New Visa Regs Beg For A Change In Payouts - GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum

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LA Mike

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#1

New Visa Regs Beg For A Change In Payouts

07-10-2003, 01:24 PM

Due to the new Visa regulations we are forced to make some changes to keep ourselves in line with these new regs and still make a profit to not only insure our longevity but the longevity of the industy as a whole.

In the past as I'm sure most of you know we were aloud to have a 2.5 percent chargeback ratio that has now been changed to 1 percent begining october 1st.

Epoch has in turn made some new regulations that we must follow to and make changes on our end. We will now only be offering 1 easy click on our join pages and there will no longer be free ezclick joins. Not only this but the joins can be charged a maximum of $20 per month.

In order to help reduce chagebacks there will be less opportunities for cross sales and we will lower the monthly charge of $39.28 to our members to $29.28. This change will also have to be passed down in order to conduct some sort of profit.

Silvercash will be lowering payouts within the next week to $25 per join and $30 per join for those sending over a certain amount per period.

Its a time of change and the biggest change this industry has seen to date. I'm sure that other programs will follow as there isnt much alternative.
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#2

07-10-2003, 01:25 PM

First reply! *

*(I have nothing to say, but I want to be on the first page of this historic thread.)

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#3

07-10-2003, 01:26 PM

Here it comes...

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#4

07-10-2003, 01:28 PM

the needle in my dick goes in and out, in and out, in and out!
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#5

07-10-2003, 01:29 PM

one down, how many to go?

Hook 'em.
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#6

07-10-2003, 01:30 PM

$10 less than before...

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#7

07-10-2003, 01:32 PM

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BradShaw

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#8

07-10-2003, 01:33 PM

Mike is correct, these upcoming changes will affect payouts. I believe Epoch has good reason to make these changes, although some of them are a tough pill to swallow short term. I would expect others to follow suit in some manner.

Running a PPS program has always been a #'s game, and some of our ammo is not longer available help turn a profit. I would expect almost all major companies to settle around $30per paid trial, or less by Aug.1. Free Trials are all but a thing of the past with the new 1% rules.

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#9

07-10-2003, 01:35 PM

the sky is falling

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Marc De

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#10

07-10-2003, 01:35 PM

Mike - let me offer a piece of support. This is a cut and paste of a new topic I started on Oprano.

There are many factors involved in programs paying the high rate per sign up they do now. These factors include

$39.99 monthly charges
2 FREE cross sells per page rebilling at $30 to $40 / mo

there are other factors as well but its these factors in specific I would like to address.

Chargebacks occur for a number of reasons but a lot have to do with very high monthly charges. Obviously these prices bring in more money which allows a much higher payout.

In an effort to reduce chargebacks, free cross sells will become single micro $1 payments that rebill at a much lesser rate. Much more importantly monthly rates must drop from the rate of $39.99 to $29.99

Obviously this will drastically hit the top of line of many sponsors (those who choose to take the path of 'correcting' some of the problems in the industry. Because of this cut in revenue payouts of $35 and $40 per trial will no longer exist (again for that group of sponsors who attempt to make the proper changes)

Payout will drop below the $30 range. Also FREE trials (which ARS recently began offering) will no longer exist. These changes will take place in the coming days.

Webmasters use this post as for warning of things to come.

Sponsors use this post as a support for you to follow the necessary trends to correct an escalating problem over the last few years. Its time to fall in line or its time to fall out!

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#11

07-10-2003, 01:35 PM

I thought the processors and PPS program owners always said cross sells didn't adversely affect c/b's. But now with lower c/b ratios they have to be ditched?

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#12

07-10-2003, 01:36 PM

We totally agree and support Silvercash's adjustment on pricing and payouts.

Expect similar changes with our program. It will be interesting to see how our industry changes...

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#13

07-10-2003, 01:37 PM

in other words the industry isnt going to take all the surfers money at once?

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#14

07-10-2003, 01:38 PM

My commendations to both Mike Price and Marc De for taking the leap and being the first to announce this.

It's refreshing to see someone willing to take a hard chance and say it like it is.
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#15

07-10-2003, 01:39 PM

Heh. You just acknowledged an "escalating problem", but only now do you care about correcting it?

Ok.

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[illnet]-Jamie

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#16

07-10-2003, 01:39 PM

I agree too ...I think that this is a must to stay within the chargeback %
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#17

07-10-2003, 01:43 PM

I agree with Both Mike and Marc on this one.

in the coming days,weeks and months you will be seeing a lot of changes from Affiliate programs of all sizes...

The days of free trials are defintely over.

The days of mulitple cross sells are over.

The days of higher and higher payouts with one company trying to out do another are over.

