeed · 11-08-2003, 12:49 PM

hmm really

stocktrader23 · 11-08-2003, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Indeed
hmm really

Indeed

makefuckingmoney · 11-08-2003, 12:53 PM

Kick Ass Chat · 11-08-2003, 01:01 PM

Well I'm sure that's all bull, but if it were true it is a first step in the right direction

stocktrader23 · 11-08-2003, 01:01 PM

Let me be the first to say

There is no way to prove you're getting shaved!

- Jesus Christ - · 11-08-2003, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by stocktrader23
Let me be the first to say

There is no way to prove you're getting shaved!

Not alone, but a large enough goup of organized webmasters who kept the whole thing hush certainly could.

stocktrader23 · 11-08-2003, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by - Jesus Christ -
Not alone, but a large enough goup of organized webmasters who kept the whole thing hush certainly could.

I was just poking fun at the usual 20 idiots and shaving sponsors that jump in and say it's impossible.

I made damn sure my main sponsor didn't shave. I know it's possible.

- Jesus Christ - · 11-08-2003, 01:08 PM

Sarcasm is hard to recognize on a forum with so many poeple who actually believe that you can't test your sponsors.

Thrawn$ · 11-08-2003, 01:09 PM

Bullshit

makefuckingmoney · 11-08-2003, 01:11 PM

First..

Define shaving?

Second..

IPSP's getting involved in something like this would mean they would be taking responsibility for affilate program operators.

The IPSP takes the transaction then just posts them back..what the operator does with that information is something the IPSP doesnt want involved in..

Just like all these partnership programs.. IF they lose their ability to rebill, you are under THEIR master account, your rebills go with the master account, the IPSP has no relationship with the affilates..

monro · 11-08-2003, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by makefuckingmoney
First..

Define shaving?

Second..

IPSP's getting involved in something like this would mean they would be taking responsibility for affilate program operators.

The IPSP takes the transaction then just posts them back..what the operator does with that information is something the IPSP doesnt want involved in..

Just like all these partnership programs.. IF they lose their ability to rebill, you are under THEIR master account, your rebills go with the master account, the IPSP has no relationship with the affilates..

Buing/transfer stolen things from a thief is a crime.......

Suckitbitch · 11-08-2003, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by monro
An employee (friend) at an European IPSP told me that all the major IPSP's had a meeting where they decided to hire some security people to do test payments in new created affiliate accounts in order to find out which sponsors do steal from their affiliates. Those sponsors will be blacklisted at all IPSP's and their funds confiscated to cover claims from the affiliates. This steps are taken to stop the risk for the IPSP's to be involved in the federal and international crime "shaving" is.. The employees at lover levels at the IPSP's are not informed of this to minimize the risk of leaks.

Are you talking about the IPSP shaving where they drop your rebills or are you talking about the initial sponsor shaving where they shave your initial sales?

gornyhuy · 11-08-2003, 01:40 PM

not fucking likely.

makefuckingmoney · 11-08-2003, 09:44 PM

heard it from a friend who....

heard it from a friend whooooooooooooooooo.......

Matt_WildCash · 11-08-2003, 09:50 PM

Another the winner of the most ridiculous remur on GFY this week goes too : wait for it : MONRO!!!

Snake Doctor · 11-08-2003, 09:51 PM

Absofuckinglutely BULLSHIT.

If this were the case then EVERYONE would be out of business soon, nobody's traffic tracking software is perfect.
I don't care how good your coders are, sales are going to fall through the cracks and end up in the house account.

gin · 11-08-2003, 09:52 PM

question is, if this happens and half the sponsors drop their payouts by 10 - 15$ almost proving they have been shaving people for years, will you still promote them?

BlackCrayon · 11-08-2003, 10:13 PM

haha, very interesting. too bad you have nothing to back it up with. something like this would be very hard to implement but very rewarding. like lenny says sales would always fall through the cracks but if they allow for a small margin of error that might work. either way im sure nothing will happen regarding this.

Police state · 11-08-2003, 10:24 PM

biggest shavers

pornkings
topbucks
pillpromote

Police state · 11-08-2003, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlackCrayon
haha, very interesting. too bad you have nothing to back it up with. something like this would be very hard to implement but very rewarding. like lenny says sales would always fall through the cracks but if they allow for a small margin of error that might work. either way im sure nothing will happen regarding this.

if a card is charged a sale CANNOT "fall through the cracks" cut the shit, you write a program for a purpose, it performs that function, if the program has an error it wont charge the card

Ic3m4nZ · 11-08-2003, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Police state
biggest shavers

pornkings
topbucks
pillpromote

you forgot nastydollars too

gin · 11-08-2003, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Police state

if a card is charged a sale CANNOT "fall through the cracks" cut the shit, you write a program for a purpose, it performs that function, if the program has an error it wont charge the card

yup, all sales should be tracked, less then .1% shouldn't be tracked, when a user signs up the processor goes to something like http://www.domain.com/adduser.php?us...er=affiliateid

it should alwayse be tracked! if it is not tracked then the username / password should not work for the members area, and this shouldn't really ever happen

Weber · 11-08-2003, 10:31 PM

Good idea...
Shaving=stealing

SpaceAce · 11-08-2003, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by monro
The employees at lover levels at the IPSP's are not informed of this to minimize the risk of leaks.

