Our cross sale is handled completely different than others

....ask Billy about us :)

Look at the trends with CC processing over the past 7 years... Chargeback rate requirements have gone from 5% or less down to 1% for Visa/MC come Oct. 1st.

Is this the level that Visa/MC really want for "high risk" transactions?

How long until the CB rate requirements reach 0.5%?

The days of recurring transactions have been numbered since Visa/MC started tightening the screws.. How long until Visa/MC don't allow "high risk" recurring transactions?

This announcement is good news for those who have traffic and want to see the big players continue to be aggressive about competing for that traffic. With the big changes coming, whoever can figure out how to offer the most money is going to get the most traffic, just like it always has been.

Thanks CECash. :)

Mr. Fiction,

Shoot me over an email, lets discuss some business

fabian @ cecash dot com

A good majority of banks will not do a chargeback for $1. It'll cost them a lot less to simply write-off the charge.

Who else is NOT lowering payouts? I want to know where to move my traffic.

Oldtimer, hit me up on ICQ 99523787 .. lets talk

'bout time for some real hard thread

what I think is cool is Ron can come in with a 468x60 banner as a sig and none of you pussies will even mention it

fucking momo's

Ron great job!

All my respect!

Top sponsors can have 468x80's. They pay the bills around here.

well of course -

My Sig banner is almost as big as my dick :Graucho

ohh yeah things are looking up :):thumbsup

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

They make $25 to $100 a chargeback - so why would they not chargeback a $1 transaction - this is exactly why they will do two chargebacks for a 'paid trial' and a 'monthly membership' - hence a free trial is better ofr processing!!

agreed on both points.

What would your affiliates make on that, $1? If that's the future of adult, count me in! :)

Hahaha... that's really funny.

I work for Visa. I personally write off dozens of charges monthly. If the charge is less than $25 and the same amount hasn't been charged before, then I write it off.

Example 1: $2.95 trial and $39.95 rebill. Trial will be written off.
Example 2: $19.95 first month and $19.95 rebill. Both will be disputed.

\ran into you a few years back and always did like the way you think.

stay in touch, man.

If you work for Visa then you know that the banks, not Visa, generate chargebacks.

Chargebacks happen when the consumer calls their bank, not Visa. They say, I don't know what thess charges are, this is usually someone's wife or a guy who is trying to stay out of a divorce by denying he entered an Adult Site. When the bank looks up the charge, they say, you have another charge for $2.95, we should remove that from your bill as well, this generates two chargebacks.

Also, if you work for Visa you know that the bank who issues a chargeback gets about 80% of the chargeback fee. This is definitely incentiving the wrong entity.

I have been involved in credit card processing since 1986, in 1986 it was credit card processing for audiotext lines, in those days there was no such thing as a chargeback fee, or fines. The bank learned these bullsh-t billing practices from third party processors and they have taken it to new heights nowadays!

Ha ha, you're really funny :)

Let's just all go back to the good ole audiotext days. Things were so much simpler back then. All you had to do was master the CALL NOW part of the pitch and you were good to go.

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Amen!! In those days we placed ads in the Adult Books or bought commercial time on the small networks and watched the calls come in - the internet is a lot different. Oh the good ole days!! :)

:thumbsup

Those phone sex call counts used to blow my mind. Then the mainstream progs that we ran TV spots for, oh mama, that was like going to Heaven every day.

Is the Van Nuys News Stand still there Ron? That guy used to carry all the good porn mags.

:Graucho

I work for TD Visa customer service. The Visa section of the bank.
When a TD Visa cardholder wishes to chargeback a transaction, they call me.
When I see a single charge of less then $25, I write it off.
The issuing bank does not get a cut of the fee. In fact, a chargeback costs the issuing bank an average of $25 (when you factor in things like employee salary, paperwork, potential loss of clientele, etc) which is why we write off charges less than $25.
On top of that, if the acquirer brings the charge to arbitration, the issuer could end up paying upwards of $500.