Last edited by ElvisManson; 07-10-2003, 01:47 PM.
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#18

07-10-2003, 01:44 PM

maybe if ppl would of been more concerned with quality instead of money over the past few years this wouldn't be happening but oh well. im sure i'll still be around, im just a simple free site maker, so as long as i can still make money off that im happy. im kinda glad prices are going down as i always thought 40 bucks/month for a paysite was expensive. personally i've always been an honest webmaster who kept quality in mind. i've never even used a pop up on any of my sites, never spammed, ect. maybe ratios will go up as a result of being more 'surfer friendly' but one thing i really fear is scrubbing, i hate that shit. anyways, i remember back in the day when they ended free trials for the first time, everyone was scared but it was never as bad as everyone said it was going to be, this is worse, for sure but still sex will always sell, one way or another. see you all on the other side lol

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#19

07-10-2003, 01:48 PM

Good job Mike..you have always had the balls to tell it like it is and do what is right.

Way to go. Wish you much success.
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#20

07-10-2003, 01:48 PM

100% webmasters have to understand that the programs they choose to promote WILL need to make changes to keep in bizz and make money for both the program and the webmaster.

Definate Props to SC being the first to man up with the bad news

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Pornkings

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#21

07-10-2003, 01:51 PM

I have to agree with Mike alot is going to change this year with the new regs going to 1%

I would watch the sponsors taking actions to make sure they are compliant and taking the right actions to stay in biz. Because if your doing biz with programs that don't.
don't get upset if they go under and you don't get paid out.

We to will be making changes in our program removing our free trial programs that we just launched.

Porn4abuck,Sunny money will remain the same with the same payouts

our paid trial program that is at $40 will drop to $30 in the next month or so.

Basically the webmasters out there trying to fraud programs etc. will now be Put on top alert and the industry will be cleaning itself up. expect to see many companies who do not comply and watch there chargebacks and make all measures in lowering it.
Go out of business.

So choose who you do business with carefully.

Last edited by Pornkings; 07-10-2003, 01:57 PM.

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#22

07-10-2003, 01:51 PM

Originally posted by ElvisManson
I agree with Both Mike and Marc on this one.

in the coming days,weeks and months you will be seeing a lot of changes from Affiliate programs of all sizes...

The days of free trials are defintely over.

The days of mulitple cross sells are over.

The days of higher and higher payouts with one company trying to out do another are over.

Elvis, not sure it is ALL over. If someone can find a way around this, it would be your boss;-) Sure he is already making calls!

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#23

07-10-2003, 01:55 PM

this is going to be a long night...

I stay busy.
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#24

07-10-2003, 01:57 PM

So many changes this year. Paypal, VISA 1%, AVS changes and processors and programs going under. Then we still have Mastercard compliance that is waiting in the wings with the rubber mallet. This is truly the year of the shakeout in the biz, who would have thought it would have come almost solely from the card associations.
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#25

07-10-2003, 01:58 PM

Megapornbucks will be following suit as well. As of July 14th 2003 our payouts will be lowered as well to $25-20.
As well as obviously getting rid of our free trials.

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#26

07-10-2003, 01:58 PM

Originally posted by BradShaw

Elvis, not sure it is ALL over. If someone can find a way around this, it would be your boss;-) Sure he is already making calls!

I have an idea that will change it all

the shakedown is happening Its going to be an interesting year

Just watch

Last edited by Pornkings; 07-10-2003, 02:01 PM.

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#27

07-10-2003, 01:59 PM

It would be interesting to know if surfers would notice that probably soon, no one will be offering free trials.

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#28

07-10-2003, 02:00 PM

I think this can only be good for the industry in the long run.
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#29

07-10-2003, 02:03 PM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha
It would be interesting to know if surfers would notice that probably soon, no one will be offering free trials.

I'm wondering how long it will take surfers to realize that they won't be "scammed" as easily anymore. Hopefully it's quick, but somehow I doubt it.

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Eric

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#30

07-10-2003, 02:03 PM

I personally think this is a good thing. And I think that many of you will be surprised. Whether you push a PPS or a Partnership program that in the long run you will make more money.

I mean right now a guy joins a site and he sees the rebill amount and shits his pants so what does he do. He charges it back. In this case the lower payouts will be due to the sponsor and the site charging less. So in the case where he may have charged it back before he just eats it and cancels the membership. Which in the long run is good for everyone.

Plus the lower costs may entice more of the guys that are on the fence to join which in turn means more sales across the board.

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Mike AI

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#31

07-10-2003, 02:03 PM

We as an industry brought these changes upon ourselves. They were forced upon us because we as an industry kept pushing the boundaries and basicly were raping surfers.

Reality is now going to set it.

I am excited about what is going on, and thing the changes will make sure this industry lasts for the long term. This is a healthy change for the industry in the long run!

Embrace the change!

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#32

07-10-2003, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha
It would be interesting to know if surfers would notice that probably soon, no one will be offering free trials.

Someone will offer free trials. Whether is is Babenet out of Panama again, or Aussies from Hong Kong, or someone else, they are not going to dissappear totally.

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#33

07-10-2003, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by Mike AI
Embrace the change!

I agree. Someone out there is going to take this "disaster" and turn it into a goldmine. I'm very anxious to see who and what it will be.

