Police, Alarm Companies and Hackers... - GoFuckYourself.com

TheFLY · 07-12-2003, 05:10 PM

Who regulates the Burgular Alarm/Security industry? Are these companies required to keep records of alarms? If that industry is left unchecked it potentially gives crooked Police, organized crime, and computer hackers enormous power over the public without risk of being caught.

I'm wondering what kind of records these alarm companies are required to keep and how any of that information is validated...

If there were reliable public records that showed the exact time that alarms are triggered and exact times that police are dispatched -- there would be no way for police to "fudge the numbers" by producing an alarm "after the fact" for the matter of convenience for racial profiling, for organized crime, etc.

I realize that the alarm/security industry is more likely connected to organized crime but all the more reason to do something about "false alarms" now -- as technology advances alarms become more sophisticated and more sensitive to movement, etc.

This is how you could try to regulate the alarm industry. Every time an alarm goes off the time/place/type of alarm needs to be recorded somewhere that can be validated at a later time without the thread of tampering... This information must be safe from tampering -- the responsibility and power of the security industry if left unchecked could grow to be an ever more serious problem. Imagine a hacker in control of alarm data -- this would give someone enormous power with little danger of being caught!

How can we validate alarm data for the safety of the public?

1. Transmit records to multiple locations simultaneously (in realtime) -- this would need to be encrypted in transit and safe from tampering -- validate the data through comparison of the mirrored data -- there should be approved hardware in place that can not be reverse-engineered by criminals -- this information needs to be stored for recordkeeping in multiple locations BEFORE this information reaches the security company and the police -- because electricity travels at the speed of light, the sequence is not important and would not affect response time to real alarms. I say multiple locations because storage at any single location would open the entire system to fraud.

2. Transmit the information to the public in a context like the internet. You could not allow criminals to see when alarms were set off -- that might undermine the alarms. I could see this as an option if the data was delayed in being distributed to the public so that it was not useful to criminals, but only for the pupose of keeping alarms systems honest. Again the hardware would need to be safe from reverse engineering and it would need to be inspected/tested/reviewed!

All this would cost an enormous amount of money but it will be necessary in the future! The alarm industry has enormous power as it stands -- it will only get worse. The cost of regulation should fall on those wealthy persons that have so muh to protect -- the fact that Police forces are used to protect businesses with alarm systems seems to further the importance of regulating the alarm industry -- as the integrity of public safety is in question...

Again we can see the complexity of the situation -- if you are sending alarm data in realtime for safekeeping purposes you run the risk of criminals being able to tap into this data for burgulary purposes or for organized crime to manipulate -- on the other hand the public needs to be able to trust the integrity of alarm data as alarms become more technologically sophisticated and consequently we lose freedom.

How can we trust the the security of the security? The protection of the protection? We can't because a Code of Ethics is not enough -- there is too much power now wielded by a private industry that essentially can do whatever it pleases -- for profit -- threatening our public safety. That's what it comes down to. Alarm data that is not secure and regulated gives Police and alarm companies too much power. Frankly I'm disgusted.

Hardcore J · 07-12-2003, 05:11 PM

Conspirancy theory.

Veterans Day · 07-12-2003, 05:27 PM

Ya all fire alarms are wired to the police and fire dept. NOW getting those logs for your harrasement case against your police dept is totally a different story. Is this a concern to you genuinely or is this to bolster your case against the police dept?

TheFLY · 07-12-2003, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Veterans Day
Ya all fire alarms are wired to the police and fire dept. NOW getting those logs for your harrasement case against your police dept is totally a different story. Is this a concern to you genuinely or is this to bolster your case against the police dept?

I just think too much power is in the hands of an industry that's completely unregulated... It's all just food for thought -- pretty much I'm sick of the entire topic, but I figured I should throw it out there for people to chew on...

TheFLY · 07-12-2003, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Veterans Day
Ya all fire alarms are wired to the police and fire dept. NOW getting those logs for your harrasement case against your police dept is totally a different story. Is this a concern to you genuinely or is this to bolster your case against the police dept?

PS: I did get information as to when the alarm went off and what alarm company it was

Made some phone calls, wrote some letters... mostly just waiting to see if there's anything about this "problem" that interests me...

07-12-2003, 05:10 PM	#1
TheFLY So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: http://www.thefly.net/ --- Quit your job and live off steady traffic. Posts: 11,856	Police, Alarm Companies and Hackers... Who regulates the Burgular Alarm/Security industry? Are these companies required to keep records of alarms? If that industry is left unchecked it potentially gives crooked Police, organized crime, and computer hackers enormous power over the public without risk of being caught. I'm wondering what kind of records these alarm companies are required to keep and how any of that information is validated... If there were reliable public records that showed the exact time that alarms are triggered and exact times that police are dispatched -- there would be no way for police to "fudge the numbers" by producing an alarm "after the fact" for the matter of convenience for racial profiling, for organized crime, etc. I realize that the alarm/security industry is more likely connected to organized crime but all the more reason to do something about "false alarms" now -- as technology advances alarms become more sophisticated and more sensitive to movement, etc. This is how you could try to regulate the alarm industry. Every time an alarm goes off the time/place/type of alarm needs to be recorded somewhere that can be validated at a later time without the thread of tampering... This information must be safe from tampering -- the responsibility and power of the security industry if left unchecked could grow to be an ever more serious problem. Imagine a hacker in control of alarm data -- this would give someone enormous power with little danger of being caught! How can we validate alarm data for the safety of the public? 1. Transmit records to multiple locations simultaneously (in realtime) -- this would need to be encrypted in transit and safe from tampering -- validate the data through comparison of the mirrored data -- there should be approved hardware in place that can not be reverse-engineered by criminals -- this information needs to be stored for recordkeeping in multiple locations BEFORE this information reaches the security company and the police -- because electricity travels at the speed of light, the sequence is not important and would not affect response time to real alarms. I say multiple locations because storage at any single location would open the entire system to fraud. 2. Transmit the information to the public in a context like the internet. You could not allow criminals to see when alarms were set off -- that might undermine the alarms. I could see this as an option if the data was delayed in being distributed to the public so that it was not useful to criminals, but only for the pupose of keeping alarms systems honest. Again the hardware would need to be safe from reverse engineering and it would need to be inspected/tested/reviewed! All this would cost an enormous amount of money but it will be necessary in the future! The alarm industry has enormous power as it stands -- it will only get worse. The cost of regulation should fall on those wealthy persons that have so muh to protect -- the fact that Police forces are used to protect businesses with alarm systems seems to further the importance of regulating the alarm industry -- as the integrity of public safety is in question... Again we can see the complexity of the situation -- if you are sending alarm data in realtime for safekeeping purposes you run the risk of criminals being able to tap into this data for burgulary purposes or for organized crime to manipulate -- on the other hand the public needs to be able to trust the integrity of alarm data as alarms become more technologically sophisticated and consequently we lose freedom. How can we trust the the security of the security? The protection of the protection? We can't because a Code of Ethics is not enough -- there is too much power now wielded by a private industry that essentially can do whatever it pleases -- for profit -- threatening our public safety. That's what it comes down to. Alarm data that is not secure and regulated gives Police and alarm companies too much power. Frankly I'm disgusted.

07-12-2003, 05:11 PM	#2
Hardcore J Hardcore 4 Life™ Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 2,553	Conspirancy theory.

07-12-2003, 05:27 PM	#3
Veterans Day Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Windy City Posts: 8,403	Ya all fire alarms are wired to the police and fire dept. NOW getting those logs for your harrasement case against your police dept is totally a different story. Is this a concern to you genuinely or is this to bolster your case against the police dept?