Apparently it didn't work.

SpaceAce

detoxed · 11-08-2003, 10:34 PM

This is the dumbest fucking thread I've seen on GFY. I say this a lot more often lately.

Dildozer · 11-08-2003, 10:34 PM

This is the best unfounded rumor i've ever heard.

Imagine the ruckus that would cause...

sponsors that shave

REGRET · 11-08-2003, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ic3m4nZ

you forgot nastydollars too

And the sponsor in your sig

Corona · 11-08-2003, 11:04 PM

I give my surfers all the porn they want for free that way I don't have to worry about sponsors that shave

XxXotic · 11-08-2003, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by stocktrader23
Let me be the first to say

There is no way to prove you're getting shaved!

like hell there isn't

Markit · 11-09-2003, 01:26 PM

use only recurring sponsors with third party stats & checks,
and you dont have to worry about being shaved

or, send your traffic to your paysite.

with verotel you dont have to pay the visa fees so it costs you nothing giving it a try

doober · 11-09-2003, 02:07 PM

Yes, As of Nov 8 2003, everyone has stopped shaving because of this...

TheSenator · 11-09-2003, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by stocktrader23
Let me be the first to say

There is no way to prove you're getting shaved!

I sued they settled out of court....it can be proved but I can't tell you how....

Snake Doctor · 11-09-2003, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Police state

if a card is charged a sale CANNOT "fall through the cracks" cut the shit, you write a program for a purpose, it performs that function, if the program has an error it wont charge the card

No the card will still be charged, the sale will go through, but the reseller won't get credit. It will happen a certain % of the time.

If you don't believe me, open up a paysite....use whatever stats program you want....write your own if you feel like it.
Then do a mailer for that site with an affiliate account.
Watch how many sales the affiliate gets and how many end up in the house account.
Be sure and do this with a site that has no other traffic going to it so you can be sure that the house sales are the ones that the stats program didn't track properly.

woj · 11-09-2003, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Markit
use only recurring sponsors with third party stats & checks,
and you dont have to worry about being shaved

It's NOT much harder to shave partnership, than it is to shave per signup.

Snake Doctor · 11-09-2003, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woj

It's much harder to shave partnership, than it is to shave per signup.

Not really...if the partnership program has their own stats software they could shave your sales the same way a per sign up company could.

There's just no reason to shave a partnership because they don't have to pay you monies that they haven't already taken in.....i.e. they can't lose money on your traffic......so while its less likely, its still possible.

And if your partnership program doesn't have its own stats software and only uses the 3rd party processors links that rely on cookies, that's very innacurate and you'd probably be better off just getting shaved by a more accurate tracking program

woj · 11-09-2003, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lenny2

Not really...if the partnership program has their own stats software they could shave your sales the same way a per sign up company could.

There's just no reason to shave a partnership because they don't have to pay you monies that they haven't already taken in.....i.e. they can't lose money on your traffic......so while its less likely, its still possible.

And if your partnership program doesn't have its own stats software and only uses the 3rd party processors links that rely on cookies, that's very innacurate and you'd probably be better off just getting shaved by a more accurate tracking program

yea, I fucked it up, it was supposed to say NOT much harder. And, you can get shaved fairly easilly even if a sponsor uses 3rd party stats.

gin · 11-09-2003, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lenny2

No the card will still be charged, the sale will go through, but the reseller won't get credit. It will happen a certain % of the time.

If you don't believe me, open up a paysite....use whatever stats program you want....write your own if you feel like it.
Then do a mailer for that site with an affiliate account.
Watch how many sales the affiliate gets and how many end up in the house account.
Be sure and do this with a site that has no other traffic going to it so you can be sure that the house sales are the ones that the stats program didn't track properly.

your shit is messed up then

11-08-2003, 12:48 PM	#1
monro So Fucking Banned Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 787	End of shaving? An employee (friend) at an European IPSP told me that all the major IPSP's had a meeting where they decided to hire some security people to do test payments in new created affiliate accounts in order to find out which sponsors do steal from their affiliates. Those sponsors will be blacklisted at all IPSP's and their funds confiscated to cover claims from the affiliates. This steps are taken to stop the risk for the IPSP's to be involved in the federal and international crime "shaving" is.. The employees at lover levels at the IPSP's are not informed of this to minimize the risk of leaks.