Be more excited than afraid.

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FlyingIguana

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#34

07-10-2003, 02:09 PM

Originally posted by Eric_aka_RedEyes
I personally think this is a good thing. And I think that many of you will be surprised. Whether you push a PPS or a Partnership program that in the long run you will make more money.

I mean right now a guy joins a site and he sees the rebill amount and shits his pants so what does he do. He charges it back. In this case the lower payouts will be due to the sponsor and the site charging less. So in the case where he may have charged it back before he just eats it and cancels the membership. Which in the long run is good for everyone.

Plus the lower costs may entice more of the guys that are on the fence to join which in turn means more sales across the board.

changes need to be made to the chargeback process. the whole system just assfucks everybody in this industry. visa and mastercard aren't changing the real problem.
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#35

07-10-2003, 02:10 PM

Personally I think ppl see ahh $10 down per sign up or whatever, but just fail to realize that more sales (volume) will follow the lower prices.

I think that the industry will see a lot more sign ups and recurring memberships, if this Visa thing truly weeds out those that scam.

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ElvisManson

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#36

07-10-2003, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by BradShaw

Someone will offer free trials. Whether is is Babenet out of Panama again, or Aussies from Hong Kong, or someone else, they are not going to dissappear totally.

Maybe not at first...but eventually everyone will realize that you don't need free trials...and 1% is not sustainable using free trials.
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#37

07-10-2003, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by FlyingIguana
visa and mastercard aren't changing the real problem.

Agreed.
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#38

07-10-2003, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by BradShaw

Someone will offer free trials. Whether is is Babenet out of Panama again, or Aussies from Hong Kong, or someone else, they are not going to dissappear totally.

True there is always someone...but I think it will be pretty obvious that quite a percentage of sites will not be offering it anymore

VISA and Mastercard maynot be fixing the real problem, but they fixed their problem

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#39

07-10-2003, 02:12 PM

Clickcash raised their payouts $5 across the board last week.

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#40

07-10-2003, 02:12 PM

Originally posted by Rictor
I think this can only be good for the industry in the long run.

Agreed, it will be good long-term.

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JMM

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#41

07-10-2003, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by scoreman
So many changes this year. Paypal, VISA 1%, AVS changes and processors and programs going under. Then we still have Mastercard compliance that is waiting in the wings with the rubber mallet. This is truly the year of the shakeout in the biz, who would have thought it would have come almost solely from the card associations.

Well, that is what happens when you have a business that is so heavily saturated with idiots, and I am NOT talking about the surfers.

Perhaps 2003/2004 will be the period when honesty and integrity finally has its payday in our industry.

Anyone that does NOT understand that the "business" brought this upon themselves is blinded by all the cocaine/booze/x, etc that the scumbags have been feeding you for years. Of course, they were brilliant...they knew that by feeding you as much as they did, you would never have the clear mind to see how bad they were fucking you, and the industry.

I wouldn't call this a shakeout, I would call it a hangover.
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#42

07-10-2003, 02:14 PM

I'm assuming free trials will be replaced with $1 trials or something similar?

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ElvisManson

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#43

07-10-2003, 02:16 PM

Originally posted by tical
I'm assuming free trials will be replaced with $1 trials or something similar?

paid trials like $2.95 will still be around...as they have been for a very long time.

the free trial is not so much about the lack of money being charged as it was about how a lot of WM's were advertaising it and the wording used.
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#44

07-10-2003, 02:16 PM

Originally posted by Mike AI
We as an industry brought these changes upon ourselves. They were forced upon us because we as an industry kept pushing the boundaries and basicly were raping surfers.

Reality is now going to set it.

I am excited about what is going on, and thing the changes will make sure this industry lasts for the long term. This is a healthy change for the industry in the long run!

Embrace the change!

Yep. Great post.

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#45

07-10-2003, 02:16 PM

I no longer offer free trials.
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#46

07-10-2003, 02:17 PM

This will make our payouts seem more reasonable. Most webmasters dont try us because $20 a sale looks low, but the 50% recurring really works well for a lot of people. We also are doing everything we can to raise payouts in the future
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#47

07-10-2003, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by ElvisManson

the free trial is not so much about the lack of money being charged as it was about how a lot of WM's were advertaising it and the wording used.

And I'm sure the $39.99 rebill had no impact on the situation.

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#48

07-10-2003, 02:18 PM

With payouts from PPS programs shrinking it makes more sense than ever to just use partnership programs with 3rd party billing.
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#49

07-10-2003, 02:19 PM

Wow. Mike, you have out done yourself. This is one of the ballsiest and most stand up things I've seen to date in this business. I bow to you. Even though you just chopped my revenue by 25% I stand in your shadow.

Regards,

Rick Latona
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Rick Latona

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#50

07-10-2003, 02:20 PM

Originally posted by Wilbo
With payouts from PPS programs shrinking it makes more sense than ever to just use partnership programs with 3rd party billing.

Words of wisdom.

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