For the record, I have nothing but respect for you and what you've done in the industry. I push your programs. But if you doubt that I work for Visa, I'll make you the same offer I made Kimmykim when I first joined GFY: Feel free to call me tomorrow @ 1-800-9TD-VISA. Ask for Matthew at extension 23141. I'll be replacing a supervisor from 4pm to 12am EST.

psyko514 is responsible for all the chargebacks in this industry. Let's "treat" him.

actually, i've done my best to get my bank to reduce friendly fraud. slowly but surely, it's been working.

in fact, i remember annoucing here a while back i had busted a case of friendly fraud and you congratulated me. :thumbsup

So you work for Visa and market porn on the side. That's a paradox.

And I suppose your site is VisaGirlsLive.com

:1orglaugh

It's still a chargeback....otherwise, $24.95 sites would have zero chargebacks....

You may work for Visa, but the dreaded envelopes that come in the mail are pretty clear about what a chargeback is...

I was in the porn game before I worked for Visa.

Up until recently, the whole processing aspect of porn didn't concern me very much, so I never paid much to attention to Visa's role in online porn.

Then I stumbled across GFY in October in the middle of the $750 drama.

The $25 policy is at my bank. At some banks, it might be $10, $15 or $20.

A charge that gets written off by Visa is not treated as a chargeback. The merchant and acquirer is never aware of a written-off Visa charge.

Take Xpics or Netfill/N-biill for examples. Their chargeback ratio would have been double or more what it was if written-off charges were included.

You obviously don't know the internal billing system for bank's chargeback fees, the issuing banks do receive money for this. I'm not trying to argue with you but McDermott, Will and Emery, one of the largest Law Firms in the world got this information from Visa for the GIA a couple years ago, it's not something that's publicized as proven by you not having that knowledge......

Keep in mind I work for a Canadian bank and Visa Canada has different policies/procedures from Visa USA. I can assure you that issuing banks don't make money on chargebacks. We're encouraged to avoid them as much as possible.

The writing-off of smaller charges is still common practice at a lot of banks, Canadian or American. Do a test if you doubt that. Post a $5 charge and a $50 charge on your account. Dispute both. You'll see the $5 charge credited in less than a week. The $50 charge will take a few more weeks.

hmmm...what's wrong with you, Ron?
how 25% can be "insignificant"?

if 25% insignificant,
3 times insignificant is insignificant nad that's where your remaining 75% allegedly are...

somethign doesn't compute...

Just a note that FuckVisa.com dropped just recently and its still available if anyone wants to have some FUN!

:Graucho

hehe i know :-)

\personally, I'm favoring all of my anti-Acacia domains right now :winkwink:

Serge as long as the payout doesn't change it's a moot point, and the payout won't change. That makes it CECash's problem, nobody elses. I don't think you even understand what we're talking about.



btw Sergiepoo - that was weak :)

I know the adult biz well, mostly 4free, and I belive in giving the surfer a good deal, but I am a big believer in the word free, it just pulls attention. I also believe in proper disclosures.

It would seem to me that it's obvious that people want to avoid chargebacks with the new ruling. if there were some way to intercept or get to the customers complaints before Visa does.

I am going to think about this, and come up with an idea

I enjoyed reading all of the posts.

Tell that to Larry Fox from McDermott, Will and Emery :)

I have already seen chargebacks on small amounts, so there is no reason for me to test that.

Since you admit Visa Canada has different policies than Visa Domestic, how are you sure American banks don't do this, I am very sure. Furthermore, American banks encourage chargebacks on Adult Sites because they make money on them.

We had a merchant account once, many moons ago, that was under a computer hardware category, it had no chargebacks. The bank uncovered the account and reclassified it, chargebacks flew in and we had to terminate the account. Domestic banks handle consumer complaints very differently when an accout is identified as a high risk, adult paysite account. So unless you have first hand knowledge of High Risk, Domestic, Adult merchant accounts don't assure anything about same.

Also, not trying to knock your job, but why do you think they would tell you they make money on chargebacks when all you do is customer service. There would be no reason for a bank to let any employee know they make money on chargebacks unles it was a high official at the bank. This information came to us directly from Visa thru Larry Fox.

We have explored this. The only way to intercept a customer complaint and sidestep the chargeback is to buy a bank and be the card issuing bank and the processing bank, otherwise ir goes in the Visa system.