11-08-2003, 01:09 PM	#10
Thrawn$ Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Mtl Posts: 4,596	Bullshit __________________ Tracking 202 \| Start Tracking PPC Campaigns Like A Pro

11-08-2003, 01:40 PM	#14
gornyhuy Chafed. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Face Down in Pussy Posts: 18,041	not fucking likely. __________________ icq:159548293

11-08-2003, 09:51 PM	#17
Snake Doctor I'm Lenny2 Bitch Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: On top of my soapbox Posts: 13,449	Absofuckinglutely BULLSHIT. If this were the case then EVERYONE would be out of business soon, nobody's traffic tracking software is perfect. I don't care how good your coders are, sales are going to fall through the cracks and end up in the house account. __________________ sig too big

11-08-2003, 10:13 PM	#19
BlackCrayon Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ottawa Posts: 19,631	haha, very interesting. too bad you have nothing to back it up with. something like this would be very hard to implement but very rewarding. like lenny says sales would always fall through the cracks but if they allow for a small margin of error that might work. either way im sure nothing will happen regarding this. __________________ you don't know you're wearing a leash if you sit by the peg all day..

11-08-2003, 12:49 PM	#2
Indeed Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 1,892	hmm really

11-08-2003, 12:53 PM	#4
makefuckingmoney Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 3,277

11-08-2003, 01:01 PM	#5
Kick Ass Chat Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 2,057	Well I'm sure that's all bull, but if it were true it is a first step in the right direction

11-08-2003, 01:01 PM	#6
stocktrader23 Let's do some business. Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: The dirty south. Posts: 18,781	Let me be the first to say There is no way to prove you're getting shaved!

11-08-2003, 01:08 PM	#9
- Jesus Christ - Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ::::::::::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: ::::::\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|:::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: :::::::::::\|\|::::::::::: :::::::::::::::::::::::: Posts: 7,197	Sarcasm is hard to recognize on a forum with so many poeple who actually believe that you can't test your sponsors.

11-08-2003, 01:11 PM	#11
makefuckingmoney Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 3,277	First.. Define shaving? Second.. IPSP's getting involved in something like this would mean they would be taking responsibility for affilate program operators. The IPSP takes the transaction then just posts them back..what the operator does with that information is something the IPSP doesnt want involved in.. Just like all these partnership programs.. IF they lose their ability to rebill, you are under THEIR master account, your rebills go with the master account, the IPSP has no relationship with the affilates..

11-08-2003, 09:44 PM	#15
makefuckingmoney Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 3,277	heard it from a friend who.... heard it from a friend whooooooooooooooooo.......

11-08-2003, 09:50 PM	#16
Matt_WildCash Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,699	Another the winner of the most ridiculous remur on GFY this week goes too : wait for it : MONRO!!!

11-08-2003, 09:52 PM	#18
gin Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 672	question is, if this happens and half the sponsors drop their payouts by 10 - 15$ almost proving they have been shaving people for years, will you still promote them?

11-08-2003, 10:24 PM	#20
Police state So Fucking Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: The Netherlands Status: Administrator Posts: 175	biggest shavers pornkings topbucks pillpromote

11-08-2003, 10:31 PM	#24
Weber Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: In the Net Posts: 1,114	Good idea... Shaving=stealing __________________ Just a sig

11-08-2003, 10:34 PM	#26
detoxed vip member Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 17,798	This is the dumbest fucking thread I've seen on GFY. I say this a lot more often lately.

11-08-2003, 10:34 PM	#27
Dildozer Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Montreal Posts: 7,519	This is the best unfounded rumor i've ever heard. Imagine the ruckus that would cause... sponsors that shave __________________ Spam link here

11-08-2003, 11:04 PM	#29
Corona Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Third mall from the sun Posts: 2,185	I give my surfers all the porn they want for free that way I don't have to worry about sponsors that shave __________________ I was looking for a job, and then I found a job And heaven knows I'm miserable now

11-09-2003, 01:26 PM	#31
Markit Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,305	use only recurring sponsors with third party stats & checks, and you dont have to worry about being shaved or, send your traffic to your paysite. with verotel you dont have to pay the visa fees so it costs you nothing giving it a try __________________

11-09-2003, 02:07 PM	#32
doober Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: in yoOoo kitchen Posts: 6,984	Yes, As of Nov 8 2003, everyone has stopped shaving because